The Stapper

[AlwaysAPrice]

Almost the first thing I did when Page 5 launched was rebuild my recent favorite stalker's (DB/Bio) default build to drop Hide just because I could, then decided to go a step further and ruled out both Assassin's Blades and Placate - no stalker-specific powers allowed unless you count Build Up since DB/ uses a Follow Up type power on other ATs iirc. (For additional context, the character has all 3 builds fully slotted out with different epics to represent different flavors of power she can access with accompanying shifts in offensive/defensive priority, along with various costume slots assigned to build swap macros; I decided her "most human" base build could get away with leaving the supernaturally effective stealth of Hide to her 'powered up' forms).

And uhhhhh it's really not bad? As DB/, it gives me an opportunity to play with the combos I passed over on her other builds, and with the ATOs I still have a way to become Hidden. Like I don't proc the Hide as reliably without having it on AS but I still get a hidden crit here and there and even, if I luck out on the proc when finishing the last enemy of a spawn, a period of usable travel stealth now and again. My overall killspeed is down, especially when it comes to cleaning up stragglers that didn't get AoE'd down, since I don't have those quick clean AS crits to mop up with, but really not by that much! It still functions well, it's just a scrapper that uses Stalker ATOs.

 

Anybody else having dumb fun with hideless stalkers yet?

[Major_Decoy]

Honestly, I'd keep assassin's blade. I kind of get why you skipped it, but it's still useful without hide.

 

I'm still debating dropping hide on my Broad Sword/Invulnerability stalker.

Edited October 26, 2022 by Major_Decoy

[MistressOhm]

Hide is a REALLY CHEAP defense mule, you can pretty much run it with zero End straight out of the box.  I'd not skip it just because you don't actually want to sneak about, it's practically a Def passive.

[Random Axis]

On 10/20/2022 at 5:08 PM, AlwaysAPrice said:

Anybody else having dumb fun with hideless stalkers yet?

A few. I started a thread about hideless stalkers last week and got some good replies amidst the people telling me that hide is a good and useful skill for stalkers.

 

I've been fooling around with one in Mids (as best I can without it updated for page 5), but haven't made it because I have enough alts in progress as it is. Funnily, I was thinking DB for the primary like your is since I don't have a melee character with it and I think the dual chainsaws would be a funny option for stalker without hide.

Edited October 28, 2022 by Random Axis
Didn't paste in the part on my hideless stalker.

[StrikerFox]

Stalker DB combos are pretty bad compared to other ATs.

 

-The Attack Vitals combo uses the 2 worst dps powers on Stalkers to activate it (Nimble and Vengeful), negating it's usefulness.

 

-The Weaken combo, which may be useful at lower lever, is achievable at lvl 26 while other ATs get it at lvl 6.

 

-The Empower combo uses 2 non-attacks to activate and relies on BU and Placate recharge to keep it perma.

 

-The Sweep combo is a ST attack on Stalkers while other ATs, it's an AoE. It also relies on BU recharge and can't be reliably used continuously.

 

The only thing that makes Stalker DB advantageous over other ATs is Assassin's Blade. The attack chain of [BU]-AS-Abl-SS-Abl-repeat is solid and can easily integrate the Empower (BU-AS-Plac) and Sweep (BU-AS-Abl) combos with slight modification.

[AlwaysAPrice]

8 hours ago, StrikerFox said:

Stalker DB combos are pretty bad compared to other ATs.

 

For me it's just the opposite, I think Stalker is the best implementation of DB's combo mechanic (attack vitals does suck tho). Before this gimmick respec I routinely used Empower, Sweep, and Weaken and still have all of them on AoE-focused build 3 though I don't often bother with Weaken. Empower & Sweep in particular see a lot more frequent use with Superior Assassin's Mark in play (Empower becomes virtually perma because it's rare to go 20 seconds without proccing a BU refresh; also continuous Sweep may not be reliable but it is not infrequent and can be outright hilarious).

 

Meanwhile, with the DB Scrappers I've played, the performance I got just cycling a handful of attacks in an order that didn't line up with any combo felt way better than anything the combos could do for me. With a Scrapper if the build has room for it I might try to keep one or two combos at least available for situational use but they don't seem integral to the playstyle. On Stalkers they all just flow way more naturally into what I want to be doing.

 

10 hours ago, Random Axis said:

I think the dual chainsaws would be a funny option for stalker without hide.

 

Dual chainsaws/fiery aura for the least hidden hideless stalker possible.

[StrikerFox]

16 hours ago, AlwaysAPrice said:

Empower & Sweep in particular see a lot more frequent use with Superior Assassin's Mark in play

 

How would Empower and Sweep be used on your other build without Assassin's Blade? 

 

DB is good on a Stalker only because of Assassin's Blade. Without it, dps is lackluster and better 2 of 4 combos can't be used at all.

[AlwaysAPrice]

On 10/29/2022 at 9:40 AM, StrikerFox said:

How would Empower and Sweep be used on your other build without Assassin's Blade? 

 

Just before the quoted bit I mentioned I was talking about a different build that still has all the Stalker tricks, that response was about why I prefer Stalker DB combo implementation to Other DB in general, not in the context of the gimmick build - I acknowledged the main factor in any underperformance for that build is the lack of Assassin's in the OP.

[Spaghetti Betty]

I decided to roll a Fire/Stone like this. No Hide chosen whatsoever. Played by my usual x8 difficulty with amps.

 

What can I say other than it sucks. But that was implied. 1-10 was tedious. I at least have AS full of procs Prestige Enhancements so that it can potentially delete 1 target by itself.

 

Can't wait to get it to 50!