New Class type?

[FieryDove]

I would love to see a summoner/conjurer type. They could pick from a variety of summons/pets from all the epic power pools, controller pets and MM pets.

 

I would also love to see some combined secondary sets. Lots of fun to be had there!

 

Is new sets possible?

[biostem]

10 minutes ago, FieryDove said:

Is new sets possible?

New sets are absolutely possible!  The big question is how to create, what I think would be a new archetype, (per your OP), into the existing game, which would both have its own unique playstyle while also fitting in among the existing ATs.  Could you flesh things out a bit more?  Cheers!

[Snarky]

MMs have been stuck with same pets / unchangeable costumes for 2 decades.  You think this will change?

[Gravitus]

2 hours ago, Snarky said:

MMs have been stuck with same pets / unchangeable costumes for 2 decades.  You think this will change?

MMs are probably the only true unique AT in the game, every other AT is somewhat related to one another. Melee ATs, range ATs and support ATs......MMs seem to be the only AT truly in a league of its own when it comes to how they are fundamentally different ......Probably not the worst idea to toy with. Didn't Sentinels sort of enter the game late? 

[Rudra]

5 hours ago, Gravitus said:

Didn't Sentinels sort of enter the game late? 

Sentinels were apparently undergoing development at time of shut down, but they weren't added. HC (or whomever was running the game as a pirate game before) added Sentinels.

[Gravitus]

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

Sentinels were apparently undergoing development at time of shut down, but they weren't added. HC (or whomever was running the game as a pirate game before) added Sentinels.

 I'm not a dev but, I would imagine you can keep the core programming the same with pet summoning/control, tweak the stats and simply toss in powers (either ones that already exist or make new ones)......the Dev team in HC has demonstrated they can do this. The only real obstacle I think would be making it a balanced and relevant AT. 

 

 

Edited October 16 by Gravitus

[Rudra]

1 minute ago, Gravitus said:

 I'm not a dev but, I would imagine you can keep the core programming the same with pet summoning/control, tweak the stats and simply toss in powers (either ones that already exist or make new ones)......the Dev team in HC has demonstrated they can do this. The only real obstacle I think would be making it a balanced and relevant AT. 

 

 

Not sure where you are going with this comment since you are quoting me for it. The only reason for my post was to answer your question about Sentinels.

[Gravitus]

5 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Not sure where you are going with this comment since you are quoting me for it. The only reason for my post was to answer your question about Sentinels.

I asked the question initially to address Snarky's comment illustrating that because x amount of time has passed, creating an offshoot of the MM likely won't happen. So, I brought up Sentinels as an example of an AT brought in after the game had existed for 8 years. Basically, saying it's not hopeless. 

 

When you pointed out the programming for Sentinels already existed in live, I thought you were insinuating that the programming capabilities of the HC devs making a new AT was perhaps out of their wheelhouse. 

Edited October 16 by Gravitus

[Frozen Burn]

17 hours ago, FieryDove said:

I would love to see a summoner/conjurer type. They could pick from a variety of summons/pets from all the epic power pools, controller pets and MM pets.

 

I would also love to see some combined secondary sets. Lots of fun to be had there!

 

Is new sets possible?

 

Hi and welcome to the game - or at least the forums!

 

I'm not understanding your request.  Masterminds are already Summoners / Conjurers.  So, the AT is there.... it sounds like you just want a new type of "Powerset" that allows you to summon a variety of controller / epic pets found across all ATs.  

 

I don't think this will be possible - or at least take some heavy coding - given that controller and epic pets do not accept commands like MM henchmen.  

 

Also, not sure what you mean by combined "combined secondary sets" - what AT's secondaries?  Armors, attacks, buff/debuffs, etc?  And highly doubtful any would be combined into something new as there are balance issues to consider from set to set. 

[Rudra]

23 minutes ago, Frozen Burn said:

or at least take some heavy coding - given that controller and epic pets do not accept commands like MM henchmen.  

There is also the difference in 'tiers' with MM pets being Henchmen tier pets whereas Controller/Dominator pets are Pet tier pets, which gives them better base stats. And then there are the differences in pet level determination where Controller/Dominator pets are never more than -1 to the Controller/Dominator even if you get 3 pets where MM pets get to -2 if you have 3 of them. And the consideration that MM pets have upgrades they need to get to full power and other pets do not. And then there is the balance question for pets since each MM primary set is balanced differently, so simply getting to choose what pets you get is unbalanced. What is to stop a player from simply taking Jack Frost, Singularity, Phantom Army, Dark Servant, Protector Bots, and their choice of MM T3 pet?

 

And then you get to the secondary sets for questions. Which you summed up nicely.

 

So while I was trying to sit out this conversation, yeah, there are a lot of questions the OP needs to address for this to be considered.

[biostem]

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

There is also the difference in 'tiers'

I think this is a big sticking point for any future/hypothetical pet ATs;  MMs try to be both the "I have lots of disposable minions" and the "I have a few very powerful enforcers" AT, never fully achieving either.  Controllers/Dominators, and SoAs to a certain extent, have a "set it and forget it" style when it comes to their pets, where you tradeoff direct control, (no upgrades or ability to issue commands, to contend with), for simplicity, (just select location and cast, with all powers immediately available and no level penalty).  In cases where other ATs can get access to multiple pets, they tend to overshadow MMs, IMHO - such as a "Crabbermind" deploying all their pets + incarnate ones, whilst still benefitting from their own armor toggles, direct attacks, and possibly even stacking leadership powers...

[tidge]

Don't forget the certain pets which inherent any boosts the player has while summoning them! So much variety!

 

20 minutes ago, biostem said:

 In cases where other ATs can get access to multiple pets, they tend to overshadow MMs, IMHO - such as a "Crabbermind" deploying all their pets + incarnate ones, whilst still benefitting from their own armor toggles, direct attacks, and possibly even stacking leadership powers...

 

I have both Masterminds and a Crabbermind. I prefer Masterminds. This is not to say that Crabberminds perform poorly, its more that I don't think the pets (and I went for the Patron Spider pet) are as reliable for the Crabbermind... obviously the lack of direct controls plays into this, but for the most part I never feel like I'm getting that much performance from the Spiders. It is a nice variation to have a Crabbermind be the big bad, whereas my MMs the henchmen end up being the big bad.

 

[biostem]

8 minutes ago, tidge said:

I have both Masterminds and a Crabbermind. I prefer Masterminds. This is not to say that Crabberminds perform poorly, its more that I don't think the pets (and I went for the Patron Spider pet) are as reliable for the Crabbermind... obviously the lack of direct controls plays into this, but for the most part I never feel like I'm getting that much performance from the Spiders. It is a nice variation to have a Crabbermind be the big bad, whereas my MMs the henchmen end up being the big bad.

No doubt!  While I, too, very much enjoy my Crabbermind, I find the lack of support powers makes me feel like less of a leader for my pets, and instead them being a bit of a distraction for the enemy and some extra DPS.  But survivability-wise and in terms of ease of use, that SoA doesn't feel naked without their pets and is much more durable.  It's definitely good to have both options, but it does make me wonder if a full AT could somehow skirt the line of individual survivability whilst still having a full entourage with them...

[Rudra]

1 hour ago, biostem said:

I think this is a big sticking point for any future/hypothetical pet ATs;  MMs try to be both the "I have lots of disposable minions" and the "I have a few very powerful enforcers" AT, never fully achieving either.  Controllers/Dominators, and SoAs to a certain extent, have a "set it and forget it" style when it comes to their pets, where you tradeoff direct control, (no upgrades or ability to issue commands, to contend with), for simplicity, (just select location and cast, with all powers immediately available and no level penalty).  In cases where other ATs can get access to multiple pets, they tend to overshadow MMs, IMHO - such as a "Crabbermind" deploying all their pets + incarnate ones, whilst still benefitting from their own armor toggles, direct attacks, and possibly even stacking leadership powers...

To be fair, Crabberminds already fit the bill for the OP. They have melee powers. They have armor powers. They get up to 6 pets (from 3 powers) before you go incarnate. And they can stand their ground and fight even without their pets.

 

Too often, these requests for new MM-style ATs seems to be a desire to be a capable ranged or melee AT that also has pets for more damage, while retaining their own defensive capabilities like armor for their secondary, or both armor and support or both armor and control or armor and control and support. An "I can do everything and I can do it very well" mentality. Now, I'm fine with more ATs being added, as long as they have their own identity and are balanced so they can fit into the game without rendering any existing ATs obsolete. And if the author is willing to both further detail his/her/their proposal so we can get a better idea of what exactly is being asked for, and to accept that the AT cannot have everything at their disposal, then we're good. Let's hash out how this potential AT works. Something to bear in mind though, is that MMs are already the pet AT, not Controllers or Dominators, yet all 3 keep getting compared to each other. And if you want a muddier comparison, then there is the everlasting debate about Brutes, Scrappers, and Tankers. So yes, the AT being melee instead of ranged goes a long way to differentiating it from MMs, more information is still needed. Which is a problem seeing as how the author hasn't deigned to provide any further posts on his/her/their suggestion after the initial pitch.

 

Edit: Whoops. I merged @gabrilend's melee MM with the OP of this thread. My apologies. So for this thread, more information is most definitely needed.

 

Edited October 16 by Rudra
Edited to add "They have melee powers."