Super Reflexes.../...?

[oedipus_tex]

I've never played Super Reflexes on any character above level 20. I currently have a Super Reflexes/Radiation Tank. He's not bad, although I'm not sure whether to stick with Radiation Melee or go with something else. 

 

Conceptually for this character, Energy Melee works well. However, I was concerned about how the toon would handle the self damage in Energy Transfer without the Regen/healing most other armors have.

 

Kinetic Melee would also work well conceptually for this toon, but I've heard not very good things about it. No idea if they are true, since I never got a Kin above level 10.

What's the lay of the land Tankers? 

[Xandyr]

I ran a Rad/SR brute before. I think they go well with each other...you get a damage aura and a damage/heal.

[Warboss]

Go to the edge! Ice Melee or Stone Melee!!

 

Oooops, sorry, got carried away. If you can stick with Rad Melee you'll pick up Irradiated Ground, which when proc'd out will add a bunch of damage to the combo. I'm not sure EM is that bad, it got reworked a bit ago and is actually pretty good set now. Kin Melee has a couple of ranged attacks built in and a AoE that either has KD or can be slotted for it. So, that's not a bad choice either.

Edited April 12, 2022 by Warboss

[Onlyasandwich]

The self damage is quite negligible. SR has plenty of extra slots with which to do whatever you like, so easy enough to throw one to the power transfer heal proc and maybe some fun Regen bonuses.

 

Really though I don't think you'll need to worry about it even without attention to incidental healing. I say just go with EM if it's what tickles your fancy! SR is truly one size fits all.

[Cancrusher]

I don't even notice the damage from energy transfer on my brute although, to be fair, I'm running Willpower- not SR.  I don't think it'll be too much of an issue for you, if at all.

[Bill Z Bubba]

15 hours ago, oedipus_tex said:

However, I was concerned about how the toon would handle the self damage in Energy Transfer without the Regen/healing most other armors have.

 

It's a non-issue. After softcapping, build for +resist and +HP, then natural regen and the various heal/absorb procs more than cover the HP loss.

[Infinitum]

17 hours ago, oedipus_tex said:

I've never played Super Reflexes on any character above level 20. I currently have a Super Reflexes/Radiation Tank. He's not bad, although I'm not sure whether to stick with Radiation Melee or go with something else. 

 

Conceptually for this character, Energy Melee works well. However, I was concerned about how the toon would handle the self damage in Energy Transfer without the Regen/healing most other armors have.

 

Kinetic Melee would also work well conceptually for this toon, but I've heard not very good things about it. No idea if they are true, since I never got a Kin above level 10.

What's the lay of the land Tankers? 

Kinetic melee needs some help like EM did pre buff.

 

The only character I've noticed the ET self damage was on a stalker but even then - Running energy aura- was easily mitigated.

 

All of my tankers with EM (i have 3) never notice it.  SR would be a good pair with it because of the extra recharge IMO.

[oedipus_tex]

Thanks all! I've decided to reroll from SR/Radiation to SR/Energy. I just like the "feel" of Energy Melee a lot, plus it fits the concept better than Radiation did. Thanks for sharing that Energy Transfer won't wreck the build. This sounds like a fun and interesting character.

 

Can someone point me to a basic Super Reflexes build? I know how to build for Defense, but in this case it's practically covered on its own. I'm very unfamiiar with best practices for building for +HP and +Resist. Would be nice to have a starting base to look at even if it's not a Sr/Energy build specifically. I admit I am also a little confused by SR's reactive Resistance feature. I understand my Resists go up as my health goes down, but am not sure what that means for the overall build nand how to strategize around it.

Edited April 13, 2022 by oedipus_tex

[Infinitum]

35 minutes ago, oedipus_tex said:

Thanks all! I've decided to reroll from SR/Radiation to SR/Energy. I just like the "feel" of Energy Melee a lot, plus it fits the concept better than Radiation did. Thanks for sharing that Energy Transfer won't wreck the build. This sounds like a fun and interesting character.

 

Can someone point me to a basic Super Reflexes build? I know how to build for Defense, but in this case it's practically covered on its own. I'm very unfamiiar with best practices for building for +HP and +Resist. Would be nice to have a starting base to look at even if it's not a Sr/Energy build specifically. I admit I am also a little confused by SR's reactive Resistance feature. I understand my Resists go up as my health goes down, but am not sure what that means for the overall build nand how to strategize around it.

Basically It looks scary sometimes until about 10-25% health is remaining and then opponents will literally wear themselves out because unless one of them can burst they are just (insert colorful metaphor here) in the wind at that point.  lol. They cant hurt you.  I have literally walked away in the middle of +4/8 content with less than 1/4 life left in the middle of a mob - made myself some lunch and came back in the same situation.  Most of the time they cant hit you at all - when they do it becomes the seige of stalingrad and they are the nazis.

 

This is the build i use. Hope it helps.

Alpha Infinitum - Tanker (Super Reflexes - Claws).mxd

[Onlyasandwich]

1 hour ago, oedipus_tex said:

basic Super Reflexes build?

 

Here is my own SR/MA build for comparison. I have not invested much into +HP, but do have moderate boost to resist. This is a proc-heavy build, as I am wont to make. 🙂

 

Spoiler

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.2.17
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Science Tanker
Primary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Secondary Power Set: Martial Arts
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Teleportation
Ancillary Pool: Soul Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Focused Fighting -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Rct-Def(40), Rct-Def/EndRdx(43), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(48)
Level 1: Thunder Kick -- SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg(A), SprGntFis-Dmg/Rchg(33), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(34), SprGntFis-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), SprGntFis-Rchg/+Absorb(37)
Level 2: Focused Senses -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(3), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(3), LucoftheG-EndRdx/Rchg(9), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(9), LucoftheG-Def(11)
Level 4: Storm Kick -- SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg(A), SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprMghoft-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprMghoft-Rchg/Res%(31), TchofDth-Dam%(33), GldStr-%Dam(33)
Level 6: Agile -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Rct-Def(7), Rct-Def/EndRdx(7)
Level 8: Practiced Brawler -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 10: Dodge -- Rct-ResDam%(A), Rct-Def(11)
Level 12: Evasion -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(13), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(13), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(15), LucoftheG-Def(15), LucoftheG-EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 14: Combat Jumping -- Ksm-ToHit+(A)
Level 16: Crane Kick -- SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg(A), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(17), ExpStr-Dam%(17), TchofDth-Dam%(19), OvrFrc-Dam/KB(27), FrcFdb-Rechg%(27)
Level 18: Lucky -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Rct-Def(19), Rct-Def/EndRdx(48)
Level 20: Dragon's Tail -- SprAvl-Acc/Dmg(A), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(21), Arm-Dmg/EndRdx(21), Arm-Dam%(23), Erd-%Dam(25), FrcFdb-Rechg%(25)
Level 22: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(23)
Level 24: Kick -- Empty(A)
Level 26: Quickness -- Run-I(A)
Level 28: Tough -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), GldArm-3defTpProc(29), UnbGrd-ResDam(29), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(31), UnbGrd-Max HP%(46)
Level 30: Focus Chi -- GssSynFr--Build%(A), RechRdx-I(31)
Level 32: Combat Teleport -- WntGif-ResSlow(A)
Level 35: Crippling Axe Kick -- HO:Nucle(A), Hct-Dmg/EndRdx(36), Hct-Dam%(36), TchofDth-Dam%(36), TchofLadG-%Dam(37), ImpSwf-Dam%(37)
Level 38: Gloom -- SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg(A), SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(39), Apc-Dmg/EndRdx(39), Apc-Dam%(39), GldJvl-Dam%(40), CldSns-%Dam(40)
Level 41: Dark Obliteration -- SprFrzBls-Acc/Dmg(A), SprFrzBls-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(42), JvlVll-Dam%(42), Bmbdmt-+FireDmg(42), PstBls-Dam%(43), CldSns-%Dam(43)
Level 44: Teleport -- Range-I(A)
Level 47: Fold Space -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(48)
Level 49: Warrior's Provocation -- PrfZng-Dam%(A)
Level 1: Gauntlet 
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Pnc-Heal/+End(A), Mrc-Rcvry+(45), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(45), Prv-Absorb%(45), Prv-Heal(50)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(46), PwrTrns-+Heal(50), PwrTrns-EndMod(50)
Level 50: Musculature Radial Paragon 
------------

 

 

[oedipus_tex]

Thanks for the sample builds. 🙂

 

I've been playing this Tanker in game and so far he's actually really good. Currently at level 40. I happened to join a Fire farm, and although I'm not close to optimally slotted, with careful use of inspirations I was at least able to mostly not die. That's an impressive result I think at this level.

 

I made the toon disco themed and named him "Discobrawl." I think the Energy Melee balls of power look pretty good as disco balls.

 

 

 

I put together this potential build. I am still pretty unsure about how best to optimize the Tanker procs and SR's resist. I took two screenshots below, one where the Tanker is getting max Resists for being low on HP. and another where he isn't getting any.

 

 

Max resists:

 

 

 

Min resists:

 

 

 

 

I put the Tanker Resist ATO proc in Energy Punch on the assumption that's where I'll be clicking it the most and have the greatest chance of proccing it, but if this is a bad assumption let me know. Swapping Energy Punch for Bone Smasher is an option if the longer Recharge on that power would be produce better proc rates.

 

The build is very slightly under the incarnate cap, but is that likely to matter? I figure there is any place I can count on a teammate buff pushing me over the top, it's in an iTrial.

 

Meanwhile, debuff resists look good. This is my first high end Tank build, so maybe I'm overkilling here?

 

 

 

The build: 

 

Spoiler

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.2.17
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Discobrawl: Level 50 Magic Tanker
Primary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Secondary Power Set: Energy Melee
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Energy Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Focused Fighting -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), ShlWal-Def(3), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(3), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(5), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(50)
Level 1: Barrage -- SprGntFis-Rchg/+Absorb(A), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprGntFis-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(7), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(7), SprGntFis-Dmg/Rchg(9), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg(9)
Level 2: Focused Senses -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(11), ShlWal-Def(11), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(13), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(13)
Level 4: Energy Punch -- SprMghoft-Rchg/Res%(A), SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(19), SprMghoft-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(19), SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(21), SprMghoft-Dmg/Rchg(21), SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg(23)
Level 6: Practiced Brawler -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 8: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 10: Agile -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(23), ShlWal-Def(25), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(25)
Level 12: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 14: Tough -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), GldArm-3defTpProc(27), ImpArm-ResPsi(29), UnbGrd-Max HP%(50)
Level 16: Whirling Hands -- PrfZng-Dam%(A), Arm-Dam%(29), Obl-%Dam(31), ScrDrv-Dam%(31), Arm-Acc/Rchg(31), Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33)
Level 18: Dodge -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), Ksm-ToHit+(27), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(33), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(33), ShlWal-Def(34)
Level 20: Evasion -- LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(A), LucoftheG-EndRdx/Rchg(34), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(34), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(36), LucoftheG-Def(36), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(36)
Level 22: Lucky -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(37), ShlWal-Def(37), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(37)
Level 24: Total Focus -- Hct-Dam%(A), PrfZng-Dam%(39), TchofDth-Dam%(39), GldStr-%Dam(39), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg(40), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(40)
Level 26: Quickness -- Flight-I(A)
Level 28: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(A), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(40), LucoftheG-EndRdx/Rchg(42), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(42), LucoftheG-Def(42), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(43)
Level 30: Build Up -- GssSynFr--Build%(A)
Level 32: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(43)
Level 35: Power Crash -- Obl-%Dam(A), PrfZng-Dam%(43), Erd-%Dam(45), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg(45), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx(45), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(46)
Level 38: Focused Accuracy -- HO:Cyto(A)
Level 41: Energy Transfer -- Mk'Bit-Dam%(A), TchofDth-Dam%(46), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx(46), SprBlsCol-Rchg/HoldProc(48), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(48)
Level 44: Physical Perfection -- PrfShf-End%(A), PwrTrns-+Heal(50)
Level 47: Taunt -- PrfZng-Dam%(A)
Level 49: Super Speed -- WntGif-ResSlow(A)
Level 1: Gauntlet 
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Mrc-Rcvry+(A), Pnc-Heal/+End(15), Prv-Absorb%(15)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(17), PwrTrns-+Heal(17)
Level 50: Mighty Radial Final Judgement 
Level 50: Degenerative Core Flawless Interface 
Level 50: Longbow Core Superior Ally 
Level 50: Assault Radial Embodiment 
Level 50: The Atlas Medallion 
Level 50: Freedom Phalanx Reserve 
Level 50: Portal Jockey 
Level 50: Task Force Commander 
Level 1: Energy Focus 
Level 49: Speed Phase 
Level 50: Musculature Core Paragon 
Level 50: Rebirth Radial Epiphany 
------------

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Thanks again for your thoughts.

Edited April 14, 2022 by oedipus_tex

[Onlyasandwich]

I'll pull this up in mids and provide more detailed input later!

 

One thing that stands out is end consumption. With FA on you are in very unsustainable territory. Are you relying on it to hit, or is it a "sometimes" power here?

[oedipus_tex]

33 minutes ago, Onlyasandwich said:

I'll pull this up in mids and provide more detailed input later!

 

One thing that stands out is end consumption. With FA on you are in very unsustainable territory. Are you relying on it to hit, or is it a "sometimes" power here?

 

 

Good question. I figured I was going for Ageless Destiny to help pay for it, but it might still be too much.

 

Right now, slotting would suggest Focus Accuracy is on most of the time, which may not be realistic. I could try to move slots around to reduce the cost of this power.

 

More food for thought: I'm unsure this build actually needs Hasten. Hasten does speed up how fast the AoEs come back up and reduce some other things. I didn't spend time mapping out a perfect attack chain because Im coming from Dominators, where the attack chain is "what can you press right now?" But if I were to drop Hasten I could swap into something else--perhaps Combat Teleport. 

[Onlyasandwich]

1 hour ago, oedipus_tex said:

Good question

Upon pulling it up, I see that Super Speed was toggled on, so that's a big chunk of what was displayed.

 

Not too bad in reality after disabling SS, even with FA on! You have ~1.4 end/sec to attack with, and EM is fairly light on end. This should be pretty solid. I like the overall picture here! I'm going to bed now, but will do a deeper dive later.

 

Hasten for CT is a tough call. EM definitely still appreciates the extra juice here, but CT is fun and has many strategic uses. I prefer my hastenless builds to have FFback mixed in if possible, but there isn't a spot in EM.

 

I generally prefer taking the T3 on a tanker (Bone Smasher in this case) for the Might proc, and hitting a 4 piece Might + a couple damage procs to keep this from cutting into my ST damage too much rotating it in. Others prefer a more carefree approach and slot it in their aura, or even an aoe where it will go off a lot in the alpha. I like it in a relatively proc optimized mid tier single target attack so it is more relevant in hard target scenarios too. You can also manage a triple stack pretty reliably in a longer battle this way, vs a 1-2 stack in a less proctimized attack or an aura.

 

Energy Punch is just a teensy bit ahead on DPA, but Bone Smasher has modestly better proc percentages. EP will be more complete chain filler if you go hastenless.

 

[Onlyasandwich]

Good morning, @oedipus_tex!

 

This isn't a total rehaul, as the build itself is fundamentally really solid.

 

I reworked it with bone smasher procced out with MoT and friends as described. Note that Hecatomb proc actually contributes more damage over time in the attack chain here than in Total Focus, even though it is of course a higher per attack contribution on average in TF. Ideally, you want every motivation to spam your MoT proc power as much as possible, so make it shine!

 

A few other things:

• Rejiggered Whirling Hands for much better damage while still contributing some good bonuses.
• Plussed out the shield walls. Since they are PVP IOs, they act as attuned even if 50+5.
• Worked in Reactive Defense scaling res - pretty important one! In doing so, managed a bit of extra psi res by squeezing in the Aegis unique, making up for the bit lost from 6 slot MoT.

 

Overall, I would consider dropping Weave. It does bring you to incarnate softcaps and houses a nice set, but even in incarnate content I think you'll find yourself plenty sturdy without it. You could pick up Combat Teleport and redistribute slots to make up for these lost bonuses, and drop a lotg in Agile for good measure. 

 

Given that Perf shifter +end proc doesn't show up in end recovery stats, I think you'll be okay on end for the most part. If you drop weave, you'll be even more solid on that front.

 

Build:

Spoiler

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.2.17
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Discobrawl: Level 50 Magic Tanker
Primary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Secondary Power Set: Energy Melee
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Energy Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Focused Fighting -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), ShlWal-Def(3), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(3), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(5), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(50)
Level 1: Barrage -- SprGntFis-Rchg/+Absorb(A), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprGntFis-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(7), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(7), SprGntFis-Dmg/Rchg(11), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg(9)
Level 2: Focused Senses -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), ShlWal-Def(11), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(13), ShlWal-EndRdx/Rchg(13)
Level 4: Bone Smasher -- SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg(A), SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(19), SprMghoft-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(19), SprMghoft-Rchg/Res%(21), Hct-Dam%(21), TchofDth-Dam%(23)
Level 6: Practiced Brawler -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 8: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 10: Agile -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Rct-Def(23), Rct-Def/EndRdx(25), Rct-ResDam%(25)
Level 12: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 14: Tough -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), GldArm-3defTpProc(27), ImpArm-ResPsi(29), UnbGrd-Max HP%(50), Ags-Psi/Status(9)
Level 16: Whirling Hands -- ScrDrv-Acc/Dmg(A), ScrDrv-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(29), ScrDrv-Dam%(31), Erd-%Dam(31), Obl-%Dam(31), Arm-Dam%(33)
Level 18: Dodge -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), Ksm-ToHit+(27), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(33), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(33), ShlWal-Def(34)
Level 20: Evasion -- LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(A), LucoftheG-EndRdx/Rchg(34), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(34), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(36), LucoftheG-Def(36), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(36)
Level 22: Lucky -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(37), ShlWal-Def(37), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(37)
Level 24: Total Focus -- PrfZng-Dam%(A), Mk'Bit-Dam%(39), TchofDth-Dam%(39), GldStr-%Dam(39), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg(40), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(40)
Level 26: Quickness -- Flight-I(A)
Level 28: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(A), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(40), LucoftheG-EndRdx/Rchg(42), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(42), LucoftheG-Def(42), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(43)
Level 30: Build Up -- GssSynFr--Build%(A)
Level 32: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(43)
Level 35: Power Crash -- Obl-%Dam(A), PrfZng-Dam%(43), Erd-%Dam(45), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg(45), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx(45), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(46)
Level 38: Focused Accuracy -- HO:Cyto(A)
Level 41: Energy Transfer -- Mk'Bit-Dam%(A), TchofDth-Dam%(46), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx(46), SprBlsCol-Rchg/HoldProc(48), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(48)
Level 44: Physical Perfection -- PrfShf-End%(A), PwrTrns-+Heal(50)
Level 47: Taunt -- PrfZng-Dam%(A)
Level 49: Super Speed -- WntGif-ResSlow(A)
Level 1: Gauntlet 
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Mrc-Rcvry+(A), Pnc-Heal/+End(15), Prv-Absorb%(15)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(17), PwrTrns-+Heal(17)
Level 1: Energy Focus 
Level 49: Speed Phase 
Level 50: Mighty Radial Final Judgement 
Level 50: Degenerative Core Flawless Interface 
Level 50: Longbow Core Superior Ally 
Level 50: Assault Radial Embodiment 
Level 50: Musculature Core Paragon 
Level 50: Rebirth Radial Epiphany 
Level 50: The Atlas Medallion 
Level 50: Freedom Phalanx Reserve 
Level 50: Portal Jockey 
Level 50: Task Force Commander 
------------

 

Edited April 14, 2022 by Onlyasandwich

[Golden Azrael]

On 4/12/2022 at 11:15 PM, oedipus_tex said:

I've never played Super Reflexes on any character above level 20. I currently have a Super Reflexes/Radiation Tank. He's not bad, although I'm not sure whether to stick with Radiation Melee or go with something else. 

 

Conceptually for this character, Energy Melee works well. However, I was concerned about how the toon would handle the self damage in Energy Transfer without the Regen/healing most other armors have.

 

Kinetic Melee would also work well conceptually for this toon, but I've heard not very good things about it. No idea if they are true, since I never got a Kin above level 10.

What's the lay of the land Tankers? 

 

I have a SR and SF.  The dam is quick and light but fun.  50 lvls of fun.  (In a knee to the jegs kind of way.)

 

SR and Energy would give you a TKO Tank.  (A tank can't do that damage, can it?)

 

Those are the two I would consider, Tex if I was to re-roll.

 

KM.  Last tried on live.  Very posey.  But, somehow, I'd rather be doing the 'Lights OUT' damage of Energy Melee.  

 

The question you have to answer, +Tex.  Are you BatMan (does teh 'I'm Batman...' voice) or Superman.

 

One you fix that in your head.  You're going SF or EM. 🙂

 

Azrael.

 

PS.  You can put some really nice Proc damage in Whirling Hands and the Energy Cone.  Before you know it, the mob is gone.

 

 

Edited April 15, 2022 by Golden Azrael

[Golden Azrael]

On 4/14/2022 at 3:13 AM, oedipus_tex said:

Thanks for the sample builds. 🙂

 

I've been playing this Tanker in game and so far he's actually really good. Currently at level 40. I happened to join a Fire farm, and although I'm not close to optimally slotted, with careful use of inspirations I was at least able to mostly not die. That's an impressive result I think at this level.

 

I made the toon disco themed and named him "Discobrawl." I think the Energy Melee balls of power look pretty good as disco balls.

 

 

 

I put together this potential build. I am still pretty unsure about how best to optimize the Tanker procs and SR's resist. I took two screenshots below, one where the Tanker is getting max Resists for being low on HP. and another where he isn't getting any.

 

 

Max resists:

 

 

 

Min resists:

 

 

 

 

I put the Tanker Resist ATO proc in Energy Punch on the assumption that's where I'll be clicking it the most and have the greatest chance of proccing it, but if this is a bad assumption let me know. Swapping Energy Punch for Bone Smasher is an option if the longer Recharge on that power would be produce better proc rates.

 

The build is very slightly under the incarnate cap, but is that likely to matter? I figure there is any place I can count on a teammate buff pushing me over the top, it's in an iTrial.

 

Meanwhile, debuff resists look good. This is my first high end Tank build, so maybe I'm overkilling here?

 

 

 

The build: 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.2.17
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Discobrawl: Level 50 Magic Tanker
Primary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Secondary Power Set: Energy Melee
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Energy Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Focused Fighting -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), ShlWal-Def(3), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(3), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(5), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(50)
Level 1: Barrage -- SprGntFis-Rchg/+Absorb(A), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprGntFis-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(7), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(7), SprGntFis-Dmg/Rchg(9), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg(9)
Level 2: Focused Senses -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(11), ShlWal-Def(11), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(13), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(13)
Level 4: Energy Punch -- SprMghoft-Rchg/Res%(A), SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(19), SprMghoft-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(19), SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(21), SprMghoft-Dmg/Rchg(21), SprMghoft-Acc/Dmg(23)
Level 6: Practiced Brawler -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 8: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 10: Agile -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(23), ShlWal-Def(25), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(25)
Level 12: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 14: Tough -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), GldArm-3defTpProc(27), ImpArm-ResPsi(29), UnbGrd-Max HP%(50)
Level 16: Whirling Hands -- PrfZng-Dam%(A), Arm-Dam%(29), Obl-%Dam(31), ScrDrv-Dam%(31), Arm-Acc/Rchg(31), Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33)
Level 18: Dodge -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), Ksm-ToHit+(27), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(33), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(33), ShlWal-Def(34)
Level 20: Evasion -- LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(A), LucoftheG-EndRdx/Rchg(34), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(34), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(36), LucoftheG-Def(36), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(36)
Level 22: Lucky -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(37), ShlWal-Def(37), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(37)
Level 24: Total Focus -- Hct-Dam%(A), PrfZng-Dam%(39), TchofDth-Dam%(39), GldStr-%Dam(39), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg(40), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(40)
Level 26: Quickness -- Flight-I(A)
Level 28: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(A), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(40), LucoftheG-EndRdx/Rchg(42), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(42), LucoftheG-Def(42), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(43)
Level 30: Build Up -- GssSynFr--Build%(A)
Level 32: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(43)
Level 35: Power Crash -- Obl-%Dam(A), PrfZng-Dam%(43), Erd-%Dam(45), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg(45), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx(45), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(46)
Level 38: Focused Accuracy -- HO:Cyto(A)
Level 41: Energy Transfer -- Mk'Bit-Dam%(A), TchofDth-Dam%(46), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx(46), SprBlsCol-Rchg/HoldProc(48), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(48)
Level 44: Physical Perfection -- PrfShf-End%(A), PwrTrns-+Heal(50)
Level 47: Taunt -- PrfZng-Dam%(A)
Level 49: Super Speed -- WntGif-ResSlow(A)
Level 1: Gauntlet 
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Mrc-Rcvry+(A), Pnc-Heal/+End(15), Prv-Absorb%(15)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(17), PwrTrns-+Heal(17)
Level 50: Mighty Radial Final Judgement 
Level 50: Degenerative Core Flawless Interface 
Level 50: Longbow Core Superior Ally 
Level 50: Assault Radial Embodiment 
Level 50: The Atlas Medallion 
Level 50: Freedom Phalanx Reserve 
Level 50: Portal Jockey 
Level 50: Task Force Commander 
Level 1: Energy Focus 
Level 49: Speed Phase 
Level 50: Musculature Core Paragon 
Level 50: Rebirth Radial Epiphany 
------------

 

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Thanks again for your thoughts.

 

I like the look of the alt.  Good show, Tex.

 

I think I'd go the Max resists route if you can.  Mine are around 66%.  I don't think that's enough.  But my defences are insanely high.  But when stuff gets through...  I've taken a Healing Destiny power to compensate for any 'bad luck.' 

 

Good build you got there.  Enjoying it?  Did you get your resists higher?  How's it doing vs different kinds of mobs and what settings?

 

Azrael.

Edited April 15, 2022 by Golden Azrael

[Infinitum]

1 hour ago, Golden Azrael said:

I have a SR and SF.  The dam is quick and light but fun.  50 lvls of fun.  (In a knee to the jegs kind of way.)

I am sure this is a dense question on my part - what is SF?

[oedipus_tex]

2 hours ago, Golden Azrael said:

 

I like the look of the alt.  Good show, Tex.

 

I think I'd go the Max resists route if you can.  Mine are around 66%.  I don't think that's enough.  But my defences are insanely high.  But when stuff gets through...  I've taken a Healing Destiny power to compensate for any 'bad luck.' 

 

Good build you got there.  Enjoying it?  Did you get your resists higher?  How's it doing vs different kinds of mobs and what settings?

 

Azrael.

 

 

I am enjoying the build a lot, yes. The in-game version still needs a lot of IOs. But he's undeniably extremely survivable. Here are some highlights.

 

• Around Level 40, entirely on SOs except for the +3% Defense globals I shipped from other toons, I got invited to a fire farm. I was planning to door sit, but decided to explore the survivability of the toon by leaping in. I found that while I wasn't able to primary-tank, if I waited for the lead Brute to work enemies down a little bit I could participate. The Brute even made a statement about Energy Melee hitting surprisingly hard.
• Around level 44 I joined an ITF. The team was great, and that definitely contributed to my perception. But it's worth noting that still running the very incomplete build, the toon survived every encounter sans two: once when I got cocky and leaped into the pack of Cyclops on the bridge with my team further behind me than I thought, and the second time when encountering a pack of Romans mostly solo. The deaths weren't at all sudden though. It was a long cycle of watching my HP dance at 20% remaining before finally a kill shot came in.
• At level 50, I did the incarnate mission. This toon destroyed that mission, including the Weakened Honoree. That fight is often a struggle for my new 50s. A Dark/Stone Tank I made a few weeks ago for example had to call in a helper to duo it. On the SR build I don't think even hit me more than one time.
• After the incarnate stuff, I added a few more IOs, but not nearly the full build. Loaded up an AE Fire Farm (the one set in a collapsed underground road tunnel). After some experimenting I found I could run it at x8+3 with bosses off. After a run runs of that, I managed to unlock all of incarnate slots. The Level Shift, Destiny Rebirth, and the Hybrid Double Damage toggle let me turn the diifficulty up to x8+4, bosses still off. 
  • It was 5 in the morning at one point, and a low level Corruptor was looking for a team. I invited him to join me if he wanted. But having  a second person there automatically reenabled Boss level enemies. I couldn't complete the run with that build, or even get past the first mob of enemies. Keep in mind the build is still far from complete.

 

Overall, what I found I really enjoy is Energy Melee's AoE attack cycle. Basically, Whirling Hands > Total Focus (to power up) > Power Crash. I'm familiar with Energy blaps from Blasters and Dominators, but on this toon it has a totally different and really satisfying feel. Whirling Hands hitting 16 targets on a Tanker also feels great. 

 

OTOH Energy Transfer, the ST melee attack that damages you, was a bit more iffy. In previous convos we had said I probably wouldn't notice the damage to self. Unfortunately I definitely did notice it, and I think it's because of the central mechanism of Super Reflexes. Basically, with SR you get way tougher as your HP drops. Using Energy Transfer at low HP doesn't do less damage to you, though. So using it at a bad time actually killed me a couple of times. I'm sure it gets better with more Regen and better Resists to avoid reaching that point, but on this build at least, avoiding it except at special times was necessary to keep running.

 

 

 

Overall I enjoyed Energy Melee enough that I'd like to explore it with some other armor combos. I rolled the same character as an Shield/Energy to see if the extra damage, taunt in Against All Odds, and the extra AoE in Shield Charge made the build more fun.  Shield seems to share a lot in common with Super Reflexes, but trades away from survivability for extra damage. I'm interested to see which version I like better.

 

In the meantime if anyone has thoughts about differences between Super Reflexes and Shield please share.

[Onlyasandwich]

1 hour ago, oedipus_tex said:

In the meantime if anyone has thoughts about differences between Super Reflexes and Shield please share.

 

My thoughts comparing these two sets -

 

SR:

• Can be more mindlessly immortal once properly slotted out, due to scaling res.
• Almost full immunity to defense debuffs. 
• Allows unparalleled flexibility in slotting, as needs are mostly served just by basic slotting in primary. It's really hard to screw up a SR build.
• +Recharge buff helps juice towards optimal attack chains.

 

Shield:

• More damage! AAO is great of course, and the burst from charge is welcome.
• Can achieve mostly the same defense numbers as SR, with more proactive resists on top, so you don't have to play the dance of death to get to optimal toughness.
• Can still achieve DDR better than primaries that are not SR, due to stacking potential of Active Defense. However, double stacking AD is moderately annoying, as it takes up even more animation time and end in your rotation.
• Harder to go all out on procs and other goodies, as you need to balance +def and +res bonuses to get to the same totals as SR. No scaling res means your top-end performance for exotic resists is never going to be quite as good.
• A couple extra spots for +psi res IOs if you really want to try and cover the Psi hole that these sets share.
• A little extra juice for +hp built-in. Not huge, but nice.
• Less concept flexibility - this character better be okay having a shield!

 

Ultimately I think Shield is more powerful overall if properly built, but that is taking damage into the equation as well. SR is going to be tougher across the board, except perhaps against Psi if you are prioritizing such IO bonuses in Shield. Shield/Energy is probably one of the best overall Tanker combos out there. AAO buffs EM to whacky numbers, and Shield Charge helps supplement the only moderate (and conditional) aoe available within EM as well. Both primaries are very strong - it really comes down to survivability vs damage, though SR isn't exactly a damage slouch given the extra proc flexibility.

 

Edited April 15, 2022 by Onlyasandwich

[PLVRIZR]

8 hours ago, Infinitum said:

I am sure this is a dense question on my part - what is SF?

 

Staff Fighting

[Infinitum]

3 hours ago, PLVRIZR said:

 

Staff Fighting

Ah yeah, i forget that is a thing - never played it.  I have had intentions to, but other themes keep outweighing it.

 

My 90s environmentals kept kicking in and telling my brain it stood for Street Fighter.

Edited April 16, 2022 by Infinitum

[Golden Azrael]

No.

 

'Street Justice.'

 

For some reason, I think of it as 'Street Fighting.'  (SF.)

 

Cryptic clue (Pun intended), I guess. 😛

 

Azrael.

[oedipus_tex]

Update, I have now played the Shield version of this toon to 49, both solo and on teams. 

 

I was initially worried about how a shield would look with the Energy pom poms, but a great thing about Shield is the many costume options available. I discovered that using an Energy Shield with a low opacity was undistracting, and kinda looked like a field of energy coming from the Energy Melee fists. Combined with a "pixel" aura applied to the fists to give a disco ball kind of effect, I think it came together and looks kinda cool.

 

 

Anyway, as much as I liked Super Reflexes, I am loving Shield. I had played Shield once before, on a Martial Arts/Shield Scrapper, but didn't come away super impressed. Here I love it. 

 

 

I've been leveling myself up by joining teams when they're available, and doing fire farms in the AE at low settings. I've found a clear of the fire tunnel map at x8+1 is about the right challenge level for the incomplete build. I earn about 3/4ths of a level per run. This toon currently has many of the Uniques slotted, sans the level 50 ones, but no actual sets yet.

 

I made a little video of the character in the AE here. I accidentally left the ally buff toggle on out of habit, but end use wasn't too bad here between all the various sources of it.

 

 

 

I specced into Energy Torrent to help a bit with AoE damage in the farm. Not sure I'll keep it, but it looks cool so I may try. I really love how all the powers come together. It's super flashy and a great fit for such a ridiculous character. 

 

One kinda minor issue I have is when there are lot of enemies, they like to crowd behind me, which makes backing up a step for Energy Torrent/Power Crash a bit harder. If I can squeeze it in, I may take Combat Teleport.

 

 

 

Anyway, long story short, as much as I enjoyed Super Reflexes, this character's future looks to be Shield/En. It's way too much fun. I can't wait to get a build going and see how it performs with some set bonuses and IOs.

 

I happened to do a Summer Blockbuster and got this shot. Unfortunately the shield and energy fists aren't included: 

 

 

Edited April 16, 2022 by oedipus_tex

[Golden Azrael]

That looks very gladiator-ial. 🙂

 

Impressive screen grab.

 

Shield is an impressive tank.  I have one Elec/Shield tank.  Turbo charged.  Shield Charge just crashes in there with bursts of damage stacking with Lightning Strike.  Thunderstrike as well.  World of pain for mobs.

 

SR is a good amour but it is very passive.  No DoT, no Shield Charge.

Add Shield Charge to Energy Crash and Whirling Hands and you have a world of hurt.  Add that to any AoE epic you can get or AoE Incarnate and you're rocking.

 

Azrael.

Edited April 17, 2022 by Golden Azrael