New to MM, not thrilled, what am I missing?

[TrashBasher]

Hi MMs, I want to appreciate this AT, but what I find is that I am spending a lot of time resummoning and upgrading my bots (I'm Bots/Time).  Heck I even have to summon then after travelling as they get picked off as I travel from mission to mission.  

 

There are up to 5 powers to get them up and running and a minimum of 3.  During missions I end up resummoning a few times per map.  I recall one time I just gave up and kept just the assault bot.  

 

I don't have it fully slotted out as I am just lvl 41, but still I have a good build with Maneuvers, farsight etc. 

 

One thing I may be doing wrong is debuffing the mobs with my PBAoE.  Time Juncture is a PBAoE debuff so generally I jump into the fray and debuff.  This may be drawing my bots in too close and this is why they are getting picked off so often, but the debuff is worth the tradeoff in terms of combat, but not in terms of fun.

 

Is this just the way the MM plays, or can I make changes to keep the bots alive more frequently.  

[tidge]

I don't run time as a MM secondary, but I do use bots as the primary. Like many MMs I use keybinds to make my spawning and buffing go faster. I don't use the masterclass binds, but something a little more homebrewed with the numpad. Mileage varies, and everyone has their own methods for pet controls.

 

I use the numpad0 to summon the bots, and ALT+numpad0 to upgrade with the primary powers.

CTRL+Numpad (1,2,3) targets the (next) closest visible bot of a specific Tier.

ALT+Numpad (1,2,3) is bound to a specific power (Grant Invisibility) that can be tossed on a bot of the specific Tier.

 

The (circular) summoning chain starts with this keybind:

 

/bind numpad0 "sg Battle Drones$$+down$$-down$$pow_exec_location me Battle Drones$$bind_load_file j:\\COH_binds\summon_bot_2.txt"

 

and then I have 3 single-line text files

 

summon_bot_1.txt:

numpad0 "sg Battle Drones$$+down$$-down$$pow_exec_location me Battle Drones$$bind_load_file j:\\COH_binds\summon_bot_2.txt"

 

summon_bot_2.txt:

numpad0 "sg Protector Bots$$+down$$-down$$pow_exec_location me Protector Bots$$bind_load_file j:\\COH_binds\summon_bot_3.txt"

 

summon_bot_3.txt:

numpad0 "sg Assault Bot$$+down$$-down$$pow_exec_location me Assault Bot$$bind_load_file j:\\COH_binds\summon_bot_1.txt"

 

For simply targeting the bots, I have keybinds to target a bot of a given tier (default names used):

/bind ctrl+numpad1 "target_name Battle Drone"
/bind ctrl+numpad2 "target_name Protector Bot"
/bind ctrl+numpad3 "target_name Assault Bot"

 

The upgrade path uses a similar "circular" keybind and textfiles:

 

/bind alt+numpad0 "sg Equipping Bots$$+down$$-down$$powexec_name Equip Robot$$bind_load_file j:\\COH_binds\bot_upgrade_2.txt"

 

bot_upgrade_1.txt:

alt+numpad0 "sg Equipping Bots$$+down$$-down$$powexec_name Equip Robot$$bind_load_file j:\\COH_binds\bot_upgrade_2.txt"

 

bot_upgrade_2.txt:

alt+numpad0 "sg Upgrading Bots$$+down$$-down$$powexec_name Upgrade Robot$$bind_load_file j:\\COH_binds\bot_upgrade_1.txt"

 

The powers Equip Robot and Upgrade Robot are AoE, so you only need to target a single bot to hit them all (after summoning). They keep their upgrades across maps and zones.

 

If you are going to cast a single non-AoE power on the bots (I use Grant Invisibility and it works similarly for Aid Other) ,  you can mimic what I did, starting with keybinds:

 

/bind numpad1 "+down$$-down$$target_name Battle Drone$$bind_load_file j:\\COH_binds\bd_invis_2.txt"
/bind numpad2 "+down$$-down$$target_name Protector Bot$$bind_load_file j:\\COH_binds\pb_invis_2.txt"
/bind numpad3 "+down$$-down$$target_name Assault Bot$$bind_load_file j:\\COH_binds\ab_invis_2.txt"

 

and then each of the bots has another 'circular' set of txt files. For example the battle drone files are:

 

bd_invis_1.txt:

numpad1 "+down$$-down$$target_name Battle Drone$$bind_load_file j:\\COH_binds\bd_invis_2.txt"

 

bd_invis_2.txt:

numpad1 "+down$$-down$$powexec_name Grant Invisibility$$bind_load_file j:\\COH_binds\bd_invis_1.txt"

 

I use the 'floating powers bar' to hold icons for pet controls, including:

 

/macro_image "PetCommand_action_Goto" "GoTo" "petcom_all goto"
/macro_image "PetCommand_Action_Dismiss" "Dismiss" "petcom_all dismiss"
/macro_image "PetCommand_Action_Stay" "Stay" "petcom_all stay"
/macro_image "PetCommand_Action_Follow" "Follow" "petcom_all follow"

/macro_image "PetCommand_Stance_Defensive" "Protect" "+down$$-down$$petcom_all follow$$petcom_all defensive$$"

/macro_image "PetCommand_Action_Dismiss" "Dismiss" "petcom_all dismiss"

 

 

 

[TrashBasher]

Wow, those are binds and macros that I had not seen before, that will help a lot I think!

[Seigmoraig]

1 hour ago, TrashBasher said:

Heck I even have to summon then after travelling as they get picked off as I travel from mission to mission.  

The problem here is that you are probably not setting your pets to passive when traveling so they will attack anything that crosses their path if they are on agressive, or anything that attacks you if they are on defensive.

 

I really like the MM numpad keybinds, not particularly the truncated version that tidge uses, but the full on numpad commands:
0 - selects all
1,2,3 - selects the tiers of pets
4,5,6 - agressive, defensive, passive
7,8,9 - attack, follow, go to
/ * - summons the pet tiers
+ (enter) apply the buffs
For a full breakdown on how to create the bind files, please see here: https://forums.homecomingservers.com/topic/6503-the-homecoming-of-sandolphans-mm-numpad-binds/

So with this setup when traveling you would hit 0 on the numpad select them all, then 6 to set them to passive and they should stay alive between missions no prob

 

Quote

I don't have it fully slotted out as I am just lvl 41, but still I have a good build with Maneuvers, farsight etc. 

One of the main reasons your pets will get shredded is if you don't have the proper resist and defence IO enhancements. If you want to function properly you need to have the following in your pet slots either T1,T2,T3 pets or in the secondary pets that Demons, Thugs and Necros get (Gang War, Hell on Earth and Soul Extraction). The IOs you are looking for are are in:
Command of the Mastermind
Mark of Supremacy
Sovereign Right
Call to Arms
Expedient Reinforcements
Edict of the Master

These will give stacking +Def and +Res auras that will affect all of your pets making them extremely more durable and are basically mandatory if you plan on doing anything above difficulty setting +0/1
 

Edited April 24, 2020 by Seigmoraig

[CaptainLupis]

With the bots there are a couple of things that might help. The sudden impact knockback to knockdown IO can make a huge difference as it keeps the mobs in the AOE area, so more damage, and would keep them in your /time debuff zones. 

If you aren't using sets yet I'd consider slotting a couple of common defence IOs in your protector bots until you get your sets and unique IOs (as mentioned above) sorted. Bots bubbles are, if memory serves, 7.5% each and both stack so the extra def for the assault bot and 3 little bots might help along with your farsight, if that's slotted out for defence you are looking at around 35% def for the majority of your bots. Between that, your AoE heal, and -tohit debuff they really shouldn't really be dieing much.

[gourdhead]

If you don't mind me asking, why aren't your bots fully slotted at level 41?  My bots/time is only 28, and I'm six slotted on drones and protectors, 3 slotted on assault, with sets in T1 and T3.  Where are your slots going, if not in your bots?

 

What I do is use a "goto" bind to charge the bots into spawns, and then drop distortion field on top of them.  depending on difficulty and end usage, I'll set temporal mending on autofire, then hit high value targets with my debuffs.  I'm currently running missions at +2/0, with no issues.

 

[tjknight]

I see posts like this and I just get really confused. I've played a variety of MM's since the old live days, and my pets just don't die when travelling. I don't use fancy keybinds, or complicated commands.  My pets typically are in Defensive Follow mode and arrive at my destination with me.  The only time I lose all my pets in battle is if I pull too much aggro, or get hit with a massive AOE.  It's not that I don't believe people when they say their pets die frequently and they have to constantly re-summon. It's that I can't figure out how it's happening, especially when travelling. 

[Seigmoraig]

1 hour ago, tjknight said:

It's that I can't figure out how it's happening, especially when travelling

Pets are on aggressive, that's all there is to it

[CaptainLupis]

12 hours ago, Seigmoraig said:

Pets are on aggressive, that's all there is to it

Not entirely. Travel speed is also a factor, if you are using fly they are chasing after you and are in danger for longer than if you are using SS or SJ. With SS and SJ you are usually outdistancing them  enough that they are regularly having to respawn closer to you, rather than running the entire distance through spawns.

[CaptainLupis]

On 4/24/2020 at 4:11 PM, TrashBasher said:

Hi MMs, I want to appreciate this AT, but what I find is that I am spending a lot of time resummoning and upgrading my bots (I'm Bots/Time).  Heck I even have to summon then after travelling as they get picked off as I travel from mission to mission.  

 

There are up to 5 powers to get them up and running and a minimum of 3.  During missions I end up resummoning a few times per map.  I recall one time I just gave up and kept just the assault bot.  

 

I don't have it fully slotted out as I am just lvl 41, but still I have a good build with Maneuvers, farsight etc. 

 

One thing I may be doing wrong is debuffing the mobs with my PBAoE.  Time Juncture is a PBAoE debuff so generally I jump into the fray and debuff.  This may be drawing my bots in too close and this is why they are getting picked off so often, but the debuff is worth the tradeoff in terms of combat, but not in terms of fun.

 

Is this just the way the MM plays, or can I make changes to keep the bots alive more frequently.  

Just think yourself lucky you weren't playing them on live when they first were introduced. They would despawn every time you zoned, entered or left a mission. Fun for ambushes. Also you had to upgrade each pet individually every single time, so your 5 powers was 3 summons plus 6x2 upgrades back then.

 

Kid MMs today don't know good they have it! 😉  

Edited April 28, 2020 by CaptainLupis

[TrashBasher]

17 hours ago, gourdhead said:

If you don't mind me asking, why aren't your bots fully slotted at level 41?  My bots/time is only 28, and I'm six slotted on drones and protectors, 3 slotted on assault, with sets in T1 and T3.  Where are your slots going, if not in your bots?

 

What I do is use a "goto" bind to charge the bots into spawns, and then drop distortion field on top of them.  depending on difficulty and end usage, I'll set temporal mending on autofire, then hit high value targets with my debuffs.  I'm currently running missions at +2/0, with no issues.

 

They are 6 slotted, but not IO slotted

[TrashBasher]

16 minutes ago, CaptainLupis said:

Not entirely. Travel speed is also a factor, if you are using fly they are chasing after you and are in danger for longer than if you are using SS or SJ. With SS and SJ you are usually outdistancing them  enough that they are regularly having to respawn closer to you, rather than running the entire distance through spawns.

Ahhhh, this seems likley.  I have a passive bind and that didn't work, so speed is the issue.  I need to get them out of my range asap.

[Dixa]

On 4/24/2020 at 8:11 AM, TrashBasher said:

Hi MMs, I want to appreciate this AT, but what I find is that I am spending a lot of time resummoning and upgrading my bots (I'm Bots/Time).  Heck I even have to summon then after travelling as they get picked off as I travel from mission to mission.  

 

There are up to 5 powers to get them up and running and a minimum of 3.  During missions I end up resummoning a few times per map.  I recall one time I just gave up and kept just the assault bot.  

 

I don't have it fully slotted out as I am just lvl 41, but still I have a good build with Maneuvers, farsight etc. 

 

One thing I may be doing wrong is debuffing the mobs with my PBAoE.  Time Juncture is a PBAoE debuff so generally I jump into the fray and debuff.  This may be drawing my bots in too close and this is why they are getting picked off so often, but the debuff is worth the tradeoff in terms of combat, but not in terms of fun.

 

Is this just the way the MM plays, or can I make changes to keep the bots alive more frequently.  

unless you are married to super jump, the ideal way to do this is to get within 40 of the pack then teleport yourself in while in bodyguard. your pets will follow quickly but will usually stop and unload before they actually get to you due to bodyguard being triggered.

 

bring break frees. 

 

your pets should be on defensive follow or goto follow and within supremacy range for bodyguard unless you are doing content that you find trivial. if yoru pets are in any other combination you do not get bodyguard. 

 

all pets do have better and more consistent attack chains I've noticed (noticed, not analyzed) if left on aggressive. but you are also a wet noodle in this state. 

 

watched a few vids of a beasts/ff recently. pets always in aggressive. he was trying to show off his build in DA. he died 3 times because he was not in bodyguard. he died. his pets were still alive. that's shameful and wastes your time running back and having to resummon everything. 

Edited April 25, 2020 by Dixa

[Coyote]

I usually put a tier in Aggressive (usually the Tier 3, they can handle it better), to balance between more aggressive attacking and personal protection. If I'm feeling really strong defensively (Demons/Time), I may put 2 tiers in Aggressive.

[The_Cheeseman]

On my Demons/Thermal, I tend to leave the T1s and the Ember Demon in bodyguard mode, and let the Prince and Hellfire Gargoyle run wild. Those two do the most damage, and the Prince even has some control powers to protect itself. The Ember Demon can heal when needed, and I prefer that he not run too far away, so that I can keep his Ember Shield. The Demonlings are mostly there to absorb hits for me, but they have the KB proc in them to help distract anything that tries to focus on me.

 

However, I find that opening with Bonfire is more than enough to activate all my bodyguards. 😉

 

[Coyote]

That's a good thought... I use Sandolphan's binds rather than clicking on them, so I never considered splitting the Tier 2s. That would work great for Demons, though, who have different types within the tiers. Might even work for Thugs, keeping the Arsonist on Defensive so he remains a bit less suicidal than usual.

While I do keep the Prince on Aggressive, I always like to control his target so that we can double up Holds on a Boss and take care of a nasty Boss, or have him Hold a dangerous Lt while I hold another. Depends on the mob type, of course.

[The_Cheeseman]

Oh, and a QoL thing for Demons MMs: you can use the command, "/macro Idle "/petsaypow "Summon Demons" <em ghoulflex>" to create a macro that maks the T2s do an animation that looks basically like their normal idle, but eliminates the constant roaring! Nice for keeping them quiet while standing around.

[TheSpiritFox]

With bot shields, maneuvers, and farsight your bots should be close to soft capped. Do you have the pet uniques for defense yet? I highly recommend you slot the 2 5% defense auras. 

 

I found bots to be pretty solidly survivable. With good slotting like my thugs/time is even very tanky. Bots/time should be decently tanky. If you're having to resummon several times per map I would say your defenses need some work. 

Also, a note. Bots are unique in that their protector bot bubbles have to be cast, so after summoning bots you have to let them sit and buff each other for a second before they reach full survivability. One of the few annoying leftovers from ye olden times, protector bots are the only force fielders who do not cast in an AoE now. 

[Palladiamors]

Bot are THE most durable of the mastermind powersets so you're doing something wrong.  IO them at 22 ((Since you have the assault bot I know you're a higher level)) and put two resistance IO's into your protector bots.  For me I go three damage,  one accuracy,  and two defense for them.  For time you want Farsight six slotted with three defense,  three recharge reduction,  and Temporal mending six slotted with three healing,  three recharge reduction and make sure you have Times Juncture and keep it on.  This makes Farsight two seconds off from being perma,  or 'good enough',  and puts mending at a nine second cooldown which should be plenty while Times Juncture lowers the enemies damage done.

For comparison,  I have a ninja/time and with that combination I also had to take Aid Other to keep up with the healing load,  while my bots/time doesn't need aid other to keep up.  Neither does thugs/time.  

If it gives you something to shoot for,  my merc/nature is at fifty now and I am running at +3+3 and only rarely lose any soldiers and Merc is considered to be the worst of the mastermind powersets.

Also offhand advice,  give each of the materminds a run up to twelve at least.  Bots gets heavily lauded but for my buck its one of the least fun of the mastermind sets.  Off the top of my head the only job that doesn't really get started even at twelve is beast master,  but eventually they develop into a whirlwind of destruction.  Fragile destruction,  but destruction none the less.

Edited April 26, 2020 by Palladiamors