4Star Aeon Complete Off-Meta Restricted Run -- Regular builds, no top powersets

[Projector]

TLDR; You can do any 4star with the right roles. Roles will always matter more than builds. IMO, it just makes it take longer, but doesn't really make it more interesting. 

Hey everyone,

 

With the growing talk around procs, 4star builds, and what is and isn't possible, I decided to record a run of Aeon that would specifically avoid all of the meta sets and would only utilize general PVE builds. Here was the specific ruleset:

 

• No Kinetics, Nature, or Cold Domination
• No Ice Blast, Fire Blast, Fire Melee, or Battle Axe
• No Bio Armor or Rad Armor
• No 4star optimized builds, only general PVE builds (my Rad/Rad Corrupter had only 2-3 additional procs that weren't already included in an IO set (like a Glad Javelin Toxic Damage+5 Apocalypses in Proton Volley).
• No prep like respecs or acquiring additional accolades beyond what a toon already has
• T4 incarnates were obviously allowed because Hardmode was designed specifically with them in mind
• I also did not seek any specific powerset combinations other than that I did want an Electric Affinity. Otherwise, I just said I needed roles filled (like debuff, buffs, taunt, etc.) and this is what people had.

Here's the video of the run with gameplay audio only: 

• Rad/Rad Corruptor (Barrier) ME!
• AR/FF Corruptor (Barrier)
• FF/AR Defender (Incan)
• Psi/Time Corruptor (Barrier)
• Grav/Elec Affinity Controller (Clarion)
• Stone/Stone Tanker (Barrier for missions 1-2, Ageless for the rest of the TF)
• Energy/Elec Blaster (Barrier) Trick Arrow/Electric Defender (Barrier)

Here is the biggest takeaway that I hope people get from this:

 

Those who advocate for 4star builds aren't being elitist, nor are they saying it's impossible without said builds. In fact, I've never heard anyone seriously claim that. The closest I hear is that it's just not worth the time it takes to do it with regular builds (I'm inclined to agree).

The 4* builds are not about being the only way to succeed, but they ARE about EFFICIENCY and SPEED, and honestly they do make things easier. There's a reason people don't do Shadow Shard TFs a lot. Not everyone has 2 hours to spend on one type of content. It's also horribly inefficient if you're trying to get as many DSyncs and HOs as possible to fund your altitis.

This was not a hard run at all. None of us were even worried about difficulty at all. We were chillin and having casual conversation throughout most of this and joking about things like putting detention field on the Brickernauts (particularly hilarious moment of this at 55:00 when we can't kill literally the last Boomer we need to move to the next area).  

In reality, 4star builds mainly make these easier and more casual. 4star builds also enable specific strategies that would actually be impossible without the time saved by killing things faster. In Mission 3 of the ITF, the time saved by the increased DPS means that if everyone survives, you can actually have your Lores out for Romulus, Requiem, the Phalanx Computer, the giant robots, Vandal, and all of the Generals. It makes all of those fights much easier.

I've completed the Vanguard fight in less than 2 minutes flat with an optimized team. I know of other teams that have taken down Dra'Gon/K'ong in less than 3 minutes. But this run took us more than that to kill only Hero 1.

In my opinion, sitting there for 5 minutes chipping away at Hero 1 isn't interesting gameplay and there is no challenge. Once you are standing in the right spot, you just keep cycling your attacks until he dies. In that same vein, I hate how long it takes to defeat U'Kon Grai in a standard MSR now after the Page 7 GM changes. Not only is this not interesting to me, but I've also been experiencing several nerve/muscle issues in my arms (so I prob shouldn't make these long posts), limiting my play time and making me miss out on things I would like to do. With that limited play time, I want to experience as much as possible, so doing things efficiently is really valuable to me to minimize the physical impact to my body.
 

Here are a few other takeaways I hope people get from this:

1. There is one specific build requirement that you need to keep in mind for all 4-star content--whoever is tanking needs to have a minimum of 2,400 HP. I thought this was just a best practice, but as our tank discovered and was shocked by, Hero 1 and Mr. Rodney were both hitting him casually for ~2,300 damage through full defense and resist cap from Barriers. So, if you want to tank 4star content seriously, get yourself more HP.

2. Your roles matter more than your powersets. While the roles can overlap, here is what you need:

• 2 Defense buffs
• 2 AoE healers (kin and nature/elec affin are the best options),
• 1 Taunt,
• 2 debuffers (prioritize -regen, and -res, with -heal being equal priority for Romulus in ITF and Dra'Gon/K'ong in LGTF.)
• 2 DPS
   

You can immediately see in that role list why Cold Domination is so good--you get AoE key stat debuffs, You get def buffs for your team, you get an additional source of end recovery, and you get high DPS with ice blast. One Ice/Cold fills 3 different roles simultaneously, making it much more valuable than just a single toon. This is also why Thermal just isn't as good--Resistance buffs are not as helpful, because, obviously, attacks that don't hit you will always do less damage than the ones that do. 

A typical, meta 4star run with powersets is: 
 

• Bio/BA Tank or Bio/BA Scrapper (though, admittedly, anything with high regen and an absorb is good here. I've even tanked all the 4* TFs on my shield/BA Tank)
• 3 Ice/Cold Corrs
• 2 Ice/Fire or Fire/Fire Blasters
• 1 Ice/Kin
• 1 Ice/Nature
   

The reason Ice is so good, beyond just what procs it can take and the versatility of the various powers, is that it also gives you another beautiful advantage: You can control when enemies die. Instead of relying on sudden bursts of damage from Inferno, stacking Blizzards allows things to die at a slow enough rate that you can track them and adjust your positioning accordingly to avoid things like Nullification fields.
 

For my next demonstration, I suspect that regular builds could actually beat the Omega K'ong fight, given you have 25 minutes to do it. I did a run a few weeks ago where we had all the meta power sets, but only myself on a Kin and our Nature were 4-star optimized builds. We completed the TF, but failed the K'ong fight, but our strategy did not include stacking Dra'Gon and K'ong whenever the gas was down to double up the DPS+debuffs, so we could not overcome Dra'Gon's second heal. We were basically stuck with Dra'Gon at a little under half-HP until the time ran out.

Again, I think we will be successful, but I don't think the fight will be any harder, I just think it will take longer. The only risk there is that there are more chances to mess up a barrier call, get your positioning wrong, get caught by a stray shot, etc. That's really it though. The fight isn't any harder or more complex, it's just...slower.

Hope you enjoyed this and thanks for coming to my TED Talk.
What are your thoughts?
 

Edited July 2 by Projector
Fix Video Link

[Glacier Peak]

This is a well-written post. I appreciate the video as well and have followed your continued uploads. It's exactly what players need to read to know that this Advanced Difficulty (Hardmode) content is not out of reach and doesn't require specific Archetypes or builds. Only when players want to complete these efficiently (meaning quickly and with minimal defeats) does optimization of Archetype and builds become common place, though again as you point out, still not mandatory. 

 

I think you should post a shorter post linking to this thread in the general discussion section because the forum community doesn't traffic through this section very much yet (newest sub forum on this website).

 

And to add a personal anecdote, I've been running Advanced Difficulty badge runs on Indomitable and used your walk through of the Lady Grey Task Force to assist in leading and navigating (especially that last part in the final mission). Thanks for posting!

[Lunar Ronin]

I tend to agree on the "just a carry" portion, for sure. The problem with this comes in the fact that many people have been the carry in a 4* team, but did not think they were being carried, so you hear things like, "Yeah, I did a 4* on my regular slotted blaster with no problem! You don't need 4* builds or anything"

 

 

So yes, you can play anything on a 4* run, provided you have 6-7 other people that are all optimized and willing to carry you through it. Though, at that point you're basically just a walking Barrier user and that's about it.

 

 

1 hour ago, Projector said:

TLDR; You can do any 4star with the right roles. Roles will always matter more than builds. IMO, it just makes it take longer, but doesn't really make it more interesting. 

What are your thoughts?

 

 

First you said that a month ago that anyone who isn't using a meta build on a 4* advanced mode is a carry.  Now you're saying that roles matter more than builds, and 4* advanced modes can be done with regular builds.  Which is it?

[Spaghetti Betty]

What a great little experiment! I will admit that Aeon isn't my favorite SF, and I prefer to get it over with pretty quickly. There also isn't much point to grinding the hell out of 4* ASF since MDCs are no longer allowed in missions (unless?).

 

Also, I would definitely still consider it the Intro to Hard Mode. Outside of the optional Vanguard fight, nothing is especially demanding and can be completed by any team full of IO'd/T4'd toons and a bit of brainpower.

 

But, as you said, it really is down to how long one wishes to take to complete the run when it comes down to optimization. If this takes longer than an hour, I start getting cranky!

[Projector]

4 hours ago, Spaghetti Betty said:

(unless?).

Check most of my Lady Grey videos. Basically, go next to a mission door, click to summon your pet, and then immediately click the door so you enter while the animation is happening. The dummies will follow you inside, and so will the MDC 😉 

[Spaghetti Betty]

2 hours ago, Projector said:

Check most of my Lady Grey videos. Basically, go next to a mission door, click to summon your pet, and then immediately click the door so you enter while the animation is happening. The dummies will follow you inside, and so will the MDC 😉 

Yes, I know. 🤭 I was being a rascal!

[Projector]

13 hours ago, Lunar Ronin said:

First you said that a month ago that anyone who isn't using a meta build on a 4* advanced mode is a carry.  Now you're saying that roles matter more than builds, and 4* advanced modes can be done with regular builds.  Which is it?

Let me clarify a couple of things:

1. "Anyone who isn't using a meta build is a carry." I mean that, specifically, one player is getting carried.If all 7 other people are using meta builds, the 8th person will likely get carried through and not contribute much. So, I've taken an 8th man who doesn't have a proper build or not really done 4star content at all through Omega Kong 2-3 times now, and other times we've completed the Omega Kong fight even after someone DCd. That's how strong the 7 meta builds are. The 8th man really matters more for helping with barrier rotations or using Clarion or Ageless in that situation. This is also how you can easily carry Masterminds and Sentinels through 4star content. Because things like Ice/Cold corruptors fill multiple roles, the 8th man can be whatever and it doesn't matter.

As I said in a prior post, it's like being a lowbie on a +4x8 KM ITF, You'll be there, but you'll be doing far less than the 50s on your team, and you won't be able to finish without them doing most of the work. 

The other example in this context would be a total new player doing a speed ITF. Even if they have a proper build but have never done a speed ITF, they'll be lost, and they won't contribute much, relying on their team to do most of the work and TP them around.

2. "The roles matter more than the builds." They do.  As long as you have the proper roles filled and people are using their powers correctly, you should be able to complete the task forces. It will be slower, but you can do it. If you're the person bringing a weaker build, you'll be contributing less to each fight. That's literally just how the math works out in terms of damage and tohit calculations, etc. And if everyone is bringing non-4star builds, then you cannot afford to have someone not filling a role, period. If your whole team is using regular pve builds, then the importance of EVERY player filling a proper role skyrockets.

So, everything I've said in prior posts is still true, but which is more relevant will largely depend on what team you are playing alongside, and what you specifically are bringing.

[Projector]

7 hours ago, Spaghetti Betty said:

Yes, I know. 🤭 I was being a rascal!

YOU SCALLYWAG!

[Projector]

14 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

This is a well-written post. I appreciate the video as well and have followed your continued uploads. It's exactly what players need to read to know that this Advanced Difficulty (Hardmode) content is not out of reach and doesn't require specific Archetypes or builds. Only when players want to complete these efficiently (meaning quickly and with minimal defeats) does optimization of Archetype and builds become common place, though again as you point out, still not mandatory. 

 

I think you should post a shorter post linking to this thread in the general discussion section because the forum community doesn't traffic through this section very much yet (newest sub forum on this website).

 

And to add a personal anecdote, I've been running Advanced Difficulty badge runs on Indomitable and used your walk through of the Lady Grey Task Force to assist in leading and navigating (especially that last part in the final mission). Thanks for posting!

Thanks for the advice. I've feel bad because I don't want to spam multiple forums just for visibility, and I figure if I start posting here, more people will start to use these sections as they fill with more content.

But I really like the idea of just linking here in another section just to help with the visibility. That's not the same thing as just copy/pasting a post, so I definitely feel better about that method!

[Projector]

@Cobalt Arachne Since you stopped by, I just wanted to say thank you for the hardmode content. For real. I have an entire new group of friends because of doing this content together with them, and it's given me a space I can also meaningfully contribute to in the game. Aside from the cool, unique, and more challenging gameplay, the kind of camaraderie it's provided has been wonderful during a really rough period in my life.

Also, and this is my favorite thing about 4* content: It brought Role-based teamplay back to City of Heroes. Playing through 4star content feels like the old days where I'd be on lowbie teams struggling through low level CoT Ruin Mages or original posi 1 and crying out that we desperately need a tank or a healer. With things like Barrier providing so much survivability across the board, everyone is left to focus on what their role actually does best. It's less about steamrolling and more about using your role's strengths to eliminate/neutralize key targets quickly. Aggro control is meaningful for tanks again, blasters get to really blast and enjoy all the orange numbers on their screen again. I think it's the most under-appreciated/under-recognized contribution that hardmode content has brought to the game.

[Cobalt Arachne]

4 minutes ago, Projector said:

thank you for the hardmode content

You are most welcome! 🙂Thanks to everyone who's played my stuff! 😄

It's been real great seeing players engaging with the advanced content, I'm glad they're an experience people can find fun with and enjoy together.

[Seed22]

It was very fun to run with you Projector through LGTF and Aeon 4*’s. My mind hasn’t changed on the nature of HMs and my main issue with them, but issues aside, it’s still pretty enjoyable if you’re playing with a group of neat folks.

 

[Projector]

 

On 9/17/2024 at 10:38 AM, Seed22 said:

It was very fun to run with you Projector through LGTF and Aeon 4*’s. My mind hasn’t changed on the nature of HMs and my main issue with them, but issues aside, it’s still pretty enjoyable if you’re playing with a group of neat folks.

 

Wait, who are you in game??? Curious to know which ones you've been on with me lol

[Laucianna]

Just seeing this post now and thought I should give my personal opinion as someone who only has 1 toon that is not meta 😄 

You may not like this but there is 100% a stigma about meta when it comes to Hard Mode communities, it's not a needed meta as you pointed out, but the people who run this tend to either require you to be on a meta toon (No matter the persons actually skill (I have heard stories of meta toons incanning into the green on LGTF)) Or you are a personality and close friends with the person running it. I am thankful to be the later as otherwise I wouldn't be wanted on any 4 star runs.

This isn't to say there is some magical solution to fix this, as it is hard content and leaders do not want it to take too long so will fill with meta players or their friends they know are okay at the game, and that is 100% up to them how they want to fill their teams and time but it does lead to an environment where you bring meta or be mates with the leader of the team ❤️

[Seed22]

4 hours ago, Projector said:

 

Wait, who are you in game??? Curious to know which ones you've been on with me lol

Thaumic Bifrost was me 😁

[Projector]

11 hours ago, Laucianna said:

Just seeing this post now and thought I should give my personal opinion as someone who only has 1 toon that is not meta 😄 
 

Yeah, but all your other toons are meta! 😛

You may not like this, but I was already well aware there was a stigma. 🙃 That's why this run happened in the first place.

As one of the leaders you are referring to, I agree with you. Both for RSI pain reasons and because it's fundamentally less tedious/repetitive, I prefer meta runs because the speed of them allows me to be more flexible with my day/schedule, and I can do more runs that include more people, on occasion. Meta doesn't guarantee short runs, of course, but it does raise the chances of shorter runs happening. Recently, I did a full meta run of Lady Grey that was only 15 minutes! We just hit that big fat red X button in the team window after wiping 4 times back-to-back in the Kong fight. Meta runs fail, too, especially since meta builds tend to already be a high-risk, high-reward, knifes-edge style of gameplay.

 

Legitimately, the run in this post was only fun because of who I was with, but there's a reason I've not done that kind of run again: it wasn't fun for me. That doesn't make it wrong, it just means I don't want to spend an hour and a half in an Aeon. Calling barriers every 25-30 seconds for over an hour is while also calling targets, giving instructions, and changing tactics on the fly as needed is exhausting. So yeah, if I can still do the content without having to do that, wonderful!

Part of why I did this off-meta run was twofold:

1. To show there's no significant difference other than time (also some known faster strategies have to be adjusted, such as dealing with Smelters directly at the Cauldron Champion if you have no one with access to rain powers). It's not really easier or harder, it's just....slower, and that's fine for people who want that, but I'm not in that category.
2. To demonstrate to people who do complain about the meta "elitism" that it's certainly possible and just fine to do these however you want. I know people who don't do barrier teams at all, I know people who do specific challenge runs, hell, I know one guy who tanked all of Lady Grey without any toggles or auto powers and only used Brawl for combat!

What I don't appreciate is people think the content is somehow gatekept from them because common leaders want meta. Or people who complain when I ask them to bring T4 incarnates to a 4* when that's literally the tier the content was developed around using. Nonetheless, anyone can walk up to Aeon, Imperious, or Lady Grey and select the 4* option--anyone. People seem to think the only solution to the meta elitism stigma is for the current leaders to change how they lead, when in reality the solution is more leaders that lead things in a variety of ways. 

And if the excuse is that they don't know how to lead them or don't know what to do on them...well, figure it out. There's 1-3star options to make the "figure it out" part even easier. That's what all the "meta" players had to do, and I've watched the strategy for Lady Grey evolve and evolve since its release. Pretty much all of my videos feel out of date now for it lol. 

And it's also not right for players to force their playstyle on a team they are not leading, so if I join a KM ITF and try and speed it, I'm in the wrong. If I join a speed ITF and hijack it by pulling all the mobs together or not helping the team because I want to fight ambushes, I'm in the wrong.

The other reason I've resorted to meta runs more often than not now is because I was, quite frankly, tired of people not showing up with their game face on. Picking roles they don't know how to do properly, but also not asking any questions or pretending they know what they are doing, getting offended when instructed to do something their role is supposed to do (like taunting Kong as the tank), sneaking random power sets when that wasn't what was asked for, etc. It's not just annoying, it's actually disrespectful to me and the team for people to behave that way, and I was done tolerating it. 

When I say "meta" or "experienced" that naturally encourages a more specific mindset when playing, and it has actually helped reduce the frequency of my runs turning into dumpster fires, but it's also a lot on me when I have to micro-manage everyone else's role alongside all the normal shot-calling and still playing my role effectively. Not every run has to be a learning run, and it's even more aggravating when a run that isn't advertised as such ends up turning into one.

Also, it genuinely doesn't seem to matter what variety of runs I do because the second I advertise even one run as meta, the "elitist" accusations pop up. Hell, I have gotten flamed just for asking people to bring T4 Barrier Core, and that was literally all I asked them to bring. I've done countless runs including off-meta stuff, you watched me help someone literally learn how to build an incarnate power just before we started a run, I've led runs where I tank only using brawl, I've led the run in this post, I've led runs with countless off-meta stuff, yet still, the second I ask for a meta run, people's pent up frustration about meta gatekeeping gets thrown at me. That I know of, I've been one of the more inclusive consistent leaders when it comes to what I've allowed on runs. 

So, with that being the case, and knowing that even if I don't ask for meta builds or team comps, I'm still going to be called elitist just asking for what is literally the bare minimum (T4 Alpha/Destiny slot), then what's the point of trying to do something I actively don't want to do for people who are going to complain anyway?

I'd rather spend my time playing the game the way I enjoy playing it.

[Bionic_Flea]

I am glad that you are having fun running hardmode and you are free to run that or whatever you recruit under your rules -- you made it, so you get to call the shots.

 

But for me, after initially being excited about hardmode content and running Aeon and ITF many times, I have lost interest and only ran 4* LGTF a couple of times outside of some runs while it was on test server.  It's been months since I've done any hardmode content.  And the reason I have lost interest is because of the requirement that I have x or y powerset and t4 barrier. 

 

I have always loved that in this game you could just get a team together and run with whatever and succeed.  Incarnate stuff started the gate-keeping at requiring level 50 and then certain Incarnate slots.  And now the gate keeping has narrowed that further: level 50, incarnate slots slotted with these things and using these power sets and powers.

 

Again, I am not criticizing Projector or anyone that runs these.  Run what you want, how you want, and have fun!  You didn't set up the gates, the content did.

[Spaghetti Betty]

I can also chime in as someone who has done meta and (severely) off-meta runs in Hard Mode. Anyone familiar with EV knows that his schemes are borderline torture, and while satisfying to complete are not fast in the slightest. But, can a 4* ITF be done with 7 Blasters and a Kin? I can personally say yes, but you might want to clear your day for that one.

 

In comparison, a meta speedrun will clock in at sub-25 at the most optimal end and sub-45 with bad luck or a hodge podge team. Which run sounds more convenient?

 

Also, I'd like to request runs be scheduled at 3 am CST so that I may join! Thanks!

[Seed22]

6 hours ago, Bionic_Flea said:

I am glad that you are having fun running hardmode and you are free to run that or whatever you recruit under your rules -- you made it, so you get to call the shots.

 

But for me, after initially being excited about hardmode content and running Aeon and ITF many times, I have lost interest and only ran 4* LGTF a couple of times outside of some runs while it was on test server.  It's been months since I've done any hardmode content.  And the reason I have lost interest is because of the requirement that I have x or y powerset and t4 barrier. 

 

I have always loved that in this game you could just get a team together and run with whatever and succeed.  Incarnate stuff started the gate-keeping at requiring level 50 and then certain Incarnate slots.  And now the gate keeping has narrowed that further: level 50, incarnate slots slotted with these things and using these power sets and powers.

 

Again, I am not criticizing Projector or anyone that runs these.  Run what you want, how you want, and have fun!  You didn't set up the gates, the content did.

I can understand where you’re coming from, just like I definitely understand projector and can empathize as i have lead a good number of 3’s & 4’s. Its exhausting…just utterly exhausting. And why I don’t lead it anymore, that and what I am about to follow this up with is why.

 

The reason you see meta comps besides the efficiency it brings in time to complete, is also because of artificial difficulty. Some here may disagree with me  but after beating games where that shit doesn’t fly(Lies of P & Black Myth Wukong)and fair challenge is the name of the game, I just look more at what CoH HM is and go, “Yep! Got a good case of AD here”. 
 

It’s jacked up stat boost that, while not outright requiring meta comps, makes you notice and regret not doing so, as has even been attested to in this very thread. 
 

But thats not all. Barrier lets you ignore 100% of the difficulty of the HM content in ITF and Aeon,  and 99.9% in LGTF(can’t ignore suits and gas) . Ergo, my claim of artificial difficulty.

 

If in a game you can ignore the danger of a fight via an easily obtainable power or item, and there are minimal mechanics to counterplay but enemies are sacks of HP and stats, you have artificial difficulty.

 

While fun to run with certain people because it’s quick and efficient, HM is artificial difficulty incarnate. Which is my second reason why I don’t lead these anymore. And why I was on the way out of even running them to begin with(saw a discord invite for Elysian Guardians and ran a few with them. They seem very chill with it)

Edited Thursday at 10:43 PM by Seed22

[Projector]

7 hours ago, Spaghetti Betty said:

 

Also, I'd like to request runs be scheduled at 3 am CST so that I may join! Thanks!

I can make this happen for you, no problem

[Spaghetti Betty]

7 minutes ago, Projector said:

I can make this happen for you, no problem

You know where to find me!

[Lunar Ronin]

22 hours ago, Bionic_Flea said:

I am glad that you are having fun running hardmode and you are free to run that or whatever you recruit under your rules -- you made it, so you get to call the shots.

 

But for me, after initially being excited about hardmode content and running Aeon and ITF many times, I have lost interest and only ran 4* LGTF a couple of times outside of some runs while it was on test server.  It's been months since I've done any hardmode content.  And the reason I have lost interest is because of the requirement that I have x or y powerset and t4 barrier. 

 

I have always loved that in this game you could just get a team together and run with whatever and succeed.  Incarnate stuff started the gate-keeping at requiring level 50 and then certain Incarnate slots.  And now the gate keeping has narrowed that further: level 50, incarnate slots slotted with these things and using these power sets and powers.

 

Again, I am not criticizing Projector or anyone that runs these.  Run what you want, how you want, and have fun!  You didn't set up the gates, the content did.

I hear you.  I'll give a personal anecdote: I left Homecoming towards the end of 2022.  I was seriously burned out from both playing and leading content (including advanced modes), and I felt like I reached an impasse with the majority of the Homecoming player base, who seem to only care about speed, efficiency, and rewards.  Things I care little to not at all about.  I'm nearly 50 years old.  I don't care about speed at all.  Seriously, I don't.  I take the average of how long a piece of content should take without speeding it at all, and then I add an extra hour to that mentally to give myself time for it.  As long as we fall within that, I'm good.  I care about efficiency very little.  I care slightly about rewards, but only slightly.  Everything on Homecoming is very easy to come by, and I can get level 50 characters with top tier Hamidon origin enhancements, purple IO enhancements, winter IO enhancements, and everything else easily enough.

 

What I do care about is the experience, and taking in the content.  For me, skipping 80% of content and rushing it as quickly as possible is just not enjoyable.  At all.  I honestly feel cheated at the end of it.

 

When the NC deal was announced in January, I came back.  I formed my own group on the Indomitable shard, one dedicated to steamrolling/kill most content, not speed runs.  We've been doing pretty well.  A couple of friends I made in my new group both told me that they did Dr. Aeon SF speed runs with others, and hated it.  They are like me, and both felt cheated out of the experience.  So we did a (regular) Dr. Aeon SF steamroll/kill most.  It took roughly two hours and 20 minutes, but it was a blast!  We had a lot of fun.

 

My point is this: Not everyone enjoys speed running.  While most people who currently do advanced mode content are speed runners, there are some people who don't enjoy that and prefer to do things the long way.  Find them, and make your own team if you want to do advanced modes without meta character requirements.  Start with 1* or 2*, and work your way up if you're interested in doing that.  As said in this thread, 4* advanced modes can be done quite successfully with non-meta characters, it just takes longer.  Find people who are willing to put in the time.  They're out there. 

[Laucianna]

I can't say for certain but I think the "Elitism" comments mainly come from the simple fact of Advanced mode being the only content you really need set things for, the "hardest" raid in the game (Hamidon) doesn't require people to bring finished builds or x amount of blasters, hell if it was an entire league of level 45 sentinels I would still give it a shot 😄 So when people are used to 98% of the game being "Bring whatever" to suddenly being told "We need you to bring X or have X" they will see it as Elitist as Advanced mode is as close as the game is going to have to an Elitist mode (Outside of PvP which most people tend to ignore)

[Seed22]

I don’t have all day anymore to just dedicate to CoH like I did as a kid and don’t want to dedicate a good number of my recreational hours to the game either, so I don’t steamroll HMs.

 

But I do respect your perspective LR. It’s pretty cool you have a crew to run with! Hope that continues for you 🙂

[Seed22]

5 minutes ago, Laucianna said:

I can't say for certain but I think the "Elitism" comments mainly come from the simple fact of Advanced mode being the only content you really need set things for, the "hardest" raid in the game (Hamidon) doesn't require people to bring finished builds or x amount of blasters, hell if it was an entire league of level 45 sentinels I would still give it a shot 😄 So when people are used to 98% of the game being "Bring whatever" to suddenly being told "We need you to bring X or have X" they will see it as Elitist as Advanced mode is as close as the game is going to have to an Elitist mode (Outside of PvP which most people tend to ignore)

Elitism tends to get thrown around so much in this community that it leads me to believe its simply the person being salty they weren’t included and hoping by throwing out a buzzword they’d get others to agree with them and their wildly off base arguments.

 

 

Not always the case, but usually.