Turnstile Gets Cranky With About 45 People in the League

[Apparition]

I have been running instanced Rikti mothership raids since October 2019.  On Excelsior, I average four or five full teams.  It’s rare for me to get more than 40 people.  I think only about a half dozen times out of a few hundred MSRs on Excelsior have I managed to get 45 or more people.  The times I did though, the turnstile started acting up, and the last couple of people invited either received the message that the event has already completed (when it hasn’t), or they joined the instance and were immediately booted right back out.

 

Lately, a friend of mine and I have been leading instanced MSRs on Torchbearer.  Unlike Excelsior, those do tend to get more than 40 people.  All goes well, until we get to around 44-45 people.  The turnstile will start acting up, and the last couple of people invited will either receive the message that the event has already completed (when it hasn’t), or they will join the instance and be immediately booted right back out.

 

The turnstile seems like it can’t really handle six full teams. Like I said, it’s not really an issue on Excelsior because there are numerous MSRs ran every day, so mine only attract four or five teams.  However, it is an issue on Torchbearer where they do attract six teams of people.

 

I am bringing this up because not only is it an issue with instanced MSRs, but I also know that instanced Hamidon raids were at least planned at one point.  Hamidon raids are more popular than mothership raids since the rewards are considered to be vastly better.  If this bug is not fixed and an instanced Hamidon raid comes to be, there are going to be some cranky players.

[TheZag]

Hopefully the other bugs with the league and instances can get squashed as well.  Like the MSR league leader has to invite to team then move the player elsewhere in the league since invite to league can bug out.  If you drop and then try to rejoin, you have to hit rejoin last event from the LFG menu otherwise theres a good chance that you are gonna be bugged out and unable to be reinvited.  And thats all assuming that one of the other bugs didnt hit you.

 

All things considered, im suprised that we manage to ever get 48 people in the instance MSR.

 

Also,  i vote yes for instanced hamidon.  And add sharks with laser beams attached to their head.

[Apparition]

16 minutes ago, TheZag said:

Hopefully the other bugs with the league and instances can get squashed as well.  Like the MSR league leader has to invite to team then move the player elsewhere in the league since invite to league can bug out.  If you drop and then try to rejoin, you have to hit rejoin last event from the LFG menu otherwise theres a good chance that you are gonna be bugged out and unable to be reinvited.  And thats all assuming that one of the other bugs didnt hit you.

 

All things considered, im suprised that we manage to ever get 48 people in the instance MSR.

 

Also,  i vote yes for instanced hamidon.  And add sharks with laser beams attached to their head.

 

 

Hrm.  I've never had "invite to league" bug out on me when I use it.  It automatically puts the player on your team if your team isn't full, and basically acts like "invite to team."  That's actually probably a good thing, because there's a nasty bug with the zone MSRs where people who are invited to league but not invited to a team may not actually get put on a team and will not be lackeyed up to level 49 if below that level, and won't receive nearly as many Vanguard merits.  The league window will show the person on a team, but if that person opens up the team window, it will show that the person is not actually on a team.  That bug hit me all of the time on zone MSRs on Excelsior and I constantly would only get about 500 Vanguard merits at the end of the raid, since the game only counted the Rikti I personally damaged.  Yes, both the zone MSRs and instanced MSRs are bugged.  Pick your poison. 

 

As far as the drop and then trying to rejoin, I think that's connected to the issue in the original post.  IIRC, there were about 45 people on the league when three people crashed two Fridays ago.  When they tried to rejoin, they received the "event already finished" message when it wasn't.  

Edited June 7, 2021 by Apparition

[TheZag]

I believe the entire invite to league bug goes: if they are the team leader and get invited to the instance MSR league the bug will not let them join the league.  If they drop team,  their former members can join but if the former leader gets invited again 'player is considering another offer' will show when they arent.  Im not sure if there were additional specifics to trigger it like current alignment or current zone or leader and members in different zones.

 

I believe i read that from a MSR guide and it may have already been fixed but i cant find it from my phone and limited time while at work.

[Apparition]

2 hours ago, TheZag said:

I believe the entire invite to league bug goes: if they are the team leader and get invited to the instance MSR league the bug will not let them join the league.  If they drop team,  their former members can join but if the former leader gets invited again 'player is considering another offer' will show when they arent.  Im not sure if there were additional specifics to trigger it like current alignment or current zone or leader and members in different zones.

 

I believe i read that from a MSR guide and it may have already been fixed but i cant find it from my phone and limited time while at work.

 

 

Ahh, I know what you're talking about.  The Indomitable shard runs instanced MSRs as well.  However, they form it up a bit differently than instanced MSRs are formed on Excelsior and Torchbearer.  Instead of inviting everyone to the instanced MSR individually like is done on Excelsior and Torchbearer, the Indomitable raid leaders invite people to their raids in teams.  They have separate teams formed in the RWZ, then when a team is full the raid leader already in the instance invites the whole team to the league.  However, if one person on that team does not have the Member of Vanguard badge, then it prevents the whole team from entering the raid instance.  Then everyone else on the team has to either zone or relog to clear it.  There are no issues inviting a whole team however if everyone on the team has the Member of Vanguard badge.

 

Yeah, it would be nice if that issue gets resolved as well.  In the meantime, you can get around it by just inviting everyone individually which is how I've always done it.

Edited June 7, 2021 by Apparition

[srmalloy]

14 hours ago, Apparition said:

They have separate teams formed in the RWZ...

If you're forming the teams in the RWZ, doesn't that defeat the purpose of having an instanced raid that can be formed in a zone that doesn't have the 50-player limit of the RWZ?

[Apparition]

Now that I'm thinking about it some more... this is total conjecture and probably 100% incorrect, but...  Whenever an instanced mothership raid is run, you always have a couple of people (anywhere from one to a half dozen), who try to get an invite without having the Member of Vanguard badge.  Most will go get the badge after being told how to do so, and join the raid in media res.  Others... will get cranky and try to argue with me because they don't think that they should need the badge even though it only takes about five minutes to obtain, and never actually join the raid.  I'm wondering if the turnstile is counting those few that get invited without having the badge and never join, blocking others from joining.

[Apparition]

@Faultline , @Number Six - I believe that I know what the core issue may be.

 

To make things easier for @Anyad and myself, along with everyone else, we form Rikti mothership raid leagues from inside the instance itself.  We queue in while having the raid locked to ourselves, and then invite people once inside.  Works great.

 

Now, say that you have 30 people in the league.  That’s three full teams and a fourth team with six players.  Then someone in team two either leaves the instance, logs, or disconnects.  So teams one and three are full, team two now has seven players, and team four has six players.  Now Anyad or I invite another player into the instance, and he or she begins loading in… only to be booted right back out with an error message.  The league leader has to move the sixth player in team four to team two, so team two is now full and team four has five players.  Only then will someone new be able to successfully load into the instance after being invited.

 

This is just much more pronounced and possible once the league reaches six teams, since more players in the league means that there is a greater chance that someone will quit the raid, log, or disconnect.  Which is why I thought originally that it was due to the size of the league, since the issue is usually encountered when the league has six teams.  But it happened last night when the league only had four teams, because someone in team two logged or disconnected.

 

Also, this would still occur if we formed and queued normally like an Incarnate trial.  We always start the raid without a full league, and pick up people during.

 

To sum up: If someone leaves, logs off, or disconnects during an instanced Rikti mothership raid (and I'm sure that this impacts Incarnate trials and the Cathedral of Pain trial as well, just that it's less likely to occur due to the smaller league size), then no one new can join the instance until the league leader fills the missing spot on the team that the person left/logged/disconnected was on.

 

Edited September 25, 2021 by Apparition

[Apparition]

18 minutes ago, Krimson said:

On Excelsior we have a player who does instanced MSRs and usually forms them in Pocket D. Also, I have totally joined this after it started and it is weird. One minute you are in a zone, and the other in the instance. But getting people in Pocket D also solves the problem of alignment.

 

 

That was me.  I stopped forming them in Pocket D back in November 2020 though because there were several major issues, and started forming them from inside the instance like I do now.  It's much easier on everyone to form instanced Rikti mothership raids from inside the instance.