Schrodinger's Market: Wait, this sells for how much?

While following the wisdom of crafting uncommons, converting to rare, then selling, I've stumbled upon a pretty vexing problem... I can't tell what the going rate for this IO is:

Is it selling for 5-10m or 18-30m? I was able to swap all the displays between these two ranges (clicking on the attuned / stored IO I got both ranges, and by clicking between the different crafted IOs the price alternated, too. While it's inconsistent which of the two ranges gets displayed, it's consistent in showing only these two ranges. I really don't know what to make of this besides it being very concerning.

Has anyone else run into this? Or, better yet, have an explanation as to what the heck is going on?

This is the second time I've run into this bug, but the first time I've taken screenshots. (Well, last time I did take screenshots - with UI hidden, oops.)

Yeah it's a recurring bug, turns up quite a bit.

Maybe it's selling for 5m to 30m over a very wide sample of units sold per unit time.

Yeah it's a recurring bug, turns up quite a bit.

Bummer. Okay, given that it's bugged, is there any way for me to determine which range is the correct one? I'd hate to either sell it for less than it's worth or price it way too high such that it never sells and waste money on posting fees.

Maybe it's selling for 5m to 30m over a very wide sample of units sold per unit time.

Possible, but I don't think that's the case. I have screenshots over the course of 4 minutes, and the bids on them are all the same. The low range and high ranges are exactly the same, including that very specific 18,123,455 bid. If it was super high volume, then I'd expect every screenshot to have a different price history.

If the refresh rate on the updated sell price queue is low (or is otherwise somehow bugged) that wouldn't preclude average sale prices ranging from 5m to 30m, would it?

I think it's a bug, but I did sell one for at 20 million.

But I think I listed it for 5.1 million, so maybe someone got excited and bid high because of the display bug.

If the refresh rate on the updated sell price queue is low (or is otherwise somehow bugged) that wouldn't preclude average sale prices ranging from 5m to 30m, would it?

Oh I beg your pardon, I misinterpreted your original post. I thought you were saying "maybe it's selling so fast the range is actively changing a lot." That's an interesting point.

I was originally thinking it was a bug where I was accidentally getting the history for a different IO instead of the one I was searching for. Instead, what it could be is the game retrieving a history from further back than the most recent 5. It also got me thinking "if there are multiple instances of "AH caches," and each of the caches has a different snapshot of the price history, I could be intermittently getting data any of the caches, which don't agree. (That's just spitballing, though.)

Yeah it's a recurring bug, turns up quite a bit.

Bummer. Okay, given that it's bugged, is there any way for me to determine which range is the correct one? I'd hate to either sell it for less than it's worth or price it way too high such that it never sells and waste money on posting fees.

Not really. In this particular case I can tell you that the one showing 5-10million is more accurate but that's only because I happen to know roughly how much it goes for.

When this happens to me I just bit 1inf then click on the Bidding tab it will refresh and show you the current values.

When this happens to me I just bit 1inf then click on the Bidding tab it will refresh and show you the current values.

That's clever, I'll have to try that.

When this happens to me I just bit 1inf then click on the Bidding tab it will refresh and show you the current values.

Good tip.

When this happens to me I just bit 1inf then click on the Bidding tab it will refresh and show you the current values.

I tried that, but I still had it swap values on me. :\

From the IOs I've sold, I don't think I've seen any (non-bugged) sell for more than ~8 million. I'm inclined to assume anytime I see bunch of 15-20+ million (esp if it's alternating between two histories) that it's bugged and I should ignore the high values .

+1 Inf for correct reference to Schrodinger.

You can't sell it for less than it's worth. The market always sells the lowest post price to the highest bidder. If there are more bidders than there are sellers, your price is guaranteed to be fair market value because that IO market is a sellers market.

If there are more sellers than buyers, then that IO market is the buyers market. Post it for the vendor price plus 10% and be done.

I wouldn't want to tell other people how to market, and "worth" is in the eye of the buyer or seller... but you certainly can sell it for less than it cost you to craft it or craft/convert it, or much less than it typically sells for.

I would say a rule of thumb is:

1.  If it sells instantly, you probably sold it for less than it normally sells for, or less than most people think it's worth.

2.  If it doesn't sell in 24 or 48 hours, you may be trying to sell it for more than it normally sells for... more than most think it's worth.

Also I keep saying this, high number of bidders does not always indicate high demand.  It can just mean a few players are placing a high number of very low bids, hoping to get lucky.

But if you want to place your faith in the market and believe that you can't possibly sell something for less than it's worth, be my guest.  I'm one of those people who likes to place a lot of lowball bids.  8)

You can't sell it for less than it's worth. The market always sells the lowest post price to the highest bidder.

Of course you can. If it costs you 500k to craft it and you list it for 1 inf, there's every chance I'll buy it with a lowball bid of 100.

If someone has a higher bid than me, they would get it but their bid might be 101.

That isn't an indication of worth but it is the selling point.

A few days ago I accidentally bid 20 millionish for a recipe I meant to bid 2 millionish.  Oh, I forgot to mention, I bid a block of ten.

That hurt.

For a moment the last five sales said 20 mill, then a few in the teens and then went right back down to the 2-3 million range in the span of a few minutes. 

Moral of the story: Sometimes its a bug, sometimes it's market shenanigans, and sometimes it is stupid fat fingers.

Some things, like recipe or enhancement drops that have a vendor value, can literally be (and often are) sold on the market for less than they're worth.  I used to make money flipping recipes from the market to a vendor before I learned the crafting market.  (Thanks, Shinobu).

And I'd like to repeat this point louder for the people in the back:  [move][glow=red,2,300]A high number of bids is not a guarantee of high demand.[/glow][/move]  Many of those bids could be lowball bids from people who hope to make money flipping the item, but don't want to use the item.  So there might be 100 bids, but 20 units might satisfy all the demand in Paragon City.

A few days ago I accidentally bid 20 millionish for a recipe I meant to bid 2 millionish.

 

{snip} 

 

Moral of the story: Sometimes its a bug, sometimes it's market shenanigans, and sometimes it is stupid fat fingers.

This underscores a great example of something that is very likely highly undervalued in the marketplace: patience.

Even if you list something for more than its current going rate, that could change (intentionally or, accidentally, as above) tomorrow.

Yeah, I've got roughly 75ish rare enhancements for sale at about 1.5 million each. I want to let them sit there like that, but I'm getting kind of inpatient...

I'm getting kind of inpatient...

Yeah, that’s the kind of thing that can drive you crazy...

EXACTLY! Totally nuts. I am quite committed to my sales.

You can't sell it for less than it's worth. The market always sells the lowest post price to the highest bidder.

 

Of course you can. If it costs you 500k to craft it and you list it for 1 inf, there's every chance I'll buy it with a lowball bid of 100.

If someone has a higher bid than me, they would get it but their bid might be 101.

That isn't an indication of worth but it is the selling point.

That means your cost was higher than the value, not that you sold it for too low of a price. If you spend 500k crafting useless recipe x that won't sell for more 1000 you sold it for what it's worth. 

A pound of gold is worth more than a pound of sea bottom timber, even if you spent more to get the sea bottom timber than you would spend to get a pound of gold.

You can't sell it for less than it's worth. The market always sells the lowest post price to the highest bidder.

 

Of course you can. If it costs you 500k to craft it and you list it for 1 inf, there's every chance I'll buy it with a lowball bid of 100.

If someone has a higher bid than me, they would get it but their bid might be 101.

That isn't an indication of worth but it is the selling point.

 

That means your cost was higher than the value, not that you sold it for too low of a price. If you spend 500k crafting useless recipe x that won't sell for more 1000 you sold it for what it's worth. 

 

A pound of gold is worth more than a pound of sea bottom timber, even if you spent more to get the sea bottom timber than you would spend to get a pound of gold.

Buy It Now Price =/= what the item is worth, or will sell for

It's entirely possible to sell something for 100,000 influence, even if the average going price is, say, 10 million.

I hate to resurrect this, but the display for Miracle procs remains bugged.  I just sold a bunch for 15mm that were listed around 5mm.