Advice: Mind Cont / Empathy Build

[Daystar]

The title says it all.  I had a Mind/Empathy on live so I rebuilt her on Homecoming and she ended up being my Homecoming first 50.  But its punishing to try and solo (I wouldnt of made it to 50 if it wasnt for groups to handle mission)

 

I skip the two sleeps and Telekinesis, taking the rest for Mind Control.

I have all the Empathy except Absorb pain.

 

Speed: Hasten

Flight: Hover and Fly

Concealment: Stealth and Grant Stealth

Presence: Pacify, Intimidate, Invoke Panic, Unrelenting

 

Here is to hoping you folks can help me.  😄

[oedipus_tex]

I'm going to be honest and say as much as I feel like these two sets compliment each other conceptually, mechanically they don't do each other a whole lot of favors. The best news is that both of them benefit from a lot of Global Recharge, but that's about where the synergy ends.

 

By all means you should play it if that is what your heart is set on. Concept matters a lot. But as far as soloing, like you said, it's going to be punishing. Even on teams these two sets don't have a whole lot going for them by the time you build them with IOs. 

 

If you're willing to reconsider your set choices, some alternatives with very similar mechanics/concepts are:

• Dark/Empathy: Would give you a single target Confusion power, a cone fear with -ToHit, a good PBAoE stun you can use as either a shutdown or proc bomb, and two pets. Your regen and heals combo nicely with all of the -ToHit in Dark Control.  
• Illusion/Empathy: All the fire and forget pets here let you send your illusions into the world and then concentrate on your buffs.
• Gravity/Empathy: Lacks the Confusion abilities, but doubles down on the "telekinetic" aspects of the psi concept. You can't heal the pet, but probably wont need to. You can buff his Regen and Defense.

 

Don't forget that you get to pick an APP pool, so you can tie your Psi concept together with the Psi APP.

 

If you're determined to stick with Mind/Emp you'll probably want a Ranged Defense + Recharge build. I'd set my expectations fairly low. Even Mind Controllers with debuff secondaries often struggle to deal enough damage. Things are a bit better these days with powers like Arcane Bolt, but Mind Control's Containment issues are well known, and the set doesn't have particularly good AoE controls nor a pet to make up for it.

 

I did used to main a Mind Controller a long time ago and the best advice I can pass along is that Power Boost is your friend. You can Power Boost Total Domination and use that to set Containment. It's not ideal but does function. Power Boost also happens to combo well with Empathy so that's a plus.

Edited June 8, 2021 by oedipus_tex

[Daystar]

Yea I did the incarnate mission where your supposed to be a god and found it boring.  Just set Mez to auto fire and go get something to eat. 

[DreadShinobi]

As @oedipus_tex said, the two sets love global recharge, and more global recharge on top of global recharge. I am not however of the mind that there is any reason not to kit out your first 50, or to feel like you need to reroll it. No it's not going to be a top performer, but it will do just fine at supporting teams like you would like it to. That and you will have plenty of opportunities to make your next character be something that can pack some more punch. The inf may be initially hard to come by, but it just gets easier and easier.

 

Here is my take on a mind/emp, with 125% global recharge, and 3 proc loaded attacks, Dominate, Terrify, and Psionic Tornado. I tried to keep the power picks the same as what you listed, but I dropped Presence pool for Leadership and dropped Grant Invis. Depending on your uptime with Psionic Tornado Forcefeedback procs, you will have perma mez protection, hasten, Adrenaline Boost, and maybe 20-30s downtime on your RAs. All depends on your forcefeedback uptime, but Psinado is pretty good at that as long as you have mob saturation. Good luck ^^

 

Hero Plan by Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer 2.6.1.25
https://github.com/Crytilis/mids-reborn-hero-designer

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Magic Controller
Primary Power Set: Mind Control
Secondary Power Set: Empathy
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Concealment
Ancillary Pool: Psionic Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Mesmerize -- FrtHyp-Sleep(A), FrtHyp-Acc/Rchg(43), FrtHyp-Sleep/EndRdx(45), FrtHyp-Plct%(45), FrtHyp-Acc/Sleep/Rchg(46)
Level 1: Healing Aura -- Pnc-Heal/EndRedux(A), Pnc-Heal(33), Pnc-Heal/Rchg(34), Pnc-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(34), Pnc-Heal/+End(34)
Level 2: Dominate -- UnbCns-Dam%(A), GhsWdwEmb-Dam%(3), NrnSht-Dam%(3), GldNet-Dam%(15), GldJvl-Dam%(15), Apc-Dam%(17)
Level 4: Heal Other -- Prv-Heal(A), Prv-Heal/EndRdx(5), Prv-EndRdx/Rchg(5), Prv-Heal/Rchg(11), Prv-Heal/Rchg/EndRdx(13), Prv-Absorb%(13)
Level 6: Confuse -- CrcPrs-Conf(A), CrcPrs-Conf/Rchg(7), CrcPrs-Acc/Conf/Rchg(7), CrcPrs-Conf/EndRdx(9), CrcPrs-Acc/Rchg(9), CrcPrs-Conf%(11)
Level 8: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 10: Hover -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 12: Fly -- BlsoftheZ-ResKB(A), BlsoftheZ-Travel/EndRdx(42)
Level 14: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(17), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(42)
Level 16: Clear Mind -- Range-I(A)
Level 18: Total Domination -- BslGaz-Acc/Hold(A), BslGaz-Rchg/Hold(19), BslGaz-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(19), BslGaz-Acc/Rchg(25)
Level 20: Fortitude -- Rct-Def(A), Rct-Def/EndRdx(21), Rct-EndRdx/Rchg(21), Rct-Def/Rchg(23), Rct-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(23), Rct-ResDam%(25)
Level 22: Stealth -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 24: Resurrect -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 26: Terrify -- PstBls-Dam%(A), Bmbdmt-+FireDmg(27), CldSns-%Dam(27), JvlVll-Dam%(29), GlmoftheA-Dam%(29), Ann-ResDeb%(31)
Level 28: Recovery Aura -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(31)
Level 30: Tactics -- AdjTrg-ToHit/EndRdx(A)
Level 32: Mass Confusion -- SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear(A), SprWiloft-Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/Rchg(37), SprWiloft-EndRdx/Rchg(37), SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx(40), SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx/Rchg(40), SprWiloft-Rchg/Dmg%(46)
Level 35: Regeneration Aura -- Pnc-Heal/EndRedux(A), Pnc-EndRdx/Rchg(36), Pnc-Heal/Rchg(36), Pnc-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(36), Pnc-Heal(37)
Level 38: Adrenalin Boost -- Pnc-Heal/EndRedux(A), Pnc-EndRdx/Rchg(39), Pnc-Heal/Rchg(39), Pnc-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(39), Pnc-Heal(40)
Level 41: Indomitable Will -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), RechRdx-I(43)
Level 44: Mind Over Body -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), GldArm-3defTpProc(45), GldArm-ResDam(46)
Level 47: Psionic Tornado -- FrcFdb-Rechg%(A), PstBls-Dam%(48), JvlVll-Dam%(48), Bmbdmt-+FireDmg(48), ExpStr-Dam%(50), PstBls-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(50)
Level 49: Vengeance -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 1: Brawl -- Hct-Dmg/EndRdx(A), Hct-Dmg/Rchg(31), Hct-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), Hct-Acc/Rchg(33), Hct-Dmg(42)
Level 1: Containment 
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run 
Level 2: Swift -- HO:Micro(A)
Level 2: Health -- Mrc-Rcvry+(A), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(43)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(50)
Level 50: Vigor Core Paragon 
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[Daystar]

I should of explained more.  Presence is mostly there for the self heal/rez.  Im the most likely one to die in any party Im healing with only the AoE self heal so the Rez comes in handy.  That said Leadership is super tempting if I can get it so I can run them and not drain my End when healing 🙂

[Bananiac]

Will hop in this bus and check out the build when back home. I still need to Clean Up and Incarnate mine correctly.

 

My Mind/Emp Controller was my 1st to 50 as well. Plays absolutely great in teams, especially in squishy ones.

But DONT try to solo anything with that!

[Daystar]

18 hours ago, 5099y_74c05 said:

Something to consider is using your alt build

I feel there is some mechanic your talking about I dont know of.  Can you have two character builds at once and swap between them?

 

18 hours ago, 5099y_74c05 said:

Soloing and on small teams Mass Hypnosis is a great tool; post 50 endgame not so much. If the later is more the case I can see why you skipped it,

Hypno was always frustrating to me.  I feel like it should be more useful than 'tap' and they wake up.  That said I have to admit the last time I used it was around issue 4.

 

I'll look up that defender build.  It sounds like a spot to steal a few ideas :D

[Doomguide2005]

     To add to what @5099y_74c05has said.  You have the potential for a total of 3 different builds for a character.  Your second build unlocks at lvl 10 and the 3rd unlocks when you complete Mender Ramiels arc and unlock your Alpha slot.  (I'm unsure, the HCwiki may need updating but you may only need to unlock the Alpha in any manner rather than specifically doing so only by completing his arc).   Only the primary and secondary sets are fixed and can't be changed.   Your epics and pools can be different between builds.  There is a minimum time between swapping builds and I believe there is a slash command so you don't have to be at a trainer these days.  Each build must be leveled up separately and both require their own enhancements (enhancements aren't shared between builds).   

     I don't use it often but it's especially handy for ATs and sets which don't solo well such as pretty much anything Empathy.  In particular I built 2 versions of one of my Emp/Sonics.  First a typical team oriented very high recharge team build, the second had capped range defense/hover and Fly while my main build used Super speed and had only incidental defense.

 

There's an article in the HCwiki called "Multiple Builds" with further details as well.

 

Edit:  PS ->  I believe he is talking about @Linea's build.  She has several Empathy builds in the thread titled "Is Empathy dead" if I recall where I saw them most recently.  Specifically it's the Emp/Fire/Soul that completed a +4/×8 ITF solo.

Edited June 9, 2021 by Doomguide2005

[Bananiac]

On 6/8/2021 at 3:38 PM, 5099y_74c05 said:

Something to consider is using your alt build to make a solo spec and have one that is team focused. Powers like Heal Other, Resurrect, Clear Mind, etc don't impact you for solo play. You can work in more offensive powers that benefit you to help meet your goals. When you team, you just switch back to your team spec. There is a "selfish" Empath build on the Defenders forum that soloed the ITF. You aren't going to get that kind of performance out of Mind/Emp/Psi but you can look at it for some inspiration.

 

Typically AoE Damage is difficult to make up. Sorcery is decent for Enflame and you can work it in fairly early and it can be cast directly on enemies. In this case it seems like choice would be theme breaking. 

....

 

Thanks! This is actually a very good advice for cases like this, and one of the things I put on my To-Do list. 

 

And Sorcery would actually fit at least My theme perfectly (Dark Anaesthetist, a magically empowered Brain Surgeon and Psychiatrist having some Beef with CoT). And after the recent upgrade to this powerset it looks like a very servicable solution for a Controller, I would say...