Dr Causality Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) Most of the "Proc Monster" discussion seems to center on damage. I got interested in what other nifty things could be done in the new PPM world.... Powers that used to be questionably bad because of long cooldowns are now procilicous. And although it's technically percent based so not a PPM, having seen what Bonfire with 'Overwhelming Force: Chance KD' can do you, get the idea of what amazing non-damage impacts procs can potentially have... Leviathan Mastery FTW So what makes MM Leviathan special? Mainly a single power. All the MM Epic Hold's have a long 32s cooldown making them great for procing. But Knockout Blow from Leviathan Mastery stands out, in that it already does massive damage, plus it accepts Hold, Melee and KB IO sets, and has a massive 40s cooldown. If that wasn't enough it's also a Mag3 hold and has a base accuracy of 90 rather than the standard 75, so we can skimp on accuracy for more procs! And if all that wasn't enough Leviathan gets another hold power, plus an aoe cone Immobilize and decent resistance shield. How to exploit? What are the gimmicks I promised? Even with some recharge from Alpha or IO enhancements both 'ForceFeedback: Chance for 5s 100% Rech buff' and 'Super Entomb: Chance for +Absorb' can still have capped 90% chance to proc. With a moderately high global recharge and Hasten build that means you can reliably have both of those buffs up again every 10 - 15s. ForceFeedback --- 'Knockout Blow' being single target with a long 40s cooldown, means that a ForceFeedback proc even with it's low PPM of 2 still is above the 90% proc chance as long enhancement Recharge stays below 61% enhancement. All the other procs we'd care about have 2 or better PPM, so that magic 61.5% rech threshold will also give us capped 90% proc chance for all the other procs. This means you can slot for recharge, taking Alpha Spiritual or Agility and still have capped proc chances! That let's you easily get KO Blow cooldown into the 10s to 13s range, meaning you can reliably have FF's 100% buff up around 1/3 to 1/2 of the time if you're judicious about using KO whenever it's up in combat, so roughly equivalent to 33% to 50% global Recharge while holding enemies and doing very respectable damage. In my testing this let me make other long cooldown powers like Nature's Overgrowth Perma. Super Entomb: Chance for +Absorb --- Why care about this? Well how would you like an Absorb shield you can refresh roughly every 10s? (Taking into account the Rech buff from ForceFeedback...) This is my favorite gimmick, but it's arguably better in the Epic Range holds since you can more easily fire at will that way... In my use it's just a little under 150 HP Absorb on my MM. That may not seem like much, but I'm at 75% S/L res. Resistance reduces incoming damage before it hits the Absorb. So that means with that paltry 150 Absorb my MM can take an extra 600HP of S/L damage roughly every 10s or so. Not bad for a character that only has a 842 HP. If you can get off even 4 procs a minute it could protect you from 2400 HP of S/L damage. Another important is that's damage won't be transferred to pets in BodyGuard mode for instance when we all take a massive pboe hit.... Absorb is more effective when you have high Resistance, so will be best with 2ndaries like Resistance buffs like /Nature, /Thermal and Sonic can best leverage this. And it just so happens that Leviathan includes a decent shield 'Shark Skin' with base Resistance of 27.5% S/L/ and Cold. Combined with a 2ndary like /Nature this makes it easy to get to 75% cap on S/L even without Tough. Since Leviathan has two Holds it will also do well with 2ndaries like /Time, /Nature and /Radiation letting you stack multiple Holds. KO Blow Gimmick slotting: Relying on the 90% capped proc chances by keeping our Recharge enhancement at or below 61% for this power. ForceFeedback The usuals: 1 x Purple 'Enbreakable Constraint' [If you're poor non-purples will also have 90% proc chance it's just that they do less damage. But for instance you have other lower cooldown holds powers like Time Stop that you want to proc out you might be better off putting the purple there where the high PPM is actually needed to stay at proc cap. ...and 1 x Purple Hecatomb dmg But KO does a whopping (for MM) base damage of 109, so we also want to slot for Dmg. Optimal will be a two +5 boost Hecatomb's. 1 x Acc/Dmg/Rech and 1 x Dmg get you 94% Dmg 33% Rech. But I like 2 x Basilisk for Def bonus with 1 x Hecatomb Dmg which still gets you 66% Dmg. [2nd Hecacomb from choices above....] *Utility proc or another dmg proc seasoned to your build tastes. Interesting Utility options: Super Entomb: Chance for +Absorb is the main gimmick but I actually recommend taking ranged Spirit Shark too and putting Entomb in that. It's much easier to spam a ranged power, letting you more reliably keeping your Absorb up. Also, Spirit Shark has a lower 32s cooldown, but since Entomb is 3 PPM you can still easily keep it 90% proc chance cap... Mag5 Hold --- How about boosting the Mag3 hold up to Mag5 so you can instant hold Bosses? Superior Blistering Cold proc would let you do that but it's expensive and you don't need the high 4 PPM rate. Lockdown chance for hold's 2.5 PPM rate means you can reach 106% Recharge while still being at 90% cap Chance for -Res --- ?? Is this a bug. KO Blow accepts Targeted aoe sets?? Hmm how about 90% chance of procing an Annihilation chance for -Res? +Def bonuses --- We're often chasing Defense bonuses so my favorite slotting is actually 2 x Basiliks's and 1 x Hecatomb Dmg. That gets you 2.5% E/N, 1.25% Range Def and 66% Dmg and you can tune the Rech you get to keep it below 61% when combining with 45% from Alpha Spiritual.... Unless you have some other outside buffs you'll need some Accuracy anyway, so the Basilisks serve a purpose and also extend the hold mezz time. Other Leviathan Powers: Spirit Shark --- Single target mag3 Hold that does damage, so takes Ranged Damage and Hold Procs. Procs of interest: As mentioned previously, if you can fit it your build along with KO Blow, then this where I actually recommend putting Entomb here. At 3 PPM we can go as high as 98% Recharge while still keeping our 90% proc chance. And since this is 32s coldown power it will be up more often... Mag5 Hold -- Again adding a hold proc let's you reliable stack enough Mag hold to instant hold bosses. But don't use Lockdown as it's just a 2.5 PPM. This power takes Ranged Dmg sets and Devastation's Hold proc is a 3 PPM like Entomb. That small .5 PPM difference means Lockdown has to stay below 62% Rech to keep 90% Proc rate, whereas Devastation like Entomb can go to 98%.... Dmg procs -- Ideally the Purple Apocalypse Ranged Dmg proc. Not because we need the higher PPM rate, but because it does more Dmg... Honorable mention again with 2 x Baslisk Gaze, for the +Def set bonus and we do probably want some Accuracy and Recharge. School of Sharks: Nothing unique to see here that other Epics Immobs don't also have. The procs of interest will all be 3.5 PPM with the exception of Annihilation -Res which is 3 PPM. This means given the aoe cone and lower 20s cooldown, any recharge will greatly reduce or PPM chances in this power. For optimal procing you should go w/ no Alpha bonus and as close to zero IO Rech as possible. Procs of interest: Annihilation: chance for -Res (3 PPM) --- even with zero rech you'll still only have a ~54% chance of procing. ~45% chance to proc at 23.1875% enhancement Rech. And when you reach ED 96% Rech that goes further down to a 30.4%. Superior Frozen Blast: Chance for Immob --- This stacks ontop of the powers own Mag3 Immobilize letting you potentially mezz bosses and more easily hold AVs. While IO is 3.5 PPM which will help a bit, unfortunately it has a 23.1875% Rech Enhancement....so works against our proc plans. This will force you to 23.1875% Rech giving a proc chance of is ~52%, and worth yet also decreasing the proc chance other procs you want to use in School of Sharks. With Alpha Spiritual's 45% Rech tier that would total 68.1875% rech for a ~39.7% chance of procing. After the These might not seem that great, but for comparison remember that Controllers only get a 20% to add a +1 Mag to their powers. And since their powers are low cooldown that won't be able to use procs efficiently. Gravitational Anchor: Chance for Hold --- /Time and /Nature have chance for aoe Hold powers that accept the Lockdown chance for hold proc. If we add another aoe Chance for hold, we start to have decent odds of holding things. Gravitational is a 3.5 PPM, so the same numbers as Frozen Blast above, except if you opt to skip Frozen Blast, then you can actually be a zero recharge. Zero Rech means this a ~63% chance to proc a +2Mag Hold on targets in your Aoe cone. Debilitation Action: Chance for Stun --- It's only 3 PPM and it won't help us with Leviathan powers, but if you have other sources of Stun it might be better. Also it's dirt cheap. PPM chances will the same as Annihilation listed above. Dmg procs. Positron's, Javalin Volley, Trap of the Hunter all standard 3.5 PPM so same chances as Frozen Blast / Gravitational.... Dmg/Range or Pure Range --- This is cone power. Extending the range makes the cone's radius much wider at the end, but importantly doesn't reduce your PPM chances. You get a lot more mileage out of these powers when enhance for range because you can more easily target all enemies at once... (But sadly ranged cones have a target cap of 10 enemies....so there's only so much you can do with cone width...) Shark Skin --- Nothing much to say here. It's just like any of Epic Res Shields, but part of Res is for Cold which probab ly isn't as useful as Mu's Energy or Soul Mastery's Negative and Toxic. But I'm not here for the shield. The main point is that you want this power and you want it well slotted so you can best take advantage of the Absorb from Entomb. Bile Spray --- I'd say skip this. This power only takes Targeted Aoe sets so the proc options are limited. For proc builds you want to fully proc out powers for maximum benefit. Meaning you'll need all the 35+ slots you can spare for Knockout Blow and Spirit Shark etc.. Edited October 10, 2019 by Dr Causality Spelling & Punctuation 2
Dr Causality Posted October 9, 2019 Author Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) Update on this example build: Validated to +2/+8 solo ITF. I've now tested this build on two solo ITF runs, set to Bosses and AVs, w/ no temp powers (other than Ninja Run and Steam Jump). It's cruised at +1/+8 and handled +2/+8 pretty well. On the 2nd run I triggered the Dark Ones ambush to see how it would go. I had to pull them back to a confined space to deal with the ranged attacks and it was a long fight, but got through them without much danger. I don't think it can handle more than +2/+8 though and would at minimum need more accuracy and/or +tohit to even try. I was nonetheless able to slog through a couple +4/+8 Timed Cimerora missions, but it was very slow rough going....not recommended. At +4/+8 with bosses I could not handle more a single Cimerora spawn at a time, so could easily die from accidental aggro or an ambush. The build destroyed both +4/+8 Council and Circle of Thorns Newspaper missions. But when I tried Malta I predictably couldn't get through the 1st spawn that had a Zeus Class Titan. Those might be the toughest thing I fight for MM's. Being able to perma hold you, while pounding you and the pets with aoe's is very tough to deal with. From the hardest fights I realized you often won't have time to spam both KO Blow and Spirit Shark, so for really hard content like +4/+8 you're best off moving the Entomb: +Absorb into KO Blow so you only have to spam that one power for both the Absorb and FF Recharge buffs. Also, comparing to a similar build using /Time instead of /Nature. /Time was easier to solo due to Distortion Field's slow letting you kite enemies... It also seems to have an easier time with the AVs. (Probably due to more -Res debuffs....) So for solo play /Time is probably the way I'd go for a Leviathan proc builds. Although when Cimerorian debuffs dropped defense /Time time struggled more than /Nature and had to run and regroup. And on a team I could see /Nature having more utility due to the uniqueness of aoe team +Absorb buff. Here's a Thugs/Nature build I've worked up as an example of how to take advantage of Leviathan Mastery PPM Gimmicks. I think /Time actually does Leviathan proc builds a bit better due to Farsight's Def and the 50% Recharge buff. But /Nature does very well too, so I wanted to use /Nature to add to @SmalltalkJava's testing, as I hadn't seen a Thugs version yet. I think Thugs were also the best option for this /Nature build. Even with Defense from Hybrid Support Thugs and Bots are the only pets that I could get to soft cap Def. Protector Bot's Bubbles have a 7% base Def versus Enforcer's 8% Maneuvers, which is made worse by Protector Bots not being able to buff themselves. So w/ Nature the Protector Bots themselves would not be softcapped. The thing Bots have going for them would be the 11% bubble one Protector bots puts on the MM, making it much easier to get good defense numbers for your character itself. But Thug's Gang War meant that I could use more procs meaning overall Thugs seem much better for this build. Build Goals and Theory Crafting: Spoiler Overall: Create a very sturdy build that can stay in Melee Range to make use of KO Blow and Entangling Auro. Aim for as close to 32.5% typed or positional Def, rather than full softcap. Why? Multiple reasons. Mainly because a single small inspiration fills that missing 12.5%, whereas there are no Inspirations that replace Procs. On my take especially for teaming, we unnecessarily weaken the strength of builds by chasing set bonuses to be at that magical softcap number. Leverage the proc gimmicks in KO Blow and Spirit Shark. Enough Recharge to get Overgrowth near perma, Wild Growth and proc-ed attacks up more often without having to take Ageless because we want Barrier. (Hasten, Moderate Set bonuses, Alpha Spiritual and KO Blow FF proc gimmick will get us mostly there...) Get Resistances as high as possible to fully leverage the Absorb from Wild Bastion and the Entomb proc. Fully proc out the pets for both Dmg and safety. Fit all the /Nature powers. (The build is tight enough it was tempting to skip 'Spore Cloud' and 'Lifegiving Spores'...but both of those are very useful in extended AV fights) Overall: Play-style / Strategy Spoiler Alpha Spiritual gives much needed +Rech and the Heal enhances four of your core Nature Powers, freeing up slots for procs. Normally you wouldn't want Spiritual on a proc build, but our core proc powers are all long cooldown Leviathan powers, so their proc chances are still at 90% cap. Pets aren't impacted by Rech. You really only hurt the School of Sharks Immobilize and maybe Entangling Aura (since I'm not clear on how +Rech impacts toggles...) Alpha Spiritual's Rech combined with the KO Blow FF gimmick gives enough +Recharge that you can skip Destiny Ageless letting you take Barrier to fill the Def gap that /Nature has Hybrid Support Embodiment alternating with OverGrowth's gives you massive Endurance Reductions, solving Endurance issues from active power use and the lack of Ageless. This also let's me short slot Endurance and Endurance Reduction to steal a few precious slots... General damage Mitigation strategy is alternating Hybrid Support w/ Barrier and mixing in Wild Bastion as needed. Provoke Tankermind style greatly helps with Mitigation when needed because it leverages the pets Absorb from Wild Bastion. Three layer dip: (1) Your MM's has higher resistances than the pets, so damage you take is more greatly reduced. (2) Then for that reduced damage you have the Entomb Absorb. (3) When you're really taking heavy damage Wild Bastion w/ Bodyguard mode means Damage that makes past that is spread out to pet's own Absorb. Mitigation: Thug pets are at Softcap when Hybrid Support is up. MM is also softcap with Hybrid Support is up, plus one small Inspiration. When Hybrid is down you have Barrier. But I often find alternating Hybrid with Wild Bastion is enough and I don't need Barrier, so save it to time with Gang War and Lore Pet summoning. MM spams Spirit Shark to keep the Entomb proc's Absorb up. Wild Bastion: Saving for Mid battles seems better since it's also a large heal. The problem in battle is I often can't target a couple of the pets who have strayed too far out of my radius... So using it preemptively before aggroing a spawn means I get all pets, and also means it will be up again more quickly in case I need it.... Tankermind Provoke is also used to keep enemies mezzed in your Entangling Aura. It can be difficult to aim Regrowth on an a stray pet in the heat of battle. Rebirth let's you individually target them with a nice heal, which combined Solo opening: I don't follow this precisely but I've had good luck with this general stategy so far Check prereqs : Use Overgrowth if it's up. Make sure you're in Defensive Follow. NinjaRun forward to create some space from pets. If there's a nasty like a Sapper take him down with Spirit Shark's Mag5 hold. Fire off the School of Sharks Immobilize to get intial Alpha strike aggro and Immobilize some enemies Jump up over the enemies to flank them from the back side. If I'm fast enough this means aoe attacks typically don't target the pets. Also it gets them in my Entangling Aura. Provoke enemies from behind the spawn to get them attacking and running towards my MM. Enemies waste time chasing you first running forward and now running back at you away from your pets. For annoying targets like (Sappers, Healers etc.) you have your two Leviathan hold Powers that stack with Entangling Aura. This lets you shut them down pretty quickly.... Most importantly now if needed I'm in a position to use Regrowth aimed back towards my group of pets. Starting working in your KO Blow and Spirit Shark for the proc gimmicks whenever they're up. Spirit Shark first if you're taking damage. KO Bow 1st if not since you need the +Rech buff for getting Overgrowth and Wild Bastion up again... School of Sharks is usually up again by now, so you can stack a 2nd immoblize to keep things from running out of Arsonist's burning areas. Pets are running towards you through the enemy spawn, slaughtering on the way. If it looks like it's going to be a long fight drop Life Giving Spores in the combat area. If there's a tough target and/or you accidentally pulled extra mobs look for a good Spore Cloud Anchor. KO Blow with Dmg procs does some pretty impressive damage for a MM, so you can use it to speed up taking out bosses that are still standing. Mix in Heals and Provokes as needed... Etc. The core powers and slotting compromises: Spoiler Biggest compromise - This is one of the more difficult builds I've worked on, which is saying a lot. It absolutely crushed me to have to take two full purple Winter sets essentially in proc mule powers I didn't even want, just to be able to get the bare minimum I needed to get near 32.5 def with Hybrid Support Embodiment I tried everything imaginable, including switch from a typed to positional defense build. But all the powers I wanted to slot and that had good set bonuses were in the 35+ range. And School of Sharks the one 35+ I was willing to short slot had to be taken 1st in the Leviathan powers. Meaning there just weren't enough slots to 6 slot Entangling, Overgrowth, KO Blow, Spirit Shark and get nice bonuses in Shark Skin etc. The only way I could make it up was with those the 2 x Winter sets and their massive 2 x 5% Def bonuses. In a dream world I would have fit Spring Attack in since it's a great Tankermind opener that works very well with Entangling Aura. But I would have had to drop core /Nature or Leviathan gimmick powers and also give up def...it just wasn't worth it. /Time definitely has a slot advantage a Leviathan proc build like this since Farsight takes the pressure of chasing +Def set bonuses. Endurance: The only way you can run all the toggles and use all high endurance active powes and attacks is from the massive reductions you get from Overgrowth and Hybrid support. Without those a few KO Blows and you need to take a breather... So you need to fire those powers off before fights! The Endurance Reductions also let me short slot Stamina. In regards to Health it was tempting to switch to a 6 x Numina's in Wild Bastion for the 3.75% Ranged by moving the unique from Health. But I couldn't make Postional Def workout, so it wasn't worth the slots in the end. The Endurance recovery from Numina's versus more Enhancement in Stamina is about a wash. You might be better off with with the 15 HP bonus from Performance Shifter, but I opted for the 0.67 +Regen from Numina's. Call Thugs Here's another Proc Gimmick --- Overwhelming Force: KB to KD adds an immense amount of mitigation, which by shear number of pets you get the most mileage from in Tier1 pets. But the gimmick is the IO turns Arsonist's Firebomb burn patch into a mini Bonfire KD patch. It also works with his other aoe powers. He's still suicidal, but it's much harder for him to self destruct when the enemies aren't standing up.... I usually use Musculature to "top off" the pet damage on MM's. It was very hard to fit all the sets and procs in while still hitting 95% Dmg ED. Overwhelming force in place of an Explosive Strike proc, get another 26% Dmg... Call Enforcers In my tests I was getting the most DPS from Enforcers. So I wanted to be able to fit two procs, but I also needed two Def IO's and it would be nice to have +Tohit for their Leadership since fitting in all the procs and sets meant I would need to skimp a bit on Accuracy... Each Dmg proc was getting around 15 dps, so I think probably best with Touch of Lady Gray and Shield Breaker. But this likely changes depending on the enemy you're facing. Gaussian's might actually be better. Against hard targets like AV, Achilles Heel proc might be best since it helps the Damage done by everything else and Lore pets are higher Dps.... My strategy is to use Unslotters to swap out at will. Getting four free slots was tough. I used a Hami, in place of the +5 Boosted LOG Def I wanted. The Hami let me get the necessary Endurance Reduction and some Tohit for Leadership. But it comes at the cost of about 2% Global Defense to Thugs pets. If you can find a +3 Hami you can get that back, but I haven't seen any since Live.... Gang War I had to slot mule three pet procs, so put the Superior Command of the Mastermind proc here, letting get bonuses for a set of four. Arbitrary design choice: I slotted for max Recharge rather than Full Damage. You can shift this back towards Dmg by swapping in the Dmg/End if you prefer. Call Bruiser Some people like to split the 'Mark of Supremacy' set into three pars of two for a total of 30% Recharge. I couldn't do this with all procs like free 4 slots in Enforcers, and fit in the set of four Commmand of the MM. It was also nice to get the 5% Melee and 2.5% S/L Def from four Mark of Supremacy. Definitely need the Explosive Strike here for DPS, adds a good bit of DPS ?? SouldBound Allegiance might actually be better in Call Thugs. Arsonist is doing some pretty impressive damage from Burn. And the tier1 pets would benefit more from the +Tohit bonuses... Should be easy to test since you can just use an unslotter to swap.... Maneuvers Slot mule for the Shieldwall and Scaling Def uniques giving you another 8% - 15% Resistance With Hybrid Support Core Embodiment Thugs can hit soft cap without this. 10% from pet procs. + 22.38% (2 x 11.19) from Enforcers Maneuvers = 32.38% That means 12% from the Hybrid Support gets them to 44.38%. So Maneuvers gets them over and gives a little margin. But you're MM needs its and so do the your Lore Pets since they also will not get the Enforcers 2 x Maneuvers buff. Hasten This is core on /Nature because you need Overgrowth near perma and you want Wild Bastion up as often as possible. Spore Cloud Would have loved the Rech set bonus from a 4 x Dark Watchers but build was too tight. I short slotted this power because I found it was slow enough that I only used on hard targets like AVs. AV's were minimally impacted by the -Tohit, so mostly what it was doing was the -16 Dmg, which is unhanceable. By that logic in short slotting all you give up is Endurance Reduction and set bonuses.... I alsos seriously considered skipping this to fit in the Fighting Pool or Spring Attack. I think those are viable build options but you have to also skip one more power....which one? Lifegiving Spores I short slotted this power because I found I only needed and used in long fights. The heal buff from Spiritual meant a single +5 boosted Heal gets it up to a good enough 86% Heal. So I mostly gave up set bonuses and Endurance. Mid's lists this a using a tiny 0.08/s Endurance which is wrong. In game it's actually a much great 0.33/s. Theoretically, you should still get the Endurance more than returned. But in practice you aren't also able to stay in power's aura. You could mitigate that with a Perfomance Shifter proc, but this power doesn't seem to trigger on the same proc frequency as Stamina and it only works when the power is up which costs you 0.33/s Endurance. So in the end I dropped the proc to free up a slot for elsewhere. When I needed this most I was often also running the Spore Cloud toggle. The two combined could lead to Endurance struggles, especially if the fight strays out of the Lifegiving aura radious, so I changed to an endurance/End Reduction. If you know you can stay in the aura you're better off with a pure End mod IO So Further Research needed: I saw that @SmalltalkJava mentioned the Performance Shifter and Panacea both work in aoe on teammates and pets here! I have not tested and that's definitely not the way those IO's work in any other powers I've tried. Everywhere else I know of they only target the caster. But if they work in aoe on targets here, then while wouldn't help the MM it would be great for teamates and pets. In which you the slotting should absolutely be retooled to move them here.... But there are some downsides: (1) you only get their procs when lifegiving is toggledon, so you would have to leave it running at previously fight locaitons while traveling. (2) Health should fire more frequently, so the MM would take a loss on Panacea since it's unique. Peformance Shifter could be slotted in both... Wild Bastion Absorb enhancement values weirdly seems to be static and not dependent on Heal enhancement value. So there's no advantage amount to the pure Heal IO's and we want Recharge, so we take the two +5 boosted Recharge Preventative Medicine IO's. That caps Absorb and gets Rech to 104% with the buff from Spiritual. Provoke You need this for for Tankerminding to leverage mitigation you get from the Absorb Shields and aoe heal. Provoke has a short duration and you want good odds of not missing. So you need at least some Taunt ehancement and some accuracy, which only come in separate IO's. You have to use at least two IO's. Once you're at two you might as well add 4 more for the 2.5% S/L, 3.13% Fire/Cold and 7.5% Rech. Tough to get that many bonuses in four slots... Entangling Aura Toggle powers have poor proc chances, made worse by the somewhar larg 15'radious. Dmg procs on my take are a waste here since I'm so starved for slots. But Lockdown chance for hold I think it an exception. Toggle check for procing IOs every 10s and an single proc of Lockdown can take out an enemies for 8s. Making this makes this power more reliable for holding minions and giving a chance to hold Lts and bosses. Whereas a single random proc of a dmg IO isn't likely to kill it, so they are not prevented from attacking.... Entomb Absorb seeemed like a novel idea, but in my testing it just wasn't up reliably even in full spawns. And against single targets it was rarely up. Definitely not worth slotting here if you have any other non toggle Hold powers. I really wanted to fit either an entire set of Lockdown for the +Def bonuses are even better an entire set Entomb again for the +Def bonuses. 6 x Entomb I couldn't do because I need the proc in another power and also didn't want to give up the Lockdown proc. 6 x Lockdown or 5 x Entomb 1 x Lockdown proc I couldn't do because I couldn't spare slots and could get more +Def from Muling 6 x Winters sets... Compromise: 2 x +5 boosted Basilisk Gaze gets 2.5% E/N Def and gives enough Endurance Reduction for you to get by when combined with the reductions from Overgrowth and Hybrid Support. Overgrowth I really wanted 6 x Gaussian's to work here. But I couldn't make positional Def numbers work out and Gaussian's didn't give enough Typed defense. So like with Entangling Aura I had to settle for using the slots to mule another 6 x Winters set. Rectified Recticle give a much needed 1.88% S/L, a tiny bit of +Tohit and just enough +Rech to reach a comforable 110% with Spiritual and a +5 boosted Recharge. You could shave off 3s by gonig all in on Rech but I'm counting on the FF proc gimmick to make up the difference needed to perma overgrowth. In testing I was mostly able to keep this up constantly in combat, so long as I was good about religiously spaming KO Blow. KO Blow's 100% FF rech buff seemed to give somewhere around an equivlent of 20 - 30% global Rechage over the course of combat. The big downside being you can't get the buff outside of combat, so your effective Rech drops while traveling between fights... School of Sharks Really would have liked to fit Anhilation -Res and Gravitational Anchor Chance for Hold here. But I was short on slots. I sacraficed here because this power's lower cooldwon makes it ahve much worse proc chances, made all the worse by the 23% Rech from Superior Frozen Blast Chance for Immob, which I wanted inorder to stack Mag5. Depending on whims you might prefer swaping that proc out for Gravitational Anchor or the -Res... Or even stealing proc slots from Spirit Shark or KO Blow... Knockout Blow I need the 2.5% E/N Def and the accuracy. But otherwise could have fit another Dmg or the -Res proc here. Depending on Playstyle you might prefer the Entomb proc here, so that you only have one power you need to spam. Then you'd use Spirit Shark simply as a way to hold and take out annoying targets at range.... The FF proc gimmick is core to the Leviathan Strat The two purple dmg procs maximum the damage the power has. +5 Boosted Hetacomb gets 66% Dmg, which because this power has high base dmg of 109 gets you roughly as much damage as another standard Dmg proc, but without the 10% not procing RNG risk... It also gets you a nice 0.07recovery bonus. Spirit Shark Again I needed ethe 2.5% E/N Def and the accuracy. The Devastation Chance for Hold makes this into a reliabe mag5 ranged hold for taking out annoying targets. The Apocalypes Dmg proc is your best single dmg available since I already used the purple hold proc in KO Blow. Entomb here is my preference for ease of play since ranged powers are easier to spam. But again since you already need to spam KO Blow for the FF proc recharge buff it might be better to put Entomb in KO Blow. For consideration - Decimation: Chance for Build --- At zero Rech Decimation has an impressive ~57% chance to proc. Unfortunately, with Spiritual's 45%, Entomb's 23.1875% and Basilisk's 15.225% for a total of 84% rech that proc chance drops to 32%. Might still be worth it in certain playstyles since you can time Spirit Shark's Build up to buff KO Blow's good Damage. Or even better if it buffs Judgement! But given the recharge reduced proc chance and the complication of timing it I opted not to use in this build... Shark Skin Really would have loved to squeeze in some set bonuses from Unbreakable Guard. I just couldn't make positional def work and that makes Unbreak Guard's def bonus less valueable. In the end I couldn't make it work. I couldn't even fit in the bonus +7.5% HP unique, which defintely made me sad. The Example Build: Urban Ecology Club" Thugs/Nature MM build using Mid's Reborn v2.6.0.5 Spoiler http://www.cohplanner.com/mids/download.php?uc=1604&c=805&a=1610&f=HEX&dc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| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1604;805;1610;HEX;| |78DA6594494C136114C7BFE94CA92D6529055A0A485B16A12D2D55BC7810B5A051A| |981B0EA850CD065B45BBA187BF4E0C15D50E351132FB85E8C267A45144CBC9148F4| |A48989461113F5E2A53EBEF7A4937492E6F7FABEF77FCBF7CD37C133FDC6C787CEF| |631A13A10933399A9A09CC986D2712531AB0DCA116546648C59FBD3813DF6B1F4B4| |9CB00FCC2463C948DE1E88E5A6ED3A58B414155323B9783C99F08E4673914C8BCA7| |F20170E7B8FC9D95C3A34B53F1C56124A36CFAA8692C998773024CF86D299A89232| |F0FF23A95068D6C4CDA09C5052B9989C559209E3FFE0949288380652CA8C57957F3| |0745A91B3513941EDE7ADD0980F7E8B5A464F41CBC624C6FC12D34C10FB34403D93| |3E019B2526FDD6707FD94791F37DEB9696311BE3BE0FE013D0A711BE8B5C6FFC427| |431CEF31023F2A08228FA70ADBA1759B31373D7B461EC12F4A7A51A5A07D630C1AE| |EA48AFAB13785CED51D4D56E609EFA5FF8FF02D4D2935EFF02E7790D09CB69E6F2B| |DE8ABDF87B4BEC519AD65229FD9B61BC22491D9A88E136A57606DA1C28D3D36112F| |42AD2ACC2B54CD61BE269A63196A9AA8A669057BDBBE4C5C22BE42DAFFE09CF6AFC| |01D12BB0479CDB4A7E66F389F9DF6D6B18E1A1BF45547F9EBA2388323463C896C3D| |45548871E44BE8CD425ACB029E7DDB3DE27DE20364C743E223E40A681B48DB304A6| |BE3C81D93C4E3C43CD4334BAC2B80752FC35C8DB45F8D345717CD550FF334E33EB3| |66DAFB3750AB85CEB285DE852710EEA41CCECF94E339D6BB0AF9DB69DFDAEFE279B| |86E13F999E9D8BA91B14EEABF736DF33DD732D7EA26F5CCD381B19E73D8AFC78DEC| |3E8C7C06E5DCA895DC6B7847BA57897E8CF12D612FBE05ECF72968BC3897C66B117| |81D9F17E7F35B05AEBD027DF7504CCF5FCCE35FC39EFCEF904D92EADE5EC31A6573| |C86DF3C4EB48C30DE24DA44B52DDDB023CACA7C4E32FF1EC2AF1F4967806D51E3D7| |61E2CFA0A43D2D6D781095CA1AF866F01ADAE1B6095CE5CE8C67BB351F469842302| |BF0F95E302CF5CE9C077FF875AD789BA9F459F20DCC24EAAE7F13C870DBC3F5E734| |2654FAAEC132ADB530B32CC55386829DAC3E6A2CD9F3B9B0E122D3A8BF63F32E711| |E3| |-------------------------------------------------------------------| To Be added later: (Cleaned up) Shared Google Sheet with the PPM calculations I used Edited October 13, 2019 by Dr Causality Formatting / added note about Decimation proc
Couthless Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 Quote Chanc for -Res --- ?? Is this a bug. KO Blow accepts Targeted aoe sets?? Hmm how about 90% chance of procing an Annihilation chance for -Res? Is that something that happens in game, or is it just a bug with Mids?
Redlynne Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 Paging @SmalltalkJava ... please pick up the white telephone that's burning with hellfire ... 1 1 Verbogeny is one of many pleasurettes afforded a creatific thinkerizer.
Dr Causality Posted October 9, 2019 Author Posted October 9, 2019 1 hour ago, Couthless said: Is that something that happens in game, or is it just a bug with Mids? My first thought too. I only tested on Beta server, but it's working there. 1
SmalltalkJava Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 Mmm. Yummy I love me some /Nature. Kudos for testing out new approaches also! I love it! I’m typing this in my phone at the moment. So I my apologies. But for some MM Nature research look through my posts. I’ve done several builds for different pet sets and Nature. And I love it when people actually learn from, validate, even invalidate any efforts that I’ve put in. Efforts should be reproducible! I always worry if I didn’t something wrong or over looked something. The hold proc in Entangling Aura rocks. I love it. I didn’t always use it due to build slot space but I love it. - The damage procs in it were ok. Not great but ok. - The absorb proc in it was kind of blah when I tried it. I think it can only proc on a player every 90 seconds or so. Again I’m going off memory and could be wrong. But my memory seems to recall their being some wording in it about a proc limit. But I’ve tried so many things that it all gets crossed up. Procs in lifegiving spores. Mmm yummy Panacea and Performance Shifter will proc in every pet and player in the spore field! And in the MM also! The other health procs don’t impact the things in the field,Numinias miracle and such. I tried the stun proc in one of the endo sets and it didn’t seem to work. I’m not sure on its mag. But it just basically turned the spores from a non aggro patch to an aggro patch. Wild Bastion. LOL. Pure sweet sauce baby!!!! It takes the absorb percent of the MM’s health to get an amount of raw HP and gives that to EVERYTHING in range. Let me lay down a scenario. * Resilient Incarnate gives + absorb. *Power Boost increases Absorb effect. Combine those and you get a capped out health absorb of 802 or 803 (what ever the MM’s base HP is) that is the max limit. A player can only have absorb totaling their base HP. Soooo. All your pets get and absorb of 802 HP every time bastion is available. Depending on the build every 63 to 75 ish seconds! Now if you take BurnOut!! You can, every couple minutes, insta recharge it and cast it again! If it works for Thugs Gang War, you might as well bend it to work for demons/nature also! Hell on Earth 2 different pets! Wild Bastion ! I just thought of this burnout idea yesterday. So One thing I haven’t tried yet is if you burnout bastion will it double stack on the pets? What if 2 natures bastion the same pets will it stack? Dunno, I just know that the player can only have base cap absorb. Any ways T1 pets have hp 574 ish. Stack on 803 to that! *I’m not sure if pets have an absorb limit or not* Get those pet def/resist aura IOs and wowza keep the pets close but not in bodyguard for max usage. As Nature it usually isn’t you dying. The pets still do when I play but I’m not very good at hand eye coordination. You want your defenses and resists high as you can reasonably get them. Get that recharge up as high as you can so stuff is available. Unfortunately, the only way to gauge pet absorb is via the pet window and floating heal numbers when you cast it. Pet window shows visual bar ratio of absorb vs natural hp. You can see the ratio differences in the different tiers of pets. I need to find if their getting the full 800+ hp. I forgot to check when I did resilient and powerboost combo. LOL. Nature is solid. I haven’t really gone all out and put procs in spore cloud. It takes 1 or two iirc. But so far I’ve just gone the -to hit set enhancements and not Procd it. This isn’t MM related but I tested an Nature/Ice Defender and I’m not even sure he could die. (Build is on the forum, attack chain probably needs work). But wow. Fought a pylon, endo never dropped below 90% and my health basically never moved. Stand in that Lifegiving spores field. Lol. Again. Please retest and verify any info that I’ve provided I want to provide people accurate info. It’s my nature to always wonder if I did something wrong or overlooked something. I’m a build newbie. I still have no true idea what I’ll really doing in regards to mathematically building good sets builds. It’s all about the math. I suck at math. Which is why I never finished my degree in physics and switched to computers. I’ll let them do the math. Baseline MM Henchmen Defenses and Resist Values MM - Beast Pets - Pet Attack usage and some quick proc testing
Redlynne Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 40 minutes ago, SmalltalkJava said: The hold proc in Entangling Aura rocks. I love it. I didn’t always use it due to build slot space but I love it. - The damage procs in it were ok. Not great but ok. - The absorb proc in it was kind of blah when I tried it. I think it can only proc on a player every 90 seconds or so. You're thinking of Preventative Medicine which has a proc once per 90s limitation on it. 41 minutes ago, SmalltalkJava said: Now if you take BurnOut!! You can, every couple minutes, insta recharge it and cast it again! Last time I checked, Burnout has a 30 minute base recharge, so I'm a little dubious of an "every couple of minutes" use for it. Verbogeny is one of many pleasurettes afforded a creatific thinkerizer.
SmalltalkJava Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Redlynne said: Last time I checked, Burnout has a 30 minute base recharge, so I'm a little dubious of an "every couple of minutes" use for it. Yeah. I can’t remember exactly what it is. I have it in my thugs poison. But it’s up enough to have fun with. Double Gang War and double Poison Trap and two different bonfires 🙂. Hasten and two +5 recharge IOS and some recharge set bonuses. So. Every 15 minutes maybe? I can’t check Mids atm. But it’s a fun gimmick. - Ahh preventive medicine that it. I stand corrected. I’ll have to revisit the absorb proc again in entangling. As a matter of fact. Now that I think about it. One of the PI portal mission videos that I posted showed me ending a fight with more absorb than I started it with due to the proc in entangling. Nice!!! @Dr Causality I can’t wait wait to see your mad build experiment! Very exciting to see what you come up with. Edited October 9, 2019 by SmalltalkJava Baseline MM Henchmen Defenses and Resist Values MM - Beast Pets - Pet Attack usage and some quick proc testing
Redlynne Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 2 hours ago, SmalltalkJava said: The hold proc in Entangling Aura rocks. I love it. I agree. On 9/7/2019 at 6:30 PM, Redlynne said: Level 35: Entangling Aura (A) Basilisk's Gaze - Recharge/Hold: Level 27 (36) Basilisk's Gaze - Endurance/Recharge/Hold: Level 27 (36) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge/Hold: Level 27 (36) Basilisk's Gaze - Chance for Recharge Slow: Level 10 (37) Entomb - Recharge/Chance for +Absorb: Level 10 (37) Lockdown - Chance for +2 Mag Hold: Level 30 Verbogeny is one of many pleasurettes afforded a creatific thinkerizer.
Dr Causality Posted October 9, 2019 Author Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, SmalltalkJava said: ....for some MM Nature research look through my posts. I’ve done several builds for different pet sets and Nature. And I love it when people actually learn from, validate, even invalidate any efforts that I’ve put in. Efforts should be reproducible! I always worry if I didn’t something wrong or over looked something. This is a different approach than I believe you've tested thus far. Extra Absorb comes from Entomb proc rather than your Powerboost (only impact the MM itself so not as good as Powerboost, but up every 10 -15s...). Recharge comes from Alpha Spiritual and Leviathan FF proc gimmick, rather than Ageless. That frees up Destiny for Barrier, which is great since Nature has no way to get Lore pets anywhere near softcap. I came to this combo because I was trying make a hand to hand combat theme MM build for a friend that would play more like a Tanker but with a small army.... I'd love for you to try it out. Quote The hold proc in Entangling Aura rocks. I love it. I didn’t always use it due to build slot space but I love it. - The damage procs in it were ok. Not great but ok. - The absorb proc in it was kind of blah when I tried it. I think it can only proc on a player every 90 seconds or so. Again I’m going off memory and could be wrong. But my memory seems to recall their being some wording in it about a proc limit. But I’ve tried so many things that it all gets crossed up. Build was slot starved. Much more mileage from procs in Leviathan powers since toggle powers like Entangle Aura don't seem to proc reliably enough. I tested the Entomb in Entangling Aura. It sometimes worked decently when surrounded by a massive mob, but against a solo target like an AV fight it was rarely ever up. Whereas, in Leviathan's KO Blow or Epic Hold it can very reliably proc every 10 - 15s. In my testing there's definitely no 90s cooldown on the Entomb Absorb proc. I never tested how stacking works or even if it will fully stack with Wild Bastion's Absorb. Quote Procs in lifegiving spores. Mmm yummy Panacea and Performance Shifter will proc in every pet and player in the spore field! And in the MM also! The other health procs don’t impact the things in the field,Numinias miracle and such. I tried the stun proc in one of the endo sets and it didn’t seem to work. I’m not sure on its mag. But it just basically turned the spores from a non aggro patch to an aggro patch. This is very interesting as it would be a big team buff. I would love to see some testing about this. But definitely not the way I expect it work based on other powers. In other powers procs from Performance Shifter, Panacea, Miracle, Numina's Theft of Essence etc, only target the caster. That said assuming it works, it actually not that great for the MM itself: (1) You'd have to leave Life Giving Spores running at your old location while traveling to keep benefiting from the Panacea and Performance Shifter procs. (2) I'm not sure how the mechanics would work. Health and Stamina are fairly unique, and the activation period for Life Giving seems to be worse than Health and Stamina, so this might mean a reduced number of procs for the MM. Quote Wild Bastion. LOL. Pure sweet sauce baby!!!! It takes the absorb percent of the MM’s health to get an amount of raw HP and gives that to EVERYTHING in range. Let me lay down a scenario. * Resilient Incarnate gives + absorb. *Power Boost increases Absorb effect. Combine those and you get a capped out health absorb of 802 or 803 (what ever the MM’s base HP is) that is the max limit. A player can only have absorb totaling their base HP. Soooo. All your pets get and absorb of 802 HP every time bastion is available. Depending on the build every 63 to 75 ish seconds! Now if you take BurnOut!! You can, every couple minutes, insta recharge it and cast it again! If it works for Thugs Gang War, you might as well bend it to work for demons/nature also! Hell on Earth 2 different pets! Wild Bastion ! I just thought of this burnout idea yesterday. So One thing I haven’t tried yet is if you burnout bastion will it double stack on the pets? What if 2 natures bastion the same pets will it stack? Dunno, I just know that the player can only have base cap absorb. Any ways T1 pets have hp 574 ish. Stack on 803 to that! *I’m not sure if pets have an absorb limit or not* Get those pet def/resist aura IOs and wowza keep the pets close but not in bodyguard for max usage. As Nature it usually isn’t you dying. The pets still do when I play but I’m not very good at hand eye coordination. You want your defenses and resists high as you can reasonably get them. Get that recharge up as high as you can so stuff is available. Unfortunately, the only way to gauge pet absorb is via the pet window and floating heal numbers when you cast it. Pet window shows visual bar ratio of absorb vs natural hp. You can see the ratio differences in the different tiers of pets. I need to find if their getting the full 800+ hp. I forgot to check when I did resilient and powerboost combo. Quote LOL. Nature is solid. I haven’t really gone all out and put procs in spore cloud. It takes 1 or two iirc. But so far I’ve just gone the -to hit set enhancements and not Procd it. The PPM change seems to have mostly ruined procs in toggle powers. I think the only exceptions are procs like Lockdown Chance for Hold that have an immediate and extended mitigation impact by taking a target out of the fight. Otherwise, slots going to be better used elsewhere. Quote This isn’t MM related but I tested an Nature/Ice Defender and I’m not even sure he could die. (Build is on the forum, attack chain probably needs work). But wow. Fought a pylon, endo never dropped below 90% and my health basically never moved. Stand in that Lifegiving spores field. Lol. Again. Please retest and verify any info that I’ve provided I want to provide people accurate info. It’s my nature to always wonder if I did something wrong or overlooked something. I’m a build newbie. I still have no true idea what I’ll really doing in regards to mathematically building good sets builds. It’s all about the math. I suck at math. Which is why I never finished my degree in physics and switched to computers. I’ll let them do the math. Definitely interested in a Defender that's that sturdy. I saved your build and added to my list of things to play around with on Beta... Edited October 9, 2019 by Dr Causality
Dr Causality Posted October 9, 2019 Author Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) 48 minutes ago, Redlynne said: On 9/7/2019 at 4:30 PM, Redlynne said: Level 35: Entangling Aura (A) Basilisk's Gaze - Recharge/Hold: Level 27 (36) Basilisk's Gaze - Endurance/Recharge/Hold: Level 27 (36) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge/Hold: Level 27 (36) Basilisk's Gaze - Chance for Recharge Slow: Level 10 (37) Entomb - Recharge/Chance for +Absorb: Level 10 (37) Lockdown - Chance for +2 Mag Hold: Level 30 This is solid slotting. I couldn't spare the two additional slots slots for 4 x Basilisks otherwise I would have loved that sweet 7.5% Rech. Definitely one of the most value 4 slots bonuses in game. Entomb is good here if you don't have any other Hold power to drop it in.... But in my testing it doesn't reliably proc in Entangling Aura unless your in large spawns, and even then wasn't up anywhere near reliably or all the time. The uptime gets really bad when you need the Absorb most against single target AV fights. Because it's trying to proc an aoe toggle power on just a single target. My two cents is if you have any non toggle holds, especially single target long cooldown, then Entomb is much better there. For example I'm able to have the Absorb buff up almost every cast with the single target Holds from Leviathan (roughly every 10 - 15s...) Edited October 9, 2019 by Dr Causality
SmalltalkJava Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) Cool info! I did a check on my two burnout builds that i'm working on. Looks like mids has one recharging in 468 seconds. so just shy of 8 minutes. Another has 513 seconds. @Dr Causality interesting approach! Something i need to revisit testing the 2 procs in lifegiving spores. For some reason I am thinking that it doesn't need to be active for the procs to impact the MM. I think i remember seeing that happen. Additionally, unlike defenders version, it doesn't turn off if you run out of range. You can leave spores active and go all over the map. But that is a side note. I don't want to detail your thread. Edited October 9, 2019 by SmalltalkJava Baseline MM Henchmen Defenses and Resist Values MM - Beast Pets - Pet Attack usage and some quick proc testing
Couthless Posted October 10, 2019 Posted October 10, 2019 This is what I am thinking of using in order to go with the high power of Leviathan. I ended up siding against the Absorb proc in KO Blow as I wasn't so sure the extra survivability was necessary and I quite like damage. Also Mids was listnig the +Recharge of the proc at 53% and I am pretty sure that is wrong (and I didn't want the headache of having to figure out the ability's recharge with incorrect information). There are some serious issues with it however. Most notably, I don't see any way of getting away from Ageless not for the Recharge but for the End. That is a serious issue due to the Mez protection of Clarion being basically mandatory for any Tankermind, otherwise you get mezzed, your toggles drop, and you die. I also have no idea what I am doing. I'm sure the pet slotting is all kinds of wrong and I am probably skipping some key powers (I'd really love to get my hands on Time's Junction but don't know what to sacrifice). Any help would be appreciated. http://www.cohplanner.com/mids/download.php?uc=1547&c=754&a=1508&f=HEX&dc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
Redlynne Posted October 10, 2019 Posted October 10, 2019 14 minutes ago, Couthless said: Mids was listnig the +Recharge of the proc at 53% Level 50+5 Common IOs are worth +53% enhancement to their value. Verbogeny is one of many pleasurettes afforded a creatific thinkerizer.
Dr Causality Posted October 10, 2019 Author Posted October 10, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, Couthless said: I ended up siding against the Absorb proc in KO Blow as I wasn't so sure the extra survivability was necessary and I quite like damage. Also Mids was listnig the +Recharge of the proc at 53% and I am pretty sure that is wrong (and I didn't want the headache of having to figure out the ability's recharge with incorrect information). 6 hours ago, Redlynne said: Level 50+5 Common IOs are worth +53% enhancement to their value. Your hunch was right, it's a bug in Mid's stats that hasn't yet been fixed. The Superior version of the Entomb proc actually only has a 23.875% Rech enhancement. But either way with KO Blow being a 40s cooldown single target power you have nothing to worry about in terms of recharge diminishing your proc chances. In fact it's a rare case where you have enough room to spare that it's better with Recharge, so you can use the power and proc more often.... The proc you're worried about is Force Feedback because it's a lowly 2 PPM. But given KO's 40s cooldown that means you go up to 61% Rech while still staying at your 90% proc chance cap. Here's a chart to help out: KO Blow PPM Calculations for Force Feedback Proc % Enh Rech Proc Chance in % 2 PPM (FF) 0.0% 141% capped to 90% 2 PPM (FF) 23.875% Rech 115% capped to 90% 2 PPM (FF) 53.00% Rech 95% capped to 90% 2 PPM (FF) 61.50% Rech 89.99% 2 PPM (FF) 99.13% Rech 74.39% So optimally even for proc builds you'd actually slot KO Blow for recharge as close to 61% recharge as you can get without passing it.... Edited October 10, 2019 by Dr Causality
Dr Causality Posted October 10, 2019 Author Posted October 10, 2019 (edited) On 10/9/2019 at 6:31 PM, Couthless said: This is what I am thinking of using in order to go with the high power of Leviathan. I ended up siding against the Absorb proc in KO Blow as I wasn't so sure the extra survivability was necessary and I quite like damage. Also Mids was listnig the +Recharge of the proc at 53% and I am pretty sure that is wrong (and I didn't want the headache of having to figure out the ability's recharge with incorrect information). There are some serious issues with it however. Most notably, I don't see any way of getting away from Ageless not for the Recharge but for the End. That is a serious issue due to the Mez protection of Clarion being basically mandatory for any Tankermind, otherwise you get mezzed, your toggles drop, and you die. I also have no idea what I am doing. I'm sure the pet slotting is all kinds of wrong and I am probably skipping some key powers (I'd really love to get my hands on Time's Junction but don't know what to sacrifice). Any help would be appreciated. http://www.cohplanner.com/mids/download.php?uc=1547&c=754&a=1508&f=HEX&dc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n general build looks viable as is. Looks sturdy but I'd try to find a way to fit in more of the /Time powers. As for Clarion: Fighting Malta without Clarion is admittedly rough. But I don't usually want to use up Destiny on Clarion. Unless something can chain mezz you, I find I'm usually okay getting periodically mezzed on a well built MM. Sure you drop toggles, but as a Tankermind you don't drop your biggest damage mitation: Bodyguard mode's damage dispersion. When you're mezzed your pets are still attacking helping pull aggro from you, so with good Def and Resistance I find I rarely get chain stunned that I can solve by combining insps into a break free. Even soloing the ITF on a MM, an unexpected early Nictus kill that stuns me and my whole troop of minions hasn't killed me lately. But it's all about playstyle, so I get you wanting Clarion. Because we've all had the experience of sitting there unable move as a few critters slow carve you into pieces... And Clarion is a nice power to offer your teams. But back to your build: 1st Priority - Distortion Field - Find a way to fit it in your build. It doesn't look impressive in Mid's but its' surprisingly good in action in terms of mitigation. But slot it for Slow that way you can open with Distortion Field and things move so slowly they'll have trouble closing into melee range. The slow movement combined with Provoke's Taunt and strategic movement shuts down a lot of attacks. Once you've taunted, you can kite around jumping to opposite sides of the field punching things and mobs will slooooooly try to reach you. Keep applying Taunt and moving so they chase you back and forth across the Distortion Field. That way they end up not doing much besides moving slowly, and because of the -Rech they don't even get to use their ranged attacks often... If you're feeling starved for slots you only need a single +5 boosted Slow to take advantage of this playstyle mechanic. But Distortion Field is an usual power. With PPM changes most of these type powers like toggles are no longer worth slotting with Procs. But Distortion Field has a long duraction and relatively low cooldown. Combined with /Times 50% Rech buff, you can get high recharge builds capable of triple stacking Distortion Field! These kind of powers should get a chance to proc ever 10s. Distortion lasts long enough to get 4 proc chances. Even double stacked that starts to be a lot of proc chances for an aoe power you only have to cast once. It's an exception that's worth slotting for dmg procs if you can find the room. Using the SNBR Damage tracking meter, a single dmg proc in Distortion Field generated me around 5 DPS. For comparision Enforcers together usually get around 50 - 74 DPS and my tier1 Bots usually only get in the mid 30's. So 5 DPS is that's a great return on single IO slot... Stretch Goal - Time's Juncture - This is a skippable power on ranged builds. But since you're taking a lot of melee attacks you'd get good mileage out of this and it's definitely worth giving something up. If starved for slots you can slot it just for Endurance Reduction. Out of the box it's a slow that stacks with Distortion Field and a -15% Dmg, this will make it even easier to kite enemies around and you take less damage. The -Tohit is just a bonus. The other utility on a Tankermind is, especially when soloing auras like this helps your MM retain aggro. Last thought: Evaluate your playstyle strategy and the value of Procs in Low cooldown attacks - You've got a lot procs in Boxing and Kick. With a standard 3.5 PPM dmg proc Boxing has roughly a ~21% chance to proc and Kick with it's longer castime has a ~28% chance. That means for a standard 3.5 PPM dmg proc you get an estimated value (average) of around 15 Dmg per actiation in Boxing. Boxing is up almost instantly, and you can easily put 3 - 5 procs, so that's very respectable DPS for a MM. But a MM has lots to do besides repeatedly jabbing things in the face. It's a playstyle difference but I'd rather put those procs into long cooldown powers that gives higher proc chance, so I can use it less frequently for roughly the some overall damage. But either way since Boxing casts and recharges so fast you probably don't need to proc out both Boxing and Kick.... Boxing looks like it's slightly better Damage Per Animation, so better overall DPS than Kick. Kick knocks enemies away, which is handy for mitigation but annoying for when you want to keep hitting them with melee attacks. Crosspunch is a surprisingly good power for MM's. I would take everytime if I didn't also have to take Boxing and Kick to get the most from it. At zero recharge in Crosspunch, standard 3.5 PPM dmg procs have a 41% proc chance and 4.5 PPM purples have ~61% proc chance. My favorite slotting is 3 x Eradications for the massive 3.13% E/N Def set bonus: 1 x Dmg - boosted to +5 for for 43.5% dmg 1 x Acc/Dmg/End/Rech(+5) boosted to 19.03% 1 x Chance for Energy Dmg. The 19% recharge on a single boosted Acc/Dmg/End/Rech only drops your proc chances by roughly 6% (depending on the PPM value...), so usually seems worth it for the +Def bonus. That still leaves 3 slots for other procs like Armegeddon, FF, Fury of the Gladiator, etc. I build /Time very differently. /Time has so many good powers and it's +50% Recharge buff means you get a lot more mileage from proc builds. My strategy for standard game content is to just build for 33% Def...so one small purple insp away from softcap. You can easily fill in that missing 12.5% Def with a bind or macro button that combines inspirations. But there's not an Insp that will fill in all the powers you gave up and all the slots you used chasing that last 12.5% Def. Another bonus to using the Insp and set bonuses instead of toggles is you don't drop your defense numbers when mezzed.... With Farsight /Time can get to 33% Def so easily that you don't even need the Tough or Weave from the Fighting Pool. This means you can make weird novelty theme builds like fit in Spring Attack, slotted with FF and other procs, while taking almost all the /Time powers. Spring Attack makes for a very nice opener or follow up to dropping Distortion Field since it immediately gets you into range for Time's Juncture and has good chances to KD enemies... To further free up slots for Procs I take Musculature Radial Paragon. It's about 20% more dmg on your Thugs, and makes more creative slotting for procs possible. Additionally, it boosts the Endurance in ChonoShift and Stamina helping with Endurance issues you can end up with from having so many attack powers. But if you aren't comfortble fitzing with inspiration combing during combat, then this playstyile won't be very good or fun. That's one thing I love about this game, so many ways to play.... Edited October 13, 2019 by Dr Causality Copy/Paste Typo putting Times' Junction as top when it should have been Distortion Field. 1
SmalltalkJava Posted October 21, 2019 Posted October 21, 2019 On 10/9/2019 at 2:37 AM, Dr Causality said: The Devastation Chance for Hold makes this into a reliabe mag5 ranged hold for taking out annoying targets. The Apocalypes Dmg proc is your best single dmg available since I already used the purple hold proc in KO Blow. Cool build. I'm still perusing it in my off time. I do have a question that I've never tested or seen actually tested. Does the Devastation Hold proc mag actually stack with the hold power that it is in? I always wondered about Lockdown and Entangling if they actually stacked for combined magnitude. I just couldn't think of a way to actually test it. Let me know! Baseline MM Henchmen Defenses and Resist Values MM - Beast Pets - Pet Attack usage and some quick proc testing
Omega-202 Posted October 21, 2019 Posted October 21, 2019 7 minutes ago, SmalltalkJava said: Cool build. I'm still perusing it in my off time. I do have a question that I've never tested or seen actually tested. Does the Devastation Hold proc mag actually stack with the hold power that it is in? I always wondered about Lockdown and Entangling if they actually stacked for combined magnitude. I just couldn't think of a way to actually test it. Let me know! Yes, it stacks. I can safely confirm this after running Electric Shackles on my Stalker with the Devastation proc. A single application will take a boss out of the fight when the proc fires (90% of the time as the PPP holds have a 32 s recharge). 1 1
SmalltalkJava Posted October 21, 2019 Posted October 21, 2019 11 minutes ago, Omega-202 said: Yes, it stacks. I can safely confirm this after running Electric Shackles on my Stalker with the Devastation proc. A single application will take a boss out of the fight when the proc fires (90% of the time as the PPP holds have a 32 s recharge). freakin' sweet. Baseline MM Henchmen Defenses and Resist Values MM - Beast Pets - Pet Attack usage and some quick proc testing
Dr Causality Posted October 21, 2019 Author Posted October 21, 2019 (edited) On 10/20/2019 at 7:44 PM, Omega-202 said: Yes, it stacks. I can safely confirm this after running Electric Shackles on my Stalker with the Devastation proc. A single application will take a boss out of the fight when the proc fires (90% of the time as the PPP holds have a 32 s recharge). Like Omega-202 said the procs stack with whatever other mezz the target is under, even from the same power the proc is slotted into. The reason to use the Devastation proc instead of the Lockdown, is Devastion is a 3 PPM, whereas Lockdown is just a 2.5 PPM. It makes a surprisingly big difference in how recharge you can get away with. In Spirit Shark Jaws w/ Devastation you should be able to go up to roughly 98% Rech slotting while still staying at the 90% proc chance cap. Whereas with Lockdown you'd have to stay under 27% recharge. So by using the Devastation version you can get away with taking Alpha Spiritual for a 45% Recharge boost, plus some +Rech slotting from Basilisks and still be at the 90% cap... Edited October 22, 2019 by Dr Causality
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