Guidance/Perspective

[Bellicose]

I have an Invul/Fire Tanker. I'm pretty pleased with him at level 50 with all of his Incarnate abilities unlocked and a full IO build. 

Recently, with all of the FotM talk going on, I decided to build an Invul/Super Strength Tanker. It's highly represented; and, I see them all the time.  I had always just chalked that up to being a very 'iconic' combination. Nevertheless, I powered through and now have one with all of his Incarnate abilities unlocked and a full IO build.  Regarding that IO build, I really went whole hog.  Got the IO sets that allowed me to reach soft cap Defense on all damage types. It's a nice build. 

Been playing him lately and got to Tank the Crimson Prototype, the AVs in the Miss Liberty TF, Apex/Tin Mage, etc.  Really impressive. I genuinely felt...Invulnerable.  That being said, I don't feel Super Strong. The damage feels middling at best. Only one real AoE attack.  All Smashing damage.  Just underwhelming.

So, am I missing something? Is SS a real gem and I'm not playing it right?

The idea has entered my head recently, that I could just pry all of these high dollar enhancement out of the SS Tank and throw them in a storage bin in the SG base. And then respec the Invul/Fire Tank and get the same great benefits of a high dollar build on a Tank whose damage is superior.

Am I missing something about Fire Melee? Is it not as good as it seems?

I would really like some perspective here.

[Coyote]

Super Strength generally works better with an armor set that has a damage aura (or both a damage aura and Burn, hehe), because it's main strength is its damage bonus... and you want that modifying as much of the character's powers as possible. And when paired with APPs that have AoE attacks, like for example Leviathan Mastery.... Arctic Breath goes up to 400+ damage with 5 damage procs in it, using Rage for +Acc and +Dam.

 

If you're not adding extra attack powers, especially AoE into the build, and you're only getting Rage's bonuses to improve Footstomp, then one of the main reasons that people play Super Strength is affecting fewer of your powers. Compare that to a Fire/SS with Fiery Aura, Burn, Bile Spray, and Arctic Breath... 5 AoE attacks with Footstomp (you do want that many, since the 4 clicks are all on 20+ second base recharges). Play that, and a SS character ends up doing loads of AoE damage. Play a pure Inv/SS, maybe with just Energy Torrent as an additional AoE damage power, and the character seems lacking in AoE.

[tellania]

close to what Coyote said,

Fire is more AOE, with SS only having footstomp (hand clap, which is rarely taken, is knock back and does zero damage.   Prime candidate for procs, otherwise skipable).

 

Silly question, are you running rage?   Base rage is 20% to-hit, and 80% damage bonus.   Super strength is pooper strength without it.   In fact, there are LOTS of rage discussions, due to this dependency.   Also, add in the rage crash, and you can waste a lot of attacks (or even die) from the crash itself.    I have an invul/ss, and its a beast in that she doesnt die, AOE can take a bit, as its a good AOE (plus rage damage), but as stated, all smashing damage.  

 

So, fire will kill faster (its fire, that what fire does).   SS will hit MORE often (due to rage +to hit), and single attacks should do more damage (esp bots, which dont like the smash).   AOE wise, footstomp is acceptable, but its not fire (but better aoe than dark melee, which is awesome in its own, but different, right).

 

Fire melee has no secondary effects.   SS has a hold (KO blow), footstomp (knock down), jab (stun), and even hand clap, which opens up a LOT of possible proc monster options.    Hold has 2 psi procs (plus the superior smashing proc), there is a psi taunt proc, etc.   Footstomp can have the tanker IO procs (I put my +res in there, get 2-3 stacks easily), force feedback +rech proc, etc.

 

In short: fire melee better at aoe, SS better at hitting and single target damage.   SS has more proc options.

 

Also, check out the tanker discussion on beta.    There is a possibility tanker damage may be increased, and AOE's will be increased (# targets, cone width, etc).   This may tilt it to fire melee option.   Worth checking out.

 

[Call Me Awesome]

In my experience nothing FEELS stronger than Stone Melee, it hits like a truck (both the mob and, unfortunately, your blue bar).  Having never played SS I can't comment from experience but I have played WITH lots of SS tankers and I tend to agree with you on it's feel, if only from a secondhand perspective.

 

That said, there's a reason Fire is looked at as the high damage secondary; it doesn't have any secondary effects so it gets more damage and it will naturally kill faster.  I'm not at all surprised you find it's faster than SS, not only does it have the bonus damage but it also has a less resisted damage type.

[Sir Myshkin]

10 hours ago, Bellicose said:

I would really like some perspective here.

As others have mentioned, if you're not running/double stacking Rage, you'll definitely feel under powered as the set truly needs that ability to really stand function. You also want to get an additional AoE out of your Epic/Patron options (I highly recommend Gloom and Dark Obliteration as key components to a stronger-feeling attack cycle). Next to Titan Weapons, Super Strength is the second strongest attack set Tankers have access to from a raw-output (ST) perspective, but lacks some 'oompf' in the AoE side of things. If you really want those raw orange numbers to fly around, stick with a set that maximizes PBAoE/AoE/Cones to get that. There's plenty of sets that can offer you that utility, and if/when the Beta changes hit the Live, you'll find your general function as a Tanker go way up in performance on those abilities too.

[Hyperstrike]

That's the thing with Invuln.
You're basically an unbreakable rock.
You eat grenades like grapes and use nukes to get a tan.
But it doesn't really augment your damage output the way other Armor types do.
No damage aura (since they removed the ability to slot Taunt sets in Invincible).
So your kill speed is going to be lower than something like Fire/Dark/Elec/Rad.

You're essentially trading damage output for ungodly toughness.