Energy Armor - overcoming enemy tohit buffs

[Frosticus]

Enemy tohit buffs can be troublesome for defensive builds. Your typical "softcap" build will quickly find they have little protection.

Fortunately they aren't "that" common and similar to heavy psi damage from the previous demonstration you can just avoid the content, or stack inspirations, or rely on a team if that floats your boat. 

 

But what if you didn't?

 

This is 40 mins of continuous fighting against:

• +4x8 Nemesis - each cast of vengeance adds +30% tohit to the spawn
• Lvl 54 Positron AV and Nemesis ambush - crazy strong debuffer that uses radiation blasts and radiation debuffs

          for reference each attack debuffs def by 26-39% . Tohit floor of 9.75%, so he will hit you and potentially strip your defense. He also has

          his own version of "Overload" that gives him a ton of defense and a huge hp buff.

• Lvl 54 Manticore AV - he has some of the TA debuffs like acid arrow, but is surrounded by upwards of 100 nemesis mobs that constantly join the fight. His tohit floor for attacks is 11.26% and he also has a 10% tohit buff toggle.

 

I go through 10 overload crashes. Some I'm paying attention to, some catch me by surprise if a lot is going on. Even given the above situations, I'm never in danger from the crash.

 

As always: no insp/temps/amps/lore pets

Also, No deaths

 

[nihilii]

I have to admit even after you taught me about the Placate buffs, my instinct goes to "why would I spend a power pick when I can just run away". But then, just-run-away is one of these ideas that makes sense on paper, and indeed tends to work out much of the time, but still takes some amount of time, adds some chaos, and sometimes plain doesn't work out.

 

This video illustrates well of the advantages of your approach. I like the build choices in general. Skipping Energy Drain on /EA seems so counterintuitive (to say nothing of Fighting and Leadership), but with this Ageless + Unleash/Melee strategy you're clearly protected and condition-independent. Replicating the base setup of /nin while enjoying the maxHP and resistances of /ea.

This is coooool.

[Frosticus]

Ya that was my exact thought. After your grail post about the /ea brute, the hamster in my head put in an overtime shift thinking how I could replicate the ease that nin gets thru its t9 crash. EA is a good set with an incredible t9. 

 

Tough: Just don't have room for it. I'd like it because lvl 54 melee AVs can still essentially 2 shot me if things go badly. Weave would just be a drop in the bucket. Plus it would be 2 more togs to turn back on.

 

Leadership: I ran a leadership build with mu for awhile. In the end I really like the heal procs (4  total) they cover a lot of chip damage and keep working thru the crash. FA gives me perception and some tohit+acc but works way better against tohit debuffs. Torrent works as a single target attack in a pinch, but the ffb and knockdown is nice vs groups.

 

Energy drain: it seems weird not to have it, but I don't need it. Even though the def would help during the crash. The build has so much recovery and near immunity to drain. 

 

I actually didn't realize melee hybrid cost 0 end until recently. I was going thru the crash with no mez protection for awhile as I assumed it would detoggle.

 

 

[Sancerre]

your build takes a very unique approach that i am very interested in --- possible to clip it into mids?

 

general question -- non level cap stuff, does the build operates just fine not needing to cycle overload?  presuming it would be so long as no psionic mobs.

[Frosticus]

I'll put of the mids when I'm at my pc

 

It isn't a particularly complicated build, just lots of recharge so you have no gap where overload or unleash potential is not buffing you.

 

This leads to several things:

-It's a bit weaker if you choose to play outside of those powers, but it is more or less an /ea build so still good where /ea is good. It is however, considerably stronger than typical /ea builds if you use the powers.

-Your endurance management relies on overload and unleash potential. Both powers give a lot of recovery, so if you play outside of them you will need to use energize proactively for the end discount.

- you have overload+unleash in lvl 25 content, but without ageless you probably want inspirations to get thru the crash. Pretty small issue unless you are playing with insp locked out.

[Frosticus]

Attached

Stalker (Energy Melee - Energy Aura)3.mbd

[Saiyajinzoningen]

10 hours ago, Frosticus said:

Attached

Stalker (Energy Melee - Energy Aura)3.mbd 44.97 kB · 3 downloads

 

looks clicky but extremely effective. 

thanks for sharing 🙂

 

[Frosticus]

More clicky that an /ea spamming power drain? Probably a wash, just loaded differently.

 

You can see in the above video how it plays. There were 10 overload crashes in that clip and no hesitation on engagement with spawns to manage it.

 

Everything in this game has some sort of cost. The cost here is you either micromanage the crash and learn to perfectly time ageless, or you just play and power thru it like I do.

 

The above video is content that a normal /ea build will crumble in...quickly.

Keep in mind that I'm showing this without inspirations. A single small purple and you can retoggle at your leisure while at softcap. A normal /ea would be using insp like they are a competitive eater.

 

 

[Frosticus]

Not that it makes a huge difference, but I typically run spiritual (agility was on the build I posted and in the vid). My def numbers are usually overkill and the +heal of spiritual is more beneficial.

 

I have agility on that build because I've been working on Lanaru AV. He pushes a 20% tohit buff, saps like a mofo and has freezing rain. So you need 65% def to softcap Ignoring the fact that freezing rain is a 37.5% def debuff (at lvl 53. I couldnt make a meaningful dent at 54). No success yet, but getting there. 

[Without_Pause]

As someone who builds it more on the conventional side, I don't really spam Power Drain. I just find the experiment of building it in such a different way than I would helpful as it gives me ideas. I'll likely try to put various builds on test and play around with something like this, but with different ATs as well. 

[Frosticus]

13 minutes ago, Without_Pause said:

As someone who builds it more on the conventional side, I don't really spam Power Drain. I just find the experiment of building it in such a different way than I would helpful as it gives me ideas. I'll likely try to put various builds on test and play around with something like this, but with different ATs as well. 

 

Fair enough, I'm not sure how a conventional build would attempt to counter tohit buffs like in this demo without stacking as much powerdrain as possible (and being far more cautious about target selection), but players often have unique solutions.

 

Other fun t9 builds that I've played and highly recommend trying:

/nin (scrapper and sent). They don't need any incarnates to get through the crash. It actually gets silly.

SR/ tank. 82% def during unleash, 45% def thru the crash, 160% def under elude. I'm sure some players might find a place where that is useful. 

[Without_Pause]

1 minute ago, Frosticus said:

 

Fair enough, I'm not sure how a conventional build would attempt to counter tohit buffs like in this demo without stacking as much powerdrain as possible (and being far more cautious about target selection), but players often have unique solutions.

 

Other fun t9 builds that I've played and highly recommend trying:

/nin (scrapper and sent). They don't need any incarnates to get through the crash. It actually gets silly.

SR/ tank. 82% def during unleash, 45% def thru the crash, 160% def under elude. I'm sure some players might find a place where that is useful. 

I haven't looked at using Elude on two /sr Scrappers I have. I don't see using it on the sturdier ATs either. My thing was adding in Rune of Protection. It's roughly 20% increase for Res as a base. You stick that on a SR Tanker with the Might of the Tanker proc, rotating in Hybrid Melee, and that's a really difficult Tanker to take down. 

[Sancerre]

17 hours ago, Frosticus said:

Attached

Stalker (Energy Melee - Energy Aura)3.mbd 44.97 kB · 4 downloads

 

awesome thanks for the reference.

 

a few things in here pop out to me as something i wouldnt have moved towards but the results in your video speak for itself.

• chance to hide proc... i have read that most people just dump it in assassins strike so you dont accidentally use the free crit on assassins strike.  i guess with total focus you almost always follow into energy transfer or power crash here so that makes sense for energy melee.
• do you end up using weaken resolve at all?  seems like a waste of time unless achilles heel procs... and its not even a capped proc per minute at 30s.  understandably you probably just have the proc in there as a why not scenario
• really surprised to see you slotting in so much recharge on energy transfer and total focus ON TOP of procs... counter-intuitive to me as far as proc math is concerned
• placate slotting initially is really surprising but has quite nice set bonuses for typed defenses
• heavy favor towards chance to heal procs on endurance auto powers instead of stamina procs -- presuming end is just not a concern with perma-energize
• focused accuracy slotting on top of having kismet already seems excessive but this just looks like an area where i can flex slots around so all good.
• i honestly never considered energy torrent before seeing your build, but it is quite a nice power and fills in a much needed void for force feedback recharge proc that energy melee doesnt have otherwise... incidentally the focused accuracy is just kinda needed anyways.  also energy melee doesnt have PBAoE so its already typically in positions for cones (with power crash in mind).  DPA is serviceable even as a single target attack with all the procs in mind anyways.  i might opt for javelin's toxic proc instead of the annihilation smaller -res proc (only 12%)
• and the big one... agility core paragon.  really hard for me to look at playing stalker and not immediately gravitate towards musculature.  i do see the major impact being on overload here which is the hallmark of the build... 15 seconds longer gap in cooldown.  ill have to walk that one down a bit and see what feels right for me.

really appreciate you posting this.

[Frosticus]

1 hour ago, Without_Pause said:

I haven't looked at using Elude on two /sr Scrappers I have. I don't see using it on the sturdier ATs either. My thing was adding in Rune of Protection. It's roughly 20% increase for Res as a base. You stick that on a SR Tanker with the Might of the Tanker proc, rotating in Hybrid Melee, and that's a really difficult Tanker to take down. 

Ya for sure, my normal sr tank build uses RoP, I think many do. But the hilarity of the t9 build is something else. Not batting an eye at rage crashes and unlimited endurance is a different set of benefits compared to the RoP build.

 

A t9 /ea brute ala @nihilii is a sight to behold.

My elec/nin t9 clarion radial sentinel is the definition of ridiculous in so many ways.

Now I'm working on an unstoppable sav/invuln stalker. Obviously that crash is a whole different kettle of fish.

 

It's just a different approach. In general I thought I was happy with the performance of my various armor toons, but similar to how making proc builds was fun and fresh a  couple years ago, this avenue gives a new look at some of them and changes the areas they excel at. 

[nihilii]

1 hour ago, Frosticus said:

160% def under elude. I'm sure some players might find a place where that is useful. 

 

I can see 160% def being helpful to solo +4/x8 Rularuu. The eyeballs still hit a bit through 120% def, and their +perception can make for double or even triple aggro in those large cave rooms we often fight Rularuu in. ~140% def seems to be the level that floors them.

Then there's the Shadow Shard TFs where you sometimes fight Nemesis and Rularuu in the same group, the vengeance of Nemesis lieuts boosting Rularuu eyeballs too. This is a situation where 160% def would come in handy!

[Frosticus]

6 minutes ago, Sancerre said:

 

awesome thanks for the reference.

 

a few things in here pop out to me as something i wouldnt have moved towards but the results in your video speak for itself.

• chance to hide proc... i have read that most people just dump it in assassins strike so you dont accidentally use the free crit on assassins strike.  i guess with total focus you almost always follow into energy transfer or power crash here so that makes sense for energy melee.

I think that is maybe not the best advice for some sets. Fast AS is often the best DPA attack a stalker has with or without focus. It should be spammed. I want my AS up as quickly as possible, which means the proc rate on hide would be really low. Trying to optimize the hide proc in AS while abiding by the 10 second lockout leads to some very convoluted attack chains that don't interest me.

I can slot oodles of rech into TF and it will still proc hide.

Also I want double focus from TF. Placate reliably gives me that. Hide proc in AS (even with minimal rech) was failing to trigger that often enough that I was frustrated.

Crit ET heals me a bit

12 minutes ago, Sancerre said:

• do you end up using weaken resolve at all?  seems like a waste of time unless achilles heel procs... and its not even a capped proc per minute at 30s.  understandably you probably just have the proc in there as a why not scenario

I don't use it. It's not even on my tray. Might give faster pylon times I guess?

14 minutes ago, Sancerre said:

• really surprised to see you slotting in so much recharge on energy transfer and total focus ON TOP of procs... counter-intuitive to me as far as proc math is concerned
• placate slotting initially is really surprising but has quite nice set bonuses for typed defenses

Fast ET is my highest DPA attack outside of crit fast AS. The procs are irrelevant compared to the raw DPA of fast ET. The goal is double focus and fast ET spam. Procs are just a bonus.

Placate is fundamental to my playstyle. But ya the bonuses of that set are really nice.

17 minutes ago, Sancerre said:

• heavy favor towards chance to heal procs on endurance auto powers instead of stamina procs -- presuming end is just not a concern with perma-energize

I use energize reactively as a heal. The heal procs help me use it that way by covering most chip damage. The recovery bonuses of overload and unleash potential are very high.

18 minutes ago, Sancerre said:

• focused accuracy slotting on top of having kismet already seems excessive but this just looks like an area where i can flex slots around so all good.

I need perception and I need additional tohit and accuracy. I ran a tactics build for awhile, but FA works well enough and gives really good tohit debuff protection. I wish I had more tohit honestly. 

 

20 minutes ago, Sancerre said:

• i honestly never considered energy torrent before seeing your build, but it is quite a nice power and fills in a much needed void for force feedback recharge proc that energy melee doesnt have otherwise... incidentally the focused accuracy is just kinda needed anyways.  also energy melee doesnt have PBAoE so its already typically in positions for cones (with power crash in mind).  DPA is serviceable even as a single target attack with all the procs in mind anyways.  i might opt for javelin's toxic proc instead of the annihilation smaller -res proc (only 12%)

Yep torrent is pretty good. 100% knockdown is also really nice. It won't make you an aoe machine, but I didn't make an em stalker for that purpose.

22 minutes ago, Sancerre said:

• and the big one... agility core paragon.  really hard for me to look at playing stalker and not immediately gravitate towards musculature.  i do see the major impact being on overload here which is the hallmark of the build... 15 seconds longer gap in cooldown.  ill have to walk that one down a bit and see what feels right for me.

It is what it is. I need a lot of recharge (just look at the overslotting of overload). My intent was to have no gap between overload and unleash potential. In practice you can easily pause for a moment or just placate them and wait (I placated mother mayhem until overload cycled in the psi video). This build is an exercise in seeing how far I could push the t9.

[Sancerre]

2 hours ago, Frosticus said:

 

Fair enough, I'm not sure how a conventional build would attempt to counter tohit buffs like in this demo without stacking as much powerdrain as possible (and being far more cautious about target selection), but players often have unique solutions.

 

Other fun t9 builds that I've played and highly recommend trying:

/nin (scrapper and sent). They don't need any incarnates to get through the crash. It actually gets silly.

SR/ tank. 82% def during unleash, 45% def thru the crash, 160% def under elude. I'm sure some players might find a place where that is useful. 

 

thanks for all the feedback about my comments btw

 

regarding the /nin t9 -- is that just because of the +end self clicky effectively removing the need to work around ageless and/or carry blues?  or is there other hidden tech there?

[Frosticus]

41 minutes ago, Sancerre said:

 

thanks for all the feedback about my comments btw

 

regarding the /nin t9 -- is that just because of the +end self clicky effectively removing the need to work around ageless and/or carry blues?  or is there other hidden tech there?

yes, primarily kyoyo it lets you get through the crash without insp in lvl 25 content. 

But also the click mez and auto power that gives kb protection. They both make the crash safer too. 

 

Basically I'm forced to take melee core and ageless on my /ea if I want to safely and easily get through the crash. My /nin sentinel gets to use clarion radial which gives me even more defense as well as boosting the +end power, giving me a bigger self heal and making my sapping more powerful (elec blast). Really nice synergy and flexibility offered by /nin. 

[Shred Monkey]

4 years later and I still feel like I'm one of the only players who abuses Disrupt.  I combine it with TF to perm-stun the most dangerous target with my opening hit out of hide (including +4 bosses, and AV's while their purple triangles are down).  Disrupt also significantly reduces the additional attacks coming in from melee range by stunning minions and LTs on it's own.

 

Vengeance is a complex beast.. I usually deal with it by killing LT's last and out of range of the next spawn.  This way I don't have to account for it in my builds so much.

 

I haven't played my EM/EA stalker in a while... this post has me feeling the itch.  That's a really solid combo.

Edited December 25, 2023 by Shred Monkey

[Cpt. Caveat]

Do you by chance have a build for your electric/nin. I ran a em/ea back at release of CoV but I think I’m leaning eclectic/nin for something new but I’ve always worked around a t9 with a crash