Need help on INV/SS

[Dreamsfar]

So I am overall thinking my build is ok, but not good enough.

How can I softcap my defense and raise my resists other than smashing/lethal?

Will the attacks I picked work well together?

Tanker - Invulnerability - Super Strength.mxd

[Tsuko]

19 minutes ago, Dreamsfar said:

So I am overall thinking my build is ok, but not good enough.

How can I softcap my defense and raise my resists other than smashing/lethal?

Will the attacks I picked work well together?

Tanker - Invulnerability - Super Strength.mxd 4.73 kB · 0 downloads

The SS / cross punch build is kinda a "classic" 🙂

 

Well... The "classic" inv SS build, the dream of Superman and cie... 🙂

 

Dont get me wrong it's a good AT, is it the best... not quite 😛 

 

Cause the rage crash is a thing on an armor set without endurance / stam management...

 

Wait why no rage ? no Knockout blow and no Archetype Only  io ?

 

[Dreamsfar]

Forgive me for any obvious mistakes I'm kind of new at advanced builds.

 

No rage because no incarnates + rage crash sounds disastrous, a lot of people told me that its not uncommon to not get rage, is SS really that bad without it?

I was told that knockout blow was slow enough that its not a must have, dunno how accurate that is. For attacks I will have jab, boxing, kick, cross punch, foot stomp, lazer eyes, and energy torrent. 4 single target and 3 AoE, will this combination under perform?

 

I didn't put archetype enhancements because I wasn't sure where to put them really.

 

I'm mostly going for a superman type build, but was trying to squeeze in more area damage since SS is lacking in that area.

 

Also, I probably should make a version without super expensive enhancers to play until I can afford that stuff?

Edited September 23, 2020 by Dreamsfar
To add info

[Tsuko]

36 minutes ago, Dreamsfar said:

Forgive me for any obvious mistakes I'm kind of new at advanced builds.

 

No no np 🙂 i was mostly joking, the only bad questions are those not asked. Forgive me 🙂

 

Quote

No rage because no incarnates + rage crash sounds disastrous, a lot of people told me that its not uncommon to not get rage, is SS really that bad without it?

I was told that knockout blow was slow enough that its not a must have, dunno how accurate that is. For attacks I will have jab, boxing, kick, cross punch, foot stomp, lazer eyes, and energy torrent. 4 single target and 3 AoE, will this combination under perform?

 

Let's say that the only "optimal" powers in Super Strenght are Rage, Knockout blow and Foot stomp 😛 In PVE Boxing and kick are jokes : only there to buff a cross punch. The issue with the mighty classic invul SS is that they share the same weakness : no Endurance, stamina or recovery management AND no Regen / heal ability (strong enough IF YOU RE NOT TANKY ENOUGH AKA WITH A FULL ENDGAME BUILD, keep cool the "social INVULNERABILITY warriors") : so Destiny incarnate can only fill one hole, not both.

 

• Rage is probably the most powerfull "build up" power of them all, but come with a price : the rage crash is not for everyone.
• Knovkout blow is the best attack of Super strenght : 

 

The whole Super Strenght spec is designed around Rage so :" will you underperform" yes, will you become unplayable ? NO if and only if your aim is not doing tons of damage.

 

People on help channel and so on give you what they know and if they know s..it, they will give you poop 😛

Quote

I didn't put archetype enhancements because I wasn't sure where to put them really.

Wise 

Quote

I'm mostly going for a superman type build, but was trying to squeeze in more area damage since SS is lacking in that area.

Tanker area taunt with all their single target attacks and taunt is there for this purpose

Quote

Also, I probably should make a version without super expensive enhancers to play until I can afford that stuff?

Wise too, but before you must ask you what type of tanker you want to begin with with your Clark Kent ?

 

Is it a damage dealer tanker or an immortal tanker able to tank for a team everywhere but with average low personnal self damage ?

Edited September 23, 2020 by Tsuko

[Supertanker]

You definitely want Rage, the crash really isn't a big deal, and the ToHit buff may be even more valuable than the damage. And KO Blow is just way too good to skip.

 

If you want Fly and Afterburner, I'd suggest taking Air Superiority instead of Hover. It's a useful attack for keeping annoying enemies off their feet.

[Tsuko]

33 minutes ago, Supertanker said:

You definitely want Rage, the crash really isn't a big deal, and the ToHit buff may be even more valuable than the damage. And KO Blow is just way too good to skip.

 

If you want Fly and Afterburner, I'd suggest taking Air Superiority instead of Hover. It's a useful attack for keeping annoying enemies off their feet.

Rage endurance crash + Hasten endurance crash + Flying instead of hover (making even more pressure on endu consum) = 100% chance of detoggle on a average to low budget non incarnate build.

 

The only interest of Air Sup would be to "force" another Force feedback Recharge and cross punch do all better than Air sup.

 

And on an invul / SS, taking Ageless for infinite Endurance means no Rebirth, leaving the invul tanker with no other way to heal him than Dull pain every "too much" seconds in extreme content.

 

Not to mention, the -20% def ALL during the crash, which can be deadly with an invul lacking a bit of gear VS only 1 strong target.

Edited September 24, 2020 by Tsuko

[Supertanker]

13 minutes ago, Tsuko said:

Rage endurance crash + Hasten endurance crash + Flying instead of hover (making even more pressure on endu consum) = 100% chance of detoggle on a average to low budget non incarnate build.

Why is Fly on? And if Rage plus Hasten is a problem, I take Rage every time. I really notice the lack of the ToHit buff when playing other sets.

 

[tellania]

Ok, finally can access your build.

 

http://www.cohplanner.com/mids/download.php?uc=1486&c=691&a=1382&f=HEX&dc=78DA65944B4F135114C7EF74A6943E9062A1E555A085524A61DAE1A111352E048D0AA65AE3CEE0A0D7D23896A62D46962EDC2BF8581ADDE9C22FE0B7F011F51BE0033571AB194FE7FC838D33C9F477FABFE771EFB977EECA9DC5D0ABD3774F082574D232EBF5D54B66E5A6ACF9CE9B8DCD9A6989E6E3A37788F5D545794356EA523F53B9BD695564CD5C2B5BE5C6D6008657A425A55EDCAC925D6CD464A5D45817C1C2C686A59FB2CAA5F54607DB4DB35C29059C7FC5AA94D7438EB92CCD2AE991A56AF99ABE44F94B5BAB2B66BD216B5BBD348B0CBD6FFCF4A334E7652B2246465C139E1955084313530181C716E2AA70B4B7E4AFB0BFAA64C84893FF04531B0353CC77E4AB72BC57DDE39C816FE05766E80BF3C0677097F99E62BDA8E3459D36D41947FE0CEABDA685F8E0EB836F3BC6DAE11B456C90DAEFC79AFCBF15A7D6071282880F223E04FF04F24C238F42F11D1CAF761408494DF45E002F327345A64ABE9DC8DB89BC61E40D23EF20F27EA43974398DB5B5AE798226C4C1FF68BCF038F3357A78DE1AE58F707E4F045A7737186626C9A707FBDB93E53D8C8206ED6F0CFB137BA439DAC843F03E33F18039BA0DEE303FD17CFB38AFB70FB5FA51BBFF1CEFE110E634F40BFFFF08E77CCD50DD01E7D0D99E8185E6DA543108E6409D7CE2E8731C7D1E419F13E8B3813EE7C877987D95E15BDCA3318BF9944A273196C4BA47C1398A4B61FDA9E3EC3F7E0C3CC24C2F30278F32A7EF319F51DE098ED5260CD63279701A313950673EA7982CEA650FB336350BCE818750679E9943BD28EDA3CEFD163AFAFA920E621E5AFE09FB0D6A2DDFAC4D8FC868FB5FB83DE91ACDBB14C3A5CCBA943997B2EC520A1ACA92A2388A3FBC7F1FD87B81FD7B04A33FFE291E25C12766EC32AF347D96BF92EFAEA89F8196FB083D68DBC619D8C11E3E665E0938B79C53DF6CB1D75AEC428BFD171A98E480

 

First, made some adjustments and sacrifices.   Why have so much recharge, you you gave up your best attacks?

I shifted slots to your defense (SL is softcap), increased your resistance, and increased your endurance.   This gives you about 2.9  end/sec for attacks, not count the +endurance from panacea or the two performance shifters (they may not stack, careful)

 

Yes, rage and hasten drops will suck, carry some emergency blue's, but this build is significantly better.  I did add the accolades to increase your hp and endurance though (it is achievable for anyone)

 

It was a quick and dirty change, mostly attempting to keep the flavor of what you wanted, giving back the best attacks, removing the attacks you probably wont use, so ...    also, removed focus accuracy (.78 end/sec!!!!) and replaced it with conserve power, it will also help out (greatly).   To help compensate for some +recharge,  I put a chance %recharge in foot stomp AND energy torrent in the 6th slot.    Those should help compensate.

 

as for crosspunch, not sure how it compares to haymaker.  Mid's shows haymaker doing more damage, though its not a cone.

 

 

Edited September 24, 2020 by tellania

[Tsuko]

19 minutes ago, Supertanker said:

Why is Fly on? And if Rage plus Hasten is a problem, I take Rage every time. I really notice the lack of the ToHit buff when playing other sets.

 

ok

[Tsuko]

7 minutes ago, tellania said:

Ok, finally can access your build.

 

http://www.cohplanner.com/mids/download.php?uc=1486&c=691&a=1382&f=HEX&dc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

 

First, made some adjustments and sacrifices.   Why have so much recharge, you you gave up your best attacks?

I shifted slots to your defense (SL is softcap), increased your resistance, and increased your endurance.   This gives you about 3.25 end/sec for attacks.

Yes, rage and hasten drops will suck, carry some emergency blue's, but this build is significantly better.  I did add the alcolades to increase your hp and endurance though (it is achievable for anyone)

 

It was a quick and dirty change, mostly attempting to keep the flavor of what you wanted, giving back the best attacks, removing the attacks you probably wont use, so ...

 

nice one 🙂

 

I allow me to present a no rage "Tanky" build, if the op decide to go for a defensive tanker.

 

Here with 1 stack of ATO and only lowest buff of rebirth Radial :

 

 

Tanker - Invulnerability - Super Strength - Tanky.mxd

 

Have fun 🙂

[tellania]

If  was going to skip rage, I'd seriously take another secondary (dark melee is excellent for survival).

 

My main is an invul/ss tank, and I have 2 builds.  one for uber survivability, the other for fun/damage.

I couldnt fit fly in my survivable build, nor laser eyes, but I put it in my fun/damage build (which can have some endurance problems, but still fun to play).

 

In short, this is what the original poster desires for a build, we can only suggest.   If they wanted a tough invul/ss tanker (no fly, no LBE).

 

http://www.cohplanner.com/mids/download.php?uc=1486&c=686&a=1372&f=HEX&dc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

 

Though Tsuko brought up a good point.  We can replace a 4 set might of tanker ATO (still have a 10% recharge), and add a proc from aTO superior fist.    The OP should also look into some ATO's, they really help.

Edited September 24, 2020 by tellania

[Hyperstrike]

If you are not going to take Rage, just pick another Secondary.

Tough Inv/SS?

About as tough as you can get without factoring in anything beyond your Alpha.

If you're worried about End Consumption, go with Cardiac instead of Resilient.  Your Resists only come down about 1.5% or so.
 

Spoiler

Hero Plan by Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer 2.7.2.10
https://github.com/Crytilis/mids-reborn-hero-designer

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Mo Durable 2: Level 50 Technology Tanker
Primary Power Set: Invulnerability
Secondary Power Set: Super Strength
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Flight
Ancillary Pool: Pyre Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Resist Physical Damage -- RctArm-ResDam:40(A), RctArm-ResDam/EndRdx:40(3), RctArm-ResDam/Rchg:40(3), RctArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:40(5), GldArm-3defTpProc:50(5), StdPrt-ResDam/Def+:30(7)
Level 1: Jab -- SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg:50(A), SprMghoft-Dmg/Rchg:50(7), SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(9), SprMghoft-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(9), SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(11), SprMghoft-Rchg/Res%:50(11)
Level 2: Temp Invulnerability -- UnbGrd-ResDam:50(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx:50(13), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam:50(13), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:50(15), UnbGrd-Max HP%:50(15)
Level 4: Haymaker -- SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg:50(A), SprGntFis-Dmg/Rchg:50(19), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(21), SprGntFis-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(21), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(23), SprGntFis-Rchg/+Absorb:50(23)
Level 6: Dull Pain -- DctWnd-Heal/Rchg:50(A), NmnCnv-Heal/Rchg:50(50), Pnc-Heal/Rchg:50(50)
Level 8: Resist Elements -- RctArm-ResDam:40(A), RctArm-ResDam/EndRdx:40(25), RctArm-ResDam/Rchg:40(25), RctArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:40(27)
Level 10: Taunt -- PrfZng-Dam%:50(A)
Level 12: Unyielding -- UnbGrd-ResDam:50(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx:50(27), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam:50(29), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:50(29)
Level 14: Resist Energies -- RctArm-ResDam:40(A), RctArm-ResDam/EndRdx:40(31), RctArm-ResDam/Rchg:40(31), RctArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:40(31)
Level 16: Kick -- FrcFdb-Rechg%:50(A)
Level 18: Invincibility -- ShlWal-Def:50(A), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx:50(33), ShlWal-Def/Rchg:50(33), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:50(33), Rct-ResDam%:50(34)
Level 20: Knockout Blow -- SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg:50(A), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx:50(34), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:50(34), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(36), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg:50(36), SprBlsCol-Rchg/HoldProc:50(36)
Level 22: Tough -- UnbGrd-ResDam:50(A)
Level 24: Weave -- ShlWal-Def:50(A), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx:50(37), ShlWal-Def/Rchg:50(37), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:50(37)
Level 26: Tough Hide -- ShlWal-Def:50(A), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx:50(39), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:50(39), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP:50(39)
Level 28: Rage -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(40)
Level 30: Combat Jumping -- ShlWal-Def:50(A), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx:50(40), ShlWal-Def/Rchg:50(40), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:50(42)
Level 32: Super Jump -- WntGif-ResSlow:50(A)
Level 35: Hurl -- SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg:50(A), SprWntBit-Dmg/Rchg:50(42), SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:50(42), SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(43), SprWntBit-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg:50(43), SprWntBit-Rchg/SlowProc:50(43)
Level 38: Foot Stomp -- SprAvl-Acc/Dmg:50(A), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx:50(45), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:50(45), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(45), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(46), SprAvl-Rchg/KDProc:50(46)
Level 41: Char -- SprEnt-Acc/Hold:50(A), SprEnt-Hold/Rchg:50(46), SprEnt-End/Rchg:50(48), SprEnt-Acc/Hold/End:50(48), SprEnt-Acc/Hold/End/Rchg:50(48)
Level 44: Hasten -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(50)
Level 47: Hover -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+:50(A)
Level 49: Fly -- Frb-Stlth:50(A)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Gauntlet
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Flight-I:50(A)
Level 2: Health -- Pnc-Heal/+End:50(A), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+:50(17), Mrc-Rcvry+:40(17)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I:50(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%:50(A), PrfShf-EndMod:50(19)
Level 50: Resilient Core Paragon
------------

 

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[Supertanker]

3 hours ago, Hyperstrike said:

If you are not going to take Rage, just pick another Secondary.

Tough Inv/SS?

About as tough as you can get without factoring in anything beyond your Alpha.

It can be a little tougher: put the Gladiator's Armor +Def in Tough (since it's a passive bonus that doesn't need Tough running) and the Impervious Skin +Regen in Resist Physical Damage.

 

I don't take the Fighting Pool so I have the +Def in Unstoppable.

[Hyperstrike]

I prefer to place  the uniques as lower as I can in the build.
This way they stay active throughout exemp play.

[SableShrike]

37 minutes ago, Hyperstrike said:

I prefer to place  the uniques as lower as I can in the build.
This way they stay active throughout exemp play.

For the PvP uniques it doesn’t matter where they are placed.  You can test in an Ouro mission.

 

The only ones I know need to be “on” to work are Kismet and Impervious Skin’s Regen%.  Most of the others can go anywhere at any level.

 

(Some I’m unsure of since I only ever put them in Fitness: Power Transfer and Panacea.)

Edited September 24, 2020 by SableShrike

[Dreamsfar]

Ok, I hit lvl 50, and this is what I'm rolling with right now due to not being able to afford all the purples etc.

Is this ok? I plan on getting barrier destiny

 

Tanker - Invulnerability - Super Strength - cheap.mxd

[Hyperstrike]

For most content, you're going to find yourself rather squishy.
I mean, you won't be a Blaster or anything.
But at higher levels (and Incarnate content), it's going to be especially rough going.

[Dreamsfar]

Well, I didn't include Destiny: Barrier on my build but with that active all my defense are at like 120, and resists at 90, I figured that would make me tough enough to start collecting more expensive enhancements?

 

Other than adding tough which I wont need with purples as my S/L will be maxed, S/L is already 83.

So as far as I can tell the only way I could make any significant improvements is to spend like half a billion or so influence?