When someone bids, is the seller picked randomly?

[firstmagic]

So, I listed 20 crafted enchancements at 100k influence several days ago.

 

There are a fair few listings and a fair few bids.  The market information shows sales every day at the 100k price (or more).  A couple of mine sell each day ... but the market sales each day definitely outnumber how many I sell.  When there are multiple items that match a buyer's bid, is it random which seller's item is sold?  I was hoping it'd be 'first come first served', but my experience doesn't match that.

[firstmagic]

So, at the risk of being gauche and replying to my own post, I now understand how this can happen.  There may be lots of buyers at 100k, but only so many sellers at 100k... so the buyers are paying 100k, even though the sellers are listing for less than that.

 

Sorry for my confusion. :)

[justicebeliever]

Here’s a good post with examples -

 

https://forums.homecomingservers.com/index.php/topic,3754.0.html

[firstmagic]

Yeah, that essentially became my understanding yesterday, literally minutes after I posted my question. :)

 

Thanks for the follow-up!

[Yomo Kimyata]

I believe that when there are two or more eligible bids for an offer or two or more eligibility blue offers for a bid it is random rather than by when the bid or offer was made.

[justicebeliever]

Yomo, check the link above it explains the logic.  Nothing random or date driven about it...

[Shinobu]

Yomo, check the link above it explains the logic.  Nothing random or date driven about it...

 

When there are two or more eligible bids or two or more eligible offers -- that is, they are equal bids or equal offers for sale -- then logically it can go by date (who listed first) or it can be random to determine which sale occurs.  What other option would there be?

 

I think I used to know what the answer to this question was, but I've forgotten.  Nor do I really think it's that important.  But it is one or the other, when there are no other ways to determine which sale has precedence....

 

[justicebeliever]

Shinobu, as always, you are correct.  Yomo, apologies, I failed to take the time to read your question carefully enough.

 

I do not have the amswer myself.  -1 Inf for me

[Yomo Kimyata]

I believe that if there are multiple equivalents then the sales are random.  Example:  I put up a handful of offers of common salvage at 5.  I find that I’ll sell one or two from each block of ten rather than the first ten selling first, etc.

[Adeon Hawkwood]

When there are two or more eligible bids or two or more eligible offers -- that is, they are equal bids or equal offers for sale -- then logically it can go by date (who listed first) or it can be random to determine which sale occurs.  What other option would there be?

So I'm going by memory here and unfortunately I can't find the original data but from what I recall the answer is slightly more complicated than that. When the market was first released some people did some testing and concluded that while the order in which transactions were performed was not random it also wasn't as simple as "first in, first out". Basically there was some other variable (probably database ID related) that determined sale order which was deterministic but not predictable. So functionally it was random but it wasn't technically random.

 

Of course now that we've got the code base it should be possible for someone to look through the code and figure it out.

[Pine]

I have also noticed if I have 1 item listed for sale, I cannot buy any of that item on that character until that item sells. I guess this is to prevent people from automagically converting those items?

 

Ie. If I have a luck charm for sale, my luck charm bids won't go through.

[justicebeliever]

I have also noticed if I have 1 item listed for sale, I cannot buy any of that item on that character until that item sells. I guess this is to prevent people from automagically converting those items?

 

Ie. If I have a luck charm for sale, my luck charm bids won't go through.

 

It makes sense to have this restriction.  I can’t think of a reason you would want buy and sell the same item at the same time.

[Shinobu]

 

You would want to buy an IO at 2 million and sell it for 5 million, if that was something you could reasonably do because the price fluctuated that much.  Which might happen if there aren't a lot for sale at any given time.  I've never done this but that's how flipping works, and it seems to me that you should be able to bid low and sell high without any problems.  I suppose I could test it to be certain.

[Yomo Kimyata]

 

You would want to buy an IO at 2 million and sell it for 5 million, if that was something you could reasonably do because the price fluctuated that much.  Which might happen if there aren't a lot for sale at any given time.  I've never done this but that's how flipping works, and it seems to me that you should be able to bid low and sell high without any problems.  I suppose I could test it to be certain.

 

As a market maker, I can speak with authority that you certainly can have outstanding bids and offers on the same item at the same time.  (In fact, it's particularly satisfying to buy and sell things at the same time -- it tells you that you are in the sweet spot!).  You cannot, however, buy or sell from yourself.  Pine, that may have been the case that you would have been selling to yourself and so the system didn't put it through.

[greenstalker]

Didn't read the rest of posts but AFAIK market matches highest bidder with lowest seller so even if you put things at same price tag is even one person puts things 1 inf lower theirs sold first. Which is why you might see 500001 or 5100002 sale history for items since some sellers put it that way and some sellers are picky about it enough to find the point of break.

[Yomo Kimyata]

I believe that if there are multiple equivalents then the sales are random.  Example:  I put up a handful of offers of common salvage at 5.  I find that I’ll sell one or two from each block of ten rather than the first ten selling first, etc.

 

This is in respect to what happens when there are TIES in bids or offers across characters or accounts.  And I'm changing my statement to "I'm not sure" based on my experience with common salvage.

 

Often I'll have lots and lots of bids out at a low level that happens to be the highest outstanding bid, so when someone comes in to dump salvage, I'll have the best bid.  On a single character, I've noticed that bids get filled in what seems to be a random fashion.  A few here, a few there.  When I use the same bid across characters, I notice that sometimes one toon's bids fill entirely while another's don't.  That may be a timing issue or an observational error though.

 

On the sell side, I will frequently dump large amounts of common salvage at 1 inf.  Since that, by definition, is the lowest outstanding bid and guaranteed to be at or below any outstanding bid, I would expect them to sell instantly or close to it.  However, sometimes the system doesn't process my offers instantly, and I'll often wait 10-15 seconds between sales, despite the fact that there are plenty of outstanding bids.  I am guessing that is because there is at least one other person selling at 1 inf at the same time, and that the system is somehow allocating our offers in a manner that neither seems random nor in order of when the order was placed.

 

It's curious.