Regen rework/ideas.

[Galaxy Brain]

11 minutes ago, AgentForest said:

I do like the discussion going on here, but my brain, upon first seeing this post's name, was hoping to find one thing here and did not.  So I'll include my suggestion here:

Can regen, finally, heal in smaller intervals more often?  Across all power sets?

For example, you tend to heal in chunks every second or two, but what if the powers just increased the rate at which you received single hitpoints.  Not changing the overall total of healing per second that regen stats provide, but changing the rate and frequency at which that value is added to your health bar so that it's a constant, consistent flow of health instead of a weird, staggered jolt of HP every so often.

That would be nice if there were say, a toggle that were like the Blaster /Fire that actually healed you X/Sec instead of being faster regeneration in the traditional sense.

[Sarrate]

59 minutes ago, AgentForest said:

I do like the discussion going on here, but my brain, upon first seeing this post's name, was hoping to find one thing here and did not.  So I'll include my suggestion here:

Can regen, finally, heal in smaller intervals more often?  Across all power sets?

For example, you tend to heal in chunks every second or two, but what if the powers just increased the rate at which you received single hitpoints.  Not changing the overall total of healing per second that regen stats provide, but changing the rate and frequency at which that value is added to your health bar so that it's a constant, consistent flow of health instead of a weird, staggered jolt of HP every so often.

 

46 minutes ago, Galaxy Brain said:

That would be nice if there were say, a toggle that were like the Blaster /Fire that actually healed you X/Sec instead of being faster regeneration in the traditional sense.

 

Aside from a way of sidestepping regen resistance (using periodic heals that scale off current max hp rather than fixed off base hp), I really don't see changing the tick rate as being beneficial. Regeneration causes players to gain 5% of their hp every 12 seconds (240 sec to go from 1 to full). With just Health, Fast Healing, and Integration 3 slotted with SOs (559% total regen) that drops the tick period down to 2.1 seconds (12 / 5.59).

 

Honestly, healing that 5% health smoothly over 2.1 seconds or all at once is completely immaterial to Regen's problems. If it's going to die, regenerating 4.8% health in 2 sec or 5% health at 2.1 sec isn't going to make the difference.

 

I'd rather not just make changes for cosmetic reasons without addressing a core problem, and that's dying to burst damage.

[AgentForest]

3 hours ago, Sarrate said:

Honestly, healing that 5% health smoothly over 2.1 seconds or all at once is completely immaterial to Regen's problems.

I didn't say it was a balance issue.  I said we have the processing power and ability to make that cosmetic change, and a post about Regen seemed a valid place to put it.

I'd also support doing it for Endurance drain/recovery as well.  It would be a lot easier to visually gauge when your bar would be full or depleted.  Instead of seeing it tick down every second, then up every 5 seconds, just having it replenishing at a constant rate because of the current boosts and drains on your Endurance balancing out to form a single, constant contribution would be better for quality of life.  If your base recovery is 2.08 per second, and you activate a toggle with 0.26/sec end cost, it would make more sense and would make power activation more reliable (less likely for toggles to just drop in combat) if it just made your endurance recover at 1.82/sec.  And make that happen steadily throughout that second.

For Regeneration as an effect, it wouldn't change the number values of the regeneration, but would help visually express how fast your health is actually declining at a glance, which helps when one is deciding when to activate panic moves.  Other people already brought up ways to mitigate dying to burst damage.  It would be redundant for me to go over all of those suggestions again.  Having Integration provide that Absorb over time shield that "Instant Regeneration" provides for Sentinels is a great start for that.  Converting "Dull Pain" into an absorb shield plus regeneration effect helps too.  But I felt it wasn't really useful to reiterate old comments.

Edited March 24, 2020 by AgentForest

[Tugzug]

I do like the idea of a regenerator getting more resilience the lower their HP gets. Weak to alpha but strong to consistent damage!

 

I'd also like some minor buff to MoG, but considering how garbage most T9 armors are by comparison, I guess I shouldn't be too greedy.

[quixoteprog]

A lot of the problems could be seriously mitigated, I think, by adding a power that just increased your health, by a fairly large amount. Could be 50% enhanceable up to 100%-150%, whatever amount would be able to give you enough of a cushion to give you the surviveability comparable to invulnerability or willpower. The problem is that increasing health also increases regeneration since it is a percentage of health. So it would have to be very finely tuned.

[Sarrate]

58 minutes ago, quixoteprog said:

A lot of the problems could be seriously mitigated, I think, by adding a power that just increased your health, by a fairly large amount. Could be 50% enhanceable up to 100%-150%, whatever amount would be able to give you enough of a cushion to give you the surviveability comparable to invulnerability or willpower. The problem is that increasing health also increases regeneration since it is a percentage of health. So it would have to be very finely tuned.

The problem with that approach is twofold. First, Regen already has a +MaxHP power, Dull Pain. Second, MaxHP has a cap which varies from AT to AT. On a Scrapper, it's around +80% MaxHP. That's trivial to reach for Regen, Dull Pain (60%) and Accolades (20%) get you there. Brutes have some room to grow (cap at +114%), and I'm not sure about Sentinels (I'm guessing their hp cap is fairly low).

 

Either way, even for Brutes, the caps aren't high enough to have +MaxHP make a meaningful difference.

[SwitchFade]

It's Wednesday so.....

 

Nerf Regen.

[Galaxy Brain]

Hm, if we are tossing all sorts of ideas at the wall, how about a bonus if you are at 100% hp?

 

The problem with Regen is that it cannot take an alpha well, and conversely it lacks any sort of mitigation unless you are actually being damaged. Maybe if certain powers in the set (the passives) also had a built in bonus effect if you are at full health:

 

Fast Healing: when at full HP, gain an absorb layer equal to 10% of your hp (enhanceable)

 

Resilience: when at full HP, the resistance values are doubled (enhanceable) and you also gain a small amount of defense vs all (3%, unenhanceable).

 

The idea would be these two could combine to give you a sturdier layer of mitigation. Jumping into a fight at full health, and rewarding you for constantly healing back to full and giving you some breathing room once you do so vs a number of hits or one big hit.

[Haijinx]

maybe Regen should have scaling Defense 

 

Allowing it to be the inverse of SR 

 

 

[Haijinx]

I mean.  After it gets nerfed of course. 

[Galaxy Brain]

5 hours ago, Haijinx said:

maybe Regen should have scaling Defense 

 

Allowing it to be the inverse of SR 

 

 

Scaling up the more HP you have? I would rather any HP scaling on regen for things that aren't healing stats to be with higher HP, to encourage good play.

[Menelruin]

8 hours ago, Galaxy Brain said:

Hm, if we are tossing all sorts of ideas at the wall, how about a bonus if you are at 100% hp?

 

The problem with Regen is that it cannot take an alpha well, and conversely it lacks any sort of mitigation unless you are actually being damaged. Maybe if certain powers in the set (the passives) also had a built in bonus effect if you are at full health:

 

Fast Healing: when at full HP, gain an absorb layer equal to 10% of your hp (enhanceable)

 

Resilience: when at full HP, the resistance values are doubled (enhanceable) and you also gain a small amount of defense vs all (3%, unenhanceable).

 

The idea would be these two could combine to give you a sturdier layer of mitigation. Jumping into a fight at full health, and rewarding you for constantly healing back to full and giving you some breathing room once you do so vs a number of hits or one big hit.

I'd say more at 90%+ HP.  With all the random shots flying around, 100% isn't going to happen often in combat, I'd imagine.  You'll get NICKED, but heal it up in 5 seconds when Regen tics.

[Galaxy Brain]

5 hours ago, Menelruin said:

I'd say more at 90%+ HP.  With all the random shots flying around, 100% isn't going to happen often in combat, I'd imagine.  You'll get NICKED, but heal it up in 5 seconds when Regen tics.

That's fair, though the idea should still be the Absorb layer + Res/Def layer should help mitigate a good chunk of damage when at or near full to help with Alphas.

[Haijinx]

18 hours ago, Galaxy Brain said:

Scaling up the more HP you have? I would rather any HP scaling on regen for things that aren't healing stats to be with higher HP, to encourage good play.

No. Only meant inverse in the sense that its def instead of resist.

 

Basically you would still be soft to alphas, but as you take damage your defense goes up,  increasing the time you have to hit your click heal.

 

 

 

[Haijinx]

Or to just regen out of it.