Thoughts on Making a Good Shield/ SJ Tank?

[Arnabas]

I have been trying to make a good Shield/ Street Justice Tank, but it just isn't working for me. I have 2 main issues: 

1. Even with Tough and Weave, Shield Defence feels squisher than almost any other defence set, and

2. This combo burns through Endurance much too fast, even with End reduction in every attack.

 

So, effectively, this combo is more "expensive" for less effect. At least in my experience.

I'm thinking about switching to a Brute or Scrapper, but that would probably be worse.

I'd appreciate some feedback on making this viable.

Edited June 22 by Arnabas

[Erratic1]

This should probably be in the Tanker forum but...

 

1. Shield is considered one of the top performing Defense sets, particularly for Scrappers, but defense works for any AT regardless, so it should be working plenty well on a Tanker. It has good DDR, boosts damage, but in exchange does not help you with endurance or healing as is the case with some other protection sets.
2. You will need to slot for endurance recovery, particularly if you are using IO sets. If not, you will definitely want to slot endurance cost reduction in your larger attacks. Short of IO sets, you will not be able to do much in the healing department.
3.  As a Tanker, you should be able to make some nice inroads on Resistance, particularly using the class ATO.

 

[Arnabas]

I admit to not being a numbers person and playing mostly by feel, but just in terms of gameplay, I have a Blaster (Psi/ Martial) who I take into melee on a regular basis, who is more survivable than my Shield tank, which seems odd.

I have End Reduction in all my attacks and some Shield powers. I have Stamina 3-slotted and I have Miracle: + Recovery in Health, but I still burn through Endurance and pop inspirations throughout every battle to keep from running out.

 

I am currently doing Pathogen's Warehouse with this character and struggling, but I can get through it easily with other characters, including Blasters and Controllers, who should be less durable.

Edited June 22 by Arnabas

[Riverdusk]

Shield is top tier....once you get your defense with it to softcaps (45+).  It also has very good DDR (especially if you double stack  active defense), so your defense tends to stay there, even through defense debuffs.  It also has a moderate amount of resistances (typically 30-60% to most everything on my scrappers).  I've played shield on a scrapper plenty and once I get the build done or even mostly done, it didn't feel squishy at all, and that's with a scrapper.  A tank should have much better numbers and better DDR.

 

However, before you get some good IO sets and get that defense where it needs to be, I can see it feeling squishy.  Don't see that as much different than any other defense set though, except maybe super reflexes where you can cap defense very early.

 

As to endurance there are a lot of ways to fix that issue.  The usual IO's (miracle, numina, panacea, performance shifter), end reduction slotting, SG base buff +recovery, epic pool +recovery powers, START temp powers, +end accolades, incarnates, etc.  Some of those are temps and some come late, but the trick is to use the temps early, and then you can drop the temps once you get the end powers.

 

One idea is to try it with dark melee, it synergizes very well and that combo is a bit of a known classic.

 

[Erratic1]

37 minutes ago, Arnabas said:

I admit to not being a numbers person and playing mostly by feel, but just in terms of gameplay, I have a Blaster (Psi/ Martial) who I take into melee on a regular basis, who is more survivable than my Shield tank, which seems odd.

 

Once you push towards 35+ Defense, you should start feeling increasingly safe. Deflection and Battle Agility slotted with 3 SOs, Toughness with Steadfast Protection: +3% Def, and Gladiator's Armor: +3% Def, and Weave with 3 SOs, you can reach 37% Defense, which should be pretty solid survivability unless you are upping your difficulty. Obviously, you can go a lot further with set IOs. 

[Biff Pow]

Do you have attacks slotted? I find sometimes when people complain about endurance on Tanks it's because they're barely doing any damage with their attacks. Or they're running Hasten when they don't really need it.

[Arnabas]

On 6/22/2025 at 12:35 AM, Biff Pow said:

Do you have attacks slotted? I find sometimes when people complain about endurance on Tanks it's because they're barely doing any damage with their attacks. Or they're running Hasten when they don't really need it.

No, I don't have Hasten on this guy. His attacks are slotted with Accuracy and End Red. 

[Championess]

I put the Entomb +absorb into Crushing Uppercut that has a high chance of adding an absorb if the old one had been chewed off.  Plus I have the Tanker one in Spinning Strike.  I'm getting 900 extra hp doing that along with the base hp I have already.  You're basically healing as you're punching when you have room for an absorb.

 

This is in addition to what others are saying to do as well.

Edited Monday at 08:46 PM by Championess

[Biff Pow]

My Shield/Justice Tank is just at level 35 right now, so don't consider me an expert, but my strategy has been six-slotting my attacks so I can use IO sets like Touch of Death and Mako's Bite for the positional defense. My defenses are around 38% right now, which I feel is pretty good for my level and that I don't use the Fighting Pool. For endurance I just have the Miracle +Recovery in Health, which makes a difference but I will get low if the fight goes long (like Freakshow with their healing/rezzing.) 

[Major_Decoy]

On 6/21/2025 at 8:48 PM, Arnabas said:

I admit to not being a numbers person and playing mostly by feel, but just in terms of gameplay, I have a Blaster (Psi/ Martial) who I take into melee on a regular basis, who is more survivable than my Shield tank, which seems odd.

I have End Reduction in all my attacks and some Shield powers. I have Stamina 3-slotted and I have Miracle: + Recovery in Health, but I still burn through Endurance and pop inspirations throughout every battle to keep from running out.

 

So, Pathogen's Warehouse, if I remember correctly, is 20-30 content. Even if you had a build goal you would be having trouble with stamina if you're doing this level appropriate. I think vahzilok tend to have smashing resistance and not lethal resistance, so Street Justice will be weaker.

 

When you say you have Stamina 3 slotted, is that 2 End Mod and 1 Power Shifter: Chance for +Endurance? Because that's definitely recommended slotting. If I only have room for two slots, I'll do performance shifter and 1 end mod.

 

I enjoy my build. I will not claim it is a great build, but it is pretty sturdy. There is definitely room for improvement, but it's not too expensive. 

 

The stats are shown without any procs active. I did not go with six slots of Superior Avalanche because when Shield Charge's knockback procs and Avalanche's knockback procs, enemies actually get knocked back.

 

Major Decoy - Hero Tanker
Build plan made with Mids Reborn v3.7.14 rev. 1
──────────────────────────────

• Primary powerset: Shield Defense
• Secondary powerset: Street Justice
• Pool powerset (#1): Fighting
• Pool powerset (#2): Leadership
• Pool powerset (#3): Concealment
• Pool powerset (#4): Fighting
• Epic powerset: Energy Mastery
  

──────────────────────────────

Powers taken:

Level 1: Deflection

• A: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• 3: Luck of the Gambler: Defense
• 3: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Endurance
• 5: Unbreakable Guard: Resistance
• 5: Unbreakable Guard: Resistance/Endurance
• 7: Unbreakable Guard: RechargeTime/Resistance
  

Level 1: Initial Strike

• A: Mako's Bite: Accuracy/Damage
• 7: Mako's Bite: Damage/Endurance
• 9: Mako's Bite: Damage/Recharge
• 9: Mako's Bite: Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
• 11: Mako's Bite: Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
• 11: Mako's Bite: Chance of Damage(Lethal)
  

Level 2: Battle Agility

• A: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• 13: Luck of the Gambler: Defense
• 13: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Endurance
  

Level 4: True Grit

• A: Steadfast Protection: Resistance/+Def 3%
• 21: Gladiator's Armor: TP Protection +3% Def (All)
• 23: Gladiator's Armor: Resistance
• 23: Preventive Medicine: Chance for +Absorb
• 25: Preventive Medicine: Heal
• 25: Invention: Healing
  

Level 6: Active Defense

• A: Invention: Recharge Reduction
• 27: Invention: Recharge Reduction
  

Level 8: Against All Odds

• A: Invention: Endurance Reduction
  

Level 10: Taunt

• (Empty)
  

Level 12: Phalanx Fighting

• A: Shield Wall: +Res (Teleportation), +5% Res (All)
• 27: Reactive Defenses: Scaling Resist Damage
  

Level 14: Kick

• (Empty)
  

Level 16: Tough

• A: Impervium Armor: Resistance/Endurance
• 29: Impervium Armor: Resistance/Recharge
• 29: Impervium Armor: Endurance/Recharge
• 42: Impervium Armor: Resistance/Endurance/Recharge
• 42: Impervium Armor: Resistance
• 42: Impervium Armor: Psionic Resistance
  

Level 18: Grant Cover

• A: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• 31: Luck of the Gambler: Defense
• 31: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Endurance
  

Level 20: Rib Cracker

• A: Superior Gauntleted Fist: Accuracy/Damage
• 31: Superior Gauntleted Fist: Damage/RechargeTime
• 33: Superior Gauntleted Fist: Accuracy/Damage/RechargeTime
• 33: Superior Gauntleted Fist: Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime
• 33: Superior Gauntleted Fist: Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime
• 34: Superior Gauntleted Fist: RechargeTime/+Absorb
  

Level 22: Weave

• A: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• 34: Luck of the Gambler: Defense
• 34: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Endurance
  

Level 24: Combat Readiness

• A: Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control: Chance for Build Up
  

Level 26: Shield Charge

• A: Superior Avalanche: Accuracy/Damage
• 36: Superior Avalanche: Damage/Endurance
• 36: Superior Avalanche: Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
• 36: Superior Avalanche: Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
• 37: Superior Avalanche: Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
• 37: Armageddon: Recharge/Accuracy
  

Level 28: Spinning Strike

• A: Superior Frozen Blast: Accuracy/Damage
• 37: Superior Frozen Blast: Damage/Endurance
• 39: Superior Frozen Blast: Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
• 39: Superior Frozen Blast: Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
• 39: Superior Frozen Blast: Damage/Endurance/Accuracy/RechargeTime
• 40: Superior Frozen Blast: Recharge/Chance for Immobilize
  

Level 30: Maneuvers

• A: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• 40: Luck of the Gambler: Defense
• 40: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Endurance
  

Level 32: One with the Shield

• A: Impervium Armor: Psionic Resistance
• 43: Unbreakable Guard: +Max HP
• 50: Aegis: Psionic/Status Resistance
  

Level 35: Shin Breaker

• A: Mako's Bite: Accuracy/Damage
• 43: Mako's Bite: Damage/Endurance
• 43: Mako's Bite: Damage/Recharge
• 45: Mako's Bite: Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
• 45: Mako's Bite: Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
• 45: Mako's Bite: Chance of Damage(Lethal)
  

Level 38: Crushing Uppercut

• A: Superior Might of the Tanker: Accuracy/Damage
• 46: Superior Might of the Tanker: Damage/Recharge
• 46: Superior Might of the Tanker: Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
• 46: Superior Might of the Tanker: Damage/Endurance/Recharge
• 48: Superior Might of the Tanker: Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
• 48: Superior Might of the Tanker: Recharge/Chance for +Res(All)
  

Level 41: Conserve Power

• A: Invention: Recharge Reduction
  

Level 44: Physical Perfection

• A: Performance Shifter: Chance for +End
• 48: Power Transfer: Chance to Heal Self
• 50: Numina's Convalesence: Heal
• 50: Numina's Convalesence: Heal/Endurance
  

Level 47: Tactics

• A: Invention: Endurance Reduction
  

Level 49: Vengeance

• A: Kismet: Accuracy +6%
  

──────────────────────────────

Inherents:

Level 1: Gauntlet

Level 1: Brawl

• (Empty)
  

Level 1: Sprint

• (Empty)
  

Level 2: Rest

• (Empty)
  

Level 2: Swift

• (Empty)
  

Level 2: Hurdle

• (Empty)
  

Level 2: Health

• A: Panacea: +Hit Points/Endurance
• 15: Numina's Convalesence: +Regeneration/+Recovery
• 15: Numina's Convalesence: Heal
• 17: Miracle: +Recovery
• 19: Regenerative Tissue: +Regeneration
  

Level 2: Stamina

• A: Performance Shifter: Chance for +End
• 17: Performance Shifter: EndMod
• 19: Power Transfer: EndMod
• 21: Power Transfer: Chance to Heal Self
  

Level 1: Combo Level 1

Level 1: Combo Level 2

Level 1: Combo Level 3

Level 1: Prestige Power Dash

• (Empty)
  

Level 1: Prestige Power Slide

• (Empty)
  

Level 1: Prestige Power Quick

• (Empty)
  

Level 1: Prestige Power Rush

• (Empty)
  

Level 1: Prestige Power Surge

• (Empty)
  

Level 4: Ninja Run

 

[FFFF]

On 6/21/2025 at 8:12 PM, Arnabas said:

I have been trying to make a good Shield/ Street Justice Tank, but it just isn't working for me. I have 2 main issues: 

1. Even with Tough and Weave, Shield Defence feels squisher than almost any other defence set, and

2. This combo burns through Endurance much too fast, even with End reduction in every attack.

 

So, effectively, this combo is more "expensive" for less effect. At least in my experience.

I'm thinking about switching to a Brute or Scrapper, but that would probably be worse.

I'd appreciate some feedback on making this viable.

 

I haven't played Shield/SJ but I've run into the same issues on an Invuln/SJ. The issue is that you don't have enough slots, and consequently, you don't do enough damage, which burns your endurance like crazy. I remember going against 3 even-con mobs and being completely out of endurance. I thought the character was borderline unplayable. 

 

What eventually helped were getting accolades that increased total endurance and some set bonuses that did the same. At the same time, sets like Multistrike (which has something like 80% end redx when 6-slotted) help a lot. 

 

I eventually got my tanker to 50 and then your alpha slot powers (Cardiac or Agility) fixes any lingering issues. 

Edited Wednesday at 04:41 AM by FFFF

[Nemu]

On 6/21/2025 at 11:48 PM, Arnabas said:

I admit to not being a numbers person and playing mostly by feel, but just in terms of gameplay, I have a Blaster (Psi/ Martial) who I take into melee on a regular basis, who is more survivable than my Shield tank, which seems odd.

I have End Reduction in all my attacks and some Shield powers. I have Stamina 3-slotted and I have Miracle: + Recovery in Health, but I still burn through Endurance and pop inspirations throughout every battle to keep from running out.

 

I am currently doing Pathogen's Warehouse with this character and struggling, but I can get through it easily with other characters, including Blasters and Controllers, who should be less durable.

You are learning an important lesson here.

 

When things die faster content feels easier. When things are locked down you can take your time and cruise to victory.

 

Early game tank experience sucks. You have too few attacks and the natural instinct when building a defensive AT is to take all armor picks and slot up your defenses. But even if you slot up your defenses early on you have nowhere near a complete toolkit to help you actually tank, which exacerbates the leveling situation where you don't have enough defenses nor do you have adequate offense to level at a good pace.

 

Nowadays I don't even bother adding slots to my armors before 5-6 slotting 3 attacks (for acc and damage, and then endurance reduction/recharge) on tanks (as a general rule, but there are exceptions, especially endurance granting powers). The base slot on armor toggles is just an endurance reduction. I start slotting my defenses more during my 20s and certainly go all in once I reach my 30s and have slots to spare.

 

During the early leveling process your increased bag of HP is your primary defense and the mantra during those levels is to kill the enemy before they kill you. Also if you are solo I run at -1/0, you get more xp via mission completion and story arc completion bonuses than killing higher con/tougher foes and wasting more time doing so.

[Biff Pow]

11 hours ago, Nemu said:

Nowadays I don't even bother adding slots to my armors before 5-6 slotting 3 attacks (for acc and damage, and then endurance reduction/recharge) on tanks (as a general rule, but there are exceptions, especially endurance granting powers). The base slot on armor toggles is just an endurance reduction. I start slotting my defenses more during my 20s and certainly go all in once I reach my 30s and have slots to spare.

 

This is especially true with Shield Defense, because it really doesn't need many slots beyond the two main +Def powers. True Grit can wait, Phalanx Fighting isn't very effected by enhancements (not at all when solo), Active Defense and Against All Odds don't even use any IO sets (except Taunt), etc. It's a good set to go all-in on offense.

[Arnabas]

On 6/25/2025 at 9:28 AM, Nemu said:

You are learning an important lesson here.

 

When things die faster content feels easier. When things are locked down you can take your time and cruise to victory.

 

Early game tank experience sucks. You have too few attacks and the natural instinct when building a defensive AT is to take all armor picks and slot up your defenses. But even if you slot up your defenses early on you have nowhere near a complete toolkit to help you actually tank, which exacerbates the leveling situation where you don't have enough defenses nor do you have adequate offense to level at a good pace.

 

Nowadays I don't even bother adding slots to my armors before 5-6 slotting 3 attacks (for acc and damage, and then endurance reduction/recharge) on tanks (as a general rule, but there are exceptions, especially endurance granting powers). The base slot on armor toggles is just an endurance reduction. I start slotting my defenses more during my 20s and certainly go all in once I reach my 30s and have slots to spare.

 

During the early leveling process your increased bag of HP is your primary defense and the mantra during those levels is to kill the enemy before they kill you. Also if you are solo I run at -1/0, you get more xp via mission completion and story arc completion bonuses than killing higher con/tougher foes and wasting more time doing so.

 

The thing is, I have played every AT and every powerset, often multiple versions of each. I have played from the launch of the live game until sundown, and again since its return, so I am pretty familiar with the gameplay of each AT. My point was that my Shield Defence Tanker was less survivable than any other Tanker or Brute that I've played, or even, as I pointed out, my Blapper, who has very little trouble staying mostly in melee.  Additionally, he went through End like crazy.

 

But someone made a comment about how SD is great, particularly for Scrappers, so I remade the character as a Scrapper. He performs significantly better now. He is more durable and uses less End, even though the Tank had End Reduction in every attack and the Scrapper has none at all. That seems odd to me, unless the powers have different End costs for different ATs. As I said, I don't really look at the numbers and play by feel, so I can't offer evidence to support that, but my Tank used to be gasping for breath after every fight, while my Scrapper can go through multiple groups before needing to rest or use Inspirations.

 

I think the other thing that I should point out is that many people seem to discuss what powers are good/ great from the POV of a level 50, fully-outfitted character. For some players, level 50 seems to be where the game begins, but for me, my level 50 characters are mostly semi-retired. I enjoy the journey to 50 more than actually getting there, so I judge powers based on their performance along that road.

 

Edited 17 hours ago by Arnabas

[Psyonico]

31 minutes ago, Arnabas said:

He performs significantly better now. He is more durable and uses less End, even though the Tank had End Reduction in every attack and the Scrapper has none at all.

Scrappers do more damage, therefore you use fewer attacks to defeat an enemy, therefore you use less endurance overall.

[Nemu]

6 hours ago, Arnabas said:

The thing is, I have played every AT and every powerset, often multiple versions of each. I have played from the launch of the live game until sundown, and again since its return, so I am pretty familiar with the gameplay of each AT. My point was that my Shield Defence Tanker was less survivable than any other Tanker or Brute that I've played, or even, as I pointed out, my Blapper, who has very little trouble staying mostly in melee.  Additionally, he went through End like crazy.

Again, how are you picking and slotting your powers as you are leveling your tank? You mentioned that you slotted your attacks for acc and end but did not mention damage. Doesn't that correlate to what I said about kill speed making things easier? You said the scrapper is more survivable and that you don't slot scrapper attacks for endurance reduction. Scrappers do more damage than tanks out of the gate, this further bolsters my comment about killing things faster = things seem easier.

You kill things in two hits, mobs has less time to hit back, you use less overall endurance - Scrapper

You kill things in 5 hits, mobs has more time to hit back, you use more overall endurance, fights drag out longer and you have to spend more time recovering HP and End - Tanks that choose to invest heavily in defense early game instead of go all in on offense, I've experienced this myself as a newbie with 1-2 attack tanks that focused all in on armor into their late teens.

[Arnabas]

9 hours ago, Psyonico said:

Scrappers do more damage, therefore you use fewer attacks to defeat an enemy, therefore you use less endurance overall.

True enough, but I didn't expect it to be as big of a difference as it seems to be. It feels like less End per attack, but I recognize that could just be my perception.

[Arnabas]

3 hours ago, Nemu said:

Again, how are you picking and slotting your powers as you are leveling your tank? You mentioned that you slotted your attacks for acc and end but did not mention damage. Doesn't that correlate to what I said about kill speed making things easier? You said the scrapper is more survivable and that you don't slot scrapper attacks for endurance reduction. Scrappers do more damage than tanks out of the gate, this further bolsters my comment about killing things faster = things seem easier.

You kill things in two hits, mobs has less time to hit back, you use less overall endurance - Scrapper

You kill things in 5 hits, mobs has more time to hit back, you use more overall endurance, fights drag out longer and you have to spend more time recovering HP and End - Tanks that choose to invest heavily in defense early game instead of go all in on offense, I've experienced this myself as a newbie with 1-2 attack tanks that focused all in on armor into their late teens.

I slotted them about the same. Up until recently, my Scrapper only had Accuracy slotted, though I did put in Critical Hits, so that obviously helped boost his damage.