Ally only powers

[Maxzero]

14 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Why are you asking me that? I'm not arguing against you. The sole purpose of my comment was to respond to your comment that only Scrappers could solo decently when CoH first launched. And I'm saying that is nonsense. Every AT was good at soloing. (Except for Controllers because of how long it took them to do anything, but by god they were safe while slowly making their way through the missions.)

 

You want warnings for sets and their powers? Like I said, that information is already available on the character select screen if you click the green exclamation point that says Info. If it says "Friendlies"? Then it is ally only. If it says "Self"? It affects you too. And obviously, if it says "Enemies", it needs enemies to work.

 

Edit: Players can also use Mids, go to City of Data, or go to the wiki to get this information.

 

 

 

 

Its a bit rude to reply to a post and only respond to one point. It looks like thats the only point you are comfortable responding too. Especially when its not even the main issue.

 

Whats the issue with just a warning saying this power selection is 'team focused and poorer in non team activites?'

 

Its better then someone creating a character and finding out later on. Its not like it will take a lot of effort to implement.

 

The new player experience being a focus and all at the moment.

Edited February 16 by Maxzero

[Rudra]

21 minutes ago, Maxzero said:

 

Its a bit rude to reply to a post and only respond to one point. It looks like thats the only point you are comfortable responding too. Especially when its not even the main issue.

 

On 2/13/2024 at 1:09 AM, Rudra said:

I was planning on staying out of this conversation....

 

Look, I don't care if Empathy gets buffed or not. I have no stake in this. Your comparison however has me rather confused.

As long as you and the others debate the Empathy set? I'm going to sit the debate out. Like I said, I have no stake in it. If you are going to post nonsense? I'm going to reply.

 

24 minutes ago, Maxzero said:

Whats the issue with just a warning saying this power selection is 'team focused and poorer in non team activites?'

 

Its better then someone creating a character and finding out later on. Its not like it will take a lot of effort to implement.

 

The new player experience being a focus and all at the moment.

And for crying out loud, how many times do I have to say the warning is already there? I even showed you where the information is in game. Any player that wants to know what their chosen power set offers can see it at character creation. And that information is there so that any player, even new ones, can get the information they need to make more informed decisions for their characters. If you want something more? Fine. Just please stop pretending the warning isn't already there.

[Maxzero]

45 minutes ago, Rudra said:

 

As long as you and the others debate the Empathy set? I'm going to sit the debate out. Like I said, I have no stake in it. If you are going to post nonsense? I'm going to reply.

 

And for crying out loud, how many times do I have to say the warning is already there? I even showed you where the information is in game. Any player that wants to know what their chosen power set offers can see it at character creation. And that information is there so that any player, even new ones, can get the information they need to make more informed decisions for their characters. If you want something more? Fine. Just please stop pretending the warning isn't already there.

 

I don't think the current information is sufficient.

 

If we are going to make 2 tiers of support sets I think the limitations should be made clearer.

 

Since you said you a fine with that this conversation should be over.

Edited February 16 by Maxzero

[megaericzero]

10 hours ago, Maxzero said:

 

You act like buffing themselves is a mistake, that it is the wrong way to play. Who decides that? You may say the developers. So does that mean if it is changed to become self targetable you would agree that its now the right way to play?

 

>Then people complain that they're being punished for teaming because it locks them out of self-buffing.

 

As opposed to being locked out because you 'picked wrong' on the character select screen? I glad you agree with the warning because if you are going to create two tiers of supports sets then players should be fully informed before they make their selection.

I'm not here to appeal to authority; I'm just voicing my thoughts or opinions. I do think it's a mistake for reasons others and I have already gone over - it's counter to team play and support sets should not be useable as pseudo armor sets. If this change were implemented, I'd still think it's incorrect. Even if it's to throw a bone to soloing, I think keeping the door shut to prevent the potential problems to groups is more important.

 

Don't get me wrong. I hate aggressively Gaigaxian design too. I just don't think a support being largely unable to buff themself is a paradigm to shift. It's a fairly standard practice, at least in the games that I've played. I think it's sensible both in lore and mechanically.

 

As for disclaimers, I'm with you but I don't think it's as profound a point as you do? Like, yeah, players should be fully informed before they make decisions. I can see more warnings integrated into descriptions such as Energy Melee saying "Energy Melee offers more single-target damage but has less AOE than other sets" (last I played with this set was before the update so maybe this has changed?) or Controllers saying "the most powerful foes (EBs, AVs, GMs) may be nearly impossible for you to lock down on your own."

Edited February 16 by megaericzero
clarity

[TygerDarkstorm]

On 2/11/2024 at 1:29 AM, Maxzero said:

Is there any reason why we still have these?

 

Why do some sets loses 50%+ of their effectiveness if they have no one to cast their buffs on yet other powersets do not? Its not like Empathy is going to be OP if players can cast Fortitude on themselves.

 

You now have implemented QoL changes where certain ST shields and buffs affect the whole party except the person using the power. You end up in situations where everyone wants to group with a /Kin but no one actually wants to play one because the /Kin player gets all the grunt work while everyone else gets the fun.

 

So is this something that can be looked at?

Erm, you are aware that every buff /Kin provides to others it also provides to itself, yeah?

[Maxzero]

11 hours ago, TygerDarkstorm said:

Erm, you are aware that every buff /Kin provides to others it also provides to itself, yeah?

 

So /Kins can now Speedboost and ID themselves when those abilities were made AoE?

Edited February 17 by Maxzero

[Maxzero]

12 hours ago, megaericzero said:

I'm not here to appeal to authority; I'm just voicing my thoughts or opinions. I do think it's a mistake for reasons others and I have already gone over - it's counter to team play and support sets should not be useable as pseudo armor sets. If this change were implemented, I'd still think it's incorrect. Even if it's to throw a bone to soloing, I think keeping the door shut to prevent the potential problems to groups is more important.

 

Don't get me wrong. I hate aggressively Gaigaxian design too. I just don't think a support being largely unable to buff themself is a paradigm to shift. It's a fairly standard practice, at least in the games that I've played. I think it's sensible both in lore and mechanically.

 

As for disclaimers, I'm with you but I don't think it's as profound a point as you do? Like, yeah, players should be fully informed before they make decisions. I can see more warnings integrated into descriptions such as Energy Melee saying "Energy Melee offers more single-target damage but has less AOE than other sets" (last I played with this set was before the update so maybe this has changed?) or Controllers saying "the most powerful foes (EBs, AVs, GMs) may be nearly impossible for you to lock down on your own."

 

The thing is with later buff sets this 'can't buff self' was done away with and its probably made the 3 strongest/popular support sets overall in Time, Dark (esp Affinity) and Nature. I have heard everything from:

 

"Its always been this way!"

 

"Play something else!"

 

"It will be OP!"

 

Only the 3rd of which is concrete enough to generate possible responses. The other two basically being variants of: "I don't want Empathy to be able to solo because I just don't."

 

For some reason Empathy being able to solo terrfies some players. Like all the healbots in teams will suddenly vanish to play solo challenge content.

 

I must admit I was surprised but how some posters seem to take personal offence to just the idea of Empathy being able to self buff like the idea of a Emp Defender casting Fortitude on themselves makes them wake up in cold sweats.

[Luminara]

2 hours ago, Maxzero said:

So /Kins can now Speedboost and ID themselves when those abilities were made AoE?

 

Kinetics is already so strong that a player can solo the toughest enemies with it, with no Defense or Resistance, no status protection, or even Damage enhancements.  Hell, it's so over the top that you can skip the secondary entirely and still make a ridiculously strong character with pool melee attacks.  With intelligent selection of a complementary secondary and IOs, a Kin defender is just plain unbalanced now, and corruptors with a complementary primary are even further into banana balls territory.  Even */Kin controllers, with fewer real attacks and more limited debuffing options (if they take /Kin, they can't take something with high -Res, like /Sonic or /TA) are brokenly good.

 

I loathe ally-only powers, but your continual use of Kinetics as an example of why they should be changed... well, it implies that the problem is on your end, not the game's.  Perhaps it would be wise to take a step back and review your data and conclusions.

[TygerDarkstorm]

10 hours ago, Maxzero said:

 

So /Kins can now Speedboost and ID themselves when those abilities were made AoE?

The T3 I think is a single target ability you use to speed boost yourself. The mez protect ability is maybe the only thing /Kin can't do to themself, but the vast majority of buffs Kin provides to others, it also provides to itself.