Sniper Beta Patch Notes, June 2nd 2019

THIS IS WHY WE BETA

Another day, another patch! Feedback has been passed along, and the most agreed-upon bits have been implemented in this patch. Other ideas are being considered, but were not ready yet. Keep the feedback coming, and remember that this is a beta. The whole point is to gather feedback, and more importantly, feedback based on testing. A lot of the loudest complaints yesterday came from accounts that didn't log in to Justin at all; gut feelings are nowhere near as valuable as playtesting fedback.

Several changes to Devices are implemented on this patch; they were not planned to be tested this soon, as they were part of a different branch, but since there is a general concern is that Devices is getting the short end of the stick with the Snipe changes, they're being merged now.

Patron power pools are now unlocked at character creation.

INVENTIONS

Thanks to Banana Man and Dan Petro, the new set Experienced Marksman is getting modified significantly.

Old version, five-slotted: 47.7% accuracy, 116.6% damage, 47.7% endredux, 25.6% range and 42.4% recharge.

New version, five-slotted: 47.7% accuracy, 92.8% damage, 42.4% endredux, 12.8% range, 66.3% recharge and 51% interrupt time.

The Fast Snipe enhancement now has a Range component; this means that if you six-slot the set, the 51% interrupt time becomes meaningless, but the Range is boosted to 25.6%.

The set bonuses have also been changed a bit. The +Health and +Accuracy bonuses have been bumped a tier, and the last two PVP bonuses (recharge and recovery) have been switched around.

POWERS

All snipes, regardless speed, will again have maximum range. This means 150ft feet for most snipes, 175ft for Psionic snipes.

The "engaged" flag that drives fast snipe now requires 10 seconds without attacking or being attacked, down from 15 seconds.

Blaster Devices:

Changed Web Grenade to Toxic Web Grenade, now deals scale 1 toxic DoT and can be slotted for damage

Taser recharge reduced from 20 to 10 seconds, duration reduced from scale 10 to scale 5, damage increased from 0.25 to 1.96 (same damage as Energy Punch)

Time Bomb animation is now 2.77 seconds, interrupt time removed, countdown reduced to 5 seconds, defiance values reduced to match (this only applies to this set, not to the Traps support set versions.)

Targeting Drone now also adds a 30% recharge buff.

A lot of the loudest complaints yesterday came from accounts that didn't log in to Justin at all; gut feelings are nowhere near as valuable as playtesting fedback.

Personally, I started posting before testing because I didn't need to see the range nerf to know it would be a significant nerf to my particular playstyle of shooting things from very far while in combat. Nor did I need to try a rotation that was calculated to fit just right with a 12s recharge to know there would be a slight delay with 15s recharge. Numbers have no guts nor feelings. :)

Then, I logged in, and experienced exactly what I expected.

I hope it's OK for me to say the change back to 150 feet fixes my main pet peeve without logging back on. :P

A lot of the loudest complaints yesterday came from accounts that didn't log in to Justin at all; gut feelings are nowhere near as valuable as playtesting feedback.

 

Are you reducing people's criticisms to "gut feelings" just because they didn't play on the beta branch? Don't you find that a bit ridiculous?

1. You don't need to play on the beta branch to know that ToHit (namely from tactics) is going back to being a useless endgame stat.

2. You don't need to play on the beta branch to know that people will have to re-work their builds and that new builds (on sets with snipe) will not work for other servers anymore.

Even I, a new player that did not play until 2 weeks ago can know how an attack chain get ruined with recharge nerfs and how awkward it can get with the range nerf. It does not require oh-so-extensive testing to see. While I did not try a high level blaster around yet, I can already see you just managed to get it back together. I like the idea of always-fast-snipes with a slow alpha strike opener. But yeah, range reduction was unneeded. Glad it got to where it was once more.

Device changes makes it interesting and gives it a new mechanic, makes it more damage oriented, I am interested to try it.

Lots of things won’t work on other servers, that’s a terrible excuse for any change, and who cares if a specific stat is “useless” at end game? There are tons of useless stats. I take that reduced range is an issue, roll my eyes at people complaining about less than 1 second

Recharge increase at end game, but still also at least a real issue.

A stat becoming useless or builds not having the same impact on other servers? Ugh....

Anyways, glad to see the changes coming. That recharge bonus on targeting drone may actually eat away the recharge increase on most builds!

Lots of things won’t work on other servers, that’s a terrible excuse for any change, and who cares if a specific stat is “useless” at end game? There are tons of useless stats. I take that reduced range is an issue, roll my eyes at people complaining about less than 1 second

Recharge increase at end game, but still also at least a real issue.

 

A stat becoming useless or builds not having the same impact on other servers? Ugh....

 

Anyways, glad to see the changes coming. That recharge bonus on targeting drone may actually eat away the recharge increase on most builds!

About that useless stat. Making ToHit useless also makes many powers much less useful and Tactics useless.

Gave the new snipe range changes a shot.

Definitely feels very snipe-y now. Still have my former complaints about it narrowing down build choices but I think it feels fine at least, just from some messing around in the open world and some +0x1 missions. Nothing really too fancy, really, just enough to get a feel for how it plays. Also makes LAM rocket feel a lot better now.

Experienced Marksman feels like the better way to play with snipes post change though, so I hope it's REALLY easy to obtain a set.

LowlyOne, I personally think it’s still useful, even if it’s not a meta stat. Enemies with defense are easier to defeat if you have to-hit over accuracy, and it’s also a better stat to more accurately hit higher level foes.

That being said: targeting drone now has +recharge! And time bomb sounds actually useful!

LowlyOne, I personally think it’s still useful, even if it’s not a meta stat. Enemies with defense are easier to defeat if you have to-hit over accuracy, and it’s also a better stat to more accurately hit higher level foes.

 

That being said: targeting drone now has +recharge! And time bomb sounds actually useful!

It does give something that is very situational but now it is not worth the endurance cost on the power. Unless Tactics becomes cost free on endurance with this change I will respec all my characters out of it. I already never take Aim on my characters.

Suggestion based on both experience and similar powers: would say that Targeting Drone should be at most 20-25% recharge buff; this brings it in line with similar powers that provide a recharge buff such as Entropy Shield/Entropic Aura while providing additional benefits like mez protection at the same available level. Entropic/Entropy has a 20% recharge it adds on, FYI.

Devices has Targeting Drone available at 10, Entropic Aura/Energy Shield for the Scrapper/Stalker/Brute at 10 as well.

A lot of the loudest complaints yesterday came from accounts that didn't log in to Justin at all; gut feelings are nowhere near as valuable as playtesting feedback.

 

 

Are you reducing people's criticisms to "gut feelings" just because they didn't play on the beta branch? Don't you find that a bit ridiculous?

 

1. You don't need to play on the beta branch to know that ToHit (namely from tactics) is going back to being a useless endgame stat.

 

2. You don't need to play on the beta branch to know that people will have to re-work their builds and that new builds (on sets with snipe) will not work for other servers anymore.

It's not just about the numbers.  People have alot of experience playing CoH.  'Gut' feelings can trump numbers.  eg.  How it 'feels' to play.  Numbers can say one thing.  'Feel' says another.

Yesterday.  The snipe felt(!) worse all around to me.

I'm a mainstream non-IO (largely) player who does stuff through SOs and power selection.  No maths or science here.  Just 'feel' in.  (Pun intended.)

You don't need to play to know that nerfing range and and recharge is going to be a backwards step for something the original devs got right. :)

However, Leandro is right.  This is a 'beta' and they want feedback.  So I don't wish to sound negative.  The SCORE people have done a fab job so far.

But the Snipe changes, overall, felt(!) wrong to me.

They 'felt' slower, more awkward and not 'instant-snipe' at all.

Azrael.

Happy to see some buffs to devices. One thing I noticed in my testing last night was that I never used trip mine or time bomb. Why would I, with fire ball, rain of fire, fire breath, Bonfire slotted for - kb, etc.

These changes are going to make leveling and playing a devices blaster a lot more tolerable.

Time Bomb animation is now 2.77 seconds, interrupt time removed, countdown reduced to 5 seconds, defiance values reduced to match (this only applies to this set, not to the Traps support set versions.)

Please reconsider this nerf to Time Bomb.  The Defiance bonus from this power was massive and was a major draw for /Dev.  Now it's just a delayed PBAoE.  It's boring and cuts your DPS.  Want to change Time Bomb?  Leave it as it was, but instead of it detonating after 15s, it detonates when the player clicks the skill again (like clicking a remote detonator).

Changed Web Grenade to Toxic Web Grenade, now deals scale 1 toxic DoT and can be slotted for damage

Since Web Grenade is the same power in Traps and Devices, can Traps users expect this change as well?

As a few other people have pointed out, this will probably make to-hit a less valuable stat again. But I think that's better than having to-hit being only artificially useful because a much needed blaster buff is locked behind it.

Glad to see the range back up again. I didn't log in yesterday because my opinions on the changes come from more of a game design philosophy standpoint than a game feel standpoint, but that definitely seemed like the most common point of contention from watching the forums and discord.

Since many are concerned about ToHit being made useless I'm going to repost my suggestion from the previous thread:

Why not simply have the casting time scale with ToHit?  +22% still being needed to get your instasnipe, but lesser amounts being helpful.  So a +11% would cut your casting time in half (2.442s cast with 1.5s interrupt) as 11% is halfway to the 22% for insta.  +5.5% would shave a quarter of the time off.  Make it a dynamic sliding scale.  This way any amount of ToHit is still beneficial, but anyone going all in can still get their insta-snipe.

Now.  I'm going to reply to me. ;)

That was yesterday.  Leandro and team SCORE have been listening to feedback.  Good.  That's what we like to here.  The original developers used to come across as a bit immutable at times.  At least SCORE are listening! :D

The Good.

1.  Range seems better.

2.  I do like the 'SNIPE' graphic for the 1st hit.

3.  It comes with 1st strike bonus damage.

4.  2 seconds trims the fat for what was a lumberingly slow power (that was easily nudged to rub salt in the wounds...) to 2 secs from 3.

The Bad.

1.  It doesn't feel 'instant' ironically. 

2.  It seems to play slower.

The Ugly.

1.  Part of me still feels the original developers got this one right.

Keep.

1.  The 2 second long inital strike trim.

2.  The opening target damage.

3.  MAKE all in combat snipes fire instantly.  (Unless test has lag issues...it seems to take 2 seconds to activate?  On live it 'feel's instant.)

Lose.

1. The biggest culprit other than range, the glaringly obvious without even needing to play it is?  The Achingly long rechange time.  It seems like a 'fun tax.' :P  A formerly dev' approved attack chain has been made to feel slower, clunkier, less smooth.  It feels 'slow' even with hasten.  And in melee proximity.  It doens't trigger instantly.  It does on the live server..?  I hit AIM, BANG!  I hit build up.  BANG!  Power Boost?  BANG.  2 aim inspires?  BANG.  I don't know if it's server lag.  But lets keep it really simple.  Out of melee opening gambit?  2 sec.  IN combat close or at extreme range?  INSTANT!

2.  Remove the 'removed' link to AIM/BUILD UP/POWER BOOST for en/en blasters.  I like this way of utilising the snipe.  It seems intelligent play?  It's fun too.  GIves me something 'to do.'  If I hit any of those, why not remove the recharge limit all together so I can fire SNIPE instantly?  It allows me to keep the link to Tactics.  If you three slot tactics you have an insta snipe.  Or if you 6 slot AIM or BUILD UP for damage/to hit you have instant hit with no recharge at all.  Just triggers a INSTANT HIT ring.  Press and go.  I still enjoy this method of 'clever' play as part of my attack cycle.  It would keep the smoothness and speed I've become accustomed to in my attack chain.  Otherwise, why bother taking leadership so much?  I like the link to the snipe.  It makes sense.  It's a mainstream game choice.  Just make it so it doesn't need x6 sniper IO set to trigger auto snipe.

I appreciate the SCORE's philosophy of i26 aint a dead game but a living one.  Their policy of fixing bugs and sorting out the bugs or glitches in the original artwork to 'work as intended' is fine.  But was Snipe bugged?  No.  It was as the dev's intended.  A trim of the original activation.  Fine.  A boost for 1st hit damage.  The move to democratise features instead of behind an IO pay wall.  I get the spirit of that.  But the current snipe isn't.  As such.  Just do it through slotting.  Put 3 to hits in AIM or BUILD UP.  Simple solution.  3 slot tactics makes all blasters insta-trigger.

But if you allow insta-tigger and it doesn't instantly fire or you have a yawningly slow recharge time then it's not very instant.  And attack chain wise?  Less intuitive, ironically, less punchy, less fun, more...well, 'they took the fun away.'  That's the end result.  It still doesn't feel 'fun' even with the latest changes.  Removing the range limit was pure common sense.  That didn't need testing.  The recharge addition?  Doesn't need explaining.  It's made the attack chain more awkward.  More 'wait...and wait...'  We've had this insta-snipe fire (and with Hasten it comes around pretty quick...) but now it's a pregnant pause.  Yep.  Been on P.Isle tested it on Nemesis and war hulks and Death Mages.  I don't kick ass anymore.  I wait to kick ass. 

And I'm sure, 'one day' SCORE will create new archetypes, missions, arcs maybe even raise the level cap to 60 to sort out the MESS that is incarnate fussy non-intuitive incarnate system.  (A great idea that didn't use the standard interface BUT SHOULD HAVE!)  That I'm all for.  But the dev's really got this right.  Sure, you can argue that if you want it 'on all the time' it's stuck behind an IO pay wall.  You need an £8-£10 milliion kismet IO.  That I find annoying.  So insta-snipe sounds great.  Then it's oh.  Range has been nerfed.  (I never did like playing at that long range...but Insta-snipe has been fun targeting snipers and runners and playing from safe range because the snipe was much quicker with insta AND hasten.)  Then it's oh.  It takes ages to come round.  And awkward 'ages' with Hasten.

Anyway.  I've done my 2nd round of testing.  It's still not as good as live.  You have some good bits.  You've fixed the range.  But the recharge time and link to AIM/BU/PBoost and Tactics needs re-engaging.  Put the 3 seconds back to where they were.  Re-store the intelligent gameplay link so that clicking anyone of those buttons means an instant execution.  They're hardling gamebreaking.  They each take 3/4s of a minute to come around and PB about half a minute.

Azrael.

Since many are concerned about ToHit being made useless I'm going to repost my suggestion from the previous thread:

 

Why not simply have the casting time scale with ToHit?  +22% still being needed to get your instasnipe, but lesser amounts being helpful.  So a +11% would cut your casting time in half (2.442s cast with 1.5s interrupt) as 11% is halfway to the 22% for insta.  +5.5% would shave a quarter of the time off.  Make it a dynamic sliding scale.  This way any amount of ToHit is still beneficial, but anyone going all in can still get their insta-snipe.

That's a clever idea.

Azrael.

Loving this! Thanks HC Team! <3

I think x3 slotting Tactics with to-hits and 3 slotting aim or build up are very mainstream ways of achieving a snipe specialism.

The more slots you put in the more you scale your insta-status.

Put them into BU-UP?  You get a big 1st strike damage bonus.  Put them into AIM?  Triggers an insta snipe.

Put them into tactics?  They scale with slotting to get 'more instant' execuation.

All done through slotting.  You may have to sacrifice slots to your AoE or other powers (choices...) to do this.

All very mainstream solutions.  I never bothered with 'to hit' in AIM or BU UP before.  It's x3 recharge and leave it.

I never bothered with Assault and Tactics on my blaster before.  It's been a revelation to trigger the insta-snipe after I asked around how to do it.  (So, yes, the idea of not having to ask is very democratising.  But having done it the AIM/BU/P BOOST and Tactics way?  Somehow...less rewarding.  And less fun because of the slow recharge time which has made energy seem quite slow again.  And...it doesn't 'feel' instant.)

Azrael.

3.  MAKE all in combat snipes fire instantly.  (Unless test has lag issues...it seems to take 2 seconds to activate?  On live it 'feel's instant.)

Could you tell us what blast set you are using? I just got on the test server and with fire blast, instant blazing bolt fires for me precisely as quickly as it does on live. If animation times actually are slower, that's an issue, but I'm not seeing it myself.

glad to see the range back on a SNIPE ability.

also, im not a balance/designer kind of guy, but giving targeting drone 30% recharge seems excessive.  something more like 20% seems more inline with every other powerset that has a recharge bonus built in.  I understand its a toggle, not a passive... but still.

final note.  i dont think many people mentioned it at all, but scrappers also get snipes from the patron pool.  i dont imagine many scrapper builds were often utilizing high slotted tactics or even picking up snipe in the first place.  but this definitely streamlines scrapper epic/patron power pools especially because shadow meld was such a strong pickup already and moonbeam is just sitting there as a pre-req.  not suggesting it needs a nerf on scrappers but just find it humerous the intent is to bring blasters inline with single target damage and yet it also helps along scrappers.

I've gone back to live to look at the numbers.

7.08 sec Recharge Time.  (That's x2 recharge in my snipe power...)  That's without Hasten.  Hasten at 70% cuts that down quite alot.  So it feels more exciting when you hit the Hasten button.  I count the recharge time at 5 seconds with Hasten on.

Hitting aim/bu or PBoost triggers snipe to activate immediately (this is with the Tactics toggle on x3 SO slotted for to hit.)

There does seem to be a little server variance in the 'trigger' pull activation occasionally on the 1st snipe.  Sure, it's longer if I don't hit AIM/BU or PB.  It says, 4.33 secs?  That's on live.  But any of those buttons and it activates much quicker.

Did they remove the inherent accuracy of 1.20 from Snipe in the test server?  (Also, have the missing snipe damage numbers been 'found' yet?)

Going back to the test for one more quick go.

Azrael.

Is this where we post feedback about all the beta features? Tried in the main patch notes thread but I'm sure it just got buried in the deluge of DFB complaints. Since I couldn't find a thread for the power timers that are in the beta section on the live servers, I figured this was a good place to put it.

Added power cooldown indicators as a WIP option, accessible through Options > Window > Beta Settings.

Checked this out and it seems to work well, nicely done! Couple suggestions:

- The partial seconds that show up under 10 seconds are distracting for some folks. Be a good option to let people choose whether to use partials or just leave it at whole numbers even under 10 seconds.

- Not sure how hard this would be to implement, but I'd love to be able to turn on timers only for long-recharge powers. The growing-icons are just fine for powers that recharge in 10 seconds or so, I don't need a number for that. But longer ones, Hasten and the like, the numbers are great there. Could we set a threshold so timers only show up for powers that take longer than, say, 30 seconds to recharge?

- If the above isn't feasible, maybe an option to simply have the timer disappear with 10 seconds left might solve both things.

Good catch.

The countdown numbers indicators.

I've just put this one.

I'll post once I've checked the snipe out again.

Azrael.