Debuff toggles off team mates

[Outrider_01]

tl;dr - Radiation debuff, Dark Affinity, Dark Miasma, ect - let them have the ability to run off a team mate like Sonic's Disruption Field.  It steps on uniqueness of Sonic, but stuff dies so fast at higher levels most is defeated before it really takes affect and you end up casting a toggle that sits around while the target is dead and the toggle turns off 10 seconds later.

 

Alternatively, let them be casted as a placed pet with no target or maybe it goes with idea 1 but uses the difference to cast on any target; kind of like how TP Friend/Foe now works.

 

Last alternative, just a faster cast time in general.  Can at least put down the toggle before the majority of the minions are dead, half alive LTs for the next 1/2 second, the wounded bosses for the next 1.3 seconds, and it works already neutering EB/AV.

[Katharos]

I play sonic, and honestly it's not going to suffer from other sets borrowing from Disruption Field's design. It has bigger problems to be worried about. (Honestly, did someone roll sonic solely on the basis that Disruption Field has interesting targeting options? Was that a reason someone rolled sonic?) This is a good suggestion that would make a variety of support sets more playable in a number of ways. It'd allow relevant support sets to be more useful in casual speedrunning content. It would prop up struggling teams better, say, teams lacking a tank and someone still needs to take the alpha, and they can't wait 10 seconds for you to get your debuff trifecta up every fight. It encourages a lot more critical thinking about what you're throwing out and when you're doing it, because those toggles drink endurance like Dark Armour.

I see two issues: one is a matter of aggro generation. Disruption Field doesn't generate aggro on the caster. Darkest Night, Radiation infection, Enervating field, and Spore Cloud do, and a lot. As they should, I think. They're all much more aggressive debuffs than Disruption Field. But there is a clumsiness in execution when casting it on an ally with that still in play. Say you've thrown it on a blapper with no damage aura - they run into melee and lag, preventing them from attacking. Suddenly you're eating the alpha strike. 

The second is that these powers show up in places outside of support sets. Would blaster plant manipulation's Spore Cloud get that benefit? Would tanker/brute soul mastery's Darkest Night get that benefit?

 

edit: I was unclear - I would only support this change if it worked like enflame and could work on enemies or allies. 

Edited June 12, 2021 by Katharos

[Parabola]

57 minutes ago, Outrider_01 said:

Last alternative, just a faster cast time in general.  Can at least put down the toggle before the majority of the minions are dead, half alive LTs for the next 1/2 second, the wounded bosses for the next 1.3 seconds, and it works already neutering EB/AV.

This would be where I'd start. Many of these toggles have dreadfully slow cast times making them unworkable in a fast paced team. Of course said team might not need these debuffs in the first place but that's a different issue.

[SeraphimKensai]

Gonna have to say no towards forcing debuff anchors on allies. I used my rad toons a lot of time to go solo giant monsters. That said I'm NOT opposed to allowing them to anchor on to any target.

Edited June 12, 2021 by SeraphimKensai
EARLY MORNING, NO COFFEE....EDIT IN BOLD

[Outrider_01]

2 hours ago, SeraphimKensai said:

Gonna have to say no towards forcing debuff anchors on allies. I used my rad toons a lot of time to go solo giant monsters. That said I'm opposed to allowing them to anchor on to any target.

See alternatives, casts like teleport friend or foe does now in a single power.  Not through ally, either on ally or on enemy (aka solo).

[Naraka]

10 hours ago, Katharos said:

(Honestly, did someone roll sonic solely on the basis that Disruption Field has interesting targeting options? Was that a reason someone rolled sonic?) 

 

I like to assume the way they brainstormed powersets is similar to how we do it: they come up with a power theme and as they are creating some of the powers, they think of unique mechanics to make it different from other sets.  Sonic Dispersion is similar in make-up as Force Field?  Ok, what other effects could we try and implement?  Well, instead of a personal barrier (PFF already has +res in it) how about a debuff toggle to lower resistance...and let's make it an ally toggle.

 

Sonic Dispersion is a fairly old set, back before they added combos and charge mechanics to any sets.

[Naraka]

9 hours ago, Parabola said:

This would be where I'd start. Many of these toggles have dreadfully slow cast times making them unworkable in a fast paced team. Of course said team might not need these debuffs in the first place but that's a different issue.

I'd actually argue to have them suppressed while in stealth, so you can stealth up to a group, cast Darkest Night on something in the middle but has no effect until you drop a Tar Patch or an attack.  Of course, this would only be the case for special stealth powers that have an "on" and "off" flag and not unsuppressed stealth powers like Shadowfall.

[arcane]

10 hours ago, Katharos said:

(Honestly, did someone roll sonic solely on the basis that Disruption Field has interesting targeting options? Was that a reason someone rolled sonic?)

Guilty. Grav/Sonic/Sorcery = 4 ally toggles on a vacuum pet. So you have an extra tanky pet with high absorb and resistance using an AoE pull, constant AoE knockdown (firing off FF procs too), constant AoE damage and -res. TP it into a +4 mob, start firing off Crushing Field behind it. Everything melts in a tight pack, now mop up the bosses.

 

This might be ok to test as an option to some toggles, but think of it more like Enflame: (1) Enflame can toggle on enemies and on allies, and (2) Enflame aggros. Would not be ok to have Rad put all its debuffs on an ally in the non-aggroing sonic way.

Edited June 12, 2021 by arcane

[Doomguide2005]

10 hours ago, Katharos said:

(Honestly, did someone roll sonic solely on the basis that Disruption Field has interesting targeting options? Was that a reason someone rolled sonic?) 

     Well no, no and sort of.

     The first was an Ice/Sonic controller.  Created when Resonance first came out.  I paired it with Ice in a Controller.  Okay on teams but when I had to solo ... oh my.

    The second was for teaming with 4 friends in an a Dark themed 'static' team.  Sonic/Dark, possible candidate for the strongest 5 man team I've ever played on.  But more for the resist shields and the total package.  Running against +4/×8 Arachnos in Faultline arcs and crushing everything in their path.  We bored ourselves to death and while I finished him to 50th the team itself petered out in the mid twenties as we moved on to other things.

     Including the 3rd Sonic Resonance character.  Again a static team but this time, well we called the group Hot Feet and Hula Hoops.  Disruption Field (and Hot Feet) were definitely strong motivators.  All Fire/Sonic controllers the group unfortunately never reached 32 as most of us moved on to other things outside of CoH.  But I'd love at some point to recreate a similar group at a full 8 maybe 6 Fire/Sonic and 1 each Fire/Cold and Fire/Kin and wreck stuff

 

    As for the OP, rather make other tweaks to cast and animation times first.  Changing the anchor and targeting mechanics would not be high on my list for changes to be made.

 

[SeraphimKensai]

6 hours ago, Outrider_01 said:

See alternatives, casts like teleport friend or foe does now in a single power.  Not through ally, either on ally or on enemy (aka solo).

Sorry I just realized I hadn't had coffee yet so I edited my comment to reflect the actual thought I had at the time. see here....

 

8 hours ago, SeraphimKensai said:

Gonna have to say no towards forcing debuff anchors on allies. I used my rad toons a lot of time to go solo giant monsters. That said I'm NOT opposed to allowing them to anchor on to any target.

 

[Myrmidon]

All of those toggles working like Enflame. That definitely gets my vote.