Your thoughts on a Demons or Bots /Nature Tankermind

[SmalltalkJava]

I've done my experiments with demons and Beasts /Nature MM's with a tilt towards damage.  Now I'm thinking about a true TankerMind.  So that leans towards Bots or Demons.  Regarding survival, Nature gives +Resists and Absorb, but really needs high recharge to sing.  I've gone back and forth in my mind about Fighting Pool vs Leadership pool.   I know the Pools that I want are Presence for Provoke, Teleport for teleport, SuperSpeed for Hasten.  That leaves 1 extra pool.  So either leadership or Fighting.

 

My idea on how it would play.  It would work like @Crysis's Bots/Time tankermind.   Buff every 60-70 seconds, Teleport in with the Aura, then lay down my garden, then attack and Provoke.  This is basically what I do today with my /Nature, except I have to run in.   It is kind of like the two bulls on the hill scenario. Why run in when you can port in and take care of them all.

 

Bots

• + a third layer of survive-ability with Protector Bots shield
• + Ranged, so I can use mouse click bound "Stay" and "goto" to keep them out of melee aoe range
• + MM attacks are ranged, which will allow me to better control the pbaoe aura range of Entangling Aura.  Try to find the sweet spot to hit mobs with attacks and still keep the max number in my aura
•  
• - pet knockbacks. might be a problem. mobs knocked out of my aura.   trying to balance this with getting good recharge for nature
  • does it impact you /Time users that don't slot for kb->kd conversion?

 

Demons

• +  Right off the bat, +15 extra resists for several area's
• +  Don't have to worry about knockbacks
•  
• - pets are mixed melee and ranged so they will take more hits

 

Here is a rough quick build that I threw together for a tankier Demons/Nature.  It wasn't all my idea.   I've never done a tankermind before.  The incarnates should be turned off,  I wasn't set on them, I was just doing some experiments to see what would work or not work.   Regardless, if anyone has a better idea/build for either bots or Nature then let me know!   All input is welcome, especially if you can get the defense capped with high resists or vice/versa.  

 

 

Spoiler

 

Hero Plan by Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer 2.6.0.5
https://github.com/ImaginaryDevelopment/imaginary-hero-designer

Provoke Demon -Nature: Level 50 Magic Mastermind
Primary Power Set: Demon Summoning
Secondary Power Set: Nature Affinity
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Teleportation
Power Pool: Presence
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery

Hero Profile:
------------
Level 1:    Summon Demonlings    
 (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Damage
 (3) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Endurance/Pet +Resist +Regen
 (3) Soulbound Allegiance - Damage
 (5) Soulbound Allegiance - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
 (5) Soulbound Allegiance - Chance for Build Up
 (7) Expedient Reinforcement - Resist Bonus Aura for Pets

Level 1:    Corrosive Enzymes    
 (A) Accuracy IO

Level 2:    Corruption    
 (A) Superior Winter's Bite - Damage/RechargeTime
 (7) Superior Winter's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
 (9) Superior Winter's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
 (9) Superior Winter's Bite - Damage/Endurance/Accuracy/RechargeTime
 (11) Superior Winter's Bite - Recharge/Chance for -Speed & -Recharge
 (11) Superior Winter's Bite - Accuracy/Damage

Level 4:    Wild Growth    
 (A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
 (15) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance
 (15) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime
 (17) Unbreakable Guard - +Max HP
 (17) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%

Level 6:    Enchant Demon    
 (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 8:    Crack Whip    
 (A) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage
 (19) Positron's Blast - Damage/Endurance
 (19) Positron's Blast - Damage/Recharge
 (21) Positron's Blast - Damage/Range
 (21) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
 (23) Force Feedback - Chance for +Recharge

Level 10:    Regrowth    
 (A) Panacea - Heal/Endurance
 (23) Panacea - Endurance/Recharge
 (25) Panacea - Hea/Recharge
 (25) Panacea - Heal/Endurance/Recharge
 (27) Panacea - Heal

Level 12:    Summon Demons    
 (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
 (27) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage
 (29) Call to Arms - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
 (29) Call to Arms - Damage/Endurance
 (31) Call to Arms - Accuracy/Damage
 (31) Call to Arms - Defense Bonus Aura for Pets

Level 14:    Boxing    
 (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 16:    Lifegiving Spores    
 (A) Panacea - +Hit Points/Endurance
 (31) Panacea - Heal
 (33) Panacea - Heal/Endurance/Recharge
 (33) Panacea - Hea/Recharge
 (33) Panacea - Heal/Endurance

Level 18:    Hell on Earth    
 (A) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
 (34) Sovereign Right - Resistance Bonus
 (34) Edict of the Master - Defense Bonus

Level 20:    Teleport    
 (A) Blessing of the Zephyr - Knockback Reduction (4 points)

Level 22:    Wild Bastion    
 (A) Preventive Medicine - Chance for +Absorb
 (34) Preventive Medicine - Heal
 (36) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
 (36) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime
 (36) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
 (37) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance

Level 24:    Provoke    
 (A) Perfect Zinger - Taunt
 (37) Perfect Zinger - Chance for Psi Damage
 (37) Perfect Zinger - Taunt/Recharge/Range
 (39) Perfect Zinger - Taunt/Recharge
 (39) Perfect Zinger - Taunt/Range
 (39) Perfect Zinger - Accuracy/Recharge

Level 26:    Summon Demon Prince    
 (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Endurance
 (40) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage/Endurance
 (40) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage
 (40) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Damage/Endurance
 (42) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
 (42) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Recharge/Pet +AoE Defense Aura

Level 28:    Spore Cloud    
 (A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance

Level 30:    Hasten    
 (A) Recharge Reduction IO
 (42) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 32:    Abyssal Empowerment    
 (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 35:    Entangling Aura    
 (A) Basilisk's Gaze - Chance for Recharge Slow
 (43) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge/Hold
 (43) Basilisk's Gaze - Endurance/Recharge/Hold
 (43) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Hold

Level 38:    Overgrowth    
 (A) Recharge Reduction IO
 (45) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 41:    Scorpion Shield    
 (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
 (45) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance
 (45) Shield Wall - Defense
 (46) Shield Wall - +Res (Teleportation), +5% Res (All)
 (46) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance

Level 44:    Tough    
 (A) Gladiator's Armor - TP Protection +3% Def (All)
 (46) Gladiator's Armor - End/Resist
 (48) Gladiator's Armor - Resistance/Rech/End

Level 47:    Weave    
 (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
 (48) Red Fortune - Defense/Endurance
 (48) Red Fortune - Defense/Recharge
 (50) Red Fortune - Endurance/Recharge
 (50) Red Fortune - Defense/Endurance/Recharge
 (50) Red Fortune - Defense

Level 49:    Power Boost    
 (A) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 1:    Brawl    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Dash    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Slide    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Quick    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Rush    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Surge    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Sprint    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Supremacy    
Level 2:    Rest    
 (A) Empty

Level 4:    Ninja Run    
Level 2:    Swift    
 (A) Run Speed IO

Level 2:    Health    
 (A) Numina's Convalesence - +Regeneration/+Recovery
 (13) Miracle - +Recovery

Level 2:    Hurdle    
 (A) Jumping IO

Level 2:    Stamina    
 (A) Endurance Modification IO
 (13) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End

Level 0:    Freedom Phalanx Reserve    
Level 0:    Portal Jockey    
Level 0:    Task Force Commander    
Level 0:    The Atlas Medallion    
Level 0:    Ember Shield Owner    
Level 0:    Ember Shield    
Level 50:    Resilient Radial Paragon    
Level 50:    Barrier Core Epiphany    
Level 50:    Melee Radial Embodiment    
------------

| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build |
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
|MxDz;2006;757;1514;HEX;|
|78DAED94C94F535114C6EF6B5FC196565A90B9A50360814269D5B8740231416B9A8|
|0A80B439EF08A2F96B67630B2322E5C3844976A9C583A6F1CA35B35BA37718C1A57|
|A2822E30EAAA9EBEEF84366962F803BC49F3BBFDEE19BE73DF6B238706ACB7B61C5|
|92F247B7F5CC964C6224A26ABA6A7B4C48429A24C6AE382565D349D3C98DCAF7A06|
|D4A964C2D3BB5DC9E6D26A259D788BE163C3B9293A0DEA31FC454B4CBA4B2236E56|
|2B12092C736C6625A42CB4E0B4B34998C078753AA3A61D3B783DAE4BE2C65D6E8DF|
|46D4B89A4AA6B34A564B261CBA1451125A2A17D715E7E694361E2CE91151C6551E6|
|2BA911C1EA6CF39BBE0953789515988B02C0CBB99EB0C3AE50DCC7EB062017CD3B6|
|982B44B3D0B5B3544FE27AD255D4A9B8062EBBCEBC015A6E32AF80C7A89E514FCEC|
|BC605A3AE2DFFC5FC0DDAFF301B28D0258BF3D4CFC41E4C5E78B8405A257BA8BC0D|
|ADE60EF32EB8E21EF33E587F1433BD250F66E4CA66277AD5BBC0C656A61B6CF6801|
|7A95F15F7ABDA85599A4740E74783EED3F9016C7DCFFC044A64D4C6FE6DECFF0479|
|A8660FD55EF468E55E1EEEED612F1EF678893C389063703C83E6FD897ADE59A25F1|
|67EEA55CBBD6ADF61DE93D4AB0E776EAA9BE3BCCF60DB2CF30BF32BD8FE8DE7A77A|
|0D3C774302F5DA33CC14B832C94C330F8097C96F13E736EDC45DF977301FA3BEFF0|
|9D8F594F91C3C4E9E5B788E9687A8E7232F2ECC21B90285B9CDA28B3943BDDC1CEF|
|E63B3E45357CD08CBED77816DDAF982F992FC0D314DB8158A9836BF6301F90A54E7|
|E673B0B1749B57BECCC21F8EDDDCA1C048DE435801C4360159F85C1BE1028534C90|
|9F4B90EBF659985560D8CAB4319783F35621423C6F2880799D72C96F354F4B74972|
|9A132255CA6AC2E53D69429DBCA944851C947E5C57F0821E9A7667A3E463E9DB3D0|
|A9C4A7BDF0FEBDA849D22866B40E49FA3B3D5F1ADF89F81FA5F11E68D633784F0A0|
|DF3518B6E4D6FB8A764AF94ECF796EC8B6BADA350146ADA5EDCFF5F4B5F36FACF08|
|8BA5DCDB4CED5223FFBD1EF98A75FE02BADFA66C|
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|

 

 

 

Edited September 26, 2019 by SmalltalkJava

[Couthless]

Fitness is inherent so you don't need to make a choice between it and Leadership for your fourth power pool.

Also, have you considered Thugs? The main thing Bots have over Thugs is more resists but that is much less of an issue if you are a Tankermind considering their resists don't even come in to play for the shared damage. The Thugs will bring a bit more defence and a lot more damage.

[SmalltalkJava]

Ahh I got confused.  I was thinking "fighting" pool.  for tough/weave.  I've thought about thugs, but i've only dabbled in thugs a bit.  Do thugs have better defenses than bots?

 

Here is what I threw together quickly for a Bots/Nature build.

Spoiler

 

Hero Plan by Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer 2.6.0.5
https://github.com/ImaginaryDevelopment/imaginary-hero-designer

Provoke Robots-Nature: Level 50 Magic Mastermind
Primary Power Set: Robotics
Secondary Power Set: Nature Affinity
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Teleportation
Power Pool: Presence
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery

Hero Profile:
------------
Level 1:    Battle Drones    
 (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Damage
 (3) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Endurance/Pet +Resist +Regen
 (3) Soulbound Allegiance - Damage
 (5) Soulbound Allegiance - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
 (5) Soulbound Allegiance - Chance for Build Up
 (7) Expedient Reinforcement - Resist Bonus Aura for Pets

Level 1:    Corrosive Enzymes    
 (A) Accuracy IO

Level 2:    Pulse Rifle Blast    
 (A) Superior Winter's Bite - Damage/RechargeTime
 (7) Superior Winter's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
 (9) Superior Winter's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
 (9) Superior Winter's Bite - Damage/Endurance/Accuracy/RechargeTime
 (11) Superior Winter's Bite - Recharge/Chance for -Speed & -Recharge
 (11) Superior Winter's Bite - Accuracy/Damage

Level 4:    Wild Growth    
 (A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
 (15) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance
 (15) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime
 (17) Unbreakable Guard - +Max HP
 (17) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%

Level 6:    Equip Robot    
 (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 8:    Photon Grenade    
 (A) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage
 (19) Positron's Blast - Damage/Endurance
 (19) Positron's Blast - Damage/Recharge
 (21) Positron's Blast - Damage/Range
 (21) Positron's Blast - Chance of Damage(Energy)
 (23) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance

Level 10:    Regrowth    
 (A) Panacea - Heal/Endurance
 (23) Panacea - Endurance/Recharge
 (25) Panacea - Hea/Recharge
 (25) Panacea - Heal/Endurance/Recharge
 (27) Panacea - Heal

Level 12:    Protector Bots    
 (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
 (27) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage
 (29) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
 (29) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance
 (31) Luck of the Gambler - Defense
 (31) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge

Level 14:    Boxing    
 (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 16:    Lifegiving Spores    
 (A) Panacea - +Hit Points/Endurance
 (31) Panacea - Heal
 (33) Panacea - Heal/Endurance/Recharge
 (33) Panacea - Hea/Recharge
 (33) Panacea - Heal/Endurance

Level 18:    Pulse Rifle Burst    
 (A) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
 (34) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage
 (34) Thunderstrike - Damage/Endurance

Level 20:    Teleport    
 (A) Blessing of the Zephyr - Knockback Reduction (4 points)

Level 22:    Wild Bastion    
 (A) Preventive Medicine - Chance for +Absorb
 (34) Preventive Medicine - Heal
 (36) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
 (36) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime
 (36) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
 (37) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance

Level 24:    Provoke    
 (A) Perfect Zinger - Taunt
 (37) Perfect Zinger - Chance for Psi Damage
 (37) Perfect Zinger - Taunt/Recharge/Range
 (39) Perfect Zinger - Taunt/Recharge
 (39) Perfect Zinger - Taunt/Range
 (39) Perfect Zinger - Accuracy/Recharge

Level 26:    Assault Bot    
 (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Endurance
 (40) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage/Endurance
 (40) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage
 (40) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Damage/Endurance
 (42) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
 (42) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Recharge/Pet +AoE Defense Aura

Level 28:    Spore Cloud    
 (A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance
 (50) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff

Level 30:    Hasten    
 (A) Recharge Reduction IO
 (42) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 32:    Upgrade Robot    
 (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 35:    Entangling Aura    
 (A) Basilisk's Gaze - Chance for Recharge Slow
 (43) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge/Hold
 (43) Basilisk's Gaze - Endurance/Recharge/Hold
 (43) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Hold

Level 38:    Overgrowth    
 (A) Recharge Reduction IO
 (45) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 41:    Scorpion Shield    
 (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
 (45) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance
 (45) Shield Wall - Defense
 (46) Shield Wall - +Res (Teleportation), +5% Res (All)

Level 44:    Tough    
 (A) Gladiator's Armor - TP Protection +3% Def (All)
 (46) Gladiator's Armor - End/Resist
 (46) Gladiator's Armor - Resistance/Rech/End

Level 47:    Weave    
 (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
 (48) Red Fortune - Defense/Endurance
 (48) Red Fortune - Defense/Recharge
 (48) Red Fortune - Endurance/Recharge
 (50) Red Fortune - Defense/Endurance/Recharge
 (50) Red Fortune - Defense

Level 49:    Power Boost    
 (A) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 1:    Brawl    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Dash    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Slide    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Quick    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Rush    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Surge    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Sprint    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Supremacy    
Level 2:    Rest    
 (A) Empty

Level 4:    Ninja Run    
Level 2:    Swift    
 (A) Run Speed IO

Level 2:    Health    
 (A) Numina's Convalesence - +Regeneration/+Recovery
 (13) Miracle - +Recovery

Level 2:    Hurdle    
 (A) Jumping IO

Level 2:    Stamina    
 (A) Endurance Modification IO
 (13) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End

Level 0:    Freedom Phalanx Reserve    
Level 0:    Portal Jockey    
Level 0:    Task Force Commander    
Level 0:    The Atlas Medallion    
Level 0:    Ember Shield Owner    
Level 0:    Ember Shield    
Level 50:    Barrier Core Epiphany    
Level 50:    Melee Radial Embodiment    
Level 50:    Agility Radial Paragon    
Level 0:    Dispersion Bubble    
------------

| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build |
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
|MxDz;2026;759;1518;HEX;|
|78DAED94CB4F135114C667DA294869A105CAB3A50FC00285DAAA71E90B1F095AD30|
|8A22E0C19CA1427964EEDC3C8D2B8F2115DBAD2E8CEF7464504359AA8D1BD89CF3F|
|C017EA8244898B7A98EF844E5277BAF426CDEFCE77CF3DE73BF7762676748BEDE6F|
|6631B04D131909273B9D1989CCB2BD949353D6E89C9136A42A0E18A67B523DA21C5|
|B75B1BD3F2B9FE5D72BE90552A69A5B5143E3A54989CD4D2613D464DE4BC86A5CD8|
|564328C5DA39B924935ADE6A7047B5CD352E16DEAC4C1BC9A9EA8D39F86959492D1|
|B27939AF6A69A72EC5E4B49A29A474C5AA2B43194519776FCDA889B0A1464C4E28E|
|C7EAA99AC1DA7DFAC45E051B4082392204425C1B49FB9DEA453DAC81C002B16C0B7|
|1DCB7BA94F41D7EE513E91F3895790A7E22AB8E21AF33A68BDC1BC0C9EA07C667D7|
|351322F9875ADE607F327E858643651A04712EE533D0B7BB0F8E1E1010995ECA1F2|
|16B4BADBCC3B60C33473066CBC0BBE230F55D82B55B951ABD10336B733BD60AB0F7|
|C48F5AAB95EF53EF4D23A0CBA5DF0E97688FA737B03F339F68A64D4CEFEEDECFF14|
|79A8650FB57EC4B5732D1FD7F6B1171F7B9C230F4EEC31392F218FFF3CF30218A45|
|AF55CABFE3DEEF034D572E1CC2DAE79E4F27F003B3E323F313F839D5FB87FCAD7C4|
|7D37A591AF33C7CC802B35669679187C447E5B786FCB5E9C55700FF309F2079F823|
|DCF982FC093E4B90D7BC5B659E48B4E8301F2E4413FA227B4D47795D0C37C4C35BD|
|DCBF97CFFA0CE50A403307DE98F4BBEA7DCD7CC57C099EA5D82EAEDBC539FB98336|
|4AD1B75CDDD2EDC711FDF79DF207CF7EF00CDE4318458536835AF45991150A29830|
|DF4B98F3ADB232AB9936306A67D6805F6D8210E13E2321F4E9960CEF6A9186D05BA|
|644CA946899B2A64C595BA6EC2C536225A5189796BF1082A8AF5639E8BDE7D5792B|
|AD8ABCDA0FEFDF4A9A288EA047DB203148BD1AE3BB11FFDD18EF83663B87FFC752C|
|162DCAA5BD30B1E30CC65C37CCC302F8D75CEA5A450B38ED2FCFFF8A7E3227DA6A2|
|C2DF1FED5CA094E757E39F722E4AA54BFC0DC8E1B623|
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|

 

 

Edited September 26, 2019 by SmalltalkJava

[Shoulung]

I don’t know about better defense, but the enforcers use maneuvers/tactics auras that can be slotted with gaussian’s build up proc. I think that’s the only way pets can get a build up effect, but not certain. Also, demons cast their res shield on the MM too, which should stack nicely with nature’s buffs. I am curious as to why you prefer ranged pets though, as nature’s heals are centered around the caster and you’re looking to tank. In regards to personal safety, I think I’d prefer the demon res buff as that’ll benefit you’re getting to cap easier. Power pools only offer one power to improve res and two for def, so I’d say get what you can out of your pets.

[Redlynne]

9 hours ago, SmalltalkJava said:

So either leadership or Fighting.

Fighting is only good for your Mastermind.

Leadership is good for your Mastermind and every Pet you've got (and every Teammate).

 

In the context of a Mastermind, there's no contest here.

LEADERSHIP.

 

Because you can 6 slot Maneuvers with the Reactive Defenses set and lose barely any Defense and global recharge compared to 5 slot of Red Fortune plus a Luck of The Gambler global recharge IO.

[Shoulung]

If I was tanking for my pets I’d go fighting over leadership at that point, because you get both res and def out of it, and your pets aren’t really having to defend against anything. Leadership is more beneficial for team play though.

[Redlynne]

2 hours ago, Shoulung said:

Leadership is more beneficial for team play though.

Except ... soloing as a Mastermind IS team play!

[Shoulung]

I’ll stand by my point for tankerminding.

[Redlynne]

5 minutes ago, Shoulung said:

I’ll stand by my point for tankerminding.

And that works ... so long as NOTHING EVER GOES WRONG ... like having AoEs tossed at you and all your Pets clustered up around you get hit because you only bothered to protect your Mastermind instead of your Pets ... because ... Tankerminding.

 

I'm just saying, be careful of putting all your eggs in one basket (and assuming that no one will ever steal your basket).

[Shoulung]

Probably explains why I never bothered with tankerminding or bodyguard mode. Then again, I always take the fighting and leadership pools on all my masterminds because a dead MM means dead pets. I will point out out that most MMs with ranged builds will use the goto + defensive mode to keep them alive while they jump in, or tp in and debuff/detooth mobs while their pets play catch-up, all of which is too complicated a play style for me. Congratulations on never having lost your pets or taking a trip to the hospital on your MM btw, Red, don’t think I can say that of any of my characters, ever.

[Redlynne]

10 hours ago, Shoulung said:

Congratulations on never having lost your pets or taking a trip to the hospital on your MM btw, Red, don’t think I can say that of any of my characters, ever.

Um ... I never claimed that.

 

I'm just pointing out that if you're expecting Tankerminding to "solve all the problems" for you, you need to ride more than just that One Trick Pony™.

In that context, relying on Leadership rather than relying on the Fighting pool, is a superior choice in my opinion because Leadership is more "broadly applicable" both in and out of Tankerminding than Fighting.

[Shoulung]

The one thing that the leadership pool doesn’t give me is resist, and I managed to cap out resists on my thugs/dark, but not defense. Maybe the decision would benefit from a consideration of the defenses inherent in an MM’s secondary. That’s carrying both leadership and fighting pools btw.

[SmalltalkJava]

I go back and forth on resists vs defense levels.  I wish that I could find a sliding scale or graph that shows the overall survivability of different resist and defense values.  

 

Oh.  I had a couple hours today. So I respec’d my demons/nature MM.  I can’t remember if it was to the exact specification of what I had posted but lol.  AlI can say is wow.   For an unrefined build that wasn’t focused damage at all, it was cool.  I’m sure a math expert could take it and go bonkers with resists/defenses and some damage 

 

But in the end. It’s actually working. As always, I really wish that natures recharge rates were lowered just a bit.   I’m just glad that it is possible to tankermind as a /Nature.  Most of the time, with the resists that the build has you don’t need bodyguard mode at all. As a matter of fact it “seems” that in certain situations that bodyguard was a detriment to the unit as a whole.  Because their share isn’t affected by their resists.  This caused their absorb shield to get sucked dry.    I have some more experimenting to do.  But the initial results were really cool.

 

Add in incarnates,  lol. Dear Lord.  I don’t even have an idea on where to start thinking about those options.    But it looks crazy.  

 

Ps.  I’m not at my pc to check but I think on my actual in game build that I switched the slotting between scorpion shield and weave.  It gave a .1 or . 2 defense boost. IIRC

 

 

[Dr Causality]

On 9/26/2019 at 9:45 AM, SmalltalkJava said:

My idea on how it would play.  It would work like @Crysis's Bots/Time tankermind.   Buff every 60-70 seconds, Teleport in with the Aura, then lay down my garden, then attack and Provoke.  This is basically what I do today with my /Nature, except I have to run in.   It is kind of like the two bulls on the hill scenario. Why run in when you can port in and take care of them all.

This opening plan is something I've been toying with in builds.  If you can fit in, then I think the optimal way to do it would actually be Spring Attack since not only do you port in you do aoe Dmg and KD.   Makes a great Proc Monster for instance, with FF proc for some Rech etc.  

 

But the other important thing is Spring Attack has a range of only 60' which happens to also be the radius of Supremacy.   This is important because Bodyguard mode doesnt work outside of that Supremacy radius.    Now if the pets are trailing behind you even TPing 60' could cause you to be outside of Body Guard protection range.  But if you can only TP a max of 60' with Spring Attack, then you'll have a very easy way to eyeball how far you can safely TP while still benefiting from Body Guard for the Alpha hit.    Whereas, the Standard TP power has a base range of 300', so can vastly overshoot your safety radius.   

 

---

 

Also worth mentioning Sorcery's Mystic Flight includes a TP.  It's endurance heavy, but you get basically Fly and TP in a single power.  What I find annoying about Mystic Flight is it opens an extra power tray that you can't close or add powers to.    Mystic Flight will probably be most useful for builds that want to take advantage of Rune of Protection.   Spirit Ward is also very handy for keeping pets alive on builds that lack easily directed healing.    From what I've been able to tell 'Rune of Protection' can be clicked when you're already mezzed acting as a break free.

[SmalltalkJava]

8 hours ago, Dr Causality said:

I think the optimal way to do it would actually be Spring Attack since not only do you port in you do aoe Dmg and KD

That would be nice,  but i'm not sure how i can fit it in.   I worked with someone else to do another revision to my Demons Tankermind.   I've pretty much stretched my build knowledge to its max with this new build!  My brain is pretty much capped out on this one. The biggest downside to my new build is that Bastion has a 74 second recharge. That is longer than what I really want but damn the resists and defense are nice.  Especially if you turn on Resilient Alpha incarnate.  It does have FF proc in Lash, so that should help a bit.

 

This is with Resilient Incarnate OFF

 

Latest Revision: 

Spoiler

 

Hero Plan by Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer 2.6.0.5
https://github.com/ImaginaryDevelopment/imaginary-hero-designer

Provoke Demon -Nature: Level 50 Magic Mastermind
Primary Power Set: Demon Summoning
Secondary Power Set: Nature Affinity
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Teleportation
Power Pool: Presence
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery

Hero Profile:
------------
Level 1:    Summon Demonlings    
 (A) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Damage
 (3) Soulbound Allegiance - Accuracy/Recharge
 (3) Soulbound Allegiance - Damage
 (5) Soulbound Allegiance - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
 (5) Soulbound Allegiance - Chance for Build Up
 (7) Expedient Reinforcement - Resist Bonus Aura for Pets

Level 1:    Corrosive Enzymes    
 (A) Accuracy IO

Level 2:    Corruption    
 (A) Decimation - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
 (7) Decimation - Damage/Recharge
 (9) Decimation - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
 (9) Decimation - Accuracy/Damage
 (11) Decimation - Damage/Endurance

Level 4:    Wild Growth    
 (A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
 (15) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance
 (15) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime
 (17) Unbreakable Guard - Endurance/RechargeTime
 (17) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%

Level 6:    Enchant Demon    
 (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 8:    Crack Whip    
 (A) Annihilation - Chance for Res Debuff
 (11) Force Feedback - Chance for +Recharge
 (19) Ragnarok - Damage/Endurance
 (19) Ragnarok - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
 (21) Ragnarok - Accuracy/Recharge
 (21) Ragnarok - Damage/Recharge

Level 10:    Regrowth    
 (A) Panacea - Heal/Endurance
 (23) Panacea - Endurance/Recharge
 (25) Panacea - Hea/Recharge
 (25) Panacea - Heal/Endurance/Recharge
 (27) Panacea - Heal

Level 12:    Summon Demons    
 (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
 (27) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Damage
 (29) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Endurance/Pet +Resist +Regen
 (29) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Endurance
 (31) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage/Endurance
 (31) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage

Level 14:    Hasten    
 (A) Recharge Reduction IO
 (42) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 16:    Lifegiving Spores    
 (A) Panacea - +Hit Points/Endurance
 (23) Panacea - Endurance/Recharge
 (31) Panacea - Heal/Endurance
 (33) Panacea - Heal/Endurance/Recharge
 (33) Panacea - Heal

Level 18:    Hell on Earth    
 (A) Call to Arms - Defense Bonus Aura for Pets
 (34) Sovereign Right - Resistance Bonus
 (34) Edict of the Master - Defense Bonus

Level 20:    Teleport    
 (A) Blessing of the Zephyr - Knockback Reduction (4 points)

Level 22:    Wild Bastion    
 (A) Preventive Medicine - Chance for +Absorb
 (34) Preventive Medicine - Heal
 (36) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
 (36) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime
 (36) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
 (37) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance

Level 24:    Provoke    
 (A) Mocking Beratement - Taunt/Range
 (33) Mocking Beratement - Taunt/Recharge/Range
 (37) Mocking Beratement - Taunt/Recharge
 (37) Mocking Beratement - Accuracy/Recharge
 (39) Accuracy IO

Level 26:    Summon Demon Prince    
 (A) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
 (40) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
 (40) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage
 (40) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Damage/Endurance
 (42) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
 (42) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Recharge/Pet +AoE Defense Aura

Level 28:    Spore Cloud    
 (A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance
 (50) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge/Endurance

Level 30:    Boxing    
 (A) Empty

Level 32:    Abyssal Empowerment    
 (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 35:    Entangling Aura    
 (A) Lockdown - Chance for +2 Mag Hold
 (43) Unbreakable Constraint - Chance for Smashing Damage
 (43) Unbreakable Constraint - Endurance/Hold
 (43) Unbreakable Constraint - Hold/Recharge
 (46) Unbreakable Constraint - Accuracy/Hold/Recharge
 (46) Unbreakable Constraint - Hold

Level 38:    Overgrowth    
 (A) Rectified Reticle - To Hit Buff/Recharge
 (39) Rectified Reticle - To Hit Buff
 (39) Recharge Reduction IO
 (45) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 41:    Scorpion Shield    
 (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
 (45) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance
 (45) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance/Recharge

Level 44:    Tough    
 (A) Gladiator's Armor - TP Protection +3% Def (All)
 (46) Gladiator's Armor - End/Resist
 (48) Gladiator's Armor - Resistance/Rech/End

Level 47:    Weave    
 (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
 (48) Shield Wall - +Res (Teleportation), +5% Res (All)
 (48) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance
 (50) Shield Wall - Defense/Endurance/Recharge
 (50) Shield Wall - Endurance/Recharge

Level 49:    Power Boost    
 (A) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 1:    Brawl    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Dash    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Slide    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Quick    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Rush    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Prestige Power Surge    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Sprint    
 (A) Empty

Level 1:    Supremacy    
Level 2:    Rest    
 (A) Empty

Level 4:    Ninja Run    
Level 2:    Swift    
 (A) Run Speed IO

Level 2:    Health    
 (A) Numina's Convalesence - +Regeneration/+Recovery
 (13) Miracle - +Recovery

Level 2:    Hurdle    
 (A) Jumping IO

Level 2:    Stamina    
 (A) Endurance Modification IO
 (13) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End

Level 0:    Freedom Phalanx Reserve    
Level 0:    Portal Jockey    
Level 0:    Task Force Commander    
Level 0:    The Atlas Medallion    
Level 0:    Ember Shield Owner    
Level 0:    Ember Shield    
Level 50:    Resilient Radial Paragon    
Level 50:    Barrier Core Epiphany    
Level 50:    Melee Radial Embodiment    
Level 50:    Reactive Radial Flawless Interface    
Level 50:    Void Radial Final Judgement    

 

------------

| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build |
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
|MxDz;1623;759;1518;HEX;|
|78DA6594CB4F135114C6EFB453A0A59596527915FAE04D69690559AAC843506B9A8|
|0A80B432A4C71A4B44D698D2C5DB8F0115D0282CA5FE09AE8D6E77F60D4951B4505|
|59881A37783ADF091DD349C8EFF4BBE79EF39D7B6788DE18B63E3D75F3B890EC43C|
|9F8E2E27434BE9853B20B6A6AD6148DCFA933821E572C9BBE9E9E57BCC3CA423AE5|
|0D9E8BE7F259A59C567CC5F4E989FC02AD86B41CFEA1A6E63CBA8C93F9442284CDD|
|38389849A52734BC2124BA793A1898CA2CC566BE1A4925432E96C2E9E53D3298726|
|45E32935934F6A8A4D5346D5B9AB392AEF1EC9A833215D8F687C46E12196EAC8619|
|8FE56ED829F7D93D835081191856190790C944F3087C0B29FE0FB9683BD4234084D|
|5BA17A1234595A23749845D96A81B2A87888DF15CBF86D59016F531DA3843DC63DA|
|356E7D06FE61FD0FE8B594B894DB258A33E26EE6DF2A1F73A69E53C4BF967E45B6E|
|C16BF500B3BF40B3A839CAEC83FE813C98D9B7D98DBD879BC0BA66A6076CF0828FA|
|85F25F7ABBC28636D0A745F625E009BCF3327413F19B56166C916109A972EE65DF2|
|52C55EAA7CFF7B69666F5EF6E2652F8FC98B037B0C8E4F06ED8C7C7B3817DF16CEB|
|9837A3AF9CC9C1F31F73DEAE5E2195CDBA8E5FB02B66C31BF32BF81ADDFF91CA85E|
|2DFBAC4DA29EF71AD8AA32E7C1F606CCF6847CD673BFFA37A8D3F19AF982F912EC7|
|AC57C0BDE21AF8DD82B353E43DDC826EE51222F4D3C5BD33E3D62833A7958F1F01B|
|729F2AF8B9BBFF2F4EA97B1C95BAC798236070149583C3E003DADB86BDC6B675D29|
|C66D1BE56204DC737D7C3DC24C39DB85D43A74BD2EAF5D8994ED0488E039C133882|
|098311B0370CCA9413E22F23C4757ACF70CE281819678E813B567CD985B9C301CCE|
|D96755FAA763ADD254AB8448994287D254A7F8972B644891695FD987CF0FF4148DA|
|AA99EEC9C8ABDB165A95783508EF3F8A9A244DE10CACA725ED8DDED1E777227F579|
|FEFC57D589771A7318BE64AEB755917C775F1155D3CE02854419CB517631BBDF611|
|CED97016E3E7FE62FC4EA7F7D450CC7BFF019A0818B9|
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|

Edited September 30, 2019 by SmalltalkJava

[Dr Causality]

3 hours ago, SmalltalkJava said:

That would be nice,  but i'm not sure how i can fit it in.  

Yeah that's the struggle.    The Tankermind Nature builds are hungry.    I'd like to choose from 5 or maybe more powerpool.  There are no Nature powers I want to drop.  But I also like a bunch of Epic Powers.   Demon's makes it more challenging because you get an extra pet power (Hell on Earth), and the attacks are actually good due to -Res.  

[Dr Causality]

8 hours ago, SmalltalkJava said:

Latest Revision: 

------------

| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build |
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
|MxDz;1623;759;1518;HEX;|
|78DA6594CB4F135114C6EFB453A0A59596527915FAE04D69690559AAC843506B9A8|
|0A80B432A4C71A4B44D698D2C5DB8F0115D0282CA5FE09AE8D6E77F60D4951B4505|
|59881A37783ADF091DD349C8EFF4BBE79EF39D7B6788DE18B63E3D75F3B890EC43C|
|9F8E2E27434BE9853B20B6A6AD6148DCFA933821E572C9BBE9E9E57BCC3CA423AE5|
|0D9E8BE7F259A59C567CC5F4E989FC02AD86B41CFEA1A6E63CBA8C93F9442284CDD|
|38389849A52734BC2124BA793A1898CA2CC566BE1A4925432E96C2E9E53D3298726|
|45E32935934F6A8A4D5346D5B9AB392AEF1EC9A833215D8F687C46E12196EAC8619|
|8FE56ED829F7D93D835081191856190790C944F3087C0B29FE0FB9683BD4234084D|
|5BA17A1234595A23749845D96A81B2A87888DF15CBF86D59016F531DA3843DC63DA|
|356E7D06FE61FD0FE8B594B894DB258A33E26EE6DF2A1F73A69E53C4BF967E45B6E|
|C16BF500B3BF40B3A839CAEC83FE813C98D9B7D98DBD879BC0BA66A6076CF0828FA|
|85F25F7ABBC28636D0A745F625E009BCF3327413F19B56166C916109A972EE65DF2|
|52C55EAA7CFF7B69666F5EF6E2652F8FC98B037B0C8E4F06ED8C7C7B3817DF16CEB|
|9837A3AF9CC9C1F31F73DEAE5E2195CDBA8E5FB02B66C31BF32BF81ADDFF91CA85E|
|2DFBAC4DA29EF71AD8AA32E7C1F606CCF6847CD673BFFA37A8D3F19AF982F912EC7|
|AC57C0BDE21AF8DD82B353E43DDC826EE51222F4D3C5BD33E3D62833A7958F1F01B|
|729F2AF8B9BBFF2F4EA97B1C95BAC798236070149583C3E003DADB86BDC6B675D29|
|C66D1BE56204DC737D7C3DC24C39DB85D43A74BD2EAF5D8994ED0488E039C133882|
|098311B0370CCA9413E22F23C4757ACF70CE281819678E813B567CD985B9C301CCE|
|D96755FAA763ADD254AB8448994287D254A7F8972B644891695FD987CF0FF4148DA|
|AA99EEC9C8ABDB165A95783508EF3F8A9A244DE10CACA725ED8DDED1E777227F579|
|FEFC57D589771A7318BE64AEB755917C775F1155D3CE02854419CB517631BBDF611|
|CED97016E3E7FE62FC4EA7F7D450CC7BFF019A0818B9|
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|

 

Got a chance to peek at this build during lunch.     Interesting.   So if I'm following, you're basically going all in on Absorb and Rech bonus slotting.   Alpha Resilience buffs your Resistance and Absorb.  Absorb is further buffed by Powerboost.  Then you're getting your Def from Barrier and the Incarnate Melee.      Is the idea that you can cycle between Barrier and then Wild Bastion's Absorb, so that one of the two mitigations should be up most of the time?     So far I've shied away from Hybrid Melee because being based on how many enemies in your radius it doesn't off much help with lone AV's when you most need the buffs.      

 

Anyway, how is this build working out for you?

[SmalltalkJava]

Truthfully,  it works really damn good.     However, I don't have that exact build at the moment.  But it is really close.   I also don't have the incarnates yet.   I'm in the process of deciding on which /Nature i want to push through incarnates.  So far I'm leaning towards Beasts.   Since they are always melee it leads to less work, and to my surprise their single target damage was better than Demons.  Demons was faster at Aoe groups.  At least during my tests.  Beasts does have the trade off of 10-15 less resists for the MM.  I can take down a pylon with little to no effort and also farm the PI portal missions at +3x8.  I haven't tried +4 since i'm not level shifted.      I've been doing experiments with /Nature without incarnates.   So far /Nature at least the way I play it, hinges 100% on the Absorb from Wild Bastion, and the damage bonus and endo redux from Overgrowth.    I find that when Bastion or Overgrowth is down,  even if just for a few seconds that I start watching their count down.   The Absorb is what rules the roost, it makes the pets soooooooooo much more survivable.   Every time Bastion is up you can more than double the T1 pets health.   All those times for other Masterminds and their pets get one shot.  It only happens on /Nature if Bastion is down.  For other seondaries, when their pets take a shot and loses half its life.  Mine still have some Absorb left!  I can't remember the exact numbers, but if a T1 pet has 574 health, and i put a 650 absorb on it :).   See what happens if your pet takes a 400 point hit vs an absorbed pet taking the same 400 point hit!

 

The devs gave the 2 big Nature buffs Wild Bastion, and Overgrowth giant long recharge rates.   So in order to really make Nature sing, you have to have lots and lots of recharge.   

 

I've never had Barrier, so I need to figure out how it tapers off.  Because I'm thinking that I might want to take Ageless so I can hopefully make Overgrowth perma and make Bastion come up even faster!  But i've never done Incarnate content so i have no frame of reference to say what is actually better between the two.