Rudra

That's odd, because I was on those threads. Yes, threads, the bug thread and the ATO revamp suggestion thread. I didn't see any posts saying Brutes were fine as is. Though debates were being had about the fixation of the resolution being more +recharge.

Yes. Why? Because brutes typically get stronger when mad in comics. Or more vicious. Or more feral. I don't know of any that get faster. Stronger is easy to emulate, that's just +damage. More vicious and more feral are a bit harder to emulate, but can arguably also be explained by +damage.

Unless the mob is coded to be friendly, with its nice blue box, mobs are not your allies/friends. So if something has a yellow box, the target is neutral to you regardless of their faction and yours, and if they come under an offensive power effect from you, they become hostile. Damage isn't necessary, just an offensive power has to affect them. And since they aren't blue/friendly, your auras (if you have any) or other offensive powers will affect them.

Mastermind stand out feature: Pets. Lots and lots of pets. Up to 7 before lores if you take the correct secondary.

Revamping Brutes to a slow starter that builds momentum is a niche approach. While there may be brute characters that work that way, none come to mind. I'm also willing to bet it goes counter to the concepts of a great many brute characters in the game, so this proposal would essentially be forcing those players to re-conceptualize their characters or re-roll them as another AT. As much as I don't like fitting more +recharge into things, changing Brutes to start slow and build up speed is so much worse in my opinion. At least the previous thread's flat recharge boost from the proc' doesn't change player character concepts for them.

When I checked my main, the ninjas all had the same (or slightly better) listed movement than my actual character. Bear in mind, I only had like either Sprint or Ninja Run turned on at the time. And yet, the pets still fell behind. And like by a good deal. I'm not sure what caused that other than maybe they waited too long before they started moving to catch up to me when I started moving away. So outside of like Super Speed or stacked running powers, pets should be able to keep up with the MM. But they don't. As far as teleporting hostages goes? I think, not sure but think, that was disabled so players wouldn't just sneak to where the hostages are, target them, sneak back to entrance, and then teleport them to the entrance and bypass everything. As far as sharing travel powers from their PC? That would put the last nail in the coffins of Group Fly and Team Teleport. The simplest solutions I've found so far are Teleport Target to yank pets back to you (unless they manage to get critically stuck in terrain), Assemble the Team to yank all your pets (and any teammates) to you, and unsummoning followed by re-summoning the pets as needed. I would very much like for MM pets to at least keep pace with the MM when only using Sprint or Ninja Run or Athletic Run or Beast Run, but from their combat attributes window in the game, they already should be doing so.

That is a baseless assumption. For instance, my main is a Ninja/Dark MM. I only see this happen when a pet is critically stuck in an object. To the point where even Teleport Target failed to yank it back out. More commonly, you can lose control of your pets if you try dismissing them just before zoning, such as entering or exiting a mission map. Though zoning again typically fixes that. (Edit: For clarification, if you zone too soon after dismissing your pets, when you enter the new zone, you can find your pets are still with you. And sometimes, they aren't subject to your commands any more.) If Teleport Target, which my main MM has, can't pull a stuck pet out, then I'm willing to bet a recall pet command won't either.

How many times are you going to go back to that after I already said you were right about it? Also, why are you telling me to "use my words, not comment deletion"? I'm not a GM. (Edit: Neither have I reported any comments or asked for any comments to be removed.) Edit: This is like the 4th time in this thread I said you were correct about that. Edit again: My other 2 comments were deleted when the GM shortened the thread, but here is one you thumbs downed with the 3rd concession highlighted:

I can get behind it being a click instead.

From a personal point of view, don't know about Enflame since I never used it, but as far as Spirit Ward goes, it would be nice if it didn't de-toggle the moment the person you were using it on moved past the cast range. The person you buffed with Spirit Ward used an elevator? If you didn't enter the elevator at the same time, the buff goes away. The person you buffed shifts to attack a target and their movement puts them outside of cast range? The buff goes away.

Chance for fear is already a part of a redside ATO kit. I know. However, like I said, I think it would work better for Brutes. The main difference would be that the SoA ATO only triggers off the slotted power, but the Brute one could have a (lower) chance to trigger globally off the Brute's primary attacks. (Edit: Besides, @ThatGuyCDude and @PeregrineFalcon already came up with much better alternate proposals.)

You see the core problem then. Before Proliferation, Brutes were the Tankers for red side. (Yes, there are claims that MMs were, but MMs couldn't pull it off until they got Bodyguard Mode added after the fact.) So Scrappers out-damage Brutes(, and some Tankers out-damage them too). So if you want damage, go play a Scrapper (or Stalker). Tankers and Brutes have the same damage resist caps, but Tankers start with better base stats for their resists. So if you want to be durable, go play a Tanker. You can't improve Brute's damage without stepping on Scrapper toes and you can't improve Brute's resilience without stepping on Tanker toes. So how do you break out Brutes in a manner that works for all Brute character concepts? (Edit again: Also, please bear in mind that I do play Brutes. I have more Brute characters than any other melee AT. So I'm not dumping on Brutes, I'm trying to illustrate their dilemma.) Edit yet again: Melee AT breakdown (at least from my point of view): Stalker: Assassin AT. Sneak around and gank. Lots of fun. Scrapper: Damage AT. In your face maul-fest. Lots of fun. Tanker: Soak AT. Can take a pounding and not care. Lots of fun (for others). Brute: The not a Scrapper or Tanker AT. Still lots of fun, but lacks a standout identity.

Good luck with the damage. I mean, I get the current devs are not the same dev team as back on Live, so maybe they will be on board with addressing it in a manner that isn't a sidegrade middle finger that they call a buff like the Live devs did. (Yeah, I'm still upset about that. Sorry.) At least addressing it from that angle isn't just another more +recharge request. And I understand @CrusaderDroid's goal of getting a unique ID for Brutes rather than hybrid Scrapper-Tanker that isn't either. Maybe tweaking Brute's identity as an AT will help them break out from where they are. And yes, I understand @CrusaderDroid's point about how +recharge can actually do that. I just disagree that +recharge is the only or even the best way to do so. What is the best way? I don't know. I've given my ideas on possible options, even leaving several examples open-ended so others can hopefully come up with better variations or ideas for it, but to say that is unpopular is an understatement. I don't understand the +recharge fixation. Yes, a Brute can be a fast attacker rather than a skilled one, but so can a Scrapper. So where do we go from here?

I don't know. Maybe a global chance for fear, so Brutes are scarier to enemies than other ATs. Maybe a ToHit or ACC debuff, again because enemies are more scared of the Brute than other ATs. (I think the fear component would work better on Brutes than it does on Soldiers of Arachnos at least.) Hells, maybe a proc that for that power lets the Brute hit a higher damage cap than the Brute currently can. I'm just tired of +recharge being the go to any time someone thinks something needs to be buffed.

I see your points, but those were just thrown out there to show there are other options beyond yet more +recharge. If the devs decide to improve Brute's ATOs and they go the +recharge route, then at least Brutes finally got some love. It wouldn't be my preferred solution, but at least they finally got some.

Nope, still wrong. If the comment is wrong, then prove it, because your response does not. A chain is very much developed the way I said. A chain can be changed as power availability changes, like I said. And I already conceded that you were correct about me being able to simply not change my chain and so go unaffected. So your continued argument against that makes no sense. I can not want more +recharge fit into everything just as much as you can want more +recharge fit into everything. That makes it a question of preferences. You would prefer more +recharge, I would prefer more variety in improvements. Edit: Example: a character has attacks 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5. The character runs a chain going 1, 5, 3, 2, 4, 1, 3, 2, 4, 1, 5, 3, 2, 4, 1, 3, 2, 4 and so on. Now those powers become available more frequently. So the player decides to change the chain to just be 1, 5, 3, 2, 4, 1, 5, 3, 2, 4. Power 5 is used more frequently in the chain, so the chain has changed. (Edit again: To remove power 8 since I forgot to put it in the example sequences.)

Then maybe the devs can see about fixing that instead. Make it so that when the pets are a set distance away from the MM, they automatically teleport to the MM so we can stop wondering if they will teleport to our character or slowly run across the map/zone.

What I would like? Is for hostages to be able to use things like stairs and ramps without the player having to stand at the top or bottom of said stairs or ramp watching the NPC not be able to figure out how to use it. Especially since you can't teleport those NPCs to you.

It was addressed previously. Now MM pets automatically teleport to their MM when they get too far away. The problem with that is that it seems to be random for when it works. And the purpose of Group Fly and Team Teleport being in the game in the first place was so that players could get their teams from point A to point B in the event team members lacked travel powers. And MMs are their own team. They benefit the most from making use of team powers like the Leadership pool and Group Fly and Team Teleport. And though it costs 1,000,000 inf' from START, you can get Assemble the Team from Start and have the ability to immediately recall all pets to you without giving up a power choice on your character.

Teleport Target and temp powers like Assemble the Team are your friend.

Unpopular opinion: Use Savage Melee for your Sabertooth characters. It already has slashing nails. (Though Lady Deathstrike style claws being added to Claws would be nice. [Edit: It will require alternate hand models and animations though.]) And if the posture and animations for Savage Melee aren't your thing? Request alternate animations that are less hunched over for Savage Melee. (Which is something I would like for my Savage Melee character.)

I would still rather not. If players want the Brute ATO improved, I'm not going to complain. However, I will ask that +recharge not be what it goes to. That will throw my END management off as suddenly my attacks are faster and burning through END faster requiring me to go back and reconfigure my END management to keep it under control.

I don't understand the formulae used in City of Data/Heroes. That is why any time I post anything from CoD and the reference is a formula, I state that I don't know what it means or I state that I am leaving that particular reference out of my discussion for not knowing how it works. And just because damage resistance and defense don't play by the rules Misdirection is for its placate means nothing to me. Give me a placate reference. If you want the formula changed, then you already know my response. Submit a suggestion to get it changed. Which is why this discussion is so confusing. A little bit of background here. Yes, my initial inclinations should something like that happen is that it can't be what was intended and so must be a bug. However, after having had to perform several mishap investigations, I've learned that is not an acceptable approach to viewing problems. Just because I think something doesn't make sense and that there is no way the person involved meant for something to be the way it is, does not mean that the person/people involved did not make it that way because it makes sense to them. Hindsight is always 20/20, but foresight and intent are not. So, as much as it seems to annoy everyone, I will persist on not reading what I think may have been someone's intent on something and instead continue to look at what that person or those people did as compared to what was/is going on. So if something in the game says it is supposed to work a particular way and it in fact does, even if I think that makes no sense, it will remain as intended and I will continue to advise others to make suggestions to change it. My argument was that the OP was wrong, that Misdirection was not supposed to only have a 2 second duration, and you agreed with that. My justification for such was that the power said it was supposed to last longer than the OP supposed and it in fact lasts longer as described, making it not a bug. That is my take on the OP. You could have just said the OP was wrong, given your justification for it, and not dove down this rabbit hole of bug by intent you choose to read into things versus what I refuse to read into things. My arguments are in good faith, regardless of whether you can accept them or not.

Yes please. This comes up a lot on my MMs where I go to click a door to progress through the mission, but instead a pet that isn't in my window gets selected. I can deal with that by shifting my camera angle to a more top down look to click the door and then returning to a face forward view, but not having things not on my screen not be what the game keeps thinking I'm selecting would be nice.

Missions pull from the different factions to populate the maps. So for your example, both are Arachnos. The same faction. Minions draw from the pool of minion tier mobs, lieutenants draw from the pool of lieutenant tier mobs, and so forth. And yes, there have been requests for players to be able to substitute different factions' models for their pets. Such as the request for PPD, Cage Consortium, and a few others for Soldiers and Thugs.