I miss the old Sleep powers already

[UltraAlt]

11 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

I sometimes posit that we have too many powers in the game... so skippable powers I've generally considered a net benefit. If you want to make a good build, you can automagically exclude those powers giving you a much refined set from which to choose.

 

*cough*cough* https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/Mind_Control#Telekinesis

 

11 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

One of the things I loved (and was frustrated by) in The Secret World (the original version) was the amazing power wheel where you could choose a whole range of powers and grow them in different ways. Sadly the descriptions were deliberately vague so you would have to play them and make mistakes to discover which worked and respecs as we know them here weren't easy to come by.

 

This goes to replayability. 

Once you learn how that part of the system works, I'm assuming you could create another character and play through again and pick other selections to figure out how the system works.

 

11 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

Conceptually it was genius but the execution was flawed.

 

Seems intentional in the game design.

You want to give (sometimes force) players a reason to replay a game in order to keep attention on a game (mainly for gaining attention of new customers, monetized additions the the game, and/or micro transactions)

In addition to that, in that kind of game, it also adds to the air of mystery and uncertainty. 

[Scarlet Shocker]

8 minutes ago, UltraAlt said:

 

*cough*cough* https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/Mind_Control#Telekinesis

 

 

This goes to replayability. 

Once you learn how that part of the system works, I'm assuming you could create another character and play through again and pick other selections to figure out how the system works.

 

 

Seems intentional in the game design.

You want to give (sometimes force) players a reason to replay a game in order to keep attention on a game (mainly for gaining attention of new customers, monetized additions the the game, and/or micro transactions)

In addition to that, in that kind of game, it also adds to the air of mystery and uncertainty. 

 

I'm not sure what relevance your first point has to a question regarding sleep, but I agree replayability is a thing although given that you only needed three characters in TSW, and it was built around the whole Tank, Heal, DPS thing... but you could change powers with some finagling so you could change your character entirely mid go. But yes, I understand that not everything should be revealed on day one.

 

[UltraAlt]

39 minutes ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

I'm not sure what relevance your first point has to a question regarding sleep

 

it is in response to the quote from your post.

"I sometimes posit that we have too many powers in the game... so skippable powers I've generally considered a net benefit."

 

Based on the number of times I have seen it in use, ...

 

56 minutes ago, UltraAlt said:

https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/Mind_Control#Telekinesis

 

 

... is skipped by most players.

[Scarlet Shocker]

2 hours ago, UltraAlt said:

 

it is in response to the quote from your post.

"I sometimes posit that we have too many powers in the game... so skippable powers I've generally considered a net benefit."

 

Based on the number of times I have seen it in use, ...

 

 

... is skipped by most players.

 

It certainly used to be - but it has utility now.

 

If you go back far enough you'll notice that very few people bothered to take the T9 primary, because that was a deliberate gimp. It's concept was to be "the ultimate booyah" in a battle against the odds, to finish the fight but it had a number of flaws:

 

1. It almost never finished the fight
2. It took you out of the fight because it sucked out your Endurance and left you with no way to take part in the battle until a couple of minutes had passed
3. It entirely passed a burden onto your team mates who then had to carry you for 90+ seconds
4. it didn't do anything like the damage for the penalty it imposed

So nobody took it and it got a big rework.

 

TK used to be somewhat similar but it was slightly reworked and one of the less memorable ITrials got a specific case where it shone so suddenly it could be useful.

 

I have yet to decide if the new version is really as good as some claim. I love the concept but actually I think it might fail once the novelty's worn off. Time will tell.

 

But again, I don't hate the fact that it makes the decision to perm 6 from 9 quite easy.

 

YMMV as the cool kids used to say a couple of decades ago before they got mortgages and shitty jobs

[Azari]

You are free to skip a power even if it doesn’t suck.

[UltraAlt]

5 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

I have yet to decide if the new version is really as good as some claim. I love the concept but actually I think it might fail once the novelty's worn off. Time will tell.

 

So if you don't use telekinesis to corner a group and they travel down a hallway - they pick up/agro more as they go.

 

"Lifts a foe, and any nearby foes, off the ground and repels them. The targets are helpless, unable to move, and will continue to hover away, picking up any passing targets, as long as you keep this power active. "

 

And, yeah, they know who agro-ed them, and, when the power is turned off, they call come running down the hallway together.

... at least that is what happened the last time that I saw telekinesis used on Homecoming.

 

 

[Wavicle]

1 minute ago, UltraAlt said:

 

So if you don't use telekinesis to corner a group and they travel down a hallway - they pick up/agro more as they go.

 

"Lifts a foe, and any nearby foes, off the ground and repels them. The targets are helpless, unable to move, and will continue to hover away, picking up any passing targets, as long as you keep this power active. "

 

And, yeah, they know who agro-ed them, and, when the power is turned off, they call come running down the hallway together.

... at least that is what happened the last time that I saw telekinesis used on Homecoming.

 

 

They don’t continue to hover away forever. It stops at like 60 ft or something.

[Scarlet Shocker]

7 hours ago, Azari said:

You are free to skip a power even if it doesn’t suck.

 

That was pretty well what I said except you were more concise

[Zect]

My ideal would be for every powerset to have 5-6 core powers that provide most of the functionality, and the remaining 3-4 being situationally useful. If you make every power in a set indispensable, which is Homecoming's current stance, the game becomes more cookie-cutterlike - eg every mind troller will have the same powers as every other mind troller. This removes important elements of choice and expression from the game.

 

P.S. I like new telekinesis and my opinion of it goes up every time I use it. It is a very precise way of moving mobs around, far more controlled than things like KB or even foldspace or wormhole.

[Scarlet Shocker]

27 minutes ago, Zect said:

My ideal would be for every powerset to have 5-6 core powers that provide most of the functionality, and the remaining 3-4 being situationally useful. If you make every power in a set indispensable, which is Homecoming's current stance, the game becomes more cookie-cutterlike - eg every mind troller will have the same powers as every other mind troller. This removes important elements of choice and expression from the game.

 

P.S. I like new telekinesis and my opinion of it goes up every time I use it. It is a very precise way of moving mobs around, far more controlled than things like KB or even foldspace or wormhole.

 

Well said!

[Wavicle]

30 minutes ago, Zect said:

every power in a set indispensable, which is Homecoming's current stance

 

This is only sort of true for Armor and Buff/Debuff sets. It's definitely not true of Attack or Control sets.

[Arnabas]

On 6/29/2025 at 12:47 AM, Seed22 said:

There was never any challenge to begin with, even before deep sleep with a well played Mind.

 

Or any toon for that matter. 

I would pretty much agree with that, but now your character doesn't even need to be well-played.

Although there wasn't much challenge, certain characters at least required a bit of thought. Now, not so much.

[Seed22]

9 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

 

Well said!

It does the opposite effect. If every power is good then you actually see more build diversity not less.

 

What you're agreeing with is literally cookie cutter building. I think this community hears gaming terms and then tries to use them without understanding what they mean or what it looks like, because that's a pretty clear cut example of what they were arguing against.

 

5 or 6 core powers means people will only pick those 5 or 6 powers, and will only serve to further stifle diversity, esp if those other 3-4 are simply too niche(which is easy to do in a game like this) to warrant a pick outside of RP builds.

 

I get the idea, I really do, but what that looks like in practice is the opposite effect.  Instead by makong every power good but still unique, you end up with less forced picks and more of a "impossible to fail" kinda situation.

 

 

Edited Tuesday at 07:23 PM by Seed22

[Scarlet Shocker]

On 7/1/2025 at 8:14 PM, Seed22 said:

It does the opposite effect. If every power is good then you actually see more build diversity not less.

 

What you're agreeing with is literally cookie cutter building. I think this community hears gaming terms and then tries to use them without understanding what they mean or what it looks like, because that's a pretty clear cut example of what they were arguing against.

 

5 or 6 core powers means people will only pick those 5 or 6 powers, and will only serve to further stifle diversity, esp if those other 3-4 are simply too niche(which is easy to do in a game like this) to warrant a pick outside of RP builds.

 

I get the idea, I really do, but what that looks like in practice is the opposite effect.  Instead by makong every power good but still unique, you end up with less forced picks and more of a "impossible to fail" kinda situation.

 

 

 

Usually you end up with a jack of all trades that can't do anything especially well.

 

Personally I think we're forced to take too many powers as it is.

 

I understand what you're saying but when you have 18 main powers and then at least 6 pool powers, you get too many choices. It is probably easier for well-seasoned veterans to know what to choose, once they've mastered a specific AT, but for a newer player they would have no clue and we have seen how taking the wrong powers and/or mismanaging them through ignorance turns them off the game which is a bad thing.

 

If perhaps we had say 12 main powers and we could specialise in 6, then add pool powers we might find greater diversity but with 18 powers, some of which are specifically designed to be of greater power, it's hard to say we increase diversity.

 

I understand where you're coming from but in practice I don't think it actually is the case.

[Wobegone]

6 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

Personally I think we're forced to take too many powers as it is.

 

I don't think this is true.  At least for me, I don't feel forced to pick anything.   Occasionally I have to make hard choices, but my design philosophy doesn't require Hasten or Tough/Weave, although they are on many characters.  

 

6 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

I understand what you're saying but when you have 18 main powers and then at least 6 pool powers, you get too many choices. It is probably easier for well-seasoned veterans to know what to choose, once they've mastered a specific AT, but for a newer player they would have no clue and we have seen how taking the wrong powers and/or mismanaging them through ignorance turns them off the game which is a bad thing.

 

You seem like a seasoned veteran, so not sure what the problem is.  Sometimes you have to make hard choices.  That hasn't changed with this patch.  

 

As to the bolded part, this is new info for me.  Where have we seen this?  As far as I know, most new players are former players.  For the few who have never played, I'm not sure they were turned off the game because of 'wrong powers and/or mismanaging them through ignorance'.