Replacement

I mean, you're kind of asserting things that aren't at all true of the suggestion. Like, why would you assume this would see a return of a pop-up? This is simply "level -1 when far away, same level when close up." I'm not certain you would be satisfied with any fix that isn't "remove the -1 level" but I just don't see it happening. It's kind of a core premise, it's part of the fiction, and not everyone is on board with removing it. Any solution is going to be thematic and at least a little bit complicated. More importantly, it's not going to come without a drawback. Personally, I don't like "ask your team leader to lower the difficulty" as an answer. This is what @SwitchFade is not addressing. Social pressures are real, and asking someone to get way out of their comfort zone and display weakness in front of strangers is not at all the same as "having fun and enjoying the game" - and I would wager this goes double for a party leader who has mixed company for their party ("Do I lower it for the SKs and seem weak to the same-levels? Hell, many of the SKs will think I'm saying we can't handle it.") So I do want to see a solution. I just can't imagine it will be wholesale removal of the -1, no trade-offs. Snark answer: start combining inspirations into yellows. This solution is so simple you don't need any code changes! (This is a joke.)

Oh that's an interesting notion. We don't need to level cap the whole zone - just the people running the associated arcs. Of course, many of these zones would need at least one dedicated arc for that, but it's certainly a start. In fact... other than The Hollows (and with Faultline not really being a hazard zone "anymore"), I don't think any other hazard zones have stories in them? Just some arcs that send you there for a mission or 2?

The Warriors are absolutely the type to not know this, and yet still base their identify around it though. But also, Warriors wear modern clothes, so I don't see why they would need norse clothing.

Yeah, some of what you're saying here is why I like the idea of some meta objective or reward. I should note, some sense of achievement is a reward, for the reason many of us save the old lady getting mugged still. Street-sweeping is not, in itself, an incentive. There needs to be more. I suggest regular rewards of single merits and a bit of a story pat on the back, but really anything telling a player "you did a thing!" is a good start. The other thing you reminded me about is something far more near-term: some sort of "hazard zone of the week" type event to accompany our weekly S/TFs. I don't know what that would entail. Extra spawns and badges? I have no idea, just throwing stuff out.

I like this. Iirc, isn't this basically the plot of the old movie The Warriors? One gang stuck deep in enemy territory and their fight to escape keeps catching the attention of more and more who want to see them fall? As for level correcting enemies - one problem is that a level 50 Skull doesn't have any extra attacks or tricks to defend against all the things you would be expected to bring to bear. You would basically require an xp penalty to justify the incredible slaughter (self counterpoint: it still wouldn't be as good of xp/inf as a fire farm). The other thing is the sense that some stuff in zone should be harder than the others. I'm sure everyone has memories of falling off a broken ledge in The Hollows where everything was fair or even weak... And landing on purple minions of igneous. Plus, auto-level doesn't encourage you to leave ever. Really though, I think the answer is case-by-case. Rule of thumb: zones 30 and under have a level cap, 30+ syncs enemy rank. Exceptions flow from there depending on individual zone mechanics. EDIT: Ultimately, whatever would/could happen to these zones would encourage people to actually spend time there. If you sync up enemies, you are strongly advantaging 50(+) characters... And yet the only thing that would really attract those characters is new story content. Just something to keep in mind. if new arcs or other method of delivering story is on the table and you like it as a level 50 activity, using the event/monster system becomes more acceptable. If you're wanting alternate leveling paths that have some soft story hooks ("here's the premise. Now go. Hunt."), I think zone caps make more sense. They aren't strictly necessary - I don't think it's intrinsically wrong to run an activity with no risk - but it's a soft guarantee you won't "level out" of your ability to enjoy it.

I have vague headcannon for every character I stick with. I write a bio for maybe 1 in 8. I customize power sets to mesh together, or at least explain each other. I change the shape sliders for head shape on just about everyone. I try my best to not use the same face on multiple characters (someone around here has a spreadsheet for tracking that, and I envy their initiative). At least 4 costume slots are almost always minor variant outfits, with the rest tending towards particular themes. And I have never, ever, in all of retail or HC, ever set a title, let alone color it.

I was also thinking about this but considering how long it took Paragon Studios to work out phasing, I don't really have my hopes up that it's straightforward and well-documented for the HC team to dive into. Pie in the sky, yeah that's my preferred path. But low population caps, forcing multiple instances, and events triggering in only some of them is something they seem pretty comfortably able to pull off. That leaves just the minor detail of... The rest of my unrealistic wish list. But hey! It wouldn't block mission doors! EDIT: I'm really up in the air between if I would prefer Hazard zones cap your level (like ouro), or do like @Techwrightsaid and have the mobs always come up to your level. There's probably room for both.

@Erratic1I may see a miscommunication. My first post in this thread, I replied to BZB's entire post, instead of just the first section. That section was him responding to Infinitum's offer for a more fair pylon comparison with a deflection. You may have thought you were quoting someone making a general statement on how to test and unrealistic expectations of build parity across all scenarios, when I was intending something far more specific (nailing down the criteria of a good pylon test). In a final attempt at good faith, I think this may be the misunderstanding, and why we both think the other is wildly off topic.

This quote chain literally starts with you taking some of my sentences out of context to argue something unrelated (me: if you want to argue one scenario, make that scenario rigorous. You: but what about the other scenarios!) If you want to continue this rally against "how the game is played in reality," please do so without my quotes at the top for you to strawman.

Yes, we were (I was) talking about pylons. When I entered this thread, the premise was [Anecdote of a specialized anti-pylon tanker doing as well as non-optimal scrapper for the task] therefore [Tanker OP]. This was specifically my issue; the use of a pylon test to make a sweeping AT balance declaration, without acknowledging the variables still on the table, both of which biased in the same direction. As for slotting, I believe I intentionally used the word "similar" slotting. No one is asking for perfect; but working to minimize the variables should be the goal of both sides of the argument.

As always, a team experiences the leader's world. I was essentially thinking it would be a hidden badge on your character that says "you cleared x neighborhood in the past 24 hours" which determines which version of the map you load into (hence the low population caps). But to add to this, it would be superficial since there's supposed to always be a chance something else will trigger and see you return to an already-fallen neighborhood. At this point, your hidden badge is revoked and you can clear that region again. The overall goal, however implemented, is to provide a sense of persistence, but balance that with the MMO need to see things roll over and reset. My ideal private server (like truly private) would be to play the entire game level locked to each zone with all respawns disabled, and get to work cleaning up the streets. That's not really an option, but I'm shooting for something that provides some of the same sensation.

So... This is all very reasonable! No but's; just wanted to give you a call-out for this. Something you said previously has continued to bounce around in my head, and I wonder if it may be a better avenue of explaining some of the deficiency: the inconsistent rule of 90% So if tanker is a 10 for survival, brutes are a 9. If Brute damage is a 10, tanker is a 9. (Remember, these are only relative to each other, not other ATs) I think what you may be coming across is that in practice, that only explains their performance caps. At the bottom of the scales, brutes are a 7.5 on the survival scale, while a tanker maintains a 9 on their damage. So while I'm still mostly going to side with Infinitum and say I think Tanker buffs were warranted, I think there's an argument that they don't give much up to reach those heights - meanwhile a brute needs outside buffs or a terrible amount of defensive IO investment to get to their 9 survival. This doesn't change the fact that I need to see better data comparisons, but I think perhaps BZB's issue is more a crisis of convenience: tankers give up nothing to be able to come so close in contribution. (Not convinced they need it, but the Tanker nerf to consider first is to lower their 10-target caps to 8 to match the logic of their 16s).

Context, mostly. If you're talking about pylon times, it's important to understand the things that matter to pylon times. Sets that are more defensive in nature? Out. AoE driven sets? Out. If we're talking about someone saturating AoO for a self-fulcrum on what is undisputedly the strongest ST melee set, that's a whole hell of a lot of context to just ignore. Sidenote here: Galaxy Brain's mission tests actually show the new EM as somewhere in the middle of the pack. That's because under that context, they are not the top performer. I actually brought this up in dismay during i27 testing, that they weren't actually testing that high... Until we started seeing @Infinitum's pylon times and other reports on AV destruction. Turns out balance is hard and we need to keep all of this context in mind before making blanket statements. For these reasons, denying the specifics of chosen sets is denying the reality of those sets.

Hey, so, this is where it looks like you're avoiding data. You really need an apples to apples comparison, by which I mean same sets and very similar slotting, so that every time you do come into threads with this, we can start to take you seriously again. Ping me personally when you have this data and if it passes muster, I will happily advocate for you.

A path like this would be good, though there are a lot of particulars. Not looking at what is going on in [Other Dimensions], I think I would prefer to not simply have everything be builders and finishers, with combo effect based on the particular finisher. I think instead, building stacks toward each combo individually could be a neat approach. So any power in the Weaken combo builds Weaken stacks, which are removed with its finisher. This would mean you could have another combo waiting in the wings. If too powerful, you could also set finishers to decrement all other combo stacks as well (so Attack Vitals finisher removes all Vital stacks, but also lowers your Empower and Sweep counts by one).

@Draeth Darkstar Thank you for that deep dive. I am running on feeling here (which is dangerous), but I feel like the AE description is basically blasting open what's supposed to be a huge reveal. What I mean here is that I would imagine this is such a closely guarded secret that the low level soldiers don't know - even those who drank as part of their ceremony. I can't imagine this upends the whole notion of training and being their best - but it certainly does tell you they aren't above using anything for an edge! Taking it a step further, one thing I don't think is established (if anyone knows if this is exposed in-game, let me know the arc please!) Is who all knows about Ozzy's deal with a devil? I would assume he would hide this, since that truth would undermine his rule (instead of Protector of the Urn, he is That Demon's Bitch). I again want to reiterate, I'm musing at this point. There certainly are enough signs they focus on their own might first and care only for outside influences insofar as they make them, individually, stronger, so I still think we're on a good path. Random other thought: a lot about this keeps making me think of the Luddites. A bunch of magic/normies eschewing advanced technology, right? Sounds pretty similar, though how compatible they are for a merger is up to how you read them. Luddites are the product of a kindly old man spirit whispering to a guy to destroy a power plant that's feeding off a demon inside mount Diable. If you read that as "the old man is the demon, and its interest is in not having its power stolen," then suddenly you have this (same?) Demon creating two orders of semi-magical anachronistic warriors, almost like the guy's got a brand.

No I mean, instead of +12,5% acc from an insight, gain double that while SK'd. All +1 level means in this context is "bigger stats" and this would do so, albeit piecemeal. But that doesn't really help a Controller's controls or debuffs.

Improbable and obtuse suggestion: I think it would be neat if Sidekicks had some UI element they could drop inspirations on to sacrifice them for a temporary +1 level, with additionals adding duration instead. And then I realize a bunch of issues with that and come to a different thought: What if Inspirations gave additional benefit while SK'd, to offset the level difference? And I think this is kind of neat, but also makes me want a +mez/debuff strength inspiration.

I'm not really a fan of turning them into additional merits, but I'm not really sure what additional pools there are to pull from. How would people feel if the p2w goods all had a button to buy with vanguard merits instead of inf? Also: feels like the Shadow Shard should be considered Vanguard stuff.

One thing worth noting: the existence of Warrior Earth. I think those are in some Maria Jenkins missions, or maybe Tina. They aren't exactly interesting, in fact they're really easy at that point, but at least there are a lot of lady warriors! Could be a good place to check for skins, though memory tells me they're a bit bland and monotone.

... Build Monumentum. Tbh, there's something to be said about the black knights eating the warriors' lunch.

Goal: "strategic" content (more strategic-seeming than actually having much grand strategy to it) Small zone populations; you can bring your friends but not much in the way of wandering help. No traditional enemy respawns. Instead there would be a mechanism for neighborhoods to fall. Level is capped at the maximum level of the zone. Each neighborhood has something you can do to unlock enemies on the map in that neighborhood, to help you track them down (defeat X number of enemies in the area, click on a plaque, etc). Each neighborhood you clear gives you completion bonuses (XP, Inf, merits). Whenever you return to the zone, whatever neighborhoods you cleared previously are still empty, unless they've been retaken by the enemy. Many specifics are up in the air, and that means they can be determined on a per-zone basis. For example, Kicking the Hellions out of a sector of Perez Park may set it up for a rise in Skull power in the region, and they take over the sector with increased numbers. If left to stand for a while, the reinforcements will be recalled and a standard Skulls presence will be left... Another example: Devouring Earth have several "Breaches" used to enter Crey's Folly. Locating them and clearing those regions helps cut off the rest of the zone from DE reinforcements. Target those sectors first if you would like lasting peace. This could help provide an interesting and different way to level a lot of characters, like those you would envision as either fully-existing on the front lines or having spent time there, without depriving them of the "modern" expectations of getting levels and cash (courtesy of minor passive merit gain).

Ok, unsure if intentional. My brain is now imagining bosses titan wielding magical objects never intended to be weapons. "These statues were built to maintain a containment field!" "Don't care, they hit hard."

I like this distinction of "the magic is my high-end gear" here. It also happens to open the door to... flaming battleaxes and ice arrows (we desperately need more sources of incoming Cold damage), "force gauntlets" that add energy damage to their punches, lightning spears, etc. I don't know how impossible it would be to, for example, add a Fire version of Envenomed Blades to an NPC and have it trigger at 50% health -- and actually add a visible flame effect to their sword (I suppose maybe it's possible to just change out their sword skin?) Another avenue to explore is location effects with dropped "totems", similar to Devouring Earth. This could provide an interesting way to create area buffs/debuffs without straight up giving them magical powers directly.

It continues to be an extension of what I said about magic items earlier: if you use it to gain an edge, but have no specific reliance upon the thing, you're probably still Natural. * If batman needed an exoskeleton just to fight crime, we would call him Technology. But he's still a badass ninja, so Natural. * And yet if Iron Man picked up some kung fu, we would still call him Technology just because it's what defines him! Unless there was a serious sea change as part of a story arc that realigned what defines him and gives him power, he'd still be Tech. To be honest, and before this spirals too far off-topic, I would call the blurred lines between origins a feature.