Staff/Nin, What am I missing/what can I expect?

[EmperorSteele]

So quick story time: As a kid I'd imagined up a ninja dude who uses a staff and gadgets to beat up bad guys. It's dumb but w/e. When I started playing CoH back in the day, neither Staff nor Ninjitsu were made yet, so I rolled my guy as a Kat/Dark and had a decent time with him.

 

Fast Forward to now, where HEY, I can roll a Staff/Nin scrapper! Finally! So I did... and he's kinda underwhelming so far. He's only level 18 or so, so it's not like I'm expecting anything great outta him, but... playing him just feels like a drag. Due to the combo system, I end up repeating the same moves in the same order every fight... which I guess happens with my other characters anyway, but that doesn't feel forced. With staff, it's like "if you want the most damage, better click the orange circle on this long-animation AoE when there's only one bad guy left. No? Boy, you just wasted a lot of time building up a combo for nothing!"

 

It doesn't feel satisfying, I guess.

 

Is this maybe a late-blooming combo? Does it maybe not synergize very well and that's what I'm feeling? Is there anything I should look forward to while I level him? Gimme some hope here, guys!

[Vulpoid]

I ignore the stances, just use Form of Body and hit stuff. It is fun. Don't worry about combos.

[MTeague]

I'm having a blast on my Staff/Willpower scrapper.  She's lvl 29 though, so has a few more powers available to her. 

 

Staff is going to be a little be AE centric no matter what.  You'll MOW down a wall of minions in an enjoyably short time as you ThunkThunkThunkThunkThunk away.

When you're down to just the boss, you'll be a bit slower to take him down than say, a MA scrapper.  But it's not that bad. 

 

If you find yourself having End issues, Form of the Soul can work as a short term fix. @Vulpoid is correct, once you CAN, then Form of the Body is generally superior, you'll likely switch to that and never look back, unless you're doing some kind of RP concept. But if you're sucking wind and running out of End, Form of the Soul fixes that pretty quick until you have more slotting available to you. 

 

Mercurial Blow is meh. I respecced out of it, haven't looked back.

Precise Strike is a decent single target hit. Nothing snazzy, but hey, it's a T2. What do you expect?

Guarded Spin on cooldown. It's your Parry. Live it. Love it. 

Eye of the Storm, if surrounded, use on cooldown with 3 stacks / orange ring.  If not, can still be worth it for chance of Knockdown. That's saved me vs bosses in close fights before. 

Serpents Reach, good solid single target hit, decent shortrange strike, decent chance of Knockdown. Plus, if you use the bladed staff, looks like you're stabbing with it if used point blank.

Innocuous Strikes, strong cone. use if guarded spin is on cooldown. 

I don't have access to sky splitter yet.

 

Some things of note: 

• No BuildUp for you!  the sads. 😞 But you do have some constant on bonus damage in Form of the Body stacks.
• Consider Tactics and Gaussian's proc
• toss in some -RES debuffs where you can.  Fury of the Glad for sure. 
• when you can spare the slots for it, toss in a Force Feedback proc into Eye of the Storm and/or Serpent's Reach

 

 

[hejtmane]

The best way to look at single target is damage per activation to try and find out what you want to try and use on those pesky bosses

 

Here is the basic break down of the attacks by  dpa for staff and on bosses/av the goal is to use the higher dpa attacks as often as you can on them they die faster.

I like to note using guarded spin on a boss may reduce damage output but remember you get a  defense buff  which can be worth the the trade because you  increased  your survive ability in the fight so this is just looking at things in the bubble at raw power just be aware status effects can be worth a trade off.

 

These are eh base #'s

 

Name            Damage    Activation    DPA
Mercurial Blow        57.81    1        57.81
Precise Strike        90.84    1.13        80.39
Guarded Spin        81.16    1.83        44.35
Eye of the Storm    84.65    2.57        32.94
Serpent's Reach        123.9    1.77        70.00
Innocuous Strikes    114.2    2.17        52.63
Sky Splitter        189.9    2.83        67.10

 

 

 

 

 

[Yomo Kimyata]

I've got 8 staffers right now, and I get the least satisfaction from the scrappers, but it's still pretty satisfying.  

 

Early on, you can work on any endurance issues with Form of the Soul, but most of the game you're going to be in Form of the Body.  Keep in mind, you don't HAVE to execute the combo move with Eye of the Storm.  If you have three levels of Body, you are doing extra damage until you execute either Eye or Sky Splitter.  It's easy to build it up again, but once I get Innocuous Strikes I sometimes will put off Eye of the Storm for that extra damage oomph until and unless I want to apply some -resist on the baddies.  I also always slot the Fury of the Gladiator -res in EotS.  No idea if that's optimal, but I'm a sucker for stacking -resist.

 

I really dislike Sky Splitter, to be honest.  That DPA is pretty poor, and I also don't like how the damage is split into two pieces with a big lag.  I may end up skipping it on some experimental builds.

 

 

[ClawsandEffect]

You do know you don't HAVE to use your finisher, right? Staff and Street Justice's combo system isn't like Dual Blades where you have to use powers in a certain order. Every power in Staff builds stacks of Mastery and as long as you keep attacking and don't use a finisher those stacks will never go away. Don't fall into the shiny orange circle trap. 

 

I've dabbled in Staff enough to know more or less how it works, but I wouldn't call myself an expert. You can leverage the Forms to give you bonuses to end reduction, recharge, or damage without ever using a finisher to consume the stacks. 

Edited September 18, 2020 by ClawsandEffect

[Taboomantis]

This guy is God Mode:  Grimm Sweeper

 

Hero Plan by Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer 2.6.0.7
https://github.com/ImaginaryDevelopment/imaginary-hero-designer

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Grimm Sweeper: Level 50 Science Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Staff Fighting
Secondary Power Set: Ninjitsu
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Teleportation
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Precise Strike -- SprCrtStr-Acc/Dmg(A), SprCrtStr-Dmg/Rchg(3), SprCrtStr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), SprCrtStr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(9), SprCrtStr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(36), SprCrtStr-Rchg/+50% Crit(37)
Level 1: Ninja Reflexes -- Rct-Def(A), Rct-Def/EndRdx(5), Rct-EndRdx/Rchg(11), Rct-Def/Rchg(15), Rct-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(17), Rct-ResDam%(19)
Level 2: Guarded Spin -- Obl-%Dam(A), Obl-Dmg(23), Obl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(25), Obl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(25), Arm-Dmg(50), Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(50)
Level 4: Danger Sense -- RedFrt-EndRdx(A), RedFrt-Def(5), RedFrt-Def/EndRdx(11), RedFrt-Def/Rchg(17), RedFrt-EndRdx/Rchg(19), RedFrt-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(23)
Level 6: Shinobi-Iri -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(7), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(7), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(48)
Level 8: Staff Mastery 
Level 10: Kuji-In Rin -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 12: Eye of the Storm -- OvrFrc-Acc/Dmg(A), OvrFrc-Dmg/End/Rech(13), OvrFrc-Acc/Dmg/End/Rech(13), Arm-Dmg/Rchg(45), Arm-Acc/Rchg(46)
Level 14: Combat Jumping -- Ksm-ToHit+(A), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(15), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(43)
Level 16: Seishinteki Kyoyo -- EndMod-I(A)
Level 18: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 20: Kuji-In Sha -- ImpSki-Status(A), ImpSki-ResDam/EndRdx(21), ImpSki-ResDam/Rchg(21), ImpSki-EndRdx/Rchg(31), ImpSki-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(36)
Level 22: Tough -- Ags-ResDam(A), Ags-ResDam/EndRdx(40), Ags-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(46), Ags-Psi/Status(48)
Level 24: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(31), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(39), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(40)
Level 26: Innocuous Strikes -- SprAvl-Acc/Dmg(A), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx(27), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(27), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(31), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(37), SprAvl-Rchg/KDProc(43)
Level 28: Bo Ryaku -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), GldArm-ResDam(29), GldArm-3defTpProc(29)
Level 30: Serpent's Reach -- Apc-Dam%(A), Apc-Dmg(34), Apc-Dmg/Rchg(37), Apc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(42), Apc-Acc/Rchg(45), Apc-Dmg/EndRdx(46)
Level 32: Sky Splitter -- SprScrStr-Acc/Dmg(A), SprScrStr-Dmg/Rchg(33), SprScrStr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), SprScrStr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(33), SprScrStr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), SprScrStr-Rchg/+Crit(34)
Level 35: Recall Friend -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 38: Mercurial Blow -- Mk'Bit-Acc/Dmg(A), Mk'Bit-Dmg/EndRdx(39), Mk'Bit-Dmg/Rchg(39), Mk'Bit-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(40), Mk'Bit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(42), Mk'Bit-Dam%(42)
Level 41: Super Jump -- BlsoftheZ-Travel(A), BlsoftheZ-Travel/EndRdx(43)
Level 44: Conserve Power -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(45)
Level 47: Physical Perfection -- EndMod-I(A)
Level 49: Kuji-In Retsu -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit 
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Clr-Stlth(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run 
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Pnc-Heal/+End(9), Prv-Absorb%(36)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(48), EndMod-I(50)
Level 8: Form of the Body 
Level 8: Form of the Mind 
Level 8: Form of the Soul 
Level 1: Combo Level 1 
Level 1: Combo Level 2 
Level 1: Combo Level 3 
Level 1: Quick Form 
Level 50: Musculature Core Paragon 
------------

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[Lockpick]

On 9/17/2020 at 4:09 PM, Yomo Kimyata said:

Keep in mind, you don't HAVE to execute the combo move with Eye of the Storm.  If you have three levels of Body, you are doing extra damage until you execute either Eye or Sky Splitter. 

 

I did not know this...

 

I thought you were stacking to get higher damage with the finishers. 

[ZorkNemesis]

13 hours ago, Lockpick said:

 

I did not know this...

 

I thought you were stacking to get higher damage with the finishers. 

Using EotS or SS at full charge will increase their damage by adding an extra tick of damage (not significant enough to get around Smashing resistances however), but also add a secondary effect,  EotS will debuff foes hit while SS will give you a small buff.  You will consume the charges though so you momentarily lose the benefits of your stacked form.

 

Body: Extra Smashing damage, EotS will reduce Resistance, SS will increase your own (I think it's something like 12-13% to all for about 15 seconds)

Mind; Extra Psychic Damage, EotS will reduce Recharge, SS will increase your To Hit

Soul: Extra Energy Damage, EotS will reduce Defense, SS will increase your Regen/Recovery

[aatuton]

@TaboomantisI took your build and modified it a bit, here is my version!

 

http://www.cohplanner.com/mids/download.php?uc=1604&c=732&a=1464&f=HEX&dc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

Edited December 22, 2020 by aatuton