Not a lot of talk about Ninja/Marine....hows it working out for everyone?

[Crysis]

Marine Affinity really has opened up a lot of opportunities for MM's, almost like it's a Dev's gift to the class.  

 

Have pretty much finished off my Necro/Marine and have a Thugs/Marine and Merc/Marine sitting in the library of alts ready to be leveled up and slotted to 38 or so.  Haven't built a Ninja/Marine yet but seems like being heavy melee focused with crits its a good combo on paper.  

 

Anyone take one to Incarnate levels yet?  Any play/slotting notes to share?

[Meknomancer]

25 minutes ago, Crysis said:

Marine Affinity really has opened up a lot of opportunities for MM's, almost like it's a Dev's gift to the class.  

 

Have pretty much finished off my Necro/Marine and have a Thugs/Marine and Merc/Marine sitting in the library of alts ready to be leveled up and slotted to 38 or so.  Haven't built a Ninja/Marine yet but seems like being heavy melee focused with crits its a good combo on paper.  

 

Anyone take one to Incarnate levels yet?  Any play/slotting notes to share?

 

Marine is made for mm's. Ninjas and Demons working out well so far after rolling mercs, necro, thugs and bots. Looks something like this, not sure skipping smoke flash was a good idea. Fold Space has been essential, the ninjas kb stuff and timing it so the mob is pulled back onto tide pool after the kb works really well. Like all melee pets they will die a ton on harder content. 

 

Still have to give mercs no. 1 spot with bots at no. 2. For hard content. Range wins. Melee pets have been getting hammered fast even buffed up on * content or solo tougher tf's like lrsf and the phalanx fight there just isn't time to resummon and buff before they die again.

 

Demons slightly ahead of ninjas. Necro slightly ahead of demons. But not really noticeable on the majority of content. 

NINJAS MARINE - Mastermind (Ninjas - Marine Affinity).mbd

[Crysis]

Mek, where would you place Ninjas vs Thugs?  Both are Defense oriented melee.

[Meknomancer]

4 hours ago, Crysis said:

Mek, where would you place Ninjas vs Thugs?  Both are Defense oriented melee.

 

Lately i prefer ninjas. I just like the crits and they feel like they are taking stuff out much faster than thugs. I ran a few solo morti kal since they were the weekly and only the demons were faster than the ninjas, i think if i'd taken smoke flash they may have won. Demons really surprised me, 23 min 11 seconds they were way ahead of even the mercs and necro pets.

[Crysis]

BTW, wanted to call out @Meknomancer and their slotting of Brine with TotN.  General consensus early on was this was a skippable power.  Slotting Health actually improves the -MaxHP debuff.  If applied at start of engagement, when health is at top end for target, this slotting is -very noticeable.-  Combined with the extra Crits from Smoke Flash, Ninjas chew up an EB, GM or AV quickly.

 

Dont sleep on taking and slotting Brine this way.

[Meknomancer]

On 8/26/2024 at 5:19 PM, Crysis said:

BTW, wanted to call out @Meknomancer and their slotting of Brine with TotN.  General consensus early on was this was a skippable power.  Slotting Health actually improves the -MaxHP debuff.  If applied at start of engagement, when health is at top end for target, this slotting is -very noticeable.-  Combined with the extra Crits from Smoke Flash, Ninjas chew up an EB, GM or AV quickly.

 

Dont sleep on taking and slotting Brine this way.

 

It was mainly to max out the hp debuff but also to get that tiny heal bonus for soothing wave. Just wish i had the slots to do that on all mm's. I've noticed a lot of good slotting on other builds (wish i could remember everyones names for credit) - the new hammi pieces that give acc/heal/absorb. 2-3 of those bumped to 53.

Edited August 27 by Meknomancer

[Bigwheela]

I main ninjas/dark so playing aqua ninjas is taking some getting use to

Iv had to learn a more stay in the back type of playing that hurts my soul to do 

The higher lvl iv got it the more fun it gets.

Having the power to just ground pound a whole group with an aoe is fun to do compared to just a slow area tar patch

 

Not yet to incarn lvls but if it stays as fun as it is i will keep using it

 

 

[Crysis]

At lvl 50, zero incarnates, no temps and without any level shifts, I'm getting 82 seconds (average across 6 tests) Pylon times.  This is slightly better than my Necro/Marine, and quite a bit better than Thugs even with double gang war.  Smoke Flash is a must I found to max out Ninja DPS.  With fast recharge, it's up pretty often and it's almost guaranteed to deliver two-three crits -per ninja- when it's activated.  Coupled with Shifting Tides, it's noticeable, especially with Brine'd targets.   To fit in Smoke Flash, I dropped Web Nade and stuck those slots into Tide Pool and Soothing.  I also dropped the second slots for the two travel powers (SS and Teleport) as there wasn't enough +Ranged DEF bonus there to get me much out of those, although I kept both with the -KB procs.  I also swapped Teleport for Combat Teleport, which when pinned to a bind (I use Lshift+LClick) is very handy for repositioning myself in tight quarters and/or to line up Soothing Wave.  It always seems I'm missing one of the Ninja's with Soothing when they need it most.  Besides, CT is just too fun, especially when you use the smoke bomb animation.  Whitecapping is your own personal damage dealer with the one arrow attack doing pathetic levels of damage...pretty much limited to picking off runners. 

 

As stated by Mek above though, being Def based, higher level content takes out the Ninja's quite quickly.  Maybe level shifts will help with that some, as well as Destiny>Barrier, but I suspect anything +RES will survive better than anything +DEF in hard mode missions.  

 

Modified @Meknomancer build attached, all credit to them.  You can sub in a few things for the purples and Hami's on a budget and they don't make a huge difference in effectiveness.   Namely:

 

-Explosive Strike proc for Soulbound Allegiance

-Devastation w/Proc for Apocalypse (although that Hold proc won't go off that often)

-Scirocco proc for the Armageddon proc

-Positron Blast w/Proc for the Ragnarok's

-Acc/Dam Edict of the Master for the Nucl Hami-O

-Any To-Hit/End for the Cyto Hami-0 (although Gaussian Buildup proc is a waste given your attacks, it doesn't hurt)

 

Yes, you won't be min-maxxed but you can't slot these until 50 anyways, so may as well use the subs I listed above to "be all you can be" until/unless you decide to make the investments.  Otherwise, build is as attached.  You can also Boost all the defensive pieces etc to really eek out a little more.  But if going for Barrier, kinda wasteful IMO.  YMMV.

 

 

Tidal Temptress - Mastermind (Ninjas - Marine Affinity).mbd

[R jobbus]

On 8/24/2024 at 11:32 AM, Meknomancer said:

 

Marine is made for mm's. Ninjas and Demons working out well so far after rolling mercs, necro, thugs and bots. Looks something like this, not sure skipping smoke flash was a good idea. Fold Space has been essential, the ninjas kb stuff and timing it so the mob is pulled back onto tide pool after the kb works really well. Like all melee pets they will die a ton on harder content. 

 

Still have to give mercs no. 1 spot with bots at no. 2. For hard content. Range wins. Melee pets have been getting hammered fast even buffed up on * content or solo tougher tf's like lrsf and the phalanx fight there just isn't time to resummon and buff before they die again.

 

Demons slightly ahead of ninjas. Necro slightly ahead of demons. But not really noticeable on the majority of content. 

NINJAS MARINE - Mastermind (Ninjas - Marine Affinity).mbd 40.77 kB · 46 downloads

 

If I'm trying to solo +4/x8  low insp/no temps content even at a slower pace, does marine enable that any more for MM than before and if so what do you recommend, or is MM still not all that cut out for soloing hard stuff. (if i'm wrong please point me in the direction, im not experienced with the class, just haven't had good results with it)

 

Does mercs/marine have a good shot at doing that or is it not really a good pick for what i'm trying to do. thanks for any advice

[Meknomancer]

4 minutes ago, R jobbus said:

 

If I'm trying to solo +4/x8  low insp/no temps content even at a slower pace, does marine enable that any more for MM than before and if so what do you recommend, or is MM still not all that cut out for soloing hard stuff. (if i'm wrong please point me in the direction, im not experienced with the class, just haven't had good results with it)

 

Does mercs/marine have a good shot at doing that or is it not really a good pick for what i'm trying to do. thanks for any advice

 

Marine makes all the pets sets work. The absorb, +defence, +hp, +damage, +to hit, -defence (if you took shoal rush) , -resistance from Whitecap+Brine makes it my favourite mm secondary. The extra hp for the pets is the big difference. Yes you can solo +4/8 as well as you can with /dark /traps /cold /time. I still think Mercs/Marine is no. 1, all the pets stacking -defence, you can add small amounts of - res from personal attacks, the M3Nade keeps mobs knocked down and slotted right will bump your recharge letting you keep serum on the pets perma and lowering downtime on power of the depths. 

 

Haven't had any issues on +4 content and its been through the labyrinth a few times vs harder stuff than that and only struggled when the eb's in there were +7/8/9. And that was solo. 

[R jobbus]

2 hours ago, Meknomancer said:

 

Marine makes all the pets sets work. The absorb, +defence, +hp, +damage, +to hit, -defence (if you took shoal rush) , -resistance from Whitecap+Brine makes it my favourite mm secondary. The extra hp for the pets is the big difference. Yes you can solo +4/8 as well as you can with /dark /traps /cold /time. I still think Mercs/Marine is no. 1, all the pets stacking -defence, you can add small amounts of - res from personal attacks, the M3Nade keeps mobs knocked down and slotted right will bump your recharge letting you keep serum on the pets perma and lowering downtime on power of the depths. 

 

Haven't had any issues on +4 content and its been through the labyrinth a few times vs harder stuff than that and only struggled when the eb's in there were +7/8/9. And that was solo. 

can I get an example build of mercs/marine if possible? i appreciate the info, sounds good

[Crysis]

3 hours ago, R jobbus said:

can I get an example build of mercs/marine if possible? i appreciate the info, sounds good

Couple of builds posted here…

 

 

[tidge]

On 8/27/2024 at 12:49 PM, Meknomancer said:

 

It was mainly to max out the hp debuff but also to get that tiny heal bonus for soothing wave. Just wish i had the slots to do that on all mm's. I've noticed a lot of good slotting on other builds (wish i could remember everyones names for credit) - the new hammi pieces that give acc/heal/absorb. 2-3 of those bumped to 53.

 

I dunno if it was one of my posts, but I have had 2x D-Sync Accuracy/Heals (Siphons) in Brine, nothing else (on my Controller). I wouldn't invest a third slot here, unless something is otherwise wrong with global Accuracy/ToHit. The -MaxHP is awesome, but I think using that third slot to put a %-Resistance piece in the AoE M30 Grenade would be a better force multiplier than the ED-wall effects in the 60-second-base single-target Brine.

 

Marine Affinity should be an incredibly high-performing set for MMs. I opted for a Controller because I've already got an alternate high-performing MM that I play all the time and I only have so much engagement with MMs (the mental load for the challenges I take my MM through can reach Repo Man levels of intensity)... so I wanted to see what Marine Affinity can do for a pseudo-MM like the Plant/Marine Controller. With Seeds of Confusion, Carrion Crawlers and even the Giant Fly Trap, Marine Affinity takes Plant Control (already somewhat OP) to another level.

[Meknomancer]

On 10/3/2024 at 2:33 PM, tidge said:

 

I dunno if it was one of my posts, but I have had 2x D-Sync Accuracy/Heals (Siphons) in Brine, nothing else (on my Controller). I wouldn't invest a third slot here, unless something is otherwise wrong with global Accuracy/ToHit. The -MaxHP is awesome, but I think using that third slot to put a %-Resistance piece in the AoE M30 Grenade would be a better force multiplier than the ED-wall effects in the 60-second-base single-target Brine.

 

Marine Affinity should be an incredibly high-performing set for MMs. I opted for a Controller because I've already got an alternate high-performing MM that I play all the time and I only have so much engagement with MMs (the mental load for the challenges I take my MM through can reach Repo Man levels of intensity)... so I wanted to see what Marine Affinity can do for a pseudo-MM like the Plant/Marine Controller. With Seeds of Confusion, Carrion Crawlers and even the Giant Fly Trap, Marine Affinity takes Plant Control (already somewhat OP) to another level.

 

It could very well have been you, i won't swear to it but i'm pretty sure i saw some slotted troller builds in that section of the forums, fire/marines running them in brine with the dam/end d-sync/hammi pieces in shifting tides. 

Edited October 4 by Meknomancer

[tidge]

I have it 5-slotted with 2x Acc/Dam/End 50+5 and three damage %procs. The Accuracy is needed for the %procs, it makes them surprisingly reliable. I only have damage boosted because there aren't cost-effective Acc/End reduction pieces.

 

On a MM, if Shifting Tides was going to be 5-slotted I'd probably just go with 5xAnnihilation (and include the %-Resistance piece). 5-slots gets +MaxEnd, a global Endurance discount, plus the enhancement values in the power. %Proc rates may be hurt of course, but the AoE is quite large and it is a sort of set-and-forget AoE. If I was short of slots, I might go with just 3 (Acc/Dam/End and %-Res) on a MM, because it is the %-Resistance that really improves henchmen performance.

[Meknomancer]

2 hours ago, tidge said:

I have it 5-slotted with 2x Acc/Dam/End 50+5 and three damage %procs. The Accuracy is needed for the %procs, it makes them surprisingly reliable. I only have damage boosted because there aren't cost-effective Acc/End reduction pieces.

 

On a MM, if Shifting Tides was going to be 5-slotted I'd probably just go with 5xAnnihilation (and include the %-Resistance piece). 5-slots gets +MaxEnd, a global Endurance discount, plus the enhancement values in the power. %Proc rates may be hurt of course, but the AoE is quite large and it is a sort of set-and-forget AoE. If I was short of slots, I might go with just 3 (Acc/Dam/End and %-Res) on a MM, because it is the %-Resistance that really improves henchmen performance.

 

I've only tried it with the annihilation - res proc so far, i always slot it for max damage. Usually a boosted rag dmg and a dmg/end piece with musculature does enough. If your solo vs av/gm and there's no mobs nearby i like shoal rush having the ability to start a frenzy. For max dmg tics.

[Lazarus]

On 8/26/2024 at 12:19 PM, Crysis said:

BTW, wanted to call out @Meknomancer and their slotting of Brine with TotN.  General consensus early on was this was a skippable power.  Slotting Health actually improves the -MaxHP debuff.  If applied at start of engagement, when health is at top end for target, this slotting is -very noticeable.-  Combined with the extra Crits from Smoke Flash, Ninjas chew up an EB, GM or AV quickly.

 

Dont sleep on taking and slotting Brine this way.

KEEP in mind the -hp debuff  "STACKS" even from self cast.

on my troller i can get 3x stacking for around -2k hp

[Crysis]

18 hours ago, Lazarus said:

KEEP in mind the -hp debuff  "STACKS" even from self cast.

on my troller i can get 3x stacking for around -2k hp

I’ve personally never seen it self stack but I can say Brine makes a /Marine MM with almost any primary a highly effective AV/GM soloer.  
 

It’s also incredibly effective on priority targets like Sappers, Surgeons and Repair bots.  One application of Brine -by itself- is enough to one-shot most of these even at +2/+3.  They are out of the fight before I even land my Whitecap spawn flattener.

[Lazarus]

4 hours ago, Crysis said:

I’ve personally never seen it self stack but I can say Brine makes a /Marine MM with almost any primary a highly effective AV/GM soloer.

ITS easy to test for your self.

I used the test pylons and monitored its health.

just to see how many times I can get it to stack.

[benai]

So that means /Marine is now the new /Time?

Thinking currently between Ninjas, Mercs or Bots for either /Marine or /Time.

I wish Beasts wouldnt suck so much.

I am currently tending more to Ninjas then the other two even through they are melee and melee primaries have a disadvantage due to ae attacks.