Creating PVE story zones from PVP zones.

[Greycat]

Since this came up in discussion elsewhere... kind of a runthrough of the existing PVP zones and what it might look like.

 

First thing, no, this is not replacing the PVP zones. The PVP zones stay as is, dedicated for PVP (though some overhauls need to be done in some - specifically Siren's (a) needs better rewards, because working for a bunch of rep being turned in for an SO or insp is ridiculous, and (B) watching two groups stare at each other for 20 minutes before charging in and having one randomly win is boring... but that's a separate discussion.) A separate copy - or copies - for PVE story missions, however, could work.

 

Also, no, the PVE zones don't get the PVP rewards, or if they get something similar, not at the same strength. They'll have story arcs, after all - there'll be piles of merits involved. 3-4 arcs, with merit reward, plus if you do them all iin each zone, it's treated like a story zone and you get an extra bonus set of merits the first time you finish. So you're already getting fairly well rewarded.

 

Potential reward: Much as I hate to say it... some other sort of merit. At the end you can get a PVE one-use version of the Shivan, or a weaker Nuke, or if you get all the zones, a sort of "chronal mech." Refresh said mech by building merits back up, or hitting the side-contact in each zone and doing something for them again. (Or just one, but the refresh is weaker.) Yes, reachable through ouro. Each PVE zone also auto-exemps you down to the appropriate level, just like the PVP zones.

 

Not all are co-op. Some just don't have a threat that would make one side (mostly) ignore the other being there, after all. But we'll deal zone by zone.

Why do this? Because the person who commented about there being story potential was right. There is lore there, there are even instances for some missions that use some of the factions. But I want to do this in a way that makes sense for each zone. And I won't argue with more story, redside won't argue with more zones, and badgers won't argue about more badges, I'm sure. 🙂

 

Getting there:

 

Both base teleporters and just a specific PVE-zone menu, or at least *VERY CLEARLY MARKED* PVE vs PVP zone listing, in the existing helicopters and zone entrances.

Overall rewards:

 

The PVE zones get their own explore badges - mind  you, I'd be happy to have the ones for Piratical moved to the PVE zone (think those are mostly history badges) and anything for PVE accolades done so as well. PVEers who just want that and don't want to touch PVP thus have them moved somewhere they don't have to worry about it.

 

Otherwise, the PVE zones get their own history badges. If there are separate hero and villain zones, they do the "name switches with side" thing.

For the "I got the sets!" folks - IF someone gets them *all,* PVE and PVP, yes - just like Atlas and Echo:Atlas, there's another badge.
If someone has all of one type (PVE or PVP,) there's a badge for that, as well. Just because.

 

That's on top of the prior story zone arc reward system.

 

So, zone by zone....

Bloody Bay
Side: Co-op.
Threat: Shivans, primarily.

 

We know there's Shivan lore. There's Shivan vs Neoshivan lore, touched on only in the tutorial and Drowning in Blood. Main threat is the SHivans and whatever they're bringing. The theme is based around death/spirits - as the Thorns, Pantheon and even ghosts are there. Perhaps whatever is going on with the Shivans rising and using the dead is affecting them. You find out what it is and fix it.

 

Side missions for all four sides - not repeatable contacts throwing out newspaper missions, but a single contact for each alignment giving *an* arc (optional) that's appropriate for each alignment. Villains go for power, possibly. Rogue, for whoever's the highest bidder. Hero to stop things, Vig to "do what has to be done" and more violently stop things from getting out of hand. But the main missions should be enough of a threat that the siides would work together, versus fight them. They want to fight, use the PVP zone.

Siren's Call:
Side: Individual instances

Threat: Custom.

 

There's just not a *threat* in Siren's Call that would get the two sides working together that I can see. What happened, happened already. There's just a question of profit, finding Randall's lost treasures, or blueside investigating (maybe to clear up exactly what happened with Sunburst.)

... for the heck of it, add both some goverment agents (some TLAs investigating) as well as Spetznaz, from redside, on both sides zones. The latter already exists but is used... I think in one arc.

 

Again, side missions for all alignments in the appropriate zones. "Grey siders" probably benefit the most here, if the missions are different for them depending on which side they start from.

 

Warburg
Side: Co-op
Threat: Rogue Arachnos, Malta

 

 C'mon, they have a nuke. And bio and chem labs. And delivery systems. That's enough to put things aside and work together...

At least for now. (More side missions per alignment, of course.)

Recluse's Victory
Side: Individual blue/red sides.
Incarnate powers allowed.
Threat: Time. Custom mobs.

 

RV's probably the hardest one to do, and the one that would take the most work. To keep the flavor, I'd really want to have the zone switching sides between missions, like it does for the PVP zones depending on who wins. But I'd hate to see just how far the (already kind of irritating) phasing tech in game now can be pushed before it breaks, so...

 

You don't actually go to RV. You go to your staging area. You can't co-op, because you can't communicate easily with, much less *reach,* the other side. The whole war over the future has managed to destabilize something *badly* and it's going crazy out there. The troops out there are affected.

You exit your base into... whichever "future" is currently taking part for that mission. The mobs, the Phalanx or Patrons? They're affected if they're in zone... and they aren't themselves, but some mix of the two and something else. You have no support out there from Longbow or Arachnos, past JUST the outside of the little time bubble that was formed in the base. Sometimes it'll be a hero-aligned zone... sort of. At least clean and shiny... some of the banners may be wrong, though, and *those aren't the Longbow you know.* Sometimes it'll be an Arachnos victory you step out into... bbut they're changed too. It'll actually swap or change between missions.

 

Might even have a buff - or debuff - depending on what side controls what.

 

The "win" condition is basically "I can't really say it's a *win,* player, the war continues... but at least it's as stable as it ever was."

 

(This is also probably the only time you can exit into a (***CLEARLY MARKED***) PVP zone portal if you want - or just go back to the PVE zones.)

[Rudra]

Siren's Call

I would recommend leaving the Spetznaz out of it. They are only in 1 arc because they don't really fit anywhere in the story except in pursuit of Krylov. And at that, it wasn't even the Spetznaz, it was a breakaway group trying to follow in the footsteps of the Sky Raiders. And with their leadership terminated, I mean, neutralized, they won't be going that route. Besides, Arachnos already has a strong presence in zone, so I think it would be better to continue using them. (And while there may not be a central enemy for the sides to work together against, that doesn't mean one can't be introduced. Especially with all the Shadow Seed stuff you run into as you level up before you even get to Cimerora Not-Valkyrie's TF.) (Edit: Or the Jade Spider that Lord Nemesis, I mean, Mender Silos, has two versions of a TF to deal with.)

(Edit again: Though if you want co-op, I would recommend adding Vanguard or other neutral party to provide the missions. Same with BB.)

 

Recluse's Victory

Given how problematic the phasing is in the game? I'm worried about this idea. It kind of works in RV as is? I mean, it doesn't fail the way it does in Atlas Park or Mercy Island, but I'm not in favor of risking it for a PvE version. My personal take? Leave RV alone, just as a PvP zone. It is already a lesson in futility anyway, and the main story line I see in RV is already addressed through the patron arcs and to a lesser extent, some of the late hero missions where you find out you ended the world or destroyed civilization or turned everyone into ghost depending on which mission you find. (There may only be 1, but I swear I remember 3 different versions of it.)

 

I'm not sure how I feel about the others. I mean the Shivan story line in Bloody Bay was always worth investigating, and that was before the introduction of the Neo-Shivans and their hatred of the Shivans. The TF/SF we can do kind of addresses that, so I think I would try a different approach than a PvP zone clone for PvE, but nothing currently comes to mind. (I'm just not a fan of duplicating zones, especially since we still have an empty co-op zone in Khallisti Wharf.)

 

Edited January 13 by Rudra
Edited to add missing closing parenthesis.

[Greycat]

2 hours ago, Rudra said:

 

Recluse's Victory

Given how problematic the phasing is in the game? I'm worried about this idea. It kind of works in RV as is? I mean, it doesn't fail the way it does in Atlas Park or Mercy Island, but I'm not in favor of risking it for a PvE version

 

 

 

That's why it's not using the phasing, and why you're based in the ... er, base. You're just going out into a new mission map, not the zone itself.

[Rudra]

22 minutes ago, Greycat said:

 

That's why it's not using the phasing, and why you're based in the ... er, base. You're just going out into a new mission map, not the zone itself.

Ah. My mistake. Apologies.

[Greycat]

No worries, sounded like I needed to clear that up.

[Troo]

On 1/12/2024 at 4:24 PM, Greycat said:

There's just not a *threat* in Siren's Call that would get the two sides working together that I can see. What happened, happened already. There's just a question of profit, finding Randall's lost treasures, or blueside investigating (maybe to clear up exactly what happened with Sunburst.)

 

Why would the sides have to work together?

It could simply be a hazard zone. Same zone it is right now but no direct PvP. It's the ultimate street sweeping.

Content could run off intelligence gathering, espionage, saving innocents who are caught in the middle, third parties taking advantage of the situation. There is a lot to work with.

 

Siren's Call:
Side: Hazard Zone

Threat: War.

[Greycat]

5 hours ago, Troo said:

 

Why would the sides have to work together?

 

 

See "Why would SuperGuy just ignore Villaindude running around?"

 

Some of us *do* care about that sort of thing.

[Troo]

40 minutes ago, Greycat said:

 

See "Why would SuperGuy just ignore Villaindude running around?"

 

Some of us *do* care about that sort of thing.

 

Welp, while that makes sense, I am not one of those. I see less black and white and more of the shades in between.

As such I see no problem with being able to support the on going conflict while not having direct pvp. Call it avoiding escalation.

 

[AgentForest]

I can fully get behind this.  I've never been a fan of PvP, but I always loved the various PvP zones.  Actually getting stories there, with contacts and possibly TF/SFs would be great.