KaizenSoze

A fair point about the ignorance to the power of the spider. The fools! Making endurance my primary suggestion is to avoid the dreaded, but that effects PvP argument. I am hoping for incremental improvements. Changing weapon damage/recharge/cast times, is a harder sell.

I am only seeing this behavior on the beta server - Brainstorm to be specific. Every time I log in my haste power is not set to auto fire. So, I set it. Then I will noticed it has unset again later. Maybe when I finish a mission, but I am not certain. Usually, I have only zoned and done some missions. I will try and figure if there is a specific trigger.

Not sure where I said that VEAT powers cost more than other set. I re-read my comments to be sure, because I don't think particular powers are more expensive than other ATs. Just the combination of powers and toggles. Let's say for the sake of argument that I'm wrong and VEATs are in a good place. Why are there so few? Both HEATs and VEATS have the lowest numbers across all ATs and at level 50. Widows, Night or Fortunata, have the lowest play time of any AT in the game. Banes might be worse, because they don't break out specialties. I don't know why VEATs are so rare. Crab soldiers are in a good place. Even with that ugly backpack. Several Fortunata builds are very powerful. Blood Widows are my favorite build in the whole game. Night Widows and Banes not so much. I think that it's the leveling experience, endurance woes in particular, that turn folks off early on. I almost deleted my Night Widow even at 50, because end was still constant issue. I was a newbie which didn't understand accolades and couldn't afford nice enhancements. In the end, I respec'ed into a Fortunata Blood Widow. Here are the player stats from March.

Also, Banes do not get Whirling Mace. Instead they get two low damage AOEs. They are just over half the base strength of WM.

Just pointing out those health pieces together are around conservatively 20 million at current prices. Money solves a lot of problems. My inherent suggestions more concerned with the under 50 experience. Specially, the under 24 experience.

A couple of points in reply. I still remember and it was a year ago. How painful end issues were when leveling my Night Widow. This is when I had little money and could not IO myself out at 25. The individual power costs might be low, but the attacks recharge quickly. The combination of several toggles and quick attacks is really hard on end. As with any AT, end problems tend to go away after getting fully slotted. Though my melee/psi hybrid Fortuanta, can still burn through end in sustained fighting out w/o Ageless. Again, for an AT whose inherent power is improved regen and recovery. Giving the inherit a boost would not break PvE or PvP. As for the damage difference between Night Widows and Fortunatas. It's very obvious when a Fortunata has most of the same claw attacks and can stealth into a group and delete most of minions with Aim->Wail. Where all a Widow has only Spin with a possible crit. The Widow might kill the bosses quicker because of slash. But the depends a lot on resists. For example, my Fortunata switches to a mix of melee and psi against human Malta bosses because they seem to be decently lethal resistant. As for Banes, there is a thread in the VEAT forums, talking about Bane issues. The quick version is that constant redraw is very painful on huntbanes builds. That pure mace build can be pretty good, but are very far behind even Night Widows in overall damage, particularly AOE, and durability. Honestly, if they would improve end issues and add no redraw, that would be enough to make Night Widows and Banes fun enough for most folks.

Endurance problems are the "bane" of leveling VEATs. A lot of ATs have end issues, but their inherent is not centered around regen and recovery. Increase the inherent recovery rate or add 5-10 points to endurance. Regeneration boost would be nice, but that is tricky with Crab's Serum power. Please, provide a no redraw option. That would allow more build variety. Particularly, huntsman builds. Night Widows and Banes feel like pre buffed Stalkers. I would suggest that they get full crits from hide. This would not be overpowering, as stalker ATOs and their inherent are what make them single target damage gods. Buffing Fortunatas the same would be nice, but they already have a big damage advantage over Widows. An alternative would be have hidden status timer set to the same as stalkers. Pretty sure stalkers re-hide quicker, but I could be wrong. Or another idea would be to lower the recharge and cast time on placate. Allow Night Widows to take both Follow up and Build Up. Fortunatas can take Follow Up and Aim. This is a reach, but replace Night Widow Psychic Scream with Psychic Wail. Give it higher recharge or lesser damage to compensate. It would be a nice mirror of the differences in Mind Link recharge between Widows and Forts. Forts have Follow Up->Aim->Wail, which gives them a massive damage advantage over Widows. Bane mace animation need a review, they feel incredible sluggish. Ifeel like I am standing around waiting for attacks to trigger, which kills the fun. Bane AOEs Mace Beam Volley and Blast need more damage. It does not have to huge, just enough to help remove minions quicker.

Final comment on this experiment. You can tank with either build, but you lose a lot of offensive. I tried to tank the ITF ambush in the first mission. I survived as long as I could get ML, Rune, Melee up or Barrier. If there was a gap, I was done for. So, final eval. Could fill in for a tank for a group in most situations, but you're not going to solo 4x8 with any speed or TFs.

This is the beauty of Widows. So, flexible. Tidge and Gulbasaur have great advice. I on the other hand like to have my Widows tanky. I even made a high def/resist tank version as an experiment. So, I always take tough to get my s/l resists close to 50% and have buckets of def for soloing.

Current tweaked build.

Doh. How could have I not noticed that! Mids only shows 17%, but it's not listed in the power description, it's only on the status resist page. In game show 27%, which as you said isn't much, but it's more than I thought. The best thing about writing the FAQ. I have already learned a few things I didn't know. Extra costume slots and DDR are two.

I was going off personal experience. The red side was a ghost yard when I made my Widow. The extra costume wiki link mentions Brick Johnson. So, that is covered. Fixed the typo.

I juggled lunge and slash. Fixed now.

Does anyone know how to get the sticky flag on a post?

Tidge you're right. I am working on leveling builds this week. Something I could use help with. I'll put on note about why new players should head to the blue side. Also, about the multiple builds. All feedback is appreciated.

Good def and resists. I would take Mind Link and Mask Presence as early as possible. Foresight and leadership can be take a bit later. If you put the Celerity +Steath piece in sprint. Combined, with Mask Presence, you'll have enough stealth to stand next to most mobs. I would swap the ATOs between Spin and Slash. You can lead with Spin from stealth and have a chance to fear multiple mobs. From personal experience, I did not use smoke grenade enough to keep it in the end. You have an extra slot. I would put in TT:Leadership, Gaussian chance for Build Up. Start on your accolades ASAP to help with the end issue. Don't run all your toggles, until you're end stable. The assaults should be optional until then or you have team end buffing. I have no idea if that heal proc in Stamina will proc enough to be worth it. It's an interesting idea!

Thank you for feedback! I updated the guide to take your comments into account. Steal the format, but thank Croax, as I stole it from him.

Strike is great quick attack. Also, a great spot for Spider's Bite, so you will always have the global toxic proc no matter the level. I could see a place for Offensive until you respec at 24, but not in the final build.

Melee widow leveling build to 23. You might not be able to run both Assault and Leadership full time. If you have end buffs. Let em rip. Leveling hybrid range-melee widow build to 23. You might not be able to run both Assault and Leadership full time. If you have end buffs. Let em rip. Full builds. Both Gulbasaur and Tidge have their builds in the thread. Tidge's ranged build is on the last page. Here is my Blood Widow build Pure Night Widow melee build

ATOs Dominion of Arachnos - Take it for the set bonuses. The -dmg and fear are not that great. Spider's Bite - Your first ATO piece should be the global toxic proc. The set bonuses are also nice. Patron Pools - VEATs only get access to four pools Leviathan Mastery - Mix of short and long cast, expensive AOEs Mace Mastery - Shatter armor and Web envelope. Mu Mastery - Decent AOE immobilize and damage. Energy damage which is good for robots which are resistant to lethal and psi. Soul Mastery - Gloom is a very good ranged negative energy attack. Dark Obliteration is a decent negative energy AOE Build Descriptions These are terms I like to use, they are not fixed categories, but preferences in how I think builds are designed. Night Widow - Claws melee - Night Widow Training/Widow Teamwork Night Tank - Night Widow build for very difficult content like soloing ITFs or hardmode PUG Tank - Night Widow build for team tank when a tank/brute is not available Blood Widow - Hybrid melee/ranged/controller - Fortunata Training/Fortunata Teamwork Fortunata - Controller/ranged - Fortunata Training/Fortunata Teamwork Fort Tank - Fortunata build for very difficult content like hard mode or soloing some TFs Build Guidelines Widows only get 26% Defense Debuff Resistance, so you need to have greater than 45% positional defense in the end. It’s not that hard to get there with IO sets and enough recharge to make Mind Link perma, but it can be expensive. Fortunatas are noticeably more expensive to build than Night Widows, because Mind Link has a higher recharge on Fortunatas. Purple sets are a must for Fortunatas if you want perma Mind Link. But perma Fortunata Mind Link is not required, if you play smart. For soloing 4x8, I go for a minimum of 50% positionals. Defense debuffs are becoming more common. Night widow must take placate. It allows you to get more critical hits and removes attackers for 10+ seconds. Combined with Pain Tolerance, you can be pretty tanky. I tend to use Build Up over Follow Up now to maximize critical hits. Build Up->Placate->Slash is your bread and butter single target attack chain. Blood Widow’s single target attack chains are the same as Night Widow. If Psychic Wail is up, then Follow Up->Aim->Wail ASAP. I will often use hide to get in the middle of groups and start with Aim->Wail. Fortunatas use Psychic Wail just like Blood Widows, but will back out to play at range. Fortunatas Scrambled Thoughts is great for knocking off mob toggles. If you slot for stun duration, you can perma stun two bosses. Leveling suggestions Keep toggles to the bare minimum until you get accolades, Incarnates, stamina, and health piece that help recovery Endurance issues are a normal pain of leveling. Plan for it, slot endurance and endurance reducers. SG or vendor endurance buffs if you can afford them. You are very squishy in the beginning, low/moderate hp and low defense, this lasts until better slotting and mind link is up most of the time. Use Super Group base buffs to help ease the pain. Once, you have endurance and defense slotted well. You can ex-emp down very well till level 15, then you lose your stealth.

Warning a lot of opinion below M = Mandatory O = Optional S = Skip Primaries Widow Training Poison Dart O - moderate damage full slotted. Only for pure ranged builds. Swipe O - fast melee attack - good spot for Spider's Bite ATOs Strike O/M - moderate melee attack - optional for some Fortunata, mandatory for Night Widows Dart Burst O - narrow ranged cone. Pure ranged builds only. Follow Up M/O - Damage, plus to hit and global damage buff, which can stack on itself self once Night Widows have to pick either Follow up or Build up, while Fortunata are not restricted Spin M - Good Melee PBAOE, but a bit endurance heavy. See placate power for more details. Lunge M - Strong melee attack Confront S - Single target provoke, one of the least taken powers in the whole game! If you really want a taunt take Presence: Provoke. Night Widow Training Mental Blast (page 7) O - Moderate damage. Good for finishing off psi weak mobs. Build Up M - Damage/To Hit buff. Must pick either this power or Follow Up. See placate power for more details. Smoke Grenade O - Useful only in rare situations, clicking items with dangerous mobs nearby Slash M - High damage melee attack. Lead from stealth with this attack for a 100% crit. Eviscerate S - 90 deg melee cone, longish animation. Hard to hit more than two mobs. But it’s your only other Night Widow AOE. Requires practice. From stealth, 50% chance to crit for 100% damage bonus against each target. Psychic Scream O - Moderate/High damage ranged cone. Somewhat works against Spin. Good on teams. See placate powers for more details Fortunata Training Mental Blast O - Fortunata’s have much better ranged attacks, but for a ranged Fortunata you might need it for an attack chain Telekinetic Blast O - Moderate ranged damage, knockback, possible Force Feedback recharge. Fated Sealed makes the knockback happen 100% of the time. Subdue M/S - High ranged damage, MAG 3 immobilize is just a bonus for ranged builds. Fated Sealed makes the immobilization happen 100% of the time. Aim M - Fortunatas get both Follow up and Aim. Take both. Psychic Scream S - Low damage ranged cone Dominate M - Mag 3 hold, but can be proc’ed into a high damage attack with a good chance to hold bosses Psionic Tornado O - Moderate Ranged AOE with knockup, not knockback. Long cast time, large radius, decent damage, does not procs well, but takes Force Feedback for recharge. Much better than Psychic Scream. Fated Sealed makes the knockup happen 100% of the time. It can be a good crowd control tool. Scramble Thoughts (page 7) O/M - Mag 4 stun with a psi damage dot. Very useful for controlling bosses. Excellent soloing power. Total Domination O - Mag 3 AOE hold, long recharge. Fated Sealed adds 50% to the duration. Psychic Wail M - Very high PBAOE damage. Follow->Aim->Psychic Wail massive damage plus a mag 3 stun. Must take otherwise why are you playing a Fortunta! Secondaries Teamwork Combat Training: Defensive M -Passive melee only defense Combat Training: Offensive O - Passive. Can only slot accuracy IOs, not to hit. Provides 33% toHit debuff resistance Tactical Training: Maneuvers M - Bread and butter defense toggle Indomitable Will M - Must have mez resist toggle plus some psi resists Tactical Training: Assault O - 15% group damage buff, nice to have if you have the room Tactical Training: Leadership O - Great group buff, 1 Hami/D-Sync, 2 slot or 6 slot with Guasian set Foresight M - Non-toggle mez protection, psi resists. Plus scaling resists that increase as your health drops. Widow Teamwork Pain Tolerance M/O - Provides up to 7.5% resistance to all. Up to 322 max health.. Greatly increases the durability of Night Widows. I think it’s mandatory, but if you’re happy with your current build you could skip it. Greatly helps with getting 2 shot, before your scaling resists kick in. Mask Presence M - Makes you a mini stalker. If you hit Slash or Eviscerate you get a 100% critical damage bonus. All other melee attacks only get a 66% bonus. Ranged attacks do not get any bonus damage. The stealth radius is greater than the Fortunata version, so Celerity IO in sprint is not required to hide from bosses. Mental Training M - Recharge, running, flying bonus. Large resistance to running, flying, recharge debuffs. Mind Link M - Large group defense bonus, nice to hit, plus psi resists. Not hard to perma on Night Widows, hard to perma on Fortunatas. Placate M - Fast recharging AOE placate. There is a 5 second window to get a melee attack off for critical damage, even if you are hit. This greatly improved the effectiveness of Spin and somewhat Eviscerate. I prefer Build Up over Follow now, to maximize critical hits. You must take this power, unless you are tanking for the team. Placating a mob will cause it to shift to the next teammate, so it works against tanking. Tactical Training: Vengeance O - Personally, I forget to use, by the time I remember I have it the player has rezed Elude O - 60% positional with defense debuff protection. Endurance crashes at the end. I have heard it’s useful in PvP Fortunata Teamwork Fated Sealed(Page 7) O/M - Increases the duration of all controls by 33%, mezz resistance by 35%, makes secondary control effects happen 100% of the time Mask Presence M - Makes you a mini stalker. Your first melee, not ranged, attack gets a 66% damage bonus, critical, stalkers get 100% bonus. Combined with the Celerity stealth IO in sprint makes you invisible to most mobs. Mind Link M - Large group defense bonus, nice to hit, plus psi resists. Not hard to perma on Night Widows, hard to perma on Fortunatas. Confuse O - Nice to have with Coercive Persuasion proc, but not used often Tactical Training: Vengeance O - Personally, I forget to use, by the time I remember I have it the player has rezed Aura of Confusion O - Nice to have with Coercive Persuasion proc, but not used often. Long recharge.

Version .2 updated for page 7 changes The format for this guide is taken from the Stalker Guide written by @Croax Strengths All Widows Easy to cap all three positional defense type Critical melee hits from stealth 85% Psi resists Scaling resists, as HP falls, all resists increase Versatile playstyle Excellent support via toggles for defense, toHit, and damage. Can double up on all toggles using the Leadership pool Melee damage scale 1.0 Ranged damage scale 1.0 Night Widow High melee damage with the smart use of placate 100% critical damage build when using Slash or Eviscerate Stalker like playstye while providing good support Moderate ranged AOE damage 1900+ Hit points using Pain Tolerance, max HP IOs, and other buffs High durability for a non tank/brute, can exceed tank/brute durability with smart play against certain enemies Solo: mobs running is a real problem. Stacking dots, debuff, and the fact they miss a lot, causes the mob AI to start running very early. Placate can help somewhat, but provoke is your best option. Fortunata Moderate ranged damage High melee damage Good controls with Fated Sealed High damage PBAOE Low hit points for a melee - Accolades + Unbreakable Guard 7.5% = 1283 hp Critical hits limited to only 66% Weaknesses Endurance issues due fast firing melee attacks Limited defense debuff resistance Hard to reach high resists, except psi Expensive for a max build - lots of purples and winter sets Most damage is lethal or psi. Can be very tedious when fighting robots solo These can be greatly improved with IOs and Incarnate, but leveling can be painful. ATO inherent power Conditioning provides a slight increase to regeneration and recovery. Honestly, it’s not a great power as one of the biggest pains to leveling is still endurance.

Right attitude, just apply it to defense. 🙂

Generally, folks skip Offensive, for the reasons you stated. Build w/o Defensive then see if you need more ranged def. It's a nice mule for LoTG recharge. Keep in mind you have no defense debuff resistance when thinking about defense. Nada, zlitch, zero.

Good resists, but I would have more buffer in the positional def. If you're going to solo at high diff. AOEs will chew you up if you get debuffed. Arachnos will drop -7.5 and -33 def on you. Not sure about the ITF debuffs. Weaponized surveillance is intriguing.