A message from Raid Leaders

[Ruin Mage]

Hey everyone!

This is a general message from the raid leaders about some recent conduct. The origin of Everlasting TFs was to create a gathering spot for the content that has come from us today - that is, groups gathering to do iTrials and other content. In doing so, we hope to create and foster a community that is open and welcoming to as many people as possible. However, even that has its limits - for we do not tolerate things that are sexual in nature, hate speech, references to controversial real-world individuals or organizations, or sensitive current or historical events among many other things. More on this is that we do not tolerate or stand for those who are dishonest and disruptive towards our efforts to run the iTrials and other content. We strive to welcome new and old - so when we see people dishing harsh words towards other's accomplishments, it is a sign that one has forgotten where they are and what they are doing.

There have been a variety of other things going on that have caught our eye, but the point is - please do remember that ELTF seeks to welcome all sorts to our community. We're all here to play the same game, and none of us want to come home from work / school and see harassment, passive aggressive remarks, or crude if not unwanted jokes / commentary.  Please remember that Everlasting TFs seeks to welcome players of all levels of skill or experience.

All we ask is that you to be aware of your conduct.

If you have any questions or concerns, please feel free to reach out to one of the ELTF operators/raid leaders.

Edited June 16, 2020 by Shadeknight

[r0y]

Sounds reasonable; however, as long any censorship or tolerance limitations don't devolve into a "purity spiral" where we end up eating our own.

 

[Alimorel]

This post was partially written by looking back and forth to the Code of Conduct. Therefore, these are also rules that Homecoming itself has placed. However, it seems people need a reminder so that's what this is.

[Fortuneteller]

Couldn't this be summed up easier by just saying ''If you ain't talking about TF's in a TF channel then shut ur trap.''

[Breezehome]

18 minutes ago, r0y said:

Sounds reasonable; however, as long any censorship or tolerance limitations don't devolve into a "purity spiral" where we end up eating our own.

 

Already has

[Ruin Mage]

8 hours ago, Fortuneteller said:

Couldn't this be summed up easier by just saying ''If you ain't talking about TF's in a TF channel then shut ur trap.''

It's not about what happens in the ELTF channel. The stuff mentioned has happened in other mediums - tells and broadcast as major examples. Also, the summary would be more "Hey, Follow the Code of Conduct." The matter of what's talked about in a TF channel is something we can only do so much to control without being overbearing as operators of the channel.

 

 

8 hours ago, r0y said:

Sounds reasonable; however, as long any censorship or tolerance limitations don't devolve into a "purity spiral" where we end up eating our own.

 

The problem is that people are ignoring or forgetting the CoC - especially in Broadcast. 

People don't come to Hami Raids to see references to genocide or see sexual jokes. Especially in a game where there can and have been kids playing.

All we're asking is that people, if they truly must say this sort of stuff, do it among friends and not complete internet strangers.

Edited June 16, 2020 by Shadeknight

[Fortuneteller]

3 hours ago, Shadeknight said:

People don't come to Hami Raids to see references to genocide or see sexual jokes. Especially in a game where there can and have been kids playing.

All we're asking is that people, if they truly must say this sort of stuff, do it among friends and not complete internet strangers.

Crazy, can't say i've ever seen anything like that myself. But yeah what you're asking is pretty reasonable.

[Alimorel]

8 minutes ago, Fortuneteller said:

Crazy, can't say i've ever seen anything like that myself. But yeah what you're asking is pretty reasonable.

You would be shocked the kind of stuff I've screenshot that people have said at some things. Maybe disgusted even. It's been pretty bad.

[r0y]

26 minutes ago, Alimorel said:

You would be shocked the kind of stuff I've screenshot that people have said at some things. Maybe disgusted even. It's been pretty bad.

I can guarantee you that I will NOT be shocked at ANYTHING said in words across my screen on a video game.  I have seen some truly colossal ignorance and depraved stuff, but I was always taught that it is a personal weakness to let words get to you.  Guess they don't really teach that anymore.  In one ear, out the other, I say.  Just words.  You should know who you are.  If you don't, then it's not the censorship of speech that is going to help you.

 

Just my 2¢

[justicebeliever]

54 minutes ago, r0y said:

I can guarantee you that I will NOT be shocked at ANYTHING said in words across my screen on a video game.  I have seen some truly colossal ignorance and depraved stuff, but I was always taught that it is a personal weakness to let words get to you.  Guess they don't really teach that anymore.  In one ear, out the other, I say.  Just words.  You should know who you are.  If you don't, then it's not the censorship of speech that is going to help you.

 

Just my 2¢

I don't think it's too big an ask for people to follow the code of conduct.  Even free speech has it's limits.

[Alimorel]

Okay cool thats your personal opinion. You're free to think that, nothing wrong about that. However, as the leader of the global channel, Shadeknight has asked people to follow the rules that HC has laid out in the Code of Conduct (which you technically press agree to every time you sign in). Is it really that difficult to just hold your tongue in a public setting where you have been asked to? Please feel free to make those kinds of remarks in a private setting with your friends though. 

 

Edit: a reminder that free speech does not entitle someone to no consequences of their free speech. If you say something a majority of people think is bad or wrong, that will reflect back on the speaker's persona

Edited June 16, 2020 by Alimorel

[Ruin Mage]

r0y, this isn't some private medium where everyone is the same. Not everyone is open or free to any sort of topic. Some stuff also really should not be mentioned or brought up. I don't log into an MMO to see someone going "Let's ethnically cleanse these bad guys!" or seeing a sexual joke that's clearly not meant to be seen for children's eyes. It isn't a matter of thin skin or "personal weakness" that makes words get to you. It's a matter of, hey, being a decent human being and thinking before you type. You don't know the people on the other side of the screen - they're not your best buddies or long time friends. A lot of us are complete actual strangers, and it's neither fair nor appropriate for them to have to put up with this stuff at public events.

It's not that hard to be an actual person and consider others over yourself in regards to interactions. This isn't "my free speech" or "get a thicker skin" at all - its us asking for people to actually behave and be adults. It's not even remotely an adult thing to do to crack terrible references/jokes among a bunch of strangers - especially in a game, as I've mentioned, where people have their children playing. I also know that, even as someone who IS an adult, I don't go around enjoying things like "teehee sexual joke." during a Hami Raid (or in other places)

I also certainly do not enjoy hearing about references to a whole lot of other things that should not be said in public mediums. I could go on and on about examples, but frankly I'm not sure where to even begin. People have been ignorant of the Code of Conduct for long enough, and treating various channels as their own comedy hour - with some very deplorable and detestable things being said. Even the lightest stuff is getting to be too much - given what I'd consider "light."

The major reason I posted this is because myself & the other ELTF operators / raid leaders have gotten tired of this being a reoccurring thing. All we're asking is that people be decent.

Not that hard.

Edited June 16, 2020 by Shadeknight

[Alchemystic]

1 hour ago, r0y said:

I can guarantee you that I will NOT be shocked at ANYTHING said in words across my screen on a video game.  I have seen some truly colossal ignorance and depraved stuff, but I was always taught that it is a personal weakness to let words get to you.  Guess they don't really teach that anymore.  In one ear, out the other, I say.  Just words.  You should know who you are.  If you don't, then it's not the censorship of speech that is going to help you.

 

Just my 2¢

What's worse is when people are upset at people being upset at people.

[r0y]

11 minutes ago, Tyrannical said:

What's worse is when people are upset at people being upset at people.

I totally agree, I am shocked how easily some people get upset.  A better, more adult approach, would have been to just reiterate that no speech beyond what's required to form and run a TF/Trial/Raid should be used on the specific channel they set up.  I get that.  I try not to use user-created channels for communications beyond forming/running things.

 

In general, it seems that many people in this world are at a point in their life where almost everything is triggering for them.  However, even having a discussion about this seems verboten.  Lack of tolerance never ends well, and I just was hoping to delay the inevitable.

[Ruin Mage]

Roy, you're misreading what we're saying. It's getting straight up frustrating that you keep leaping to conclusions and misreading what has been typed.

We are showing a lack of tolerance towards stupid and inappropriate things being said during Hami Raids & other content. We are taking this step to ask people to remember that we're all a bunch of internet strangers - that what we've said as examples are not okay to be said - that's it. It is in the CODE OF CONDUCT to not say very specific things - a Code of Conduct which has gone ignored. This isn't being upset at "words", but being annoyed and fed up with people saying disgusting and disturbing things during our content runs. This isn't us getting "triggered." or any other excuse you want to try and make up. It shows a general ignorance if not outright blindness to brush what we've said off as that.

We cannot control that people want to talk about more than TFs in the ELTF channel. We'll gently remind people, but there's only so much we can/will do. Now, if it gets to the points brought up in this thread? Then we need to bring this up - that there are things not okay with being said either by us or by the rules of the server.

You're making it out to be something entirely different.

[Ironblade]

14 hours ago, Fortuneteller said:

Couldn't this be summed up easier by just saying ''If you ain't talking about TF's in a TF channel then shut ur trap.''

To be fair, in the absence of other specialized channels, this has become a 'group content' channel.  It's used to announce mothership raids, giant monster groups, etc.

[r0y]

This is becoming insufferable.  I'll be moving on.  I still hold to my ONLY statement (the one in which so many have replied as if it was something more):  I hope the requests for censorship does not devolve into a purity spiral.  Period.  That's all I said.  Obviously, wondering about the potential outcome of intolerance (whether it's "noble" or other) is an extremely sensitive thing.

 

Attack me if it makes you feel better, I am certain it won't, not in the long run anyway.  Have a good day.

[Alchemystic]

3 hours ago, r0y said:

it is a personal weakness to let words get to you. 

11 minutes ago, r0y said:

This is becoming insufferable.  I'll be moving on. 

 

 

[r0y]

4 minutes ago, Tyrannical said:

3 hours ago, r0y said:

it is a personal weakness to let words get to you. 

16 minutes ago, r0y said:

This is becoming insufferable.  I'll be moving on. 

 

1)  Context:  "I have seen some truly colossal ignorance and depraved stuff, but I was always taught that it is a personal weakness to let words get to you."

2)  Understanding definitions of words.
3)  Lol, you only have a meme for a reply.

[Alchemystic]

23 minutes ago, r0y said:

I'll be moving on.

[AerialAssault]

The slippery slope must be a sheer drop if you think "please be a decent human being" could lead to "all no-no words are verboten".

 

It costs nothing to be nice, it takes effort to be a jerk.

[Attu]

Heh, I just found out who's driving all of this.  It's mildly funny actually as they do very little in the game as it is.  They can't be spending that much time in the channel.

[Ruin Mage]

You'll have to elaborate, for I am the confuse.

[MsSmart]

Hi:

 

     I have to agree with the poster's thoughts, folks from all walks of life come to play here, and from all ages as well; as a whole we all come to have fun and often to escape the horrors of reality.

 

    So I second the spirit of this post, and hope for all of us to honestly try to make everlasting TF channel a wholesome place for folks to come together, be friends and have a good time

 

Sue

 

[The Mojo]

2 hours ago, Attu said:

Heh, I just found out who's driving all of this.  It's mildly funny actually as they do very little in the game as it is.  They can't be spending that much time in the channel.

 

22 hours ago, Shadeknight said:

Hey everyone!

This is a general message from the raid leaders about some recent conduct. 

You goof.