The profanity filter

[Panache]

11 minutes ago, biostem said:

You can't account for every permutation of words that may be offensive.  It is actually against the rules to bypass the filter via misspellings and the like.  That being said, we as mature adults can disable the filter and go on our merry way.  There's no need to remove any words from said profanity filter.  

 

Well, that's your opinion. Mine is: including someone's preferred descriptor in a list of words that get caught by the profanity filter is telling folks that you consider their descriptor profane. And that's pretty disappointing.

[Panache]

1 hour ago, GM Crumpet said:

To expand on the filter issue. As a PG13 game it's assumed that people of that age and above are kind of used to a lot of the words in the filter and have been exposed to them at some point. People younger than that perhaps not. This is one of those games that really does appeal to a younger demographic and youngsters either want to play (which is wrong and we don't allow it and shhhh don't tell dad) or watch while their parents play. For parents it's an option they can turn on as certain words and concepts may arise that they don't want to have to explain to their little ones just yet. I still squirm in embarrassment on behalf of my parents for the times I asked them what certain words meant when I heard them 🙂  

 

 

 

There are things in the costume creator that are 1000x more awkward to explain to a child than words. 😛

 

[biostem]

2 minutes ago, Panache said:

Well, that's your opinion. Mine is: including someone's preferred descriptor in a list of words that get caught by the profanity filter is telling folks that you consider their descriptor profane. And that's pretty disappointing.

But you have to acknowledge that your "chosen descriptor" can also be used as a slur.  The great thing is that you can disable the filter;  It is meant to be very restrictive.  Look at things from the perspective of a parent supervising a child player who is of the minimum allowable age.

[biostem]

2 minutes ago, Panache said:

There are things in the costume creator that are 1000x more awkward to explain to a child than words.

I agree, but at the same time, it is much more difficult to filter them out via some in-built mechanism.  At the same time, you can certainly report any objectionable costumes.

[Panache]

3 minutes ago, biostem said:

But you have to acknowledge that your "chosen descriptor" can also be used as a slur.  The great thing is that you can disable the filter;  It is meant to be very restrictive.  Look at things from the perspective of a parent supervising a child player who is of the minimum allowable age.

What is the minimum allowable age? 

[biostem]

1 minute ago, Panache said:

What is the minimum allowable age? 

As a teen rated game, I'd assume 13, (though there are likely even younger people playing, though those are not technically allowed).

[Panache]

Just now, biostem said:

As a teen rated game, I'd assume 13, (though there are likely even younger people playing, though those are not technically allowed).

Ok. So say I’m the parent of a 13 year old who identifies as queer. They create a character who also identifies as such. Then they find that people cannot read that in chat because they have their filter enabled to sort out offensive words. How would you explain this to them in a way that makes them feel like they’re welcomed and supported by the folks in charge of that filter?

[biostem]

4 minutes ago, Panache said:

Ok. So say I’m the parent of a 13 year old who identifies as queer. They create a character who also identifies as such. Then they find that people cannot read that in chat because they have their filter enabled to sort out offensive words. How would you explain this to them in a way that makes them feel like they’re welcomed and supported by the folks in charge of that filter?

People can use the word "queer" as a slur.  Some people are not ready or prepared to parse out the difference between it being used as a simple identifier or as an attack.  It's similar to why we have the "no real life or politics" rule - some people do not want to bring real world topics in-game.

Edited August 8, 2023 by biostem

[Panache]

To phrase it another way: as mentioned, the filter can’t grab every permutation of inoffensive words, but it does grab those words that are objectionable *on their own merits*. That’s what the filter currently says about the word queer.

[Hyperstrike]

56 minutes ago, Captain Fabulous said:

 

I'm also a gay man of an older generation when queer was absolutely a slur, I fully support removing the word from the profanity filter. But this absolutely should not give license for people to use it pejoratively in the game.

You can have it fast, cheap or good.  PICK ONE!

[Rudra]

16 minutes ago, Panache said:

20 minutes ago, biostem said:

As a teen rated game, I'd assume 13, (though there are likely even younger people playing, though those are not technically allowed).

Ok. So say I’m the parent of a 13 year old who identifies as queer. They create a character who also identifies as such. Then they find that people cannot read that in chat because they have their filter enabled to sort out offensive words. How would you explain this to them in a way that makes them feel like they’re welcomed and supported by the folks in charge of that filter?

I guess tell them it is a double standard society is still working through like female anatomy is bleeped out but male anatomy isn't in the game? (I got curious, logged on to the game, and tried several words. Sex, heterosexual, homosexual, queer, and various body parts to test.)

 

Edit: I should probably also state that out of my test words, the words sex, heterosexual, and homosexual all got by without being filtered. (Edit again: As did the words transexual, pansexual, and asexual. As well as gay and lesbian. All perfectly fine by the filter. So looks like only queer is filtered.)

Edited August 8, 2023 by Rudra

[Panache]

1 minute ago, biostem said:

People can use the word "queer" as a slur.  Some people are not ready or prepared to parse out the difference between it being used as a simple identifier or as an attack.  It's similar to why we have the "no real life or politics" rule - some people do not want to bring real world topics in-game.

This doesn’t answer the quoted question, but I didn’t expect it would. Because there’s no good answer.

[biostem]

7 minutes ago, Rudra said:

sex, heterosexual, and homosexual all got by without being filtered.

What about asexual, polyamorous, bisexual, demisexual, and the like.  Those really aren't/haven't been used as slurs. (although shortening "homosexual" probably should be filtered).  Regardless, if you want to express yourself more freely, you can disable said filter or go to other venues that aren't a teen-rated game.

[Rudra]

1 minute ago, biostem said:

What about asexual, polyamorous, bisexual, demisexual, and the like.  Those really aren't/haven't been used as slurs. (although shortening "homosexual" probably should be filtered).  Regardless, if you want to express yourself more freely, you can disable said filter or go to other venues that aren't a teen-rated game.

They get by the filter as well.

[Oubliette_Red]

33 minutes ago, Panache said:

Ok. So say I’m the parent of a 13 year old who identifies as queer. They create a character who also identifies as such. Then they find that people cannot read that in chat because they have their filter enabled to sort out offensive words. How would you explain this to them in a way that makes them feel like they’re welcomed and supported by the folks in charge of that filter?

 

This is where educating you child about the history of some meanings and words comes into play. It's a teaching moment.

 

Edited August 8, 2023 by Oubliette_Red

[biostem]

22 minutes ago, Panache said:

This doesn’t answer the quoted question, but I didn’t expect it would. Because there’s no good answer.

Sure it did - some people use it as a bad word, so it gets blocked.  It isn't about how you or your child use the word - it's about providing a broad protection against offensive uses of it.  If you feel your child is mature enough to understand how it can also be used in the an offensive manner, (and how to avoid doing so themselves), then by all means disable the filter and carry on with your gameplay.

Edited August 8, 2023 by biostem

[Scutt]

23 minutes ago, Rudra said:

I guess tell them it is a double standard society is still working through like female anatomy is bleeped out but male anatomy isn't in the game? (I got curious, logged on to the game, and tried several words. Sex, heterosexual, homosexual, queer, and various body parts to test.)

 

Edit: I should probably also state that out of my test words, the words sex, heterosexual, and homosexual all got by without being filtered. (Edit again: As did the words transexual, pansexual, and asexual. As well as gay and lesbian. All perfectly fine by the filter. So looks like only queer is filtered.)

That really speaks to me, like I had initially presumed, that this was an original filter list left over from OG days. Nobody had really considered or thought about it until this curmudgeon here noticed it and decided to point it out.

 

I was so not intending for this to blow up as such. 

[GM Crumpet]

2 minutes ago, Scutt said:

That really speaks to me, like I had initially presumed, that this was an original filter list left over from OG days. Nobody had really considered or thought about it until this curmudgeon here noticed it and decided to point it out.

 

I was so not intending for this to blow up as such. 

It is from live if I remember right. We certainly didn't go through multiple dictionaries and make the filter by hand.

[Panache]

2 minutes ago, biostem said:

Sure it did - some people use it as a bad word, so it gets blocked.  It isn't about how you or your child use the word - it's about providing a broad protection against offensive uses of it.  If you feel your child is mature enough to understand how it can be used in the an offensive manner, then by all means disable the filter and carry on with your gameplay.

I can guarantee y’all that no 13 year old who self-identifies as queer is naive to the fact that it’s a word that’s been used with the intent to offend. That’s old hat to them. What might be new to them in 2023 is finding out that that part of their identity isn’t allowed to be mentioned in a video game.

 

[GM Crumpet]

I'm going to lock this thread as it's starting to circle back on itself. It's had some interesting points raised, and people have had the chance to comment, but I think it's done.