Chris24601

It said it didn’t post, but it lied.

Connection-based multipost.

Simple solution… change one word and it’s all good. ”You have ENCOUNTERED the monster in the lake, proving to all that it is real."

Stupid internet multi-post

I think this has some merit, but I’d use the maps from the Number Six (Praetoria’s Last Gasp) arc and make it a rescue mission for an important VIP whose transport went down outside the sonic fences. For added fun make is someone the lore says is secretly loyal to the Resistance so everyone has a reason to risk the monster-haunted wilds outside the fences. Make the last section ambush waves with a timer as you have to survive long enough for the Mediporter system to lock-on and pull you out. The only “winning” is to not lose. You can’t actually beat the Devouring Earth, just slow them down enough to escape. Because, yeah, “this is WHY we have the fences and the rules” goes a long way towards keeping Gold-side as shades of grey… the Crusaders want “freedom” but what sort of plan do they have for THAT once they’ve torn down the infrastructure?

The comment above isn’t about villains in Mercy Island; it’s about drawing Blueside players to Mercy Island. Similarly, the idea would be to add some villain contacts to Atlas Park, providing villains a different path than the usual Destined Ones villain plot.

Huge compared to what though? A new power set? A new game mechanic? Adding contacts with missions would require time to compose and edit, but if you’re not introducing new mechanics, maps, or mobs, then it’s probably the most straightforward sort of content to work on. In terms of expanding player experiences, you would effectively be adding half-dozen (hero) to about a dozen (villain) new zones to explore. The first thing to devise would be Paragon Newspaper and Rogue Radio missions for repeatable content. A lot could probably just be duplicating the existing missions for each zone with the dialogue changed (rescuing instead of taking a hostage; recovering stolen goods instead of stealing them; stopping a bank/casino heist instead of participating in one). After that, maybe a zone arc akin to Faultline’s for each zone… just do it one zone at a time; maybe just half a zone (about 6 missions) per page. The main advantage is no new tech or even mobs are needing. Nor do early levels need to be particularly deep. I suggested “recapture Zig escapees” as a Mercy Island arc for heroes for a reason… it’s straightforward and doesn’t require a lot of story. Longbow has a lead, you investigate, catch villain… use the rule-of-three… three arcs each catching a supervillain who’s wholed up with one of Mercy’s villain groups. Then a fourth arc as you go after Arachnos and learn about Project Destiny. Later zone arcs might be about opposing the worst villains in each like Boccor or Themari and shutting them down. Maybe Cap could be assisting Amanda Vines as a sort of AU of the Marshal Brass arc. Conversely, I’d be looking at the main villain groups for each level band and how you might benefit from assisting or subverting their plans for your gain. I’d pay particular attention to the more mercenary groups like the Outcasts, Sky Raiders, Warriors, etc. and maybe write the arcs more like Dean McArthur’s where you’re recruiting, say, the outcasts, as muscle for a caper of your own.

The ONLY way to increase population in the redside zones would be to add hero content to it (ex. recapture the Zig escapees freed by Arachnos on Mercy) and allow heroes to go there. I actually think this would be a valid approach if Blueside zones also could be accessed by villains with rogue/villain content (ex. take advantage of the Blood Brother/Skulls gang wars in Atlas Park to cover for some heists).

I guess to add to my thoughts above; I get the reluctance to want to change too much of what the LiveDevs left us with… But at the same time in many ways what the LiveDevs left was in many ways half-finished due to the shutdown and in other ways less geared towards a coherent experience as it was towards funneling players into the premium endgame grind. One thing that really became obvious with many of the arcs released after the move to F2P was how many of them were effectively commercials for various premium power sets (Ex. Graham Easton’s arc climaxes in fighting four of the different premium power sets on tougher than average Tsoo mobs… twice during the Eagle Eye arc you get pallet swapped to someone with the Street Justice premium set). While I won’t call for it to be removed it’s also not something I’d take as the norm Homecoming should be shooting for in content, nor something it should feel can never be changed if a better design idea comes along.

Mercy Island’s sight lines WERE fine… when you started from Fort Darwin and not within the city. Trainers, Vendors, Hospital, initial contacts, the main road out into the blight where the original starting missions were. It also presented a very solid mission concept… you’ve been dumped in the worst violence-ridden slum of the isles to see if you can even survive long enough to make it to the nicer elevated and walled town. Its literally the embodiment of Lord Recluse’s Darwinian philosophy… particularly when you realize Project Destiny is just a giant scam in the late game. He’s literally dumping villains at random to see who is fit enough to survive and as long as at least one makes it through the weeding out process, it’s a win. Being a Destined One doesn’t mean you’re special… it means you’re a dupe who’s jumped through all Recluse’s hoops until you finally turn the tables in the last act. The shift in starting Mercy to where you’re now someone worthy of respect and the Arachnos troops conn as allies to you completely undercuts the longer term story in my opinion. Frankly, I think the phasing should be inverted from where it is now. You start in the gutters of Mercy outside Fort Darwin and clear it of the Longbow incursion and the final arc isn’t to clear out Fort Darwin, it’s to clear Longbow from the city above so Arachnos can reassert control.

To me, the need to leave Praetoria if you want to continue your story is basically the same as how, if you want to not be a villain, even a Rogue needs to completely abandon the Isles around level 40. All the 40+ content outside of Rogue tip missions is written as if you have fully embraced being a full villain employed by Arachnos. If you want any rogue-ish nuance at that point you can do the one Rogue arc in Independence Port and the Rogue tip missions. If you want more non-repeatable content you have to ultimately “pick a side”… not literally, you can keep the trappings of being a Rogue on your character sheet… but if you’re doing the 40+ Redside arcs you’re acting like a flat-out villain… or you can pull the trigger and become heroic so you can do Blueside content. It’s the same for Goldside… eventually you have to pick between Blue and Red side or just run out of things to do there. That is the story of every PC as the reach the endgame. While the game has a LOT of options they aren’t actually unlimited. You can write “I’m a Council Officer” in your backstory all you want. Council mobs will still shoot you like they would anyone else. By the same token, regardless of whether you believe you’re the most Loyalist to ever swear fealty to the Emperor; he’s done with you at level 20 and he has no interest in letting you fight for him. His soldiers will shoot you on sight. The New Praetorians won’t let you remain a member no matter how much you want it. You don’t get to stay in Last Bastion after you save the day there. That’s the story you get to play. If you want your own stories that deviate from the canon, that’s what AE is for. * * * * What I’d like is a fairly extensive evaluation of mission level access so that stuff is moved back to “level = timeline.” That includes the Praetorian and Signature Story content. Given the downward pressure on power access (all primay/secondaries available by late twenties, ancillary/patron start at 35) and upward pressure of IO access (set bonuses making up for fewer slots) I think the lower band for many story arcs could stand to shift down a bit (leave the upper limit alone) to make room for more of the “end game” content in the 45+ range. Think of it sort of like the time compression in comics where, despite the real world decades, Spidey’s only been doing his thing for about a decade and the stuff they said happened five years ago at one point instead happened just last year so it all squeezes in. Decide what level various events occur and adjust content to match. Move stuff that absolutely can’t fit anymore into Oroboros. - If Statesman and Sister Psyche are intended to have always been dead from the start of a player’s play through, then move the WWD signature arc to Oroboros. - If their deaths instead happen at the earliest level you could play the signature arcs they occur in (level 40), then restore Sister Psyche to Independence Port and restore the original Stateman sends you a note after you disguise yourself as him in the level 20-29 Rogue tip missions since in the level = time scale they should both still be alive. Do the same for Goldside as well. Figure out where the equivalent events occur; what level does Cole launch his invasion? what level does Praetoria die? Maybe there’s some more room in there for some things to do before the fall, but the idea that just because you don’t want to leave means Praetoria needs 40+ content just runs counter to everything else in the game. Heck, I’d argue Night Ward is only peripherally Praetorian in the first place; Drudges, Animus Arcana, Black Knights, Talons of Vengeance… and even that is done by level 35. First Ward is over by level 30. It’s not really worth the effort, but maybe using the phasing tech to put burning buildings and IDF barricades starting at level 30 and a giant crater in place of the Magisterium with DE monsters rampaging everywhere once you reach level 40 would drive the point across. Praetoria dies. That is the story. You standing around in the completed mission so it doesn’t despawn doesn’t change that.

Frankly, I think putting the New Praetorians arc at 35-40 (originally; on HC they merely removed the back end so you could take it all the way at 50) was a huge mistake on the original devs part and sorta sits with Stateman’s death being retconned into lower tier content in terms of the biggest disruptions to the old “level = point on the timeline” rule that kept things fairly coherent. I’m not entirely sure what the live devs were thinking there beyond adding more content to the biggest level slog in the game and someone deciding to basically start a second “leveling timeline” where new PCs could begin their careers already in the aftermath of the Primal/Praetorian War. The only good thing is Homecoming allows you to delay it until after the war content if you want. If it were up to me, I’d have moved it to be exclusively level 50 content because I really value the level = timeline approach for story arcs as a way to keep the player experience consistent. The earliest you can do Stateman’s death mission is level 40, so to my sensibilities, every 1-39 mission arc should act as if Stateman is alive and all the 40-50 content should treat him as dead. The real complication is the iTrials where you need to be level 50. But I think, I think there’s a way around that. The current story progression for characters who are still Praetorian ends at 35 with Night Ward… and it just sorta dangles with Pazuzu thanking you and telling you Night Ward is now a permanent feature thanks to all the magic meddling and that’s it. Technically you could then hop the portal, and do the whole New Praetorians/Mr. G arcs immediately and either skip the Tina/Maria arcs or just acknowledge they’re out of order. But I think a viable solution to all of this timeline muddling could be as follows; - Move the Praetorian portal mission exit to Primal Earth into the Vanguard headquarters in the RWZ. The portals there allow access to Blue and Red sides respectively. - beginning at level 30 or 35, those who still have a Praetorian alignment can use a portal to travel to the RWZ without changing alignment. They can do any of the content in the RWZ while retaining their alignment. - Move Tina and Maria to the RWZ and lower the minimum level for their arcs to 35 (and set both to a max of 50). Change any mission doors to portals within the Vanguard base. At level 35, Praetorians have Tina added as a contact automatically (and Tina introduces Maria when her arc is done). - Drop the Tinpex task force level requirement to 35 and, if begun at 49 or less, the debuff for no alpha slot doesn’t apply. - Create story arc versions of the iTrials with a minimum level range of 40+ for the early part and 45+ for the late ones (effectively the same range for all the other end game content) and with contacts in the RWZ. The iTrials themselves remain as they are; treated as “master runs” of the story arcs. - Lower the level of Belladonna’s arc to 45+ and move the portals for its missions to the RWZ. This allows it to played in order with the iTrial story arcs. - Instead of auto unlocking at 35, Marchand and Mr. G are instead offered as a choice by the last contact from the iTrial story arcs. This unlocks either Blue or Red side zone access to Praetorians along with radio/newspaper and tip missions that correspond to the respective side (i.e. hero/vigilante if you pick Marchand, villain/rogue for Mr. G). You do not gain access to regular contacts until you swap your alignment to one of the standard four, but you can team up with others for their missions normally. * * * * I get the “I’m gonna remain a Praetorian forever” sentiment. I really do. But CoH has never been a “choose your own canon” sorta game. Even the 1-20 Praetorian arcs ultimately end up in the same place with your PC needing to go to Primal Earth and only trivial differences overall between who actually survives. There is no version of any timeline where Tyrant does nuke Praetoria, Keyes doesn’t further nuke whatever survived by blowing his reactors and Hamidon doesn’t basically eat Praetorian Earth outside of Last Bastion (which only survives at all because Hami got distracted by Keyes and a full Incarnate deciding to stand in the gap… realistically it can’t stay as it is; either Praetorian Hami has to be destroyed or Last Bastion eventually falls). That is the story. Praetorian Earth as a dimension habitable to humans is destroyed by the Praetorian War and the survivors relocate to Primal Earth while a handful of, frankly, fatalistic holdouts insist on throwing their lives away on a doomed cause.* You can play that story… but all stories end and the ending of the “I’m staying in Praetoria til I die!” is the Last Bastion arc. You choose to stay and will one day die fighting the Hamidon. The End. If you want a story past that, it happens on Primal Earth with primal alignments, even if you’re a Praetorian.** Put another way; you’re basically saying “I want to continue being an East German” after the Berlin Wall came down and East Germany stopped existing. You’re free to proclaim that to the heavens, but you’re a German (hero/villain/vigilante/rogue) now as far as classification by the world goes. Demanding more new East German content is ridiculous. East Germany is dead and gone. * best case as imagine it with one of my characters is scattered tribes who developed some type of immunity to “the Devourer” before Last Bastion collapsed entirely, but are little more than stone age scavengers in a world ruled by DE monsters. ** worth noting is that if you started as a Praetorian, you retain unique leveling badges regardless of what primal alignment you have.

Vanguard RWZ content starts at level 35 and their troops show up in a few of the Neutropolis missions as well. Vanguard allies are given to you in a few of Tina and Maria’s missions as well. You can still get the pre-Vanguard versions via flashback, but the normal leveling ones available by going to the contacts are are post-Statesman’s death (and post 1-20 Praetorian content). In terms of the Praetorian content timeline, its original Tina and Maria arcs, 1-20 Praetoria content, First Ward, Night Ward, current Tina and Maria, Apex/Tinman, BAF, Lambda, Keyes, Underground, TPN, Dark Astoria (peripherally), Minds of Mayhem, Diabolique (peripherally), Belladonna, Magisterium, Last Bastion, New Praetorians/Mr. G arcs, and finally the Homecoming original John Houston rogue arc (basically following up on New Praetorian dangling bits). Ideally you’d want a Praetorian play through to see most of those in approximately that order. The main kicker is that even if you are a Praetorian, the story does expect you to come to Primal Earth at some point. If you go hero it’s ahead of the Tina arc (the next time Praetoria comes up Blueside) I think holding off on the Warden to Hero Portal Chamber is vastly improved by doing First/Night Ward first, but that becomes nonsensical if you delay it past when the actual war starts (and Maria’s arc is definitely the opening salvo… so if you’re not Primal by then the story just falls apart and you’d need completely separate content for a “stays in Praetoria” run). So, basically, I think Praetoria probably does work best if the content dries up at level 40 and you need to abandon Praetoria to continue the story. In that vein I definitely think there needs to enough story content (not just grindable repeatables) to get a Praetorian to level 40. Night Ward is only really solid until 35. After that all that’s left is repeatables. That’s why I suggested a 35-40 “setting up the Last Bastion” arc as something you could squeeze just enough Goldside content out to get there. Night Ward continues First Ward but is very tangential to the actual Praetoria conflict. One final zone focused on those driven out of “Paradise” and the actual threat of Praetorian Hamidon could really focus back on why you can’t keep putting it off and do need to finally go to Primal Earth (either to selfishly abandon the lost cause as a villain, or heroically align with Vanguard and do your part in bringing down Cole/evacuating innocents before Hamidon comes and destroys everything). That would put a bow nicely onto the storyline that is Praetoria.

How about taking the Last Bastion map and turn it into a zone connected to First Ward via the unused Transit Station there (it’s only used for missions in Night Ward) and say it’s part of the Resistance’s underground railroad for moving dissidents to safety. Storywise, by the time you’re done in First Ward you’re on the outs with the Crusaders (no one says no to Calvin Scott) and Loyalists (particularly once you break into the Magisterium to steal Diabolique’s amulet)… so basically you need to get out of dodge. Enter a level 35-40 (or more) zone where the missions involve getting Last Bastion set up to the point it is by the time the incarnate arc happens… getting ahold of the anti-air defenses for example. Getting food and supplies for refugees, components for the eventual portal device used in the arc, etc. Part Two of my Praetorian content plan would be to move Tina McIntyre and Maria Jenkins to the Rikti War Zone (by rights those missions should fall under Vanguard’s oversight anyway) and, by completing the Last Bastion 35-40 arcs you unlock access to the RWZ where you can participate in those arcs. Part Three of the plan is to create a non-iTrial version of the war against Praetoria as a story arc experience so you can pause to read the content without the pressure of the iTrial going on around you (you can still do the iTrials, this would just be an alternate way of experiencing it. My thinking here is the maps and mobs are already built; they just need to scaled to solo and team play. Fold Belladonna and Last Bastion into that series of arcs as well so that, by the time you’re finally done, you’ve played through the entire Fall of Praetoria story. After that if you’re not level 50, you’re doing something wrong.

Given there’s a literal monstrous glove and nearly all the melee attack animations* are reused from various punchy sets anyway (just with claws on fists)… I don’t see why “invisible” couldn’t be an option for one or both hands. A punch doing lethal makes more sense than a plasma blade also still doing lethal. In the meantime, if you use Widow Claws + a very bright Glow fist - combat aura, you can just about hide the claws behind the pom pom aura (which is when I really noticed how many of Claws’ animations are just energy melee ones with claws extended).