Solo LRSF as a MM?

[Arbegla]

Do ya'll think its possible? What would be the best sets to even attempt?

[Purrfekshawn]

4 hours ago, Arbegla said:

Do ya'll think its possible? What would be the best sets to even attempt?

Traps, so AV's won't marathonn run away.

[TheSpiritFox]

4 hours ago, Purrfekshawn said:

Traps, so AV's won't marathonn run away.

Traps can't mitigate enough damage to survive +3 AVs at once even with aid pool, can you manage to only aggro them one at a time?

 

Demons/nature would stand a chance. Its a generally solid choice for TF soloing especially fully incarnated. Barrier core, support core, and maybe have the -tohit radial on standby if you really need it to keep yourself and your pets alive. 

Edited December 25, 2020 by TheSpiritFox

[Arbegla]

1 hour ago, TheSpiritFox said:

Traps can't mitigate enough damage to survive +3 AVs at once even with aid pool, can you manage to only aggro them one at a time?

Why couldn't traps mitigate enough damage? Seeker drones to take aggro, plus the -dmg/-tohit and double/triple triage (plus Rebirth?)

[TheSpiritFox]

5 hours ago, Arbegla said:

Why couldn't traps mitigate enough damage? Seeker drones to take aggro, plus the -dmg/-tohit and double/triple triage (plus Rebirth?)

The -damage and -tohit of seekers don't do much to AVs with AV resistances even if they're -2 to you cause incarnate shift and -1x1. One AV is perfectly tankable, two AVs is difficult, 3 or more is more incoming damage than you can mitigate with a traps build as traps is more a damage force multiplier than a defense heavy set. It softcaps your pets, but thugs being the overall toughest option with traps being able to fit the pet uniques still leaves you with the ability to have minions one shot and Lts 2 shot, and your bruiser won't survive 3 AVs long either if he manages to draw all their aggro. 

 

Double triage helps, but against AV level enemies not enough considering plenty of AVs can one or two shot your pets. You get a bad set of attack rolls (for you) and the attacks slip through and you're toast, take a defense debuff and your entire set of pets can cascade fail very quickly. If you can aggro them only one or two at a time you can pick them off easily, but I think you can end up with 5 avs on you in LRSF? If you get 5 avs on you at once you're toast, there's just no way for a traps mm to tank that much incoming damage for long. 

 

Lastly, against multiple AVs you really have to focus fire, having pets on defensive randomly attacking things is not going to focus your single target enough to actually grind them down even with poison trap. And focus firing the pets removes bodyguard, leaving you open to getting one shot yourself. Tankerminding won't help, unless there's only one av for the pets to focus on. Splitting your pets among 3 avs means none of them are ever going to die, you have to attack command them and be safe from getting randomly blasted. 

 

I'm not saying its mathematically impossible, but that's why I asked if you can isolate one AV at a time you can easily solo LRSF, if the AVs aggro together as a group you're probably fucked unless you get super lucky or are prepared to die a bunch trying to succeed waiting to get lucky enough to focus fire and not get one shot, not have pets cascade, etc. 

 

Same way, rebirth helps but it's on a long cooldown. It's an emergency button, not reliable healing. 

 

If I were going to solo LRSF I'd go straight for demons/nature and probably take wide area web grenade with as much recharge as possible to try to web avs in place. Demons/nature has the buffs and debuffs to kill avs (a bit slower than traps) but is way, way, way tankier than any traps build can ever be thanks to the massive amount of aoe heals. 

Edited December 25, 2020 by TheSpiritFox

[Arbegla]

On 12/25/2020 at 4:56 PM, TheSpiritFox said:

 

Call me crazy, but isn't -damage unresisted?

https://archive.paragonwiki.com/wiki/Archvillain_Resistance

[Frosticus]

4 hours ago, Arbegla said:

Call me crazy, but isn't -damage unresisted?

https://archive.paragonwiki.com/wiki/Archvillain_Resistance

It is only impacted by the purple patch and any resistances the target has.

Builds with lots of -damage can cripple most AV's and still take a lot of the wind out of their sails at +3.

 

What out for resistance based god modes though!

[TheSpiritFox]

1 hour ago, Arbegla said:

Call me crazy, but isn't -damage unresisted?

https://archive.paragonwiki.com/wiki/Archvillain_Resistance

Its not gonna do enough.  Like said above, purple patch cuts it in half. You gotta have a bunch of recharge to keep the debuff up and adding essentially like 10% resistance to your pets. Thats not enough to stop the T1s from getting one shot and the T2s from getting 2 shot, the bruiser is the only one it will make much difference on. 3x avs with av aoe? Your pets can't tank that and neither can you as /traps. 

 

I'm thinking I'm gonna have to test this out now and see if you can separate the AVs or not. 

[nihilii]

I'd second Demons/ if only because it's relatively easy to build a 200+ DPS attack chain without pets. If you can deal 200+ DPS straight, you can beat level 53 AVs.

You can separate the LRSF AVs. Single pulls are pretty hard, but duo/trio pulls are relatively easy.

 

Numina will often come alone in the sky. And if you can fight in flight, you only have Citadel and Positron to deal with together. Only Numina, Citadel, Positron and BAB can reach the globe - so if you took the first 3 in flight, you can fight BAB alone on the globe. Then you're down to Penny, Manticore and Synapse. They link pretty well, but if your build allows for jousting, you can easily use Synapse's speed against him by hitting, moving back, hitting, moving back, so the other two AVs can never quite keep up.

[Arbegla]

What about bots/traps?

 

I say this having face-tanked both the 'Future Freedom Phalanx" (Manticore, numina, babs, and Sister Psyche) and the Vindicators (swan, luminary, mynx, Valkyrie) in the LRSF without a single death as bot/traps.

 

Seeker drones, Electrifying Fences, and triple acid mortar does amazing things to make AVs fall like tissue paper. Put the -res proc in Caltrops, and it gives you even more -resistance, (and thus boost the -damage from seekers, which the protector bots have as well) The triage beacon slotted with with +hp panacea proc gives you a pseudo Heal over Time power (especially double stacked) and the Force Field Generator gives your mez protection, which /nature doesn't have outside of breakfrees.

  Also, the purple patch doesn't affect -damage. The only thing that affects -damage is +resistance (i/e, high lethal resistance resists  lethal -damage). @arcanaville would know more, but from my understanding -damage is only resisted by resistance (and -resistance is only diminished by +resistance powers, but still gives you the estimated damage boost you'd expect.. i/e -20 resistance increases your damage by 20%)

[Arbegla]

And using that same bot/traps character, I just soloed the New Praetorians (Mr. Gs arc) all as AVs.... face tanking

[nihilii]

10 hours ago, Arbegla said:

Also, the purple patch doesn't affect -damage.

You're probably thinking of the AV purple triangles. The purple patch (level++) definitely affects your damage debuffs.

 

This is mostly irrelevant against anything before the final mission, as they're level 50 or level 51. Actually, the purple patch improves your damage debuffs against level 50s, thanks to the alpha slot level shift. You're considered +1 to them.

In the final mission, AVs are at least level 53 which is like fighting +2s after level shift. Your damage debuffs have 80% effectiveness there.