Concentrated Strike not benefiting from Crit Proc

[WindDemon21]

I know it doesn't "crit" but it's "crit" recharges power siphon. I've been replaying my kin scrapper and with the crit proc in focused burst to use for CS to do so, i'm noticing that it almost NEVER recharges power siphon right after the crit proc. I've noticed it actually recharging it MORE when used normally and not right after the crit proc but i'm sure that's just RNG. But it definitely seems like it's not benefiting from the extra "crit" chances of the crit proc so far. I'd have to do further testing but from what I'm seeing this definitely seems to be the case and if so needs fixed.

[WindDemon21]

Grrr so yeah testing more, it's definitely not getting the benefit of the crit proc. Swear every time I get really excited about a character there is always some super detrimental bug that makes it not work XD. Can this please be fixed asap! Gotta shelve another toon now till it is :((

[Sovera]

4 hours ago, WindDemon21 said:

Grrr so yeah testing more, it's definitely not getting the benefit of the crit proc. Swear every time I get really excited about a character there is always some super detrimental bug that makes it not work XD. Can this please be fixed asap! Gotta shelve another toon now till it is :((

 

To the bug forums for you! Speaking of bugs here won't make them visible to the devs.

[SomeGuy]

In the mean time, try putting the proc IN conc strike. You may like it.

[WindDemon21]

11 hours ago, SomeGuy said:

In the mean time, try putting the proc IN conc strike. You may like it.

Yes that was one of my first thoughts. However one that means you can't use it till 32 in the build, but also that still has the issue of not being able to use it FOR the power which you should be able to. It also ruins the ability to use it during the gaussians proc and getting both aoes in during it because it's cast time is so long as opposed to say focused burst which let's you do all three.

 

Any other power with bonus crits like golden Dragonfly and eagles claw ALSO gets the crit bonus on top of that. There is ZERO reason that CS also shouldn't benefit from the set defining procs. At that rate I would much rather have it just do regular crits with maybe more crit chance like gd/ec.

 

While we're at it the power also HEAVILY needs at least one of the wind ups removed to shorten it's cast time about a second.

Edited December 10, 2021 by WindDemon21

[WindDemon21]

Also to note, that repulsing torrent is also not generating stacks of power siphon. Seems it also has probably been this way but it really should be stacking that -damage and +damage from it.

[WindDemon21]

Also to be known, that especially when not being able to get boost from the crit proc, that it rarely goes off when it's actually useful, and instead will often do it when the power is almost recharged anyway, making it even more useless than if it actually crit. It needs to also crit or gain boost from the atos.

[WindDemon21]

Also to note, that it can be a bad mechanic as well when you have lots of recharge, making the PS recharge next to pointless as well anyway if you can't at least count on it with the crit proc. It's just a bad mechanic overall if it's not getting at least the benefit of the crit proc and crit bonus.

[WindDemon21]

Definitely just had an 11 streak with no PS recharge fyi, that definitely shoudln't happen, and another showcase where it NEEDS to benefit from the crit procs as mentioned above.

[WindDemon21]

Scratch that, took till 15 tries for it to finally recharge power siphon..

[SomeGuy]

The proc in CS works well for me even when CS has streaky misses like that. PS has a pretty long duration, so even with a high recharge build it worked out fine for me. PS is an interesting BU to work with and get the most out of. Having it up constantly definitely didn't seem like the best way to get the most out of it, especially since it's duration is 20s and it doesn't stack with itself. If it stacked? I'd feel pretty differently, and I'd imagine it could be pretty abused. But it would be nice if CS did like, maybe 14% additional damage AND refreshed PS when it would crit. I dunno. I'm just thinking out loud since I've got Seismic Smash on the brain from Stone Melee.

 

CS proc goes off. BB-QS-SB-BB-CS. Proc duration is...3.25s? You can string together some good crits before firing off CS again for the proc.

 

The set is in a really good place for those willing to understand it. KM is good. Really good, actually. Do the ASF final fight. The big bad's KM is pretty annoying. 😛

Edited December 10, 2021 by SomeGuy

[WindDemon21]

6th try, 1 try, 6th, 2nd, 3rd, 8th, 2nd, 1st, 8th, 2nd, 6th, 8th, 1st, 7th, 31 tries!!! 7th, 4th try. Those are the last times I've counted. It should also be noted that even with just slotting power siphon for recharge, and CS for max recharge, that you're at best using it every 13 ish seconds if you're spamming, lets say 10 for ease with some rech bonuses. That means on top of just generally doing diminishing returns the close to it base recharging is, that anything 6 tries or over, is literally doing nothing, and unless it's 3 tries or less, it's hardly doing anything as it is cause then you're not perma-ing it anyway.

 

This mechanic definitely needs fixed. And while it's RNG, there is no way that it should have taken 17 and THIRTY ONE tries before it even worked at all. I'm not joking or missed anything, I don't know how but it literally took 31 tries that one time before it actually worked.

[WindDemon21]

This is also noting, that even putting it IN CS, that CS while giving it good cproc chances, is EXTREMELY slow and using it trying to spam it also hurts a lot as it doesn't get crit damage. Having the mechanic do that s one thing, but being reliant on CS where it's a tier 9 power for one, but also can't be boosted by the crit procs, needs a MAJOR redo.

[WindDemon21]

17 minutes ago, SomeGuy said:

The proc in CS works well for me even when CS has streaky misses like that. PS has a pretty long duration, so even with a high recharge build it worked out fine for me. PS is an interesting BU to work with and get the most out of. Having it up constantly definitely didn't seem like the best way to get the most out of it, especially since it's duration is 20s and it doesn't stack with itself. If it stacked? I'd feel pretty differently, and I'd imagine it could be pretty abused. But it would be nice if CS did like, maybe 14% additional damage AND refreshed PS when it would crit. I dunno. I'm just thinking out loud since I've got Seismic Smash on the brain from Stone Melee.

 

CS proc goes off. BB-QS-SB-BB-CS. Proc duration is...3.25s? You can string together some good crits before firing off CS again for the proc.

 

The set is in a really good place for those willing to understand it. KM is good. Really good, actually. Do the ASF final fight. The big bad's KM is pretty annoying. 😛

I understand it, which is why I'm pointing out how flawed it is that it's not benefiting from the crit procs. It needs to at least do that for that mechanic to have much value at all as opposed to just actually doing crit damage.

[SomeGuy]

3 minutes ago, WindDemon21 said:

I understand it, which is why I'm pointing out how flawed it is that it's not benefiting from the crit procs. It needs to at least do that for that mechanic to have much value at all as opposed to just actually doing crit damage.

 

 

I gotta say I like the fact you found a bug with it. Maybe it'll put a light on the set and it's mechanics.

[Sovera]

This and the testing should definitely be in the bug forums.

[WindDemon21]

The long cast time as well with CS in relation to the actual power siphon buff, is also so slow, that it makes it so you don't actually get full 5 power siphon stacks most of the time,. This is also part of the issue, which is where this needs to be addressed. In theory, its good, but in actual use, it's REALLY bad for CS to not benefit from the ATO procs. This actually gets even worse the more recharge you have on the build, making the power siphon recharge even LESS useful than what I just described above.

[WindDemon21]

Just now, Sovera said:

This and the testing should definitely be in the bug forums.

I put it there cause I wasn't sure if it was 100% a bug, and apparently bopper states that "it has always been this way on purpose". Which is honestly shocking as I pointed out how really terrible it actually is and needs revamped. I would even say, either fix it so that it benefits from the crit procs at least, or make it actually do normal crits, and then have EVERY power give a chance to recharge power siphon. That way it works prior to level 32, and you get crits on CS.

 

Also re-noting, that repulsing torrent needs to apply PS stacks/-damage.

[SomeGuy]

1 minute ago, WindDemon21 said:

Also re-noting, that repulsing torrent needs to apply PS stacks/-damage.

 

I never knew this. Granted, I haven't used RT since the set came out in GR. 

[WindDemon21]

2 minutes ago, SomeGuy said:

 

I never knew this. Granted, I haven't used RT since the set came out in GR. 

Yeah, I wonder if it "is as designed cause hey, you get a ranged cone" but then so does claws and spines with no downsides on it. So I would *assume* it's a bug too, cause otherwise, just another dumb thing broken with KM.

[WindDemon21]

I'd REALLY hope for a fast patch on this one, cause otherwise I like the character i made and want to play him, but this is just being really detrimental and reminding me why i stopped playing my last KM scrapper, outside of the the fact that besides the first 3 attacks, the rest is REALLY slow. And I would imagine why it's one of the least played scrapper sets as well.

[SomeGuy]

3 hours ago, WindDemon21 said:

I'd REALLY hope for a fast patch on this one, cause otherwise I like the character i made and want to play him, but this is just being really detrimental and reminding me why i stopped playing my last KM scrapper, outside of the the fact that besides the first 3 attacks, the rest is REALLY slow. And I would imagine why it's one of the least played scrapper sets as well.

 

I will definitely defend KM as being one of the better sets, but you have absolutely valid points. The big wind up of CS does have a really awesome payoff, so I will excuse the cast delay on that all day long, but the other attacks on the set having the incredibly long windup that they do makes them VERY skippable to me.  The PBAoE definitely isn't skippable, and it is by no means weak, but that wind up is pretty harsh.

 

I really like the set because of how different you have to play it to get the most out of it, and it DOES perform really well once you do (unlike DM, which needs some SERIOUS buffing to balance it to the other sets).

[WindDemon21]

1 hour ago, SomeGuy said:

 

I will definitely defend KM as being one of the better sets, but you have absolutely valid points. The big wind up of CS does have a really awesome payoff, so I will excuse the cast delay on that all day long, but the other attacks on the set having the incredibly long windup that they do makes them VERY skippable to me.  The PBAoE definitely isn't skippable, and it is by no means weak, but that wind up is pretty harsh.

 

I really like the set because of how different you have to play it to get the most out of it, and it DOES perform really well once you do (unlike DM, which needs some SERIOUS buffing to balance it to the other sets).

Mechanically what the set OFFERS, yeah I like having the ranged and ranged cone. That being said so does both spines and claws. And I've actually just stated how the long windup of CS ISN'T validated. It's actually one of the worst ones because it both doesn't crit, and doesn't get the benefit of the scrapper ATOs. Especially the more you start IO'ing and finishing the build.

 

In fact adding hasten alone with enhancements in PS, makes it on average MUCH less more useful to have it recharge power siphon instead of doing actual crits.

 

Also, it should be known, that burst was bugged and was only getting 6 feet of radius, at least that seems to have been fixed thankfully. But all things considered, at the least CS NEEDS to be boosted by the scrapper ATOs procs/globals.

 

Seriously, i'm not joking, I had a 31 streak of NO power siphon recharge. and a 17 and 18 as well. No amount of random 1 or 2s make the mechanic worth dealing with those chances, especially when recharge/hasten/bonuses etc make the actual value of PS recharging from slow as molasses CS, much and much less worth it. In the IO world, and even SO world, I'd rather have it just plain do normal crits as a big finisher that gets the value of the scrapper ATOs, unless at the very least, they let it get those in it's current.

[WindDemon21]

Any chance @Booper could get a notice at this? I'm edging on pausing the toon, wanna play him but just too detrimental to the play and ruining the experience again, pretty much every time I have to use CS, so slow, and often doesn't recharge PS or does so when it woudln't matter anyway.

[WindDemon21]

It should also be noted if not specified earlier, how detrimental using CS is with the actual power siphon mechanic because of it's super slow cast time, it means you're never gaining full PS stacks in the ST chain and especially the aoe chains.