For realsies this time, the REAL debuff King, dark/dark corruptor

Nayland1971 · July 20, 2022

Like in my other thread, this is admittedly a gimmick build but I'd like to try and see it through. The idea is to tweak this character for debuff as much as possible. It doesn't matter if the character can't solo or doesn't do amazing dps. I just want to be able to debuff as much as possible and have the endurance to do so.

I've provided a cursory build but I am admittedly bad at this (why did I include ATOs if I don't care about damage?? Because they're shiny, I think) and am hoping that someone will either provide an alternative build or supply enough critiques that I can get this thing in working order. Here goes!

This Villain build was built using Mids Reborn 3.2.17
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Dial M for Miscreant: Level 50 Science Corruptor
Primary Power Set: Dark Blast
Secondary Power Set: Dark Miasma
Power Pool: Concealment
Power Pool: Sorcery
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Mu Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Dark Blast

(A) Superior Malice of the Corruptor - Accuracy/Damage
(5) Superior Malice of the Corruptor - Damage/Recharge
(7) Superior Malice of the Corruptor - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(7) Superior Malice of the Corruptor - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(9) Superior Malice of the Corruptor - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(9) Superior Malice of the Corruptor - Recharge/Chance for Negative Energy Damage

Level 1: Twilight Grasp

(A) To Hit Debuff IO

Level 2: Moonbeam

(A) Superior Scourging Blast - Accuracy/Damage
(11) Superior Scourging Blast - Damage/RechargeTime
(11) Superior Scourging Blast - Accuracy/Damage/RechargeTime
(13) Superior Scourging Blast - Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime
(13) Superior Scourging Blast - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime
(15) Superior Scourging Blast - RechargeTime/PBAoE +End

Level 4: Stealth

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 6: Mystic Flight

(A) Winter's Gift - Slow Resistance (20%)

Level 8: Dark Pit

(A) Rope A Dope - Accuracy/Stun
(36) Rope A Dope - Accuracy/Stun/Recharge
(37) Rope A Dope - Accuracy/Recharge
(37) Rope A Dope - Endurance/Stun
(37) Rope A Dope - Accuracy/Endurance
(39) Rope A Dope - Stun/Range

Level 10: Gloom

(A) Siphon Insight - ToHit Debuff
(15) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/ToHit Debuff
(17) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/Recharge
(17) Siphon Insight - ToHit Debuff/Endurance/Recharge
(19) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
(19) Siphon Insight - Chance for +ToHit

Level 12: Tar Patch

(A) Ice Mistral's Torment - Damage/Slow
(39) Ice Mistral's Torment - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(39) Ice Mistral's Torment - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(40) Ice Mistral's Torment - Chance for Cold Damage

Level 14: Darkest Night

(A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff
(21) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge
(21) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge/Endurance
(23) Dark Watcher's Despair - Recharge/Endurance
(23) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance
(25) Dark Watcher's Despair - Chance for Recharge Slow

Level 16: Shadow Fall

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense
(36) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 18: Night Fall

(A) Siphon Insight - ToHit Debuff
(33) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/ToHit Debuff
(34) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/Recharge
(34) Siphon Insight - ToHit Debuff/Endurance/Recharge
(34) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
(36) Siphon Insight - Chance for +ToHit

Level 20: Torrent

(A) Siphon Insight - ToHit Debuff
(25) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/ToHit Debuff
(27) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/Recharge
(27) Sudden Acceleration - Knockback to Knockdown
(33) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
(33) Siphon Insight - Chance for +ToHit

Level 22: Spirit Ward

(A) Healing IO

Level 24: Rune of Protection

(A) Resist Damage IO

Level 26: Life Drain

(A) Siphon Insight - ToHit Debuff
(40) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/ToHit Debuff
(40) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
(42) Siphon Insight - Chance for +ToHit

Level 28: Maneuvers

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
(29) Shield Wall - +Res (Teleportation), +5% Res (All)
(29) Reactive Defenses - Scaling Resist Damage

Level 30: Tactics

(A) Rectified Reticle - Increased Perception
(31) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - To Hit Buff
(31) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - To Hit Buff/Recharge/Endurance
(31) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Chance for Build Up

Level 32: Fearsome Stare

(A) Siphon Insight - ToHit Debuff
(50) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/ToHit Debuff
(50) Siphon Insight - Chance for +ToHit

Level 35: Blackstar

(A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff
(45) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge
(46) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge/Endurance
(46) Dark Watcher's Despair - Recharge/Endurance
(46) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance
(50) Dark Watcher's Despair - Chance for Recharge Slow

Level 38: Power Sink

(A) Recharge Reduction IO
(42) Recharge Reduction IO
(42) Recharge Reduction IO
(43) Performance Shifter - EndMod
(43) Performance Shifter - EndMod/Accuracy
(43) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End

Level 41: Dark Servant

(A) Accuracy IO

Level 44: Tenebrous Tentacles

(A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff
(45) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance
(45) Dark Watcher's Despair - Chance for Recharge Slow

Level 47: Charged Armor

(A) Steadfast Protection - Knockback Protection
(48) Aegis - Psionic/Status Resistance
(48) Unbreakable Guard - +Max HP
(48) Reactive Armor - Resistance/Endurance/Recharge

Level 49: Electric Shackles

(A) Accuracy IO

Level 1: Brawl

(A) Empty

Level 1: Scourge

Level 1: Sprint

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Uun · July 20, 2022

If you really want to debuff as much as possible, this needs to be a defender. Defender debuff values are higher than corruptor's across the board.

Twilight Grasp needs accuracy. Personally I would slot with Touch of the Nictus as it's a great heal. It also has -regen.
Stealth and Shadow Fall are mutually exclusive and can't be run together. If you want a LOTG mule, take Combat Jumping instead of Stealth.
Skip Dark Pit. It only disorients minions and has no -tohit.
Slot Tar Patch with 2x recharge IOs. Accuracy and damage do nothing. Not sure if procs work as it's a pseudo pet.
Skip Life Drain.
More slots in Fearsome Stare. Along with Darkest Night, it's the biggest -tohit in the set.
Dark Servant is a walking debuff. Slot with 4-6 pieces of Cloud Senses.
Tenebrous Tentacles needs accuracy.
Shadow Fall, Maneuvers, Tactics and Charged Armor all need end reduction.
Power Sink doesn't need accuracy, the +end proc or 3x recharge IOs. I usually 3-slot with some combination of EndMod, EndMod/Recharge and EndMod/EndRed/Recharge IOs.
Don't skip Howling Twilight. In addition to rezzing, it's a huge -regen.

JayboH · July 21, 2022

16 hours ago, Uun said:

Skip Dark Pit. It only disorients minions and has no -tohit.

I have fought several times to get that power to be worth a damn. Absolutely everything sucks about it and no amount of slotting makes it worth it in my opinion. 😒

Doomguide2005 · August 11, 2022

On 7/21/2022 at 3:36 AM, JayboH said:

I have fought several times to get that power to be worth a damn. Absolutely everything sucks about it and no amount of slotting makes it worth it in my opinion. 😒

... until you can stack it with something. In this case that's a mag 4 stun when stacked with HT, for example. Now the bosses are stunned as well. That said it's not a must have either. Much better stacked with another rapidly recharging stun (such as Thunderclap or Stalagmites) than the not every spawn of HT.

Blackstar - the 5 and 6 slot bonuses are nothing to write home about. Get your full debuff and damage by using 2 +5 boosted damage IOs. Be sure global accuracy and to hit are sufficient to land the attack.
Twilight Grasp - unlike Dark Pit i would definitely not skip or skimp. This power is a debuff workhorse and an AoE heal. Debuffs damage, regen and to hit. All of which self stack.
Both Siphon Insight and Clouded Sense best bonus is at 4 slots. Like Blackstar you could drop the last 2 slots in favor of a pair of boosted damage IOs. You would miss the 6 slot defense bonus but 1) this is a team build someone else is around to eat the alpha. 2) you are dropping loads of To Hit debuffs to 'cap' defenses in any case.
Tactics - the Rectified Recticle is worth essentially nothing. Tactics while active will obliterate any PvE concerns wrt the Blind condition or foe stealth.
Fearsome Stare - If/when necessary this is a prime choice for your alpha/opener. Don't skip or skimp and enhance the To Hit not the Fear attribute of the power.

And I agree overall with pretty much everything @Uunposted above as well.

JayboH · August 21, 2022

On 8/10/2022 at 9:22 PM, Doomguide2005 said:

... until you can stack it with something. In this case that's a mag 4 stun when stacked with HT, for example. Now the bosses are stunned as well. That said it's not a must have either. Much better stacked with another rapidly recharging stun (such as Thunderclap or Stalagmites) than the not every spawn of HT.

It's still bad even then - the acc is terrible and duration is terrible, and you can overcome that at the cost of something else if you really want to put all your eggs in that temporary stun for some reason.

Doomguide2005 · October 22, 2022

On 8/21/2022 at 4:28 AM, JayboH said:

It's still bad even then - the acc is terrible and duration is terrible, and you can overcome that at the cost of something else if you really want to put all your eggs in that temporary stun for some reason.

Bit late to respond, but for posterity.

Not sure where it got its terrible accuracy rep, but its had one for quite a while (well back on Live). I don't recall it being changed any time recently. It has the same base accuracy as most AoE stun powers such as Stalagmites, Flashfire, and Thunderclap, namely 0.8, readily overcome with either slotting accuracy, global accuracy and/or to hit buffs (roughly 1 even lvl SOs worth). There are AoE stuns with better accuracy but they're generally 1) higher level and 2) do other things. For example, Wormhole.

Its stun duration is lower (11.92 vs 14.9), but sheesh it's still a base 11.92 seconds hardly a "short" duration considering the expected lifespan of a stunned mob.

Edit: Accounting for the Purple Patch that's about 1.5 seconds less vs a +4 than the mag 3 Controller stuns mentioned above.

Edited October 22, 2022 by Doomguide2005

Snarky · October 22, 2022

I have pretty much decided to drop Dark Pit out of my build. I was using it to mule for some Ranged def, but I think i can build smarter for the power cost and 5 slots. Most minions that would have been stunned by this will be to hit debuffed to hell if I am playing well. errrr I think.....

Doomguide2005 · October 22, 2022

1 hour ago, Snarky said:

I have pretty much decided to drop Dark Pit out of my build. I was using it to mule for some Ranged def, but I think i can build smarter for the power cost and 5 slots. Most minions that would have been stunned by this will be to hit debuffed to hell if I am playing well. errrr I think.....

Probably ... or more likely rapidly will be. And that's where the rub is. If your ranged defense is high the foes alpha is mostly neutered. If it isn't capped/high then the stun of Dark Pit gets more useful to reduce incoming damage from minions from their return alpha prior to getting to hit debuffed. Now Dark certainly can build to neuter a good bit of foe return fire with Darkest Night or Feasome Stare especially if Power Boosted while having much less defense than most sets but against +3 or +4 that initial to hit debuff still needs about 32 to 35% defense to cap after that purple patch applies to Dark's debuff (beware rapid napkin math at play) against a +4 mob (and less if PB is applied).

JayboH · October 26, 2022

On 10/22/2022 at 1:35 PM, Doomguide2005 said:

Bit late to respond, but for posterity.

Not sure where it got its terrible accuracy rep, but its had one for quite a while (well back on Live). I don't recall it being changed any time recently. It has the same base accuracy as most AoE stun powers such as Stalagmites, Flashfire, and Thunderclap, namely 0.8, readily overcome with either slotting accuracy, global accuracy and/or to hit buffs (roughly 1 even lvl SOs worth). There are AoE stuns with better accuracy but they're generally 1) higher level and 2) do other things. For example, Wormhole.

Its stun duration is lower (11.92 vs 14.9), but sheesh it's still a base 11.92 seconds hardly a "short" duration considering the expected lifespan of a stunned mob.

Edit: Accounting for the Purple Patch that's about 1.5 seconds less vs a +4 than the mag 3 Controller stuns mentioned above.

Powers for different archetypes that aren't available for those that can get Dark Pit seems to be a weird comparison, and every one of those have better numbers - namely either lower endurance, larger AOE, higher mag level, can hit more targets, and/or have longer soft control effects. Dark Pit is beneath them all.

Doomguide2005 · October 26, 2022

3 hours ago, JayboH said:

Powers for different archetypes that aren't available for those that can get Dark Pit seems to be a weird comparison, and every one of those have better numbers - namely either lower endurance, larger AOE, higher mag level, can hit more targets, and/or have longer soft control effects. Dark Pit is beneath them all.

*shrug* none of which has much to do with its accuracy rep which was my main point. For a Defender AoE stun there's very little to compare Dark Pit with more directly. There's Thunderclap and if there's another it isn't leaping to mind and it's in the primary, not secondary. TC does as you point out, cost a bit less end, has a slightly larger AoE and the duration is slightly longer. It is also a PBAoE and requires the user to be in melee to use effectively. Dark Pit is in the blast secondary and has a 70ft range. Is Dark Pit anyone's stand out, signature power no. Does it deserve to be vilified for its poor accuracy equally no and if a Defender (or AT in general) has another stun to stack with it it's hardly a poor choice to include especially based on its accuracy and it will take a significant quantity of minions out of the picture. And that's quite useful for any Defender who wants get into melee to use their powers.

Edited October 26, 2022 by Doomguide2005
Changed more to less wrt end use

Snarky · October 26, 2022

4 hours ago, Doomguide2005 said:

*shrug* none of which has much to do with its accuracy rep which was my main point. For a Defender AoE stun there's very little to compare Dark Pit with more directly. There's Thunderclap and if there's another it isn't leaping to mind and it's in the primary, not secondary. TC does as you point out, cost a bit less end, has a slightly larger AoE and the duration is slightly longer. It is also a PBAoE and requires the user to be in melee to use effectively. Dark Pit is in the blast secondary and has a 70ft range. Is Dark Pit anyone's stand out, signature power no. Does it deserve to be vilified for its poor accuracy equally no and if a Defender (or AT in general) has another stun to stack with it it's hardly a poor choice to include especially based on its accuracy and it will take a significant quantity of minions out of the picture. And that's quite useful for any Defender who wants get into melee to use their powers.

I regularly run a Dark/Dark Brute and one of it's toggles is an AoE Fear that has a low base accuracy of 50%. I run it and have global accuracy and global to hit buffs. Dark Pit has 60% base accuracy. I think standard in the game is 75%

I run a lot of accuracy and global to hit buffs in all my builds, this Corruptor as well. Does nothing to solve Dark Pits major problem. You have too many good things to be doing to waste time energy, a power pick, and enhancers on this turd.

Doomguide2005 · October 26, 2022

*Sigh*

There are plenty of reasons to not like or want Dark Pit on a support build but accuracy shouldn't really be one of them is all I'm saying. It's accuracy is consistent with numerous other AoE stuns across ATs. A few have better accuracy. And that reduced accuracy is readily and easily overcome if desired by minimal amounts of slotted accuracy, global accuracy or to hit buffs (or some combination of the three. About the amount needed to equal a level shift). So maybe it's the final straw in the cumulative nuisance of higher end cost, low mag, shorter duration, but accuracy alone by its self would find a great many other powers on the turd pile with it.

Snarky · October 27, 2022

41 minutes ago, Doomguide2005 said:

*Sigh*

There are plenty of reasons to not like or want Dark Pit on a support build but accuracy shouldn't really be one of them is all I'm saying. It's accuracy is consistent with numerous other AoE stuns across ATs. A few have better accuracy. And that reduced accuracy is readily and easily overcome if desired by minimal amounts of slotted accuracy, global accuracy or to hit buffs (or some combination of the three. About the amount needed to equal a level shift). So maybe it's the final straw in the cumulative nuisance of higher end cost, low mag, shorter duration, but accuracy alone by its self would find a great many other powers on the turd pile with it.

For me its the low mag with no way to stack. If it was a fear it would be a yes, a to hit debuff? yep. But AoE stun? The only other option is Oppresive Gloom, which is PBAoE so defines where you need to be....dangerous. I zip into PBAoE for a Buff/Attack/Replish chain then step out to cone range Staying there is a no thank you.

MistressOhm · October 28, 2022

I'd much rather put Howling Twilight on a fast recharge than sink anything into Dark Pit. At least HT works, even if it's expensive.

IF Stuns knocked toggles consistently I'd consider maybe taking it, but even that is iffy.

The only way the Devs could fix Dark Pit at this stage would be to make it PvE autohit like the AoE Sleep powers, just take accuracy right out of the equation. But until that happens, it's End and animation time spent for ... zilch.

"And whaddya want for nuthin'? A RRRRUBBBBER BISCUIT??"

JayboH · November 3, 2022

I'll just quote myself:

"I have fought several times to get that power to be worth a damn. Absolutely everything sucks about it and no amount of slotting makes it worth it in my opinion."

Snarky · November 18, 2022

On 10/22/2022 at 2:19 PM, Doomguide2005 said:

Probably ... or more likely rapidly will be. And that's where the rub is. If your ranged defense is high the foes alpha is mostly neutered. If it isn't capped/high then the stun of Dark Pit gets more useful to reduce incoming damage from minions from their return alpha prior to getting to hit debuffed. Now Dark certainly can build to neuter a good bit of foe return fire with Darkest Night or Feasome Stare especially if Power Boosted while having much less defense than most sets but against +3 or +4 that initial to hit debuff still needs about 32 to 35% defense to cap after that purple patch applies to Dark's debuff (beware rapid napkin math at play) against a +4 mob (and less if PB is applied).

And now I am rebuilding my Corruptor in an attempt to saturate Soul Drain. So.... Throw Dark Pit (mag 2 disorient), run in while running Oppressive Gloom (mag 2 disorient), Soul Drain, Blackstar. Then joust back out to cone range and start burning.

Doomguide2005 · November 18, 2022

Anything that hits you after that combo ... well even EBs and AVs can get lucky 🙄

One thing I used to do was try to have my cones (Tentacles and Night Fall) of similar length. Didn't typically take Torrent in those days but kb to kd didn't exist either (as well as several other IO options) so not sure how similar you could get them considering it's 40, 60 and 80ft base ranges but did get the first two to 70ft with damage capped (and nothing but global accuracy for TT as I recall).

Darkir · November 18, 2022

On 7/21/2022 at 1:06 PM, JayboH said:

I have fought several times to get that power to be worth a damn. Absolutely everything sucks about it and no amount of slotting makes it worth it in my opinion. 😒

It gets better if you take oppressive gloom and then stack with a stun proc.

8 hours ago, Snarky said:

And now I am rebuilding my Corruptor in an attempt to saturate Soul Drain. So.... Throw Dark Pit (mag 2 disorient), run in while running Oppressive Gloom (mag 2 disorient), Soul Drain, Blackstar. Then joust back out to cone range and start burning.

Oh, you already mentioned this. I should have read further.

You can add a stun proc in dark consumption too. Things get better with electrical blast for the stun procs, but it's not worth it.

Edited November 18, 2022 by Darkir

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For realsies this time, the REAL debuff King, dark/dark corruptor

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