Toggle Suppression

[golstat2003]

10 hours ago, Peacemoon said:

For some sets the offensive toggles are what keeps them alive, so every second that they are not working is a very dangerous second that could result in death. So let’s not treat a few seconds difference as ‘inconsequential’, it’s not.

 

What the OP is referring to is that normally you would recast the offensive toggles straight away to ensure survivability, and you can do that a lot faster than the 5 seconds that they remain suppressed.
 

This is why the whole idea of suppression with a delayed restart time is so controversial, because it is not a ‘straight buff’ to how things were before. In many cases it makes life more dangerous, because not only are you vulnerable while mezzed, you now also have to count to 5 in your head before you can stand toe to toe with what you’re fighting, rather then just immediately recasting your protection.

 

The other point is, this is not people being ungrateful for small buffs when they wanted bigger buffs, this is people finding the newer system, under the guise of convenience and improvement, worse than the previous system, and being unable to explain why to people who aren’t used to relying on offensive toggles to survive. Also explains the frustration and emotion you hear in the posts. 
 

Personally I agree with the OP and am not a fan of invisible suppression times that are hard to gauge, whether it’s 1 second or 5. If toggles are suppressed, it should only be when your character is mezzed, and there should be no delay before they restart working. Just like defensive toggles. It makes little sense in terms of gameplay, isn’t intuitive, and doesn’t make sense from a RP perspective. Either my character is mezzed or they aren’t, I don’t see why ‘lingering weakness’ should be a thing.

 

Anyway just wanted to add my thoughts in support of the OP.

 

I don't have a dog in the fight about how long it should be however, I will say this: The invisible suppression timer SHOULD BE VISIBLE. It SHOULD NOT require you to think about it in your head. If there is a time that I can't consider my offensive toggle usable then it SHOULD BE visible somewhere on the UI clearly. And no I don't count the tiny icons below the life bar as visible. In a hectic COH fight there is some much going on I'd bet a lot of people don't or cannot take a look there.

 

I would put a counter ON the actual power in the powers UI tray. We already have an experimental feature where you can turn on a visible counter to show when a power is recharged.

Edited September 12, 2022 by golstat2003

[TheZag]

31 minutes ago, golstat2003 said:

I would put a counter ON the actual power in the powers UI tray.

 

Id be down for a translucent red circle on the power icon that that ticks away clock style.  Easier then reading a number in my opinion.

 

[Ukase]

On 9/10/2022 at 8:49 PM, Omega-202 said:

You're saying this like everyone unanimously wanted 3 seconds or for the change to be cancelled.  That's not true.  I think that 5 seconds is more than fair and is actually some solid power creep.  I thought 6 seconds was more in line, but I didn't see an issue with 8.  

 

This change is an overall buff for 95% of characters, and that huge discussion thread was definitely "over".  You just didn't want to give up.  If the dev team had to wait for you to agree with the change for the discussion to be over, then Page 4 would have never dropped.  

 

Move on.

I don't understand this comment. 

I don't want to read into it, as a lot of meaning can be lost in text, unlike a live conversation. 

I don't think the OP should "move on". The OP has a valid perspective and shouldn't be told to just move on, as if his opinion didn't matter. 
It doesn't matter how long something was on beta, it probably wasn't on there long enough. At least, that's my thinking on it. 

Now, for example. Is there something new on beta? I've no idea. I was just on brainstorm a week ago - and no messages popped up stating anything new could be tested for feedback. So, please, don't give us this "it's been on beta for months". How would we know? I never got an email or a pop up telling me something should or could be tested. I'm not a mind-reader. It's a volunteer staff. There's no reason for me to have anticipated anything was on brainstorm. 

How hard would it be for a pop up to appear in game to encourage folks to test things out, well in advance of it hitting the live server? 

Now your opinion matters too, but just because you wanted 8 seconds and (from what I've just read in this post) most folks wanted zero, that doesn't mean either of you are right, it just means you both had different thoughts on it. 

I see absolutely nothing wrong with the folks who want zero to keep mentioning it that the 5 second suppression is too long. Because, for them, it is too long! 
What's the harm? 
Squeaky wheel gets the grease. So let folks squeak all the want. Even better if they can clearly explain the rationale behind their request. 
 

[Glacier Peak]

2 hours ago, Ukase said:

Now, for example. Is there something new on beta? I've no idea. I was just on brainstorm a week ago - and no messages popped up stating anything new could be tested for feedback. So, please, don't give us this "it's been on beta for months". How would we know? I never got an email or a pop up telling me something should or could be tested. I'm not a mind-reader. It's a volunteer staff. There's no reason for me to have anticipated anything was on brainstorm. 

How hard would it be for a pop up to appear in game to encourage folks to test things out, well in advance of it hitting the live server? 

Just an FYI -

 

If you use the Official Homecoming Launcher and click the Beta shard, it will tell you this information.

 

Spoiler

 

Or if you use the Official Homecoming Discord -

 

Spoiler

 

Or if you browse the Official Homecoming Forums -

 

Spoiler

 

Or if you join the closed beta tester group....

 

Spoiler

 

Edit: Oh one more! If players want to get updated notifications via email, they can follow the content they are interested in and when a topic is posted in that thread, they will be notified -

 

Spoiler

 

Edited September 12, 2022 by Glacier Peak

[WindDemon21]

5 hours ago, TheZag said:

I got sucked in by the half information and gave an incomplete reply.  You cant just call out animation times and compare them to 5 seconds of suppression.  They all went on recharge before this change.  Come back with those numbers after adding in the recharge.  You will need them for different mez durations since they used to go on cooldown during the mez and let us know at what duration of mez does the animation+recharge become a nerf.  But since my first comment is me 'acting dumb',  i dont expect much.  The change was meant to give some quality of life for offensive toggle recasting and simulate the recast times,  not give players permanent offensive toggles that are reactivated the moment you break out of the mez.

 

If it sucks so bad for you,  turn them all off and recast everything when you get mezzed.  I bet you cant do that twice without thinking that suppression is better.

 

Except you can't even turn them off while you're mezzed, and they're still costing endurance, which is all part of the problem, but wouldn't be as bad if there was a proper suppression time. And again, defensive powers don't have to deal with this at all, and even if there were NO suppression, there are still problems that offensive toggles have that defensive ones don't have to deal with at all like the enemy dying or moving while you're sitting there mezzed for a big one.

 

This also doesn't account that during that time before you get mezzed again, casting the most important debuff toggle can mean you don't get mezzed again in the first place. Easy scenario: Rad defender with slotted RI, casting on a mob, flooring their acc, the next mez misses. Or CC/EA, cast, esp with lockdown proc, holds mob, meaning that enemy that was going to mez you can't. CC even more noticeable, as it only has a 1 second cast time. So that mob, would be held in one second, as opposted to 5. And lets say you're rad blast, no attack you do, is going to save you compared to that.

 

 

8 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

So OP wants to have a discussion, but they keep saying to anybody who responds that either they don't get it or are wrong entirely. 

 

This is going to be a short thread 😆 

No, but I'm definitely going to point out when things are said that they don't understand or are in fact wrong.

 

4 hours ago, ForeverLaxx said:

Radiation is pretty much the only set that this greatly benefits just because of how many toggles it runs. For basically everyone else, it's either a neutral change or a net nerf.

Actually, with the update to RI's cast time (which when you play it you can see how this 1-1.5s cast for any toggle should be the norm) It's actually only the 2nd worst. The new main outlier is Nature with EA and SC at just over 5s. (Which also, as bad as it is i always skip it till it's fixed, but lifegiving spores also likely detoggles when mezzed, same as spirit ward, these two powers honestly shouldn't detoggle or even be suppressed)

[Ukase]

@Glacier Peak thanks for all that - I use HC launcher, and I've never noticed that information being there. Just never paid it any attention. 

As I've confessed often, I can be obtuse. 

Edited September 13, 2022 by Ukase