Twilight Grasp should apply a HoT instead of a direct heal

[Super Atom]

I just want to know what America's Angel thinks.

 

If she thinks it looks cooler when slow, i think we should change it to be slower even if thats noticeably worse

Edited October 17 by Super Atom

[Troo]

On 10/11/2024 at 5:31 PM, gabrilend said:

Why? Why leave it alone? What's wrong with the idea? Do you enjoy the direct heal more than a HoT, and if so, can you please explain why? Is it more useful in battle or do you like it for thematic reasons?

 

Hi.

Why leave it alone?

It is one of the better powers in the game.

It's slow and a huge heal. It also has some nice accoutrements.

Twilight Grasp

Ranged, Foe -To Hit, -DMG, -Regen, Team Heal

 

Standard Effects

100% chance

Apply "Execute Power" (self only)

● Redirects.Dark_Miasma.Twilight

-10% Damage (All) Strength (all affected targets) for 20s

-5.0% ToHit (all affected targets) for 20s

100% chance

-50% Regeneration (all affected targets) for 20s

if target>enttype eq 'critter'

100% chance

-397.9% Regeneration (all affected targets) for 20s

if target>enttype eq 'player'

 

What's wrong with the idea?

Don't fuck with great powers. (explicit language used for emphasis)

 

Do you enjoy the direct heal more than a HoT, and if so, can you please explain why?

Direct heal.

While it takes a bit, the heal is big enough that it can have a big effect.

 

Is it more useful in battle or do you like it for thematic reasons?

This seems rhetorical.

[Troo]

I just added my thoughts to the discussion. My opinions. I realize this is a suggestion and not a demand.

[Renatos1023]

 

tl;dr but this quote below sums it up. I only read until the second response because this is what I would have said. Dark is one of my favorite sets to play and I love TG how it is. 

 

On 10/11/2024 at 7:53 PM, Rudra said:

Yeah, I would rather they just removed the "slowly" text. Leave Twilight Grasp alone please.

 

Also, because tl;dr (and it might have been said above) but TG heals as long as you get the heal off before the target dies, unlike Kin's Transfusion. Which makes it doubly more valuable. If they change that, I'd be mad. TG is unarguably the best targeted heal in the game so I do not want HC devs touching it thank you very much.

Edited October 18 by Renatos1023

[brass_eagle]

On 10/11/2024 at 5:20 PM, gabrilend said:

Twilight Grasp is an ability in the darkness support set. Currently the ability applies a debuff to a foe and heals allies around your character. The description for the ability is this:

 

"You channel Negative Energy from the Netherworld through yourself to a targeted foe. Twilight Grasp drains the power from that target and slowly transfers it to you and all nearby allies. The targeted foe's chance to hit, damage and regeneration rate are reduced, while you and your nearby allies are healed."

 

Darkness and shadows are all about subtlety. Not just because they hide your nocturnal activities from wary eyes, but also because they creep every so slowly over the landscape as darkness falls, their ever-advancing approach heralding the sunset before the last glimmers of our star wink out of sight beyond the mountain, the ocean, or the ground you stand upon.

 

Because the description says "slowly" I do believe that changing Twilight Grasp to a +regen buff or perhaps a HoT (Heal over Time) could fit with the theme a bit better. And frankly there are quite a bit more direct heals than there are HoTs in CoH, so more diversity could be nice.

 

The difference between those two options as I understand it is that +regen is based on the target's maximum HP, while a HoT is a flat number of health restored. In order to reduce the impact of this change, my opinion is that a HoT may be preferred.

 

Looking through this thread, I get some of your "thumbs downvotes", I do. Some of the banter, I hope is in good faith (borderline internet bully).. I also get where you are coming from, you seem like someone that likes concept and has a few really cool ideas.

 

But you do have to give more than "thematic" or "because text written 23 years ago says so" to change a good, no.... cornerstone power, when it is one of the few powersets left that is half skippable. Can it be improved or changed? Maybe... it is very potent as is. Have you used it? Give us context. Regardless of @mistagoat's comment [Black Hole] [Petrifying Gaze] leave much to be desired considering Darkness Affinity exists. In fact, I think [Black Hole] is one of the least taken powers in the game.

 

What I am saying, is you are focusing on one word as justification for volunteer effort, in the wrong place. I am also someone who adores DoTs and constant building of "effects". This set is not, nor has ever been about that. It is wasted time and may draw "Snarky" remarks from the community. 

 

Be well my friend, but I don't see this is a fight worth your time or that you will win.

 

 

Edited October 22 by brass_eagle

[mistagoat]

5 hours ago, brass_eagle said:

 

Looking through this thread, I get some of your "thumbs downvotes", I do. Some of the banter, I hope is in good faith.. I also get where you are coming from, you seem like someone that likes concept and has a few really cool ideas.

 

But you do have to give more than "thematic" or "because text written 23 years ago says so" to change a good, no.... cornerstone power, when it is one of the few powersets left that is half skippable. Can it be improved or changed? Maybe... it is very potent as is. Have you used it? Give us context. Regardless of @mistagoat's comment [Black Hole] [Petrifying Gaze] leave much to be desired considering Darkness Affinity exists. In fact, I think [Black Hole] is one of the least taken powers in the game.

 

What I am saying, is you are focusing on one word as justification for volunteer effort, in the wrong place. I am also someone who adores DoTs and constant building of "effects". This set is not, nor has ever been about that. It is wasted time and may draw "Snarky" remarks from the community. 

 

Be well my friend, but I don't see this is a fight worth your time or that you will win.

 

 

Just to be sure I'm not misunderstood, I do like Dark Miasma as it stands however, I will never advocate for Black Hole. It's trash and if it were removed from the game tomorrow, you'd hear no complaints from me. My Dark/Dark Fender (my favorite Defender) holds the record for shortest time between "lets give this power a try" and "oh gawd! I need to respec!".

I have no beef with P.Gaze though, it's not the best single target hold in the game but it's fine imo.

[brass_eagle]

9 hours ago, mistagoat said:

Just to be sure I'm not misunderstood, I do like Dark Miasma as it stands however, I will never advocate for Black Hole. It's trash and if it were removed from the game tomorrow, you'd hear no complaints from me. My Dark/Dark Fender (my favorite Defender) holds the record for shortest time between "lets give this power a try" and "oh gawd! I need to respec!".

I have no beef with P.Gaze though, it's not the best single target hold in the game but it's fine imo.

 

Yeah maybe I read into that a little too far. Sorry about that. The recharge for P.Gaze is double from a normal hold and it has no damage / side effect. I'd consider it at the bottom the tier list of holds. But, maybe I am not looking at it right. Definitely a skip for me at least. P.Gaze got the Epic pool penalty treatment before they even existed... when it was only a primary for Defs. 🤣

 

"Ice Arrow" from trick arrow used to be an identical power. And look at it now.

Edited October 21 by brass_eagle
Editted to add Ice arrow

[Trickshooter]

On 10/11/2024 at 7:20 PM, gabrilend said:

Twilight Grasp is an ability in the darkness support set. Currently the ability applies a debuff to a foe and heals allies around your character. The description for the ability is this:

 

"You channel Negative Energy from the Netherworld through yourself to a targeted foe. Twilight Grasp drains the power from that target and slowly transfers it to you and all nearby allies. The targeted foe's chance to hit, damage and regeneration rate are reduced, while you and your nearby allies are healed."

 

Darkness and shadows are all about subtlety. Not just because they hide your nocturnal activities from wary eyes, but also because they creep every so slowly over the landscape as darkness falls, their ever-advancing approach heralding the sunset before the last glimmers of our star wink out of sight beyond the mountain, the ocean, or the ground you stand upon.

 

Because the description says "slowly" I do believe that changing Twilight Grasp to a +regen buff or perhaps a HoT (Heal over Time) could fit with the theme a bit better. And frankly there are quite a bit more direct heals than there are HoTs in CoH, so more diversity could be nice.

 

The difference between those two options as I understand it is that +regen is based on the target's maximum HP, while a HoT is a flat number of health restored. In order to reduce the impact of this change, my opinion is that a HoT may be preferred.

 

The "slowly" in the description was a reference to it's original animation which had a long wind-up (it was the fists in the air, staring at your hands animation used by Bitter Freeze Ray, before that one was also sped up, think it was originally 3.67s). You'd fire a dark blast at your target which would debuff them, then a second blast would return from them to you and then the heal would happen. The animation was long, the delay for the heal to happen was long, thus "slowly".

[Renatos1023]

9 hours ago, Trickshooter said:

 

The "slowly" in the description was a reference to it's original animation which had a long wind-up (it was the fists in the air, staring at your hands animation used by Bitter Freeze Ray, before that one was also sped up, think it was originally 3.67s). You'd fire a dark blast at your target which would debuff them, then a second blast would return from them to you and then the heal would happen. The animation was long, the delay for the heal to happen was long, thus "slowly".

Wow! I think I started around i4 or i5 so I never had to deal with the bad Dark Miasma. Or I did, but was too new to MMORPGs to realize how bad it was (I think my first few mains were Scrappers). But I couldn't imagine that being an actual functional heal. That sounds miserable lol. 

Edited October 23 by Renatos1023