Riverdusk

Pro is that their defense can be capped early. Con is all you pretty much get is defense and with thugs the amount of defense you get often ends up being overkill. As others have said, time also gives you enough to more than cap their defense and comes with other things. /Cold is another one that has more than enough and adds other things. /Traps another one if you really want the mez resistance. If I'm calculating correct you can get thugs to about 40% or so defense without any secondary, assuming you slot enforcers for defense, use the pet +def IO's, and use maneuvers. So, you don't need a whole lot more to cap them from any secondary. Although having more from a secondary does save you some slots here and there and allows for some overcapping to help in some situations. Still, as always, if you really dig the combo, there is nothing wrong with it and it should do fine.

I wouldn't mind it being changed to knockdown by default. However, it is one of the easier knockbacks to control as you can choose a destination (into a corner), or you can hover and do the old aim them straight down into the floor trick to limit scatter.

From the thread title I thought this was going to be a suggestion on changing the Infiltration power. I was click baited. 😀

Open up email, start new email, drag a merit from salvage to attachment box (which autofills your global for you to assure there is 0% chance for mistake), type in inf amount, type 1 letter into message box, send. Works for me, but I guess I don't do it often enough that I ever worried about a macro for doing it. Best tip I ever got was attaching a merit to autofill my global, as I was always paranoid about mistyping it. I find it faster than doing the reply method and it doesn't clutter my inbox.

Actually shadowfall also doesn't suppress on attack (only on clicking glowies, same as SI). You can easily monitor that in combat attributes (under PvE stealth) and see that the 35 feet worth doesn't go away when you attack. It is just that Shadowfall's stealth is less, so you are still seen if you get too close to a secondary group. With SI you can literally stand inside a second group while attacking a different group and have the second group not react. Shadowfall is the way to go though anyway. Like said, It being AoE and its resistance buffs are too nice. Then just use a stealth IO in sprint or wherever (which does stack with shadowfall) and still get enough stealth to be invisible in most cases.

I'll go briefly into my usual controller AoE hold rant yet again. Several AT's have nukes which can basically wipe out an entire group of enemies and also often have their own mez/debuff effects for any that survive, recharge in roughly half the time, AND they actually have an accuracy BONUS. Controllers get an accuracy penalty, have double the recharge time, and all it does is hold them, rather than outright defeat them. At the very least they should have roughly the same recharge as a nuke and drop the accuracy penalty. Only 'advantage' would be they are typically available at a lower level than the nukes. If necessary push them all up to a higher level. The rare times I do take them I tend to leave them to later in a build anyway. I'd rather have more useful powers available at lower levels.

You left out stalker. That's the one I tried (ice/ice which several in the stalker forums raved about) and I found the same for them as well. Tried it to the mid 30's or so and pretty well IO'd up for that level. I found ice armor definitely felt among the weakest I've tried for stalkers. It can succeed, because as long as you don't crank the difficulty up too much, almost anything can succeed. However, on a relative basis compared to other defensive sets, I found it lacking. Ice patch (from ice melee and not the armor) was often more the saving grace. Specifically, Ice/Invuln, Ice/Shield, Ice/Energy, all felt so much sturdier at similar levels.

Another way to stop them from MoG is to sap their endurance. Something my electric blast sentinel can do pretty easily and even on multiple at once. Actually have an easier time with them on my electric sentinel than I do with my controllers. Can also use knockdown/knockback if you time it right. Reducing the MoG time a bit wouldn't be terrible, but I'd hate to see them nerfed too much. As others said, it gives some usefulness to things beyond the usual "moar damage=answer to everything." And it isn't like enough burst damage isn't also good enough still anyway.

Yep, beasts are the only one I think could still use a slight boost, but even they aren't as bad as some seem to say, imo. The disparities between the different MM sets isn't near as bad as it used to be. On the other hand I'd agree it is always nice to have a bit more slotting options for powers.

Also on further thought, at least some sort of sleep and possibly stun protection/resistance also makes sense in a thematic/roleplaying sense. A buff that is throwing water on a person is going to wake them up and keep them awake for a while, no? Also could be argued would snap them out of a stupor (stun). So, maybe leave hold and other mezzes as a 'hole' for balance and just give some sleep and stun resistance/protection. Would be similar to Storm's O2 Boost power. Could slide it right in to soothing wave as just one possible spot for it.

Dark, time, and radiation all have solid defense and/or tohit debuff which means mez are much less likely to hit in the first place. Radiation also has solid mez resistance which is what I was saying would be a nice addition.

Some have commented on the lack of any protection against mezzes and it being a set with hardly any defense so you can't avoid mezzes by avoiding being hit either. How about instead of mez protection, at least adding some solid mez resistance? I was just bringing up in another thread that radiation emission's accelerate metabolism is the only power in the game right now with significant mez resistance in it. It'd be cool to have another set with a solid mez resistance power. At accelerate metabolism's mez resistance levels (around 200%) I find mezzes last noticeably shorter and it makes them less often a death sentence, but still keeps things "spicy".

Yep, the only characters I really notice mez resistance on to any significant degree currently are my radiation emission ones. Accelerate metabolism gives around 200% mez resistance (varies some with AT), so it is fairly easy to add that to other bonus and get to that 300% level you mentioned. Starts to get you to the point where at least some of the mezzes only last a couple of seconds.

Acrobatics hold protection I actually find more useful and underrated. It is only a tiny amount, but it typically prevents that first hold from mezzing you on a squishie. The whole mez system of the game is honestly probably one of its weaker points. Mez protection should have been a lot more rare, and mez resistance should have been a lot more common (and more powerful). In other words outright immunity should be rare, but ways to greatly reduce mez time should have been the focus imo. The current system is much too binary. However, with the way toggles used to get knocked off instead of just suppressed even from a 1 second mez, it would not have been popular at all to do it that way back in the day. Nothing was more annoying than having to retoggle 8 different toggles after even a brief mez. Even with the detoggle issue fixed though, it isn't like it is going to change at this point. The riot it would cause...

Was thinking the same thing when I saw it. Typically just like -regen, a -hp debuff is only going to really be noticeable against an AV. -267 hp against an AV is virtually worthless. I compare it against incarnate interface degen which gives -1000 hp and can self or group stack up to 4 times for -4000 hp. Now that makes a difference. -267 I find kind of a joke.

Several of the epic MM pools have aoe immobilizes. By the time you hit ITF I'd hope at least a couple of MM's on the team would have one for that problem. I almost always take one (especially on sets like bots or thugs that tend to send things running with their fire patches).

Maybe if we feed them after midnight they transform and get stronger. 🙂 Oh, and the possibilities combining them with the new marine secondary and getting them wet.

I also agree @Ukase. It wasn't presented well as you do have to read through a bit on his post to what changes he is talking about, which is the buffs to Council and CoT. I've managed to do fine with a dominator solo against them (as well as MM, the only two AT that have tried the new council solo). But, I could see how those that aren't as familiar with the game and character building could struggle with these changes on certain characters. It isn't as outrageous as a post as some people are making it out to be imo. Just saying to keep in mind, the "everyone says the game is too easy" and "everyone is soloing at +4/x8" that you hear on the forums are not really indicative of the general population. Not entirely scientific, but when I do team I tend to take a look at how people with missions in their list are set and it is almost never +4/x8 (not even close) except the leader who knows they are filling a team or already running a full team. There is also just personal preferences, not everyone is looking to turn this into something akin to the 'Dark Souls" of MMO's. Some people just want a chill experience and a way to to feel heroic. I think the changes were fine, (I've actually been posting Council needed to be buffed, or that their xp should be lowered, for a long time before the changes were made). But at the same time the call to keep the more 'squishie' AT's and the more casual players in mind when changes like this are made I think is a fair point.

True, have heard others mention that. I guess I don't do whatever triggers that bug or have been lucky, my times have always at least seemed to be accurate as far I could tell.

Exactly, best is when you can also knock those stragglers or outsiders back INTO the group of other mobs. If I have a knockback power it is what I'm usually trying to do. Assuming they are strong enough that I'm not killing them outright, which in that case of course it doesn't matter.

I typically will find an NPC to click on with a name starting with "M" when I hit 50 or soon after, which is how you find out hours played on a character. https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/Civilian_NPCs Pretty consistent it takes me 30 to 40 hours of playtime to hit 50 with how I play. Which is far from efficient, but I've never been in a hurry to hit level 50 on any character.

My favorite knockback moment is in Posi 1 at the City Hall doors. Constantly slamming the ambush waves coming out of the doors back into them. Never gets old. I make sure to stock up on and use the START plasmatic taser temp power (aka energy torrent) in that situation if I don't have a knockback power of my own.

As to illusion, having played both a lot now, I wouldn't say one is a lot better than the other, more just different. If I had to pick one I'd say the dom version is actually just a bit better imo. Dom gets an aoe stun, a single target immobilize, and a phantom army that doesn't taunt, but that does do secondary effects instead. Between just getting normal aggro for being there and the amount of knockdowns and CC that Dom phantom army does, I rarely miss or even notice the lack of taunt (mostly just occasionally in an AV fight). Dom has that extra aoe stun and I also actually very much like the immobilize for those AV fights which makes me miss the taunt less even in AV situations. You can get the immobilize on a controller too, but you have to go traps or trick arrow. Dom version definitely feels a lot more "controllery" than the controller version. Between phantom army and spectral terror it is definitely one of the safer doms I've ever tried too. Probably helps that I went /dark secondary to stack even more tohit debuffs and have a heal. I also love my illusion controllers, but it is nice on the dom to just be able to one shot snipe things and have some aoe damage before epic pool levels.

I've seen that too actually, although once again it is a rare sight. Multiples of a combination of energy blast and storm works wonders.

I've learned to roll with it. Only really annoying thing about kb to me is when things get knocked and stuck into walls and you can't always get them. I find that happens way too often on 'kill all missions'. If I run a kb heavy character I find it is almost a requirement to take teleport target so that I can yank them out (or have an untargetted aoe attack, although that can sometimes be slow). As to quick and dirty advice on what to tell people. More passive way would be probably something like, "No thanks, but I'll try to be careful with it". Some more aggressive versions have already been mentioned. If helps if you are the team leader as the worst they can do is quit the team. I doubt any kb justification speech is going to change people's minds, they'd have to see you do well in actual practice I think. You could even try recruiting and include the message something like "Knockback friendly team looking for more". I've actually seen that, although rarely.