NCsoft files trademark application for superhero MMORPG it abandoned

[quixoteprog]

2 hours ago, Bodai said:

Leandro managed to do it without much difficulty.... If anything I think he was his own worst enemy really.

So, all the hundreds of thousands of websites that keep user information routinely with no issue, even relatively small companies, including non-profits and so on.... they all seem to manage OK right?  Sure, there are some problems and breeches, but it is statistically not significant, and the majority of it due to embarrassingly shameful negligence (looking at you Equifax). 

 

Since you seems to be belligerently ignoring the point I keep making over and over, I'll just stop engaging with you on this. It is like talking to a wall, that Mexico is going to pay for...

[Bodai]

21 minutes ago, quixoteprog said:

Since you seems to be belligerently ignoring the point I keep making over and over, I'll just stop engaging with you on this. It is like talking to a wall, that Mexico is going to pay for...

Please note, there is no belligerency in my comments, or at least I am not trying to make it come out that way.  I don't know why ppl get riled up, we are just having a conversation.

 

So, if the point you are referring to that I am ignoring is that the data is gone and unrecoverable.  Fair enough, if you are right, then never mind, because then it would not be possible.  But I would bet a case of good beer that it exists, somewhere.  Which I acknowledge also doesn't matter, because as you point out, the homecoming ppl don't want it or are possibly forbidden to use it as a possible condition of a licensing deal, if there is one.

 

Or is it the point that the ppl running homecoming are possibly working with the rights-holders and that was "off the table" at their request.  That is a fair point as well, yes that would mean it is basically an impossibility on this server.  All I can say is that is too bad, because it would be nice.  And as I have been saying, I don't think anyone has presented a sufficiently convincing explanation as to why the original rights holders have strong feelings about the old data one way or the other.  We have some speculation that could be the reason, but that is all.

 

Let me know if it was not either of those, but if I got it then I have acknowledge your points.

 

Can you acknowledge my point(s) as well?  Would it be nice to have the data, yes/no?  It's a separate issue how difficult, possible, or likely it is.

 

Am I allowed to look at a nice car and talk about how great it would be to drive it, even if I could "never" afford it?  Or maybe they don't even make it any more because they have all been destroyed?

 

Then others in this forum go on to talk about how bad that car actually is and how I would not want it anyway, and I should be glad I don't have it.  How difficult it would be to get it into the country, how expensive the insurance is, etc. etc.

 

So instead, we are all making replicas, or making them better than the original, or getting a different car entirely that we like better.  Oh and these cars are cheaper, easier to manufacture, and so on.

 

I guess you maybe thought I was only talking "around" your points and not acknowledging them.  I guess I will have to work on that / keep that in mind.  But I kinda feel like you / others were doing the same thing.  I guess if I start going liberal, other people start going conservative.

 

 

 

[golstat2003]

I would rather the devs focused on something that has a guarantee of being fruitful (improving things on this server) than going after something that is pie in the sky. Going after the original data to me would be a waste of time for the various reasons folks have already posted.

[boggo2300]

47 minutes ago, Bodai said:

Please note, there is no belligerency in my comments, or at least I am not trying to make it come out that way.  I don't know why ppl get riled up, we are just having a conversation.

 

So, if the point you are referring to that I am ignoring is that the data is gone and unrecoverable.  Fair enough, if you are right, then never mind, because then it would not be possible.  But I would bet a case of good beer that it exists, somewhere.  Which I acknowledge also doesn't matter, because as you point out, the homecoming ppl don't want it or are possibly forbidden to use it as a possible condition of a licensing deal, if there is one.

 

Or is it the point that the ppl running homecoming are possibly working with the rights-holders and that was "off the table" at their request.  That is a fair point as well, yes that would mean it is basically an impossibility on this server.  All I can say is that is too bad, because it would be nice.  And as I have been saying, I don't think anyone has presented a sufficiently convincing explanation as to why the original rights holders have strong feelings about the old data one way or the other.  We have some speculation that could be the reason, but that is all.

 

Let me know if it was not either of those, but if I got it then I have acknowledge your points.

 

Can you acknowledge my point(s) as well?  Would it be nice to have the data, yes/no?  It's a separate issue how difficult, possible, or likely it is.

 

Am I allowed to look at a nice car and talk about how great it would be to drive it, even if I could "never" afford it?  Or maybe they don't even make it any more because they have all been destroyed?

 

Then others in this forum go on to talk about how bad that car actually is and how I would not want it anyway, and I should be glad I don't have it.  How difficult it would be to get it into the country, how expensive the insurance is, etc. etc.

 

So instead, we are all making replicas, or making them better than the original, or getting a different car entirely that we like better.  Oh and these cars are cheaper, easier to manufacture, and so on.

 

I guess you maybe thought I was only talking "around" your points and not acknowledging them.  I guess I will have to work on that / keep that in mind.  But I kinda feel like you / others were doing the same thing.  I guess if I start going liberal, other people start going conservative.

 

 

 

I'm only going to respond to a few of your points, mostly because I'm lazy, and they are the only points you raise I have any real opinion of, I'm not belittling the rest of your points, I just have nothing to add either for or against them.

 

Would it be nice to have the data yes/no   for me No, there is nothing in the old NC-Soft game data I have any interest in, I have only re-made two of my old characters, and only them because they were my first two 50's and they were major characters of mine in games well before CoH existed, both of them are built significantly differently than they were on live, and if I'm honest are both built MUCH better, so no, I have don't want anything from the now destroyed NC database.

 

Yes, you are welcome to look back at your character on live and wish for them (though I think you would probably be disappointed in them stacked up to a new HC build) the main reason I was involved was the way you came across was fighting to have the DB reinstated NAOW, as you've talked about it more it's now obvious thats not your intention, but thats how you came across initially which is why I kept saying it wasn't possible, because it isn't for major legal reasons, but also because the hassle involved is not worth it for either HC or NC to let this back into the barn so to speak, also, once conversations like this start in the past (not this time which surprised me a bit) you get a pile on of people with "I want my toons back, they are mine, I deserve them!! MINE I tell you!" (not pointing at you, you definitely haven't done this, but threads on this subject in the past have gotten really nuts)

 

I'm going to leave it here, just trying to explain why I, and I expect a few of the others reacted like we did, we've had this argument a LOT of times, usually with people who ignore the reasons that are given for why it won't happen.  Nothing personal, and I hope you don't feel I attacked you, I've just been stuck on this merry-go-round for a long time!!

[Bodai]

1 hour ago, boggo2300 said:

I'm only going to respond to a few of your points, mostly because I'm lazy, and they are the only points you raise I have any real opinion of, I'm not belittling the rest of your points, I just have nothing to add either for or against them.

Well said 😉

1 hour ago, boggo2300 said:

 

Would it be nice to have the data yes/no   for me No, there is nothing in the old NC-Soft game data I have any interest in, I have only re-made two of my old characters, and only them because they were my first two 50's and they were major characters of mine in games well before CoH existed, both of them are built significantly differently than they were on live, and if I'm honest are both built MUCH better, so no, I have don't want anything from the now destroyed NC database.

This is a fair opinion, I can respect it.  For me it would save allot of time leveling, so I could just respec.  I make characters really slowly, each one with a carefully made costume and character concept, and I am really short on time.

And I would agree, the new build I have on HC is worlds past any previous build of my main, beyond what I thought was possible.  I can't actually take credit for it, some great ppl here on the forums shared it and I just tweaked it a bit, making it worse but fitting my theme.  And now I am talking with ppl in the pylon thread, and OMG it might get even better!  Seriously, some of the mix/max ppl here are crazy, I am not worthy.

 

1 hour ago, boggo2300 said:

 

Yes, you are welcome to look back at your character on live and wish for them (though I think you would probably be disappointed in them stacked up to a new HC build) the main reason I was involved was the way you came across was fighting to have the DB reinstated NAOW,

LOL, you put that typo A in there and at first I thought it was some 1337 term I was not familiar with, and it came up as "Network against Oppression of Women"....   And I am sorry I came across that way, I will be more careful.

1 hour ago, boggo2300 said:

 

once conversations like this start in the past (not this time which surprised me a bit) you get a pile on of people with "I want my toons back, they are mine, I deserve them!! MINE I tell you!" (not pointing at you, you definitely haven't done this, but threads on this subject in the past have gotten really nuts)

This is understandable, you expected me to dig in.  I am thankful you recognized this and didn't jump down my throat, I also thought that was were it was going.

 

I remember when I first signed up on live it was in the disclaimer that characters were property of NC, and they could do whatever they wanted with them, use them for advertising, etc.

 

I was on the "other" server, but quit more than a year before word leaked out, mainly because there was just no-one to play with because Leandro was paranoid about it all coming down on his head.  And even then I stayed out of it to let the dust settle, and also because I thought that would be the end of it, oh well.  I never expected the code to get out and things like HC pop up, I didn't even join in until about a month or so ago, because I was expecting even this to also blow up, so it would not be worth putting effort into.  So I was never really involved in the hottest part of the flame war, sounds like you and some others were, so you had to deal with ppl like the one's you are describing.

 

It took balls for HC and others to stand up servers in broad daylight, and they even did a great job, it's better than live was.  Most surprising is that both the quantity and quality of people playing it now are better, that is actually the best part.... I would not have stayed or re-created my main character or be here for that matter if it were not for that.  None of the friends I had before are here, they have either moved on or just don't believe it.  Maybe only the really good players came back, so we here are the condensed remains.  It's really a great story.  I will bet this is part of the reason NC is contemplating working with them, because HC is showing great respect for what it is, that means allot in Asia (I go there allot).

 

The other thing this has done is allowed me to make peace with it.  I was extremely bitter as was everyone, I stopped playing any video games at all, in some ways I never recovered.  But now I feel like I have closure and won't feel bad weather it is here for a short or long time, it will be interesting to see how long it lasts. 

 

1 hour ago, boggo2300 said:

 

I'm going to leave it here, just trying to explain why I, and I expect a few of the others reacted like we did, we've had this argument a LOT of times, usually with people who ignore the reasons that are given for why it won't happen.  Nothing personal, and I hope you don't feel I attacked you, I've just been stuck on this merry-go-round for a long time!!

Yep, I get that now, I appreciate you taking the time to explain that.

 

I have been using the Internet since the 80's (before WWW, just e-mail and Usenet and some other stuff), and it didn't really become a public thing until about 1996 or so.  I remember the HELL we all had to go through when AoL dumped their entire userbase, millions of people, onto the Internet.  And sadly it was not a high quality bunch.  I have made it a point to avoid getting involved in flame wars, and certainly never starting one.  There is this effect where people will say things online they would NEVER say to you or anyone in person (even PPL I know in person), this is what I was thinking about during this exchange, I was thinking about you or whomever was on the other side, and saying to myself, damn, if we were at a bar it would not get this out of control.  I think this is all headed for something really bad, I am trying to wrap my brain around how I will help my children navigate it properly.

 

Sorry for the walls of text, I type fast.....

 

So here is hoping we are pleasantly surprised where this NC/HC things goes.

[boggo2300]

4 minutes ago, Bodai said:

Well said 😉

This is a fair opinion, I can respect it.  For me it would save allot of time leveling, so I could just respec.  I make characters really slowly, each one with a carefully made costume and character concept, and I am really short on time.

And I would agree, the new build I have on HC is worlds past any previous build of my main, beyond what I thought was possible.  I can't actually take credit for it, some great ppl here on the forums shared it and I just tweaked it a bit, making it worse but fitting my theme.  And now I am talking with ppl in the pylon thread, and OMG it might get even better!  Seriously, some of the mix/max ppl here are crazy, I am not worthy.

 

LOL, you put that typo A in there and at first I thought it was some 1337 term I was not familiar with, and it came up as "Network against Oppression of Women"....   And I am sorry I came across that way, I will be more careful.

This is understandable, you expected me to dig in.  I am thankful you recognized this and didn't jump down my throat, I also thought that was were it was going.

 

I remember when I first signed up on live it was in the disclaimer that characters were property of NC, and they could do whatever they wanted with them, use them for advertising, etc.

 

I was on the "other" server, but quit more than a year before word leaked out, mainly because there was just no-one to play with because Leandro was paranoid about it all coming down on his head.  And even then I stayed out of it to let the dust settle, and also because I thought that would be the end of it, oh well.  I never expected the code to get out and things like HC pop up, I didn't even join in until about a month or so ago, because I was expecting even this to also blow up, so it would not be worth putting effort into.  So I was never really involved in the hottest part of the flame war, sounds like you and some others were, so you had to deal with ppl like the one's you are describing.

 

It took balls for HC and others to stand up servers in broad daylight, and they even did a great job, it's better than live was.  Most surprising is that both the quantity and quality of people playing it now are better, that is actually the best part.... I would not have stayed or re-created my main character or be here for that matter if it were not for that.  None of the friends I had before are here, they have either moved on or just don't believe it.  Maybe only the really good players came back, so we here are the condensed remains.  It's really a great story.  I will bet this is part of the reason NC is contemplating working with them, because HC is showing great respect for what it is, that means allot in Asia (I go there allot).

 

The other thing this has done is allowed me to make peace with it.  I was extremely bitter as was everyone, I stopped playing any video games at all, in some ways I never recovered.  But now I feel like I have closure and won't feel bad weather it is here for a short or long time, it will be interesting to see how long it lasts. 

 

Yep, I get that now, I appreciate you taking the time to explain that.

 

I have been using the Internet since the 80's (before WWW, just e-mail and Usenet and some other stuff), and it didn't really become a public thing until about 1996 or so.  I remember the HELL we all had to go through when AoL dumped their entire userbase, millions of people, onto the Internet.  And sadly it was not a high quality bunch.  I have made it a point to avoid getting involved in flame wars, and certainly never starting one.  There is this effect where people will say things online they would NEVER say to you or anyone in person (even PPL I know in person), this is what I was thinking about during this exchange, I was thinking about you or whomever was on the other side, and saying to myself, damn, if we were at a bar it would not get this out of control.  I think this is all headed for something really bad, I am trying to wrap my brain around how I will help my children navigate it properly.

 

Sorry for the walls of text, I type fast.....

 

So here is hoping we are pleasantly surprised where this NC/HC things goes.

Walls of text are just fine by me, I've been laid up sick for the last 2 months and honestly reading forum stuff has been all thats keeping me sane (except for one exchange thats fortunately been MOD'ded) 

 

I think the main point of difference we have about the old char data is, my pleasure from the game IS making and levelling the character, by the time they ding 50 I think of them as finished and dull, for me it's the journey of making the character as they level that IS the game. and making them as good at what they do as I can, while still concentrating on the concept of the character over always selecting the best effort.

 

Trust me, nothing I said to you is anything I wouldn't say to your face, though I am rather famously blunt and have been known to get popped in the nose more than I probably should 😄

[Asacledhae]

My current characters are 1000000000000000000 times better than the ones i used to have.. Power wise, gear wise, AND costume wise..

I only re-created one particular char, cause she was my first ever, in my first MMO.. But, with a different build AND costume, as even though i kept the original ones saved, they felt outdated and badly made with my today's standards.

 

So, IF there will be an option to recover the old roster, i'll simply skip it, and keep what i've got now, as i feel a lot more satisfied with my current chars.

(Unless of course i can keep both accounts.. And if that's the case, i'll strip the "Stuff" from the old one, transfer them to my current one, and then give away what's left from the old one to a friend, in order to get more people in the game.) :P

[Snarky]

*looks around. *picks up really big rock...

 

So, they are going to get us all our okd characters and builds back?

[Nericus]

Well as I understand US trademark laws, it's ten years then it's use it or lose it. Unless the owner files renewal/intent to use and pays the fees.

 

Once that is done, if they are not actively using the trademark the clock is still set to ten years.  Some companies renew for sake of retaining the trademark, some actually use them.  We shall see.

 

Example of a trademark issue;  marvel comics circa 1967 obtained the captain marvel trademarks and made their own character. DC owns Shazam, the original captain marvel but cannot publish anything titled captain marvel but can call him that in the books.  However they just now call him Shazam

Edited January 8, 2020 by Nericus

[boggo2300]

4 hours ago, Snarky said:

*looks around. *picks up really big rock...

 

So, they are going to get us all our okd characters and builds back?

not quite, we are all going to get yours 😄