Alternate Animations

[Ultimo]

I know, there's a few threads around that discuss various specific power sets and such, but I thought a consolidated thread might be useful.  Perhaps it could become a sticky people could add to.

Basically, my purpose here is to suggest power sets, or specific powers, that could use alternate animations.  Keep in mind, I'm not posting this for the sake of argument, if you don't like a suggestion, that's fine... but please don't muddy the waters with disagreement.

I'll begin with a couple that are on my mind, and will add more as they come to me.  I hope others will add some of their own suggestions too.

 

ENERGY BLAST

Right now, all the blasts come from the hands.  Energy blasts from the EYES are quite common in the comics, it would be nice if there were animations that resembled this.  Most of the stances and such are already in the game, even.

 

FIGHTING (Pool)

It would be nice if selected Martial Arts animations could replace the attacks here.  For example, Boxing might be allowed to use the Storm Kick or Cobra Strike animation.  I know my Ninjas MM, who longs to get stuck in melee too, would love to be doing martial arts instead of boxing.

 

ALL ARMOUR SETS

Right now, many armour sets have extremely visible effects.  It would be nice if the minimal effects setting was actually MINIMAL.  I have great difficulty using Stone Armour or Bio Armour, because they're so UGLY.  Let's have a NO effects setting.

 

DUAL PISTOLS

I find the overly flashy gymnastics really ugly and unrealistic, and frequently out of character.  It would be nice if there was an alternate set of animations that were simpler and more realistic.

[Rudra]

14 minutes ago, Ultimo said:

I have great difficulty using Stone Armour or Bio Armour, because they're so UGLY. 

Invulnerability with stone skin textures: Stone Armor w/o the Stone Armor.

[BasiliskXVIII]

17 hours ago, Rudra said:

Invulnerability with stone skin textures: Stone Armor w/o the Stone Armor.

This ignores the fact that mechanically, Stone Armour is extremely different to Invuln. If your objective is that you want to try the set and not necessarily that you simply "have a stone armour concept" but you don't like the visuals there's not a lot you can do. For a game where the ability to express how your character looks is such a well-developed aspect, the idea that "you'll have a strong armor set, but you'll look like someone glued poop to you" feels wrongheaded.

 

If Ice Armour can get a variant without ice, I don't see why Stone and Bio can't do the same. Especially when, as you point out, the armour can very easily be represented by the costume.

[Rudra]

15 minutes ago, BasiliskXVIII said:

This ignores the fact that mechanically, Stone Armour is extremely different to Invuln. If your objective is that you want to try the set and not necessarily that you simply "have a stone armour concept" but you don't like the visuals there's not a lot you can do. For a game where the ability to express how your character looks is such a well-developed aspect, the idea that "you'll have a strong armor set, but you'll look like someone glued poop to you" feels wrongheaded.

 

If Ice Armour can get a variant without ice, I don't see why Stone and Bio can't do the same. Especially when, as you point out, the armour can very easily be represented by the costume.

I don't feel like having this argument for the umpteenth time. You can read through every other thread where this has been brought up. And which the author was also a part of. So my comment is simply how to have a stone character right now without having to have the Stone Armor effects. You don't have to have Stone Armor to be a sturdy stone character. You don't have to have Bio Armor to be a mutation or bio-themed character. So on and so forth.

[Excraft]

More options for animations and visuals is always a good thing IMO.  I'd love for more minimal/no VFX options for several of the armor sets.  More powerset customization is never a bad thing.

 

13 minutes ago, Rudra said:

So my comment is simply how to have a stone character right now without having to have the Stone Armor effects.

 

That's not a stone armor character, just a stone textured character without any of the powers available in the stone armor set. 

[TygerDarkstorm]

I honestly really hate the idea of taking away the visuals on armor sets that are meant to have strong visuals. Like, if you're choosing Bio/Stone/Ice/etc., then you're choosing an armor that has a distinctive appearance. "But I can't see my costume!" Then choose a different armor set; there are ones out there that don't affect costume visibility.

 

What is the point of having these armors if you're just going to option them away so they don't present? Turn them off out of combat to see your costume; you shouldn't be staring that much at yourself in combat anyway.

 

I know more options isn't a bad thing, it's just a personal gripe of mine. And I know that having the min option isn't taking away from my ability to play with the full effects. So despite my personal gripe, more options is a good thing for the folks who want this; y'all should be able to get your enjoyment too for something like this.

[megaericzero]

I'd like Energy Blast to get alternate FX options to use Force Field's bubbles or kinetic/gravity's visuals in place of the existing molecule design.

 

39 minutes ago, TygerDarkstorm said:

What is the point of having these armors if you're just going to option them away so they don't present?

Can't speak for the others but it would be nice if stone - outside of granite - to have options that look more... consciously-designed? Sculpted? More intentional than the wild asymmetry rock armor currently has, at least.

[BasiliskXVIII]

7 minutes ago, Rudra said:

I don't feel like having this argument for the umpteenth time. You can read through every other thread where this has been brought up. And which the author was also a part of. So my comment is simply how to have a stone character right now without having to have the Stone Armor effects. You don't have to have Stone Armor to be a sturdy stone character. You don't have to have Bio Armor to be a mutation or bio-themed character. So on and so forth.

You're the one who inserted yourself into the argument.
 

5 minutes ago, TygerDarkstorm said:

I honestly really hate the idea of taking away the visuals on armor sets that are meant to have strong visuals. Like, if you're choosing Bio/Stone/Ice/etc., then you're choosing an armor that has a distinctive appearance. "But I can't see my costume!" Then choose a different armor set; there are ones out there that don't affect costume visibility.

 

What is the point of having these armors if you're just going to option them away so they don't present? Turn them off out of combat to see your costume; you shouldn't be staring that much at yourself in combat anyway.

 

But the only reason that the set has a distinct set of strong visuals is that it has been decided that they do. The whole premise of power customization is that you're not forced to be bound to what the developer decided was the best way to represent their idea of the power was. Until it came along, invulnerability also had strong visuals, making you look like a walking light show. Or worse, if you were a villain, some kind of weird negative-light show. It isn't as though what the game chooses to depict as "stone" actually looks like stone—it's a representative abstraction. It's a low-poly blob with some gritty textures on it which kinda reads as stone because we've been primed to accept it as such by seeing the name "rock armor." 

 

They have already given the option to do away with Ice Armour's big clunky visuals by replacing it with auras that give the impression of frost forming on your body. Even if the "baby's first 3d modeling practice" rocks are considered an *absolutely essential* way of representing the powers in Stone Armor, there are so many ways that they could made less obtrusive. Have them appear and then fade them out after a few seconds and give the character the "crumbling" aura so it's clear that the rocks are there, but you're not being forced to see them. Or even have them pop up for combat only, like how they do it for spines-not my favourite option, but still an improvement.

[Rudra]

1 hour ago, Excraft said:

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

So my comment is simply how to have a stone character right now without having to have the Stone Armor effects.

 

That's not a stone armor character, just a stone textured character without any of the powers available in the stone armor set. 

Yeah, that's what I said. It is a stone character. Visually, mechanically, it is a stone character. Robust, hard to hurt, stone character. Players can have stone characters that can withstand anything the game can throw at them without any of Stone Armor's visual effects.

 

32 minutes ago, BasiliskXVIII said:

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

I don't feel like having this argument for the umpteenth time. You can read through every other thread where this has been brought up. And which the author was also a part of. So my comment is simply how to have a stone character right now without having to have the Stone Armor effects. You don't have to have Stone Armor to be a sturdy stone character. You don't have to have Bio Armor to be a mutation or bio-themed character. So on and so forth.

You're the one who inserted yourself into the argument.

I'm the one that gave a comment about how to have a stone character without having to use Stone Armor. I intentionally avoided making any comments specifically against the OP itself.

 

1 hour ago, Excraft said:

I'd love for more minimal/no VFX options for several of the armor sets. 

 

34 minutes ago, BasiliskXVIII said:

But the only reason that the set has a distinct set of strong visuals is that it has been decided that they do.

Since we're apparently going to have this argument again anyway, some sets rely on their visuals for their theme. Stripping away those visuals takes away what makes those sets their theme. Alternate visuals such as sculpted rocks of some type I can support. Just like I support the lava and crystal options. Taking away the rocks from Stone Armor I will never support.

 

1 hour ago, Excraft said:

More powerset customization is never a bad thing.

Yes, more options are a good thing. I support more options. Unless the option is to not have the thematic visuals that make a set what it is. Sets are designed around a theme/idea. Stone Armor is the character gets covered in stone (or lava or crystal). Taking that away because someone wants to see their costume? Make a rock textured character and use Invulnerability. There you go. Now you are a stone character without anything hiding your costume.

[BasiliskXVIII]

10 minutes ago, Rudra said:

I'm the one that gave a comment about how to have a stone character without having to use Stone Armor. I intentionally avoided making any comments specifically against the OP itself.

For future reference you really want to stay out of the argument, then the best way to do that is by not commenting in the thread.

 

See, when you present a suggestion that's super obvious and has been made in every one of those threads that you claim to be tired of, then what you're actually doing is making a passive-aggressive swipe, thereby starting the argument.

 

17 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Since we're apparently going to have this argument again anyway, some sets rely on their visuals for their theme. Stripping away those visuals takes away what makes those sets their theme. Alternate visuals such as sculpted rocks of some type I can support. Just like I support the lava and crystal options. Taking away the rocks from Stone Armor I will never support.

 

No. Stripping the visuals takes away what makes their theme to you. But the limits of your imagination are not a fair restriction to impose on others. If the manifestation of Stone Armour on my character were something like that the rock armour shows up, then about 5-10 seconds later fades away with a persistent "crumble" effect to let you know it's still running that's more than sufficient to indicate, to me, that you have empowered yourself with rocky armour and that either it has incorporated itself into your body in such a way as it is not obtrusive, or that it's just accepted as present without needing to be visible. Energy Aura mostly behaves in this way, where activating the armour initially shows big spinning whorls of energy, but eventually fades down to a subtle glow. Plus, if you actually like one of the armours, such as, let's say, Crystal Armour, but find that the misshapen lumps of the crystal form of rock armour are a detraction, this would also empower you to display the armours that you like without needing everything on at all times.

[Rudra]

7 minutes ago, BasiliskXVIII said:

f the manifestation of Stone Armour on my character were something like that the rock armour shows up, then about 5-10 seconds later fades away with a persistent "crumble" effect to let you know it's still running that's more than sufficient to indicate, to me, that you have empowered yourself with rocky armour and that either it has incorporated itself into your body in such a way as it is not obtrusive, or that it's just accepted as present without needing to be visible.

That would be fine. You summoned the rocks, they appeared, now you instead have a rock field (the crumbling effect) that continues. Those rocks are there and affording you protection. They are just granular and constantly moving. Having that as an alternate selectable effect for Stone Armor would be an option I would agree with.

[Excraft]

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

Yeah, that's what I said. It is a stone character. Visually, mechanically, it is a stone character. Robust, hard to hurt, stone character. Players can have stone characters that can withstand anything the game can throw at them without any of Stone Armor's visual effects.

 

If the character does not have any of the powers in the Stone Armor set, then it isn't a Stone Armor character.  It's something else.

 

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

Yes, more options are a good thing. I support more options. Unless the option is to not have the thematic visuals that make a set what it is. Sets are designed around a theme/idea. Stone Armor is the character gets covered in stone (or lava or crystal). Taking that away because someone wants to see their costume?

 

It sounds like you're in favor of options, so long as they're options you like and approve of or would use.  Giving people the option to have minimal/no VFX on powers is an option that you don't have to use if you don't want to.  That's the beauty of optional things. 

 

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

Make a rock textured character and use Invulnerability. There you go. Now you are a stone character without anything hiding your costume.

 

Well no, you're an Invulnerability character with a rock texture.  You don't have any of the power specific to the Stone Armor set.

[Rudra]

1 minute ago, Excraft said:

 

If the character does not have any of the powers in the Stone Armor set, then it isn't a Stone Armor character.  It's something else.

 

1 minute ago, Excraft said:

Yeah, that's what I said. It is a stone character. Visually, mechanically, it is a stone character. Robust, hard to hurt, stone character. Players can have stone characters that can withstand anything the game can throw at them without any of Stone Armor's visual effects.

Emphasis added since you are either intentionally ignoring it or somehow missing it.

 

2 minutes ago, Excraft said:

 

It sounds like you're in favor of options, so long as they're options you like and approve of or would use.  Giving people the option to have minimal/no VFX on powers is an option that you don't have to use if you don't want to.  That's the beauty of optional things. 

If a player wants to make a character concept, they are free to do so. If the tools to make said character do not already exist in the game, then I support their requests. Making a stone character that does not have the visuals of Stone Armor is already available in the game.

 

3 minutes ago, Excraft said:

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

Make a rock textured character and use Invulnerability. There you go. Now you are a stone character without anything hiding your costume.

 

Well no, you're an Invulnerability character with a rock texture.  You don't have any of the power specific to the Stone Armor set.

Emphasis added.

[arcane]

I am in favor of:

 

- Proliferation of more Minimal FX options.

 

- Creation of more alternative animation options as the developers are able.

 

I am NOT in favor of:

 

- Porting animations from one set or pool to another. 
 

If you want Martial Arts animations, play Martial Arts.

[Excraft]

3 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Emphasis added since you are either intentionally ignoring it or somehow missing it.

 

Well no, you're misrepresenting what I'm saying and I believe you know that.  The discussion is about powers, not costume textures.  A player making an Invulnerability character isn't making a Stone Armor character.  Invulnerability doesn't have Mudpots or Crystal Armor and such. 

 

22 minutes ago, BasiliskXVIII said:

Stripping the visuals takes away what makes their theme to you. But the limits of your imagination are not a fair restriction to impose on others.

 

^ That.

[Rudra]

1 minute ago, Excraft said:

Well no, you're misrepresenting what I'm saying and I believe you know that.  The discussion is about powers, not costume textures.  A player making an Invulnerability character isn't making a Stone Armor character.  Invulnerability doesn't have Mudpots or Crystal Armor and such. 

If you are making a character that uses stone armor, not is a being made of stone, but is using stone armor in some way, then use the Stone Armor set. That is why it is there. If you are making a character that is stone, either stone skin, is a golem, or any other such reason, whose very nature as a being is stone and so is difficult to hurt but does not use stone as an armor, then use Invulnerability. That is why it is there. If all you care about is say Mud Pots? Then ask for an ancillary Earth Mastery set that has Mud Pots.

[Excraft]

5 minutes ago, Rudra said:

If you are making a character that uses stone armor, not is a being made of stone, but is using stone armor in some way, then use the Stone Armor set. That is why it is there. If you are making a character that is stone, either stone skin, is a golem, or any other such reason, whose very nature as a being is stone and so is difficult to hurt but does not use stone as an armor, then use Invulnerability. That is why it is there. If all you care about is say Mud Pots? Then ask for an ancillary Earth Mastery set that has Mud Pots.

 

Ok, so its clear you're being willfully contrarian and argumentative.  A player can make whatever character concept they like with whatever skin texture they like and it doesn't need to conform to your ideas of what is or isn't appropriate for their chosen power sets.  Having more options for minimal/no VFX on any set doesn't negatively impact you in any way since you don't need to use those options. 

[Ultimo]

22 hours ago, Ultimo said:

I know, there's a few threads around that discuss various specific power sets and such, but I thought a consolidated thread might be useful.  Perhaps it could become a sticky people could add to.

Basically, my purpose here is to suggest power sets, or specific powers, that could use alternate animations.  Keep in mind, I'm not posting this for the sake of argument, if you don't like a suggestion, that's fine... but please don't muddy the waters with disagreement.

I'll begin with a couple that are on my mind, and will add more as they come to me.  I hope others will add some of their own suggestions too.

 

 

Folks, if you please...

[megaericzero]

I think a better example of alternate stone armor would be the time Tony fashioned a makeshift Iron Man suit out of literal rocks and rope.

 

Jumping back to the thread topic: my pie-in-the-sky wish is for non-weapon sets to be able to incorporate weapons and their associated animations. For example, Fire Blast but all my attacks are flaming arrows or Electrical Melee striking through a [legally-distinct medieval weapon].

[Stormwalker]

23 hours ago, Ultimo said:

ENERGY BLAST

Right now, all the blasts come from the hands.  Energy blasts from the EYES are quite common in the comics, it would be nice if there were animations that resembled this.  Most of the stances and such are already in the game, even.

 

To be honest, I'm pretty sure they've deliberately avoided this with Energy Blast because Energy Blast is so very similar to Cyclops' optic blast in terms of  its "concussive blast" style.

 

23 hours ago, Ultimo said:

DUAL PISTOLS

I find the overly flashy gymnastics really ugly and unrealistic, and frequently out of character.  It would be nice if there was an alternate set of animations that were simpler and more realistic.

 

I'm entirely in favor of this idea, but the tricky part is that the animation times would have to be the same as the original animations, and it might be very difficult to do that without looking wonky.

[Rudra]

11 minutes ago, megaericzero said:

I think a better example of alternate stone armor would be the time Tony fashioned a makeshift Iron Man suit out of literal rocks and rope.

 

Jumping back to the thread topic: my pie-in-the-sky wish is for non-weapon sets to be able to incorporate weapons and their associated animations. For example, Fire Blast but all my attacks are flaming arrows or Electrical Melee striking through a [legally-distinct medieval weapon].

Sure, sculpted works fine. I already agreed with that. Let there be a sculpted stone option that players can select in their power customization window.

[megaericzero]

49 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Sure, sculpted works fine. I already agreed with that. Let there be a sculpted stone option that players can select in their power customization window.

Sorry. That was more meant to re-rail the thread in general since we were circling the invulnerability and costume bullet points.

 

--

 

Continuing with weapons and non-weapons: Fire/Ice/Stone Melee (and Manipulation, etc.) alternates for no-sword/mallet and all-sword/mallet.

[TheMoneyMaker]

3 hours ago, arcane said:

I am in favor of:

 

- Proliferation of more Minimal FX options.

 

- Creation of more alternative animation options as the developers are able.

 

I am NOT in favor of:

 

- Porting animations from one set or pool to another. 
 

If you want Martial Arts animations, play Martial Arts.

Martial arts are not available to some ATs despite the AT possessing something that would indicate a martial arts theme on some level.  In other words, one cannot play as a martial arts mastermind, and playing as a ninja mastermind only gives you bow and arrow attacks. You cannot wield a ninja sword, you cannot use martial arts. Since this is a limitation of the set, adding an option outside the primary and secondary options to give a little more appropriate depth seems like an easy fix. Perhaps a better option would be a Martial Mastery ancillary pool for masterminds, but wouldn't it be simpler to add two alternate animation effects to the fighting pool than to create a new pool just for MMs?

 

[ZacKing]

On 3/10/2025 at 8:41 PM, Ultimo said:

ENERGY BLAST

Right now, all the blasts come from the hands.  Energy blasts from the EYES are quite common in the comics, it would be nice if there were animations that resembled this.  Most of the stances and such are already in the game, even.

 

FIGHTING (Pool)

It would be nice if selected Martial Arts animations could replace the attacks here.  For example, Boxing might be allowed to use the Storm Kick or Cobra Strike animation.  I know my Ninjas MM, who longs to get stuck in melee too, would love to be doing martial arts instead of boxing.

 

ALL ARMOUR SETS

Right now, many armour sets have extremely visible effects.  It would be nice if the minimal effects setting was actually MINIMAL.  I have great difficulty using Stone Armour or Bio Armour, because they're so UGLY.  Let's have a NO effects setting.

 

DUAL PISTOLS

I find the overly flashy gymnastics really ugly and unrealistic, and frequently out of character.  It would be nice if there was an alternate set of animations that were simpler and more realistic.

 

Love these suggestions.  I really hate that there are a couple of powers that say they have "no vfx", but they actually do have some.  Alternate animations are always welcome to me. 

[TygerDarkstorm]

18 hours ago, BasiliskXVIII said:

You're the one who inserted yourself into the argument.
 

 

But the only reason that the set has a distinct set of strong visuals is that it has been decided that they do. The whole premise of power customization is that you're not forced to be bound to what the developer decided was the best way to represent their idea of the power was. Until it came along, invulnerability also had strong visuals, making you look like a walking light show. Or worse, if you were a villain, some kind of weird negative-light show. It isn't as though what the game chooses to depict as "stone" actually looks like stone—it's a representative abstraction. It's a low-poly blob with some gritty textures on it which kinda reads as stone because we've been primed to accept it as such by seeing the name "rock armor." 

 

They have already given the option to do away with Ice Armour's big clunky visuals by replacing it with auras that give the impression of frost forming on your body. Even if the "baby's first 3d modeling practice" rocks are considered an *absolutely essential* way of representing the powers in Stone Armor, there are so many ways that they could made less obtrusive. Have them appear and then fade them out after a few seconds and give the character the "crumbling" aura so it's clear that the rocks are there, but you're not being forced to see them. Or even have them pop up for combat only, like how they do it for spines-not my favourite option, but still an improvement.

I appreciate both your and @megaericzero's insights. 🙂 They're actually both solid ideas and I'm glad folks more creative than myself are around with these ideas. 

 

And ultimately, as I said in my post, more options is never a bad thing since that's what they'll always be: more options and not removing the original entirely.