Chris24601

To refine this a bit, I think expanding on the pick three of four free START vendor weapons would be a nice QoL option. Tuned appropriately there’d be nothing wrong with more options there. Some immediate thoughts that spring to my mind are the Rune spell and Iron Sword from the Croatoa arcs and the temp power weapons from the Zig Breakout zone event in Brickstown.

“Half the game” but only 10-20% of the players though. I generally only touch the Warden content in Praetoria, so actually pretty heroic in a “Le Resistance” sorta way (they don’t generally try to kill anyone, a lot of stealthable missions, and a lot of rescues). Similarly, Red-side I play Rogues, have a list of “no play” missions/contacts I will not do because I find it too abhorrent, and operate under the “try not to kill anyone because you can only rob a dead man once*” rule. * yes, my rogue goes through the pockets of everyone they defeat before they get mediported out… yes, even the superheroes. A Rogue’s gotta get their infamy somewhere.

Here’s an example of using the font correctly. Note the improvement in legibility. It’s still not the best format for a forum post, but at least it isn’t a crime against humanity anymore.

I’d agree. You can, however, use a font incorrectly. I know, I work with them and directing customers in their font choices daily. The offending font in this case was designed with elaborate capital letters and simpler lowercase ones. The intended use is with proper capitalization so the capital at the start of a sentence or in a proper name is highlighted and stylized. The capital letters of that font were never intended to go next to each other; it makes the font nearly illegible. If that poster could just write in normal grammatical form instead of ALL CAPS the legibility of the font would drastically increase.

I dunno. Ask the three who downvoted up above to a single upvote on the opening post. I just know it’s consistent. If a fix to PBs gets proposed it gets tons of downvotes. So, yeah, I’m at the point of just proposing radical things just to what the heck will actually move the needle a bit. Right now it’s make Human-only viable via PB-based power sets for the other ATs (with a melee set with some 40’ attacks like Claws plus an armor set being probably the ideal… because I’m old enough to remember when PB blasts only had a 40’ range in human form)… but at this point I’ll back nearly anything for PBs.

At this point, I almost feel like the only thing that can ever “fix” PBs and WSs would be to create new PB/WS themed power sets for the other ATs because the degree of pushback on making any changes that would actually fix the ATs proper makes them impossible to fix. You’re never going to appease the human-only, bi-form, and tri-form players at the same time and balancing the AT between the differences in output between those three styles is nigh impossible. At least if you stripped the Human-form concept out so it could be better expressed by a scrapper, tank, sentinel, or blaster, etc. then you’d only need to worry about balancing for bi- and tri- style play with “human only” being the equivalent of a playing a petless mastermind. I dunno… I’m just getting tired of pretty much every proposed change to try and fix the ATs gets a mountain of downvotes so why don’t I try suggesting something completely different.

I’ll have you know I only use MAGIC fire. Your body is fine. Your soul on the other hand… 😈

I always RP that my archer’s arrows all have mediporter tracking chips in them. That said I do wish the rag doll physics was turned down a bit overall… some of the ways heads and spines bend and pancake should not be possible in a still living person. I also would like it if the Arachnos Tarantulas (you know, the ones that are actually power armor with a human grafted inside) didn’t sometimes EXPLODE. I’m sorry, even I can’t RP a human surviving their body literally exploding as “they’re fine. They went to live in the penitentiary upstate… forever.” I’d honestly be quite happy if they went a little backwards on things and just had the human-shaped villains use the player death animations. I’ve been doing a fair bit of Croatoa and the Fir Bolg, Tuatha, Ghosts and Red Caps all use an animated defeat instead of rag dolling and they look absolutely fine… honestly better than most mobs in defeat if you asked me.

It depends on what you’re doing. If you’re not using XP boosters and have only done the Habashy originated mission chain (if you’re new you’re likely unaware of Death from Below) then you’re probably about level 6 when that wraps and after your level 5 level up you get a pop-up (which if you’re new you’re much less likely to ‘x’ out of without reading) for it. The first arc covers locations, the tram, and trainers. The second arc starts at level 10 and starts in King’s Row, which is also where your next popup contact has you running missions. Level 10 is when your starter accuracy buff and the damage of your origin temp power starts to fall off and the first mission discusses keeping your enhancements up to date… level 10 is about the time that starts to matter. Similarly, level 15 is when DOs used to start figuring into things and an important step of the arc that starts at 15 is going to what used to be the DO enhancement shops. That seems like it’s running right on schedule for the state of the game when it was added. Now, sure, if you immediately pop a double XP booster and start running Death From Belows you’ll outlevel the starter zones before you know it… but that’s a playstyle choice and not exactly an intuitive one if you’re actually new. Likewise, nuking TOs, while making DOs and SOs available from the get go from basic vendors does make some of the tutorial come off as too late/unnecessary. But that’s been Homecoming’s MO for a while now under the rubric of QoL improvements that ultimately amount to “get earlier access to things than on live.” But at the same time, if you’re genuinely new, drinking from the firehose isn’t how you want to be introduced to all of CoH’s multitude of systems… so a slower approach is generally a better idea. If people figure it out via other means that’s okay too, but a default route for newbies seems like a wise course.

It is long. But it’s also doing double duty as the extended tutorial a new player really needs provided they choose the Galaxy City tutorial (which covers only the most basic of basic tasks like moving, jumping, targeting, attacking, a moral choice, leveling up, and a zone event. Matt Habashy and the subsequent Atlas Park arcs cover a few more things like contacts, calling contacts, dialogue trees, glowies, door missions, etc. But it’s really the Shining Stars job to give newbies their sea legs if no one is there to help them… a lot of the “too long” parts involve traveling to various places and getting context clues about various game elements… here’s the trainer, here’s the hospital, the trams, here’s another trainer (“ah, so there’s one in every zone” says the newbie), Wentworths (yes, we have /ah now, but live didn’t and a newbie can access the market via Wentworths without ever knowing the slash command). Further in you get bits on making sure your enhancements are up to date, the contacts for changing difficulty (we have a menu item, live didn’t, and a newbie can use the guy), the costume shop, the specialty enhancement shops (which used to matter on live), sidekicking, etc. Maybe it could use SOME trimming with all the QoL things Homecoming has added, but overall, I think it still serves a purpose in showing new players where to find various parts of the game and at least start asking questions about parts of it.

Alternative suggestion for using the term Saga Mode. Saga to me implies a story. I also see this suggestion as a way for Homecoming to put its best foot forward. In terms of setup, the Devs would select what they feel are the best quality story arcs and missions sufficient to bring a character all the way from level 1 through 50. When you select Saga Mode the contacts would automatically be granted with call access and automatically granting the next contact in the selected chain. Finally, the Saga mode missions never level out… you just autoexemp down to the max level for each mission. That’s it. Just the ability to play through what the devs feel is the best content Homecoming has to offer without needing to search it out or accidentally miss it entirely.

My Widow has in her background that most of her marks in training were subpar, but they passed her because she excelled at running and jumping in 6” heels.

It said it didn’t post, but it lied.

Connection-based multipost.

Simple solution… change one word and it’s all good. ”You have ENCOUNTERED the monster in the lake, proving to all that it is real."

Stupid internet multi-post

I think this has some merit, but I’d use the maps from the Number Six (Praetoria’s Last Gasp) arc and make it a rescue mission for an important VIP whose transport went down outside the sonic fences. For added fun make is someone the lore says is secretly loyal to the Resistance so everyone has a reason to risk the monster-haunted wilds outside the fences. Make the last section ambush waves with a timer as you have to survive long enough for the Mediporter system to lock-on and pull you out. The only “winning” is to not lose. You can’t actually beat the Devouring Earth, just slow them down enough to escape. Because, yeah, “this is WHY we have the fences and the rules” goes a long way towards keeping Gold-side as shades of grey… the Crusaders want “freedom” but what sort of plan do they have for THAT once they’ve torn down the infrastructure?

The comment above isn’t about villains in Mercy Island; it’s about drawing Blueside players to Mercy Island. Similarly, the idea would be to add some villain contacts to Atlas Park, providing villains a different path than the usual Destined Ones villain plot.

Huge compared to what though? A new power set? A new game mechanic? Adding contacts with missions would require time to compose and edit, but if you’re not introducing new mechanics, maps, or mobs, then it’s probably the most straightforward sort of content to work on. In terms of expanding player experiences, you would effectively be adding half-dozen (hero) to about a dozen (villain) new zones to explore. The first thing to devise would be Paragon Newspaper and Rogue Radio missions for repeatable content. A lot could probably just be duplicating the existing missions for each zone with the dialogue changed (rescuing instead of taking a hostage; recovering stolen goods instead of stealing them; stopping a bank/casino heist instead of participating in one). After that, maybe a zone arc akin to Faultline’s for each zone… just do it one zone at a time; maybe just half a zone (about 6 missions) per page. The main advantage is no new tech or even mobs are needing. Nor do early levels need to be particularly deep. I suggested “recapture Zig escapees” as a Mercy Island arc for heroes for a reason… it’s straightforward and doesn’t require a lot of story. Longbow has a lead, you investigate, catch villain… use the rule-of-three… three arcs each catching a supervillain who’s wholed up with one of Mercy’s villain groups. Then a fourth arc as you go after Arachnos and learn about Project Destiny. Later zone arcs might be about opposing the worst villains in each like Boccor or Themari and shutting them down. Maybe Cap could be assisting Amanda Vines as a sort of AU of the Marshal Brass arc. Conversely, I’d be looking at the main villain groups for each level band and how you might benefit from assisting or subverting their plans for your gain. I’d pay particular attention to the more mercenary groups like the Outcasts, Sky Raiders, Warriors, etc. and maybe write the arcs more like Dean McArthur’s where you’re recruiting, say, the outcasts, as muscle for a caper of your own.

The ONLY way to increase population in the redside zones would be to add hero content to it (ex. recapture the Zig escapees freed by Arachnos on Mercy) and allow heroes to go there. I actually think this would be a valid approach if Blueside zones also could be accessed by villains with rogue/villain content (ex. take advantage of the Blood Brother/Skulls gang wars in Atlas Park to cover for some heists).

I guess to add to my thoughts above; I get the reluctance to want to change too much of what the LiveDevs left us with… But at the same time in many ways what the LiveDevs left was in many ways half-finished due to the shutdown and in other ways less geared towards a coherent experience as it was towards funneling players into the premium endgame grind. One thing that really became obvious with many of the arcs released after the move to F2P was how many of them were effectively commercials for various premium power sets (Ex. Graham Easton’s arc climaxes in fighting four of the different premium power sets on tougher than average Tsoo mobs… twice during the Eagle Eye arc you get pallet swapped to someone with the Street Justice premium set). While I won’t call for it to be removed it’s also not something I’d take as the norm Homecoming should be shooting for in content, nor something it should feel can never be changed if a better design idea comes along.

Mercy Island’s sight lines WERE fine… when you started from Fort Darwin and not within the city. Trainers, Vendors, Hospital, initial contacts, the main road out into the blight where the original starting missions were. It also presented a very solid mission concept… you’ve been dumped in the worst violence-ridden slum of the isles to see if you can even survive long enough to make it to the nicer elevated and walled town. Its literally the embodiment of Lord Recluse’s Darwinian philosophy… particularly when you realize Project Destiny is just a giant scam in the late game. He’s literally dumping villains at random to see who is fit enough to survive and as long as at least one makes it through the weeding out process, it’s a win. Being a Destined One doesn’t mean you’re special… it means you’re a dupe who’s jumped through all Recluse’s hoops until you finally turn the tables in the last act. The shift in starting Mercy to where you’re now someone worthy of respect and the Arachnos troops conn as allies to you completely undercuts the longer term story in my opinion. Frankly, I think the phasing should be inverted from where it is now. You start in the gutters of Mercy outside Fort Darwin and clear it of the Longbow incursion and the final arc isn’t to clear out Fort Darwin, it’s to clear Longbow from the city above so Arachnos can reassert control.

To me, the need to leave Praetoria if you want to continue your story is basically the same as how, if you want to not be a villain, even a Rogue needs to completely abandon the Isles around level 40. All the 40+ content outside of Rogue tip missions is written as if you have fully embraced being a full villain employed by Arachnos. If you want any rogue-ish nuance at that point you can do the one Rogue arc in Independence Port and the Rogue tip missions. If you want more non-repeatable content you have to ultimately “pick a side”… not literally, you can keep the trappings of being a Rogue on your character sheet… but if you’re doing the 40+ Redside arcs you’re acting like a flat-out villain… or you can pull the trigger and become heroic so you can do Blueside content. It’s the same for Goldside… eventually you have to pick between Blue and Red side or just run out of things to do there. That is the story of every PC as the reach the endgame. While the game has a LOT of options they aren’t actually unlimited. You can write “I’m a Council Officer” in your backstory all you want. Council mobs will still shoot you like they would anyone else. By the same token, regardless of whether you believe you’re the most Loyalist to ever swear fealty to the Emperor; he’s done with you at level 20 and he has no interest in letting you fight for him. His soldiers will shoot you on sight. The New Praetorians won’t let you remain a member no matter how much you want it. You don’t get to stay in Last Bastion after you save the day there. That’s the story you get to play. If you want your own stories that deviate from the canon, that’s what AE is for. * * * * What I’d like is a fairly extensive evaluation of mission level access so that stuff is moved back to “level = timeline.” That includes the Praetorian and Signature Story content. Given the downward pressure on power access (all primay/secondaries available by late twenties, ancillary/patron start at 35) and upward pressure of IO access (set bonuses making up for fewer slots) I think the lower band for many story arcs could stand to shift down a bit (leave the upper limit alone) to make room for more of the “end game” content in the 45+ range. Think of it sort of like the time compression in comics where, despite the real world decades, Spidey’s only been doing his thing for about a decade and the stuff they said happened five years ago at one point instead happened just last year so it all squeezes in. Decide what level various events occur and adjust content to match. Move stuff that absolutely can’t fit anymore into Oroboros. - If Statesman and Sister Psyche are intended to have always been dead from the start of a player’s play through, then move the WWD signature arc to Oroboros. - If their deaths instead happen at the earliest level you could play the signature arcs they occur in (level 40), then restore Sister Psyche to Independence Port and restore the original Stateman sends you a note after you disguise yourself as him in the level 20-29 Rogue tip missions since in the level = time scale they should both still be alive. Do the same for Goldside as well. Figure out where the equivalent events occur; what level does Cole launch his invasion? what level does Praetoria die? Maybe there’s some more room in there for some things to do before the fall, but the idea that just because you don’t want to leave means Praetoria needs 40+ content just runs counter to everything else in the game. Heck, I’d argue Night Ward is only peripherally Praetorian in the first place; Drudges, Animus Arcana, Black Knights, Talons of Vengeance… and even that is done by level 35. First Ward is over by level 30. It’s not really worth the effort, but maybe using the phasing tech to put burning buildings and IDF barricades starting at level 30 and a giant crater in place of the Magisterium with DE monsters rampaging everywhere once you reach level 40 would drive the point across. Praetoria dies. That is the story. You standing around in the completed mission so it doesn’t despawn doesn’t change that.

Frankly, I think putting the New Praetorians arc at 35-40 (originally; on HC they merely removed the back end so you could take it all the way at 50) was a huge mistake on the original devs part and sorta sits with Stateman’s death being retconned into lower tier content in terms of the biggest disruptions to the old “level = point on the timeline” rule that kept things fairly coherent. I’m not entirely sure what the live devs were thinking there beyond adding more content to the biggest level slog in the game and someone deciding to basically start a second “leveling timeline” where new PCs could begin their careers already in the aftermath of the Primal/Praetorian War. The only good thing is Homecoming allows you to delay it until after the war content if you want. If it were up to me, I’d have moved it to be exclusively level 50 content because I really value the level = timeline approach for story arcs as a way to keep the player experience consistent. The earliest you can do Stateman’s death mission is level 40, so to my sensibilities, every 1-39 mission arc should act as if Stateman is alive and all the 40-50 content should treat him as dead. The real complication is the iTrials where you need to be level 50. But I think, I think there’s a way around that. The current story progression for characters who are still Praetorian ends at 35 with Night Ward… and it just sorta dangles with Pazuzu thanking you and telling you Night Ward is now a permanent feature thanks to all the magic meddling and that’s it. Technically you could then hop the portal, and do the whole New Praetorians/Mr. G arcs immediately and either skip the Tina/Maria arcs or just acknowledge they’re out of order. But I think a viable solution to all of this timeline muddling could be as follows; - Move the Praetorian portal mission exit to Primal Earth into the Vanguard headquarters in the RWZ. The portals there allow access to Blue and Red sides respectively. - beginning at level 30 or 35, those who still have a Praetorian alignment can use a portal to travel to the RWZ without changing alignment. They can do any of the content in the RWZ while retaining their alignment. - Move Tina and Maria to the RWZ and lower the minimum level for their arcs to 35 (and set both to a max of 50). Change any mission doors to portals within the Vanguard base. At level 35, Praetorians have Tina added as a contact automatically (and Tina introduces Maria when her arc is done). - Drop the Tinpex task force level requirement to 35 and, if begun at 49 or less, the debuff for no alpha slot doesn’t apply. - Create story arc versions of the iTrials with a minimum level range of 40+ for the early part and 45+ for the late ones (effectively the same range for all the other end game content) and with contacts in the RWZ. The iTrials themselves remain as they are; treated as “master runs” of the story arcs. - Lower the level of Belladonna’s arc to 45+ and move the portals for its missions to the RWZ. This allows it to played in order with the iTrial story arcs. - Instead of auto unlocking at 35, Marchand and Mr. G are instead offered as a choice by the last contact from the iTrial story arcs. This unlocks either Blue or Red side zone access to Praetorians along with radio/newspaper and tip missions that correspond to the respective side (i.e. hero/vigilante if you pick Marchand, villain/rogue for Mr. G). You do not gain access to regular contacts until you swap your alignment to one of the standard four, but you can team up with others for their missions normally. * * * * I get the “I’m gonna remain a Praetorian forever” sentiment. I really do. But CoH has never been a “choose your own canon” sorta game. Even the 1-20 Praetorian arcs ultimately end up in the same place with your PC needing to go to Primal Earth and only trivial differences overall between who actually survives. There is no version of any timeline where Tyrant does nuke Praetoria, Keyes doesn’t further nuke whatever survived by blowing his reactors and Hamidon doesn’t basically eat Praetorian Earth outside of Last Bastion (which only survives at all because Hami got distracted by Keyes and a full Incarnate deciding to stand in the gap… realistically it can’t stay as it is; either Praetorian Hami has to be destroyed or Last Bastion eventually falls). That is the story. Praetorian Earth as a dimension habitable to humans is destroyed by the Praetorian War and the survivors relocate to Primal Earth while a handful of, frankly, fatalistic holdouts insist on throwing their lives away on a doomed cause.* You can play that story… but all stories end and the ending of the “I’m staying in Praetoria til I die!” is the Last Bastion arc. You choose to stay and will one day die fighting the Hamidon. The End. If you want a story past that, it happens on Primal Earth with primal alignments, even if you’re a Praetorian.** Put another way; you’re basically saying “I want to continue being an East German” after the Berlin Wall came down and East Germany stopped existing. You’re free to proclaim that to the heavens, but you’re a German (hero/villain/vigilante/rogue) now as far as classification by the world goes. Demanding more new East German content is ridiculous. East Germany is dead and gone. * best case as imagine it with one of my characters is scattered tribes who developed some type of immunity to “the Devourer” before Last Bastion collapsed entirely, but are little more than stone age scavengers in a world ruled by DE monsters. ** worth noting is that if you started as a Praetorian, you retain unique leveling badges regardless of what primal alignment you have.

Vanguard RWZ content starts at level 35 and their troops show up in a few of the Neutropolis missions as well. Vanguard allies are given to you in a few of Tina and Maria’s missions as well. You can still get the pre-Vanguard versions via flashback, but the normal leveling ones available by going to the contacts are are post-Statesman’s death (and post 1-20 Praetorian content). In terms of the Praetorian content timeline, its original Tina and Maria arcs, 1-20 Praetoria content, First Ward, Night Ward, current Tina and Maria, Apex/Tinman, BAF, Lambda, Keyes, Underground, TPN, Dark Astoria (peripherally), Minds of Mayhem, Diabolique (peripherally), Belladonna, Magisterium, Last Bastion, New Praetorians/Mr. G arcs, and finally the Homecoming original John Houston rogue arc (basically following up on New Praetorian dangling bits). Ideally you’d want a Praetorian play through to see most of those in approximately that order. The main kicker is that even if you are a Praetorian, the story does expect you to come to Primal Earth at some point. If you go hero it’s ahead of the Tina arc (the next time Praetoria comes up Blueside) I think holding off on the Warden to Hero Portal Chamber is vastly improved by doing First/Night Ward first, but that becomes nonsensical if you delay it past when the actual war starts (and Maria’s arc is definitely the opening salvo… so if you’re not Primal by then the story just falls apart and you’d need completely separate content for a “stays in Praetoria” run). So, basically, I think Praetoria probably does work best if the content dries up at level 40 and you need to abandon Praetoria to continue the story. In that vein I definitely think there needs to enough story content (not just grindable repeatables) to get a Praetorian to level 40. Night Ward is only really solid until 35. After that all that’s left is repeatables. That’s why I suggested a 35-40 “setting up the Last Bastion” arc as something you could squeeze just enough Goldside content out to get there. Night Ward continues First Ward but is very tangential to the actual Praetoria conflict. One final zone focused on those driven out of “Paradise” and the actual threat of Praetorian Hamidon could really focus back on why you can’t keep putting it off and do need to finally go to Primal Earth (either to selfishly abandon the lost cause as a villain, or heroically align with Vanguard and do your part in bringing down Cole/evacuating innocents before Hamidon comes and destroys everything). That would put a bow nicely onto the storyline that is Praetoria.