Practically Free Build: Softcapped DM/SR w/ no sets

[jack_nomind]

I'm working on a series of basic-enhancement-only builds for new players or players looking for a unique challenge.  The first one is a softcapped DM/SR.  I've left the final two power picks open and one pool selection available for players to choose travel or other powers.  To publish this at 45% all positions, I had to assign Defense to all six enhancements for the three SR toggles.  Changing at least two of those to Endurance Reduction is a much, much better choice for practical play, and the build can still achieve softcap with Hover or Stealth in the fourth pool.  Because it's a Dark Melee build and debuffs tohit, it will also have effective softcap against anything it's actually hitting even if its Defense is somewhat below 45% (exactly how much below depends on the mob's resistance to tohit debuffs).

 

Shadow Maul is in the build as-is only for its occasional utility in dealing with minion groups and to fill out the attack chain until Midnight Grasp is available; however, its enhancements and Shadow Punch's could be swapped for better damage so long as SM catches at least two enemies, at a cost of endurance and mobility.

 

Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.962

http://www.cohplanner.com/

 

Click this DataLink to open the build!

 

Shadow Speedster: Level 50 Science Scrapper

Primary Power Set: Dark Melee

Secondary Power Set: Super Reflexes

Power Pool: Leaping

Power Pool: Fighting

Power Pool: Leadership

Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery

 

Hero Profile:

Level 1: Smite -- EndRdx-I(A), Acc-I(3), Dmg-I(3), Dmg-I(5), Dmg-I(5), RechRdx-I(7)

Level 1: Focused Fighting -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(7), DefBuff-I(9), DefBuff-I(9), DefBuff-I(11), DefBuff-I(11)

Level 2: Shadow Punch -- EndRdx-I(A), Acc-I(13), Dmg-I(13), Dmg-I(15), Dmg-I(15), RechRdx-I(17)

Level 4: Focused Senses -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(19), DefBuff-I(21), DefBuff-I(21), DefBuff-I(23), DefBuff-I(23)

Level 6: Shadow Maul -- EndRdx-I(A), Acc-I(25), Dmg-I(25)

Level 8: Siphon Life -- Heal-I(A), Acc-I(27), Dmg-I(29), Dmg-I(29), Dmg-I(31), RechRdx-I(31)

Level 10: Practiced Brawler -- EndRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(27), RechRdx-I(31)

Level 12: Combat Jumping -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(33), DefBuff-I(33)

Level 14: Agile -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(33), DefBuff-I(34)

Level 16: Dodge -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(34), DefBuff-I(34)

Level 18: Dark Consumption -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(36), Acc-I(36)

Level 20: Quickness -- Run-I(A)

Level 22: Boxing -- Empty(A)

Level 24: Tough -- ResDam-I(A), ResDam-I(36), EndRdx-I(37), EndRdx-I(37)

Level 26: Weave -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(37), DefBuff-I(39), EndRdx-I(39), EndRdx-I(39)

Level 28: Lucky -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(40), DefBuff-I(40)

Level 30: Soul Drain -- RechRdx-I(A), Acc-I(40)

Level 32: Midnight Grasp -- EndRdx-I(A), Acc-I(42), Dmg-I(42), Dmg-I(42), RechRdx-I(43), RechRdx-I(43)

Level 35: Evasion -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(43), DefBuff-I(45), DefBuff-I(45), DefBuff-I(45), DefBuff-I(46)

Level 38: Conserve Power -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(46)

Level 41: Maneuvers -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(46), DefBuff-I(48), EndRdx-I(48), EndRdx-I(48)

Level 44: Physical Perfection -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(50), Heal-I(50)

Level 47: [Empty]

Level 49: [Empty]

Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Critical Hit

Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Sprint -- Run-I(A)

Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)

Level 4: Ninja Run

Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)

Level 2: Health -- Heal-I(A), Heal-I(17)

Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)

Level 2: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(19), EndMod-I(50)

------------

 

 

 

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[Nightmarer]

My first char was a DM/SR way before Invention and my build was pretty similar to this one except I never used Tough because the 19% res S/L I found out did nothing for me. I understand what you are trying to do but, without going mad with sets and all that, just 1 enhancement that costs the meager sum of 20 merits makes the build playable (Steadfast +3%def) which I don't think it is bad for beginners. Don't get me wrong, I know there's a thin line here where we can start "if you put only 2", then 3, then just 1 set... in this case, I think the gain of playability in the form of endurance management is well worth using 1 and only 1 set IO which anyone can have just by completing pretty much any TF or a couple story arcs. The enhancements I gained I redistributed to my taste but obviously there is a lot of room for different combinations. As the two last powers I selected Touch of Fear to contribute with even more To Hit Debuff and hover because of its usefulness against Caltrops and when speed boosted in uncomfortable maps. In this case, I am not using Tough because I never found it useful enough to justify the endurance consumption but that's up to the final user to wiggle slots accordingly to enable Tough or not:

 

Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.962

http://www.cohplanner.com/

 

Click this DataLink to open the build!

 

Shadow Speedster: Level 50 Science Scrapper

Primary Power Set: Dark Melee

Secondary Power Set: Super Reflexes

Power Pool: Leaping

Power Pool: Fighting

Power Pool: Leadership

Power Pool: Flight

Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery

 

Hero Profile:

Level 1: Smite -- EndRdx-I(A), Acc-I(3), Dmg-I(3), Dmg-I(5), Dmg-I(5), RechRdx-I(7)

Level 1: Focused Fighting -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(7), DefBuff-I(9), DefBuff-I(9), DefBuff-I(11)

Level 2: Shadow Punch -- EndRdx-I(A), Acc-I(13), Dmg-I(13), Dmg-I(15), Dmg-I(15)

Level 4: Focused Senses -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(19), DefBuff-I(21), DefBuff-I(21), DefBuff-I(23)

Level 6: Shadow Maul -- Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(17), RechRdx-I(23), RechRdx-I(25), Dmg-I(25), Dmg-I(36)

Level 8: Siphon Life -- Heal-I(A), Acc-I(27), Dmg-I(29), Dmg-I(29), Dmg-I(31), RechRdx-I(31)

Level 10: Practiced Brawler -- EndRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(27), RechRdx-I(31)

Level 12: Combat Jumping -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(33), DefBuff-I(33)

Level 14: Agile -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(33), DefBuff-I(34)

Level 16: Dodge -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(34), DefBuff-I(34)

Level 18: Dark Consumption -- RechRdx-I(A)

Level 20: Quickness -- Run-I(A)

Level 22: Boxing -- Empty(A)

Level 24: Tough -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A)

Level 26: Weave -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(37), DefBuff-I(39), EndRdx-I(39), EndRdx-I(39)

Level 28: Lucky -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(40), DefBuff-I(40)

Level 30: Soul Drain -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(36), RechRdx-I(37), ToHit-I(37), ToHit-I(40), Acc-I(46)

Level 32: Midnight Grasp -- EndRdx-I(A), Acc-I(42), Dmg-I(42), Dmg-I(42), RechRdx-I(43), RechRdx-I(43)

Level 35: Evasion -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(36), DefBuff-I(43), DefBuff-I(45), DefBuff-I(45)

Level 38: Conserve Power -- RechRdx-I(A)

Level 41: Maneuvers -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(45), DefBuff-I(46), EndRdx-I(48), EndRdx-I(48)

Level 44: Physical Perfection -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(50), Heal-I(50)

Level 47: Touch of Fear -- Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(48), ToHitDeb-I(50)

Level 49: Hover -- DefBuff-I(A)

Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Critical Hit

Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)

Level 1: Sprint -- Run-I(A)

Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)

Level 4: Ninja Run

Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)

Level 2: Health -- Heal-I(A), Heal-I(11), Heal-I(17)

Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)

Level 2: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(19), EndMod-I(46)

------------

------------

Set Bonus Totals:

• 3% Defense(Melee)
  
• 3% Defense(Smashing)
  
• 3% Defense(Lethal)
  
• 3% Defense(Fire)
  
• 3% Defense(Cold)
  
• 3% Defense(Energy)
  
• 3% Defense(Negative)
  
• 3% Defense(Psionic)
  
• 3% Defense(Ranged)
  
• 3% Defense(AoE)
  

------------

Set Bonuses:

Steadfast Protection

(Tough)

•   3% Defense(Melee), 3% Defense(AoE), 3% Defense(Ranged), 3% Defense(Smashing), 3% Defense(Lethal), 3% Defense(Fire), 3% Defense(Cold), 3% Defense(Energy), 3% Defense(Negative), 3% Defense(Psionic)
  

 

 

 

 

 

 

[jack_nomind]

I never used Tough because the 19% res S/L I found out did nothing for me.

 

You're mistaken.

 

My build includes Tough and is calculated with it active, even though it has only 16% S/L resist.  Defense and Resistance are multiplicative in terms of survivability, and that little bit does help more than it would seem -- but that's not why I have it.

 

Three powers in SR have scaling damage resistance.  With all three, SR gets about 1.5% damage resistance to all for every 1% of health it falls below 50%.  So just before death, an SR scrapper is at the resist cap for all damage types.  Of course they have so little health left that it almost doesn't matter; the goal is to move that bar closer to a meaningful health total.  With 15% S/L resist, the S/L cap is reached at 10% remaining health instead... enough to be realistically meaningful.  At that point the SR scrapper is more survivable than almost any other Scrapper secondary in the game.

 

I understand what you are trying to do

 

Thank you.  But you're mistaken about that, as well.  The old Scrapper Challenge wasn't run with "just one" temp power, no matter how much easier Wedding Band would have made it to accomplish.

[Nightmarer]

I never used Tough because the 19% res S/L I found out did nothing for me.

 

You're mistaken.

 

My build includes Tough and is calculated with it active, even though it has only 16% S/L resist.  Defense and Resistance are multiplicative in terms of survivability, and that little bit does help more than it would seem -- but that's not why I have it.

 

Three powers in SR have scaling damage resistance.  With all three, SR gets about 1.5% damage resistance to all for every 1% of health it falls below 50%.  So just before death, an SR scrapper is at the resist cap for all damage types.  Of course they have so little health left that it almost doesn't matter; the goal is to move that bar closer to a meaningful health total.  With 15% S/L resist, the S/L cap is reached at 10% remaining health instead... enough to be realistically meaningful.  At that point the SR scrapper is more survivable than almost any other Scrapper secondary in the game.

 

No I'm not, I know about the scaling resistance and I also know that the 16% on Tough never made any difference. If you think it did for you, fair enough, it probbaly did, in my experience, that 16% S/L resistance never meant any difference between faceplanting or not, its contribution is pretty much unnoticeable when speaking of S/L dmg combined with exotic dmg such as Fire/Lethal or Energy/Smashing while, on pure lethal dmg there is always a -def debuff associated, despite SR 90% resistance to def debuff, a series of hits that take your health below 50% have for sure dented def noticeably below softcap so more and more hits are meant to land so the 16% percent can give you a couple of seconds tops, what kept the health bar higher was Siphon Life and if said couple fo seconds are the difference between Siphon Life being recharged or not, it's a marginal contribution. Maybe it's slightly better noticeable in pure smashing dmg, still, I wouldn't call Tough a sound investment.

 

Regarding the Scrapper challenge, I guess I missed what you meant by that since your original post said nothing about a scrapper challenge and I thought you just wanted a set free build for newbies but what I have seen is an almost unplayable and seriously gimped build with Soul Drain totally underslotted.

[jack_nomind]

what I have seen is an almost unplayable and seriously gimped build with Soul Drain totally underslotted.

 

Do you mean it's unplayable because Soul Drain doesn't provide enough +DMG for your preference, or it's unplayable for some other reason, and also Soul Drain doesn't provide enough +DMG?  If it's the former, I think you're again mistaken.  If it's the latter, could you elaborate?

 

For what it's worth, my bluntness isn't meant as hostility.  I think your opinion is relevant, but you're incorrect on matters of math.

[Nightmarer]

Basically it's underslotted for recharge and it's not up as often as needed, so the longer you delay the dmg boost the more time you keep fighting and burning endurance. Usually toggles are not what eat endurance but in theis case, tehre are a lot of toggles and little endrdx, the end consumption is on par with an unmitigated DA build.

 

Meh, I keep editing typos and getting new thoughts and editing more and... lack of sleep is an annoying thing.

[Nightmarer]

For what it's worth, my bluntness isn't meant as hostility.  I think your opinion is relevant, but you're incorrect on matters of math.

 

I appreciate that and thought so much, if I sound blunt, which unfortunately happens, it's because English is not my native language and getting into specifics is usually really ahrd to translate the idea in mind accurately.

[Nightmarer]

Oh ffs, no more typo editing, let's leave it as ahrd = hard but more so

[Murcielago]

I would six slot SD with acc/rech/end also I know you said no sets but its so easy these days to get 200 merits and add the two 3% def IOs and it would add so much more flexibility to your build.

[DSorrow]

I would six slot SD with acc/rech/end also I know you said no sets but its so easy these days to get 200 merits and add the two 3% def IOs and it would add so much more flexibility to your build.

 

I just hit 50 on my first character last week and just by doing story arcs / TFs to level up I had about 500 merits when I dinged. Even if you wouldn't prioritize TFs and story arcs for leveling up like I did, I'd expect anyone who doesn't just join farms or paper mission teams to have at least 200 merits by 50.

 

As an additional note, while this may be a challenge to avoid set IOs, I'd actually go for a frankenslot build at the bare minimum once you hit 50. Level 50 generic IOs cost ~500k each to craft (50-100k recipe, ~400k crafting costs) while you can get many lvl 30-40 uncommon set IOs at 100-200k per piece (10-50k recipe, ~100k crafting). Maybe slightly apples to oranges, but the way I see it, lvl 30-40 split IOs offer roughly similar enhancement values to lvl 50 generics so it's not an unfair comparison and actually more accessible to new players due to being less expensive. It'll take a slight bit of research, though, but if a player has the mental capability to learn to craft generic IOs, going for a frankenslot build where you ignore set bonuses doesn't require much on top of that.

[Yipp]

This is a great thread especially the comments of Murchelago & Nightmarer. 

 

I have a Dark Melee Brute 31 & a new 50 Dark/Dark Corruptor, and I never played with IO's sets live. While a scrapper discussion, your back and forth is very informative. 

 

Thank you all

[jack_nomind]

Okay, so I think I should try to explain why I'm doing this without any set IOs at all.  There are basically three reasons.

 

1. New players.  I don't mean a setless build is the best midpoint of price to effectiveness.  Instead, think of them as a teaching aid.  They're new-player-friendly in the sense that they're simple to understand.  The existence of a build like this also shows to someone who has never used sets to build a character that despite the community consensus, sets really aren't necessary to play the game at any content level.

 

2. People looking for a challenge/alternative play.  Running the best farmer or ITF soloer is frankly kind of boring.  To me, and I think to many other veteran players, those are solved problems.  Getting as far as possible on as little as possible is a huge part of the Scrapper ethos, and I don't know about y'all, but I'm a Scrapper in every AT I play.

 

3. It's a personal challenge to avoid using sets at all in thinking of a build, and requires me to look at power sets in a different way than I otherwise would.  I'm starting with melee because it's easiest for me to structure, but I plan to do at least one build of this type for each basic AT (undecided on EATs).

 

[Nightmarer]

1. New players.  I don't mean a setless build is the best midpoint of price to effectiveness.  Instead, think of them as a teaching aid.  They're new-player-friendly in the sense that they're simple to understand.  The existence of a build like this also shows to someone who has never used sets to build a character that despite the community consensus, sets really aren't necessary to play the game at any content level.

 

That is great becauce, although I am trying to bring friends to the game, sometimes I am overwhelmed trying to explain everything and even worse, translating stuff into Spanish so threads and iniciatives like this one are really helpful because they're providing a basic build without sets to help understand but also the chance to slowly introduce the concept of sets prioritizing, in this case +def, in others could be KB Prot or +HP or anything totally different. I wish there was a section on all AT's dedicated to basic builds the way you did here.

[Cheese Slicer]

Would the OP build be viable to use as a leveling build? I have a low lol DM/SR I'd like to get go 50.

[jack_nomind]

Would the OP build be viable to use as a leveling build? I have a low lol DM/SR I'd like to get go 50.

 

For the power placement order, yes.  Slot placement levels will be up to you.

[SmalltalkJava]

My newbie-ness is probably showing through. but could this basic outline be applied to a Dark/SR Sentinel?  Just replacing the Dark melee attacks with appropriate Dark Blast.