Can anyone improve on this build? (DB / Ninjitsu)

[Story Archer]

This is how the character is built currently, but I've got a couple of respecs available and there are a couple of things I wouldn't mind changing if I could come up with a better option (build at the bottom of the page). Overall I'm extremely happy with the character, so I'm not looking to tear apart the whole build, but now that I'm topping out I want to make sure that I'm not leaving anything on the table.

 

 

 

A few things:

 

I have two different attack chains that I use, depending on the situation, and I'm quite happy with both. They're very smooth and give me everything that I need, while also allowing me to benefit from the combos a little, so I'm not worried about chasing too much more recharge. As much as I hate to skip a primary T9, I just can't justify taking 1,000 Cuts with its long animation time.

• Attack Chain #1: BF -> NS -> AS -> TE
• Attack Chain #2: SS -> NS -> AS -> BF

 

I almost never use Arcane Bolt, Energy Torrent or Laser Beam Eyes for anything other than the set bonuses. Ditto Kuji-In Retsu, it's just a mule for the LotG IO. I almost never need Focused Accuracy, using it only when dealing with lots of debuffs, but I feel it's better to have it as an option than not, and it opens the door to the rest of the Epic Pool.

 

Should I have gone with the Ageless Destiny Incarnate to have access to better DDR instead of the heals provided by Rebirth? Thinking about it, that seems like the way to go.

 

Any thoughts at all would be much appreciated! TIA.

 

[Veil of Blades 2].mbd

 

 

Edited September 17 by Story Archer

[Story Archer]

LOL

 

So, I guess I'll take that as a no?

[WuTang]

On 9/19/2024 at 1:47 PM, Story Archer said:

LOL

 

So, I guess I'll take that as a no?

Do you need 75% psi resistance? Your Range and AOE defenses could be topped off, if you solo alot or the more defense you have the more debuff and +toHit they need to hurt you.

 

What are you looking to improve on, damage, survivability, endurance, debuff? All that recharge is for what? At your current point losing 10% recharge only increase power recharge by fractions of a second. So you could slot for defenses or resists instead.

 

Gaussian's build up proc only has a 12% chance to hit where you have it, you'd be better off with just about anything else.

 

But really the build looks solid. IMO

[Without_Pause]

It does seem weird to have the more exotic damage types having for Res than S/L which is going to be more common. I feel like I could name most of the mobs who do Cold. Even if not true, my point remains in that Cold really isn't used that much across mobs as a whole. 

[Jeff Krock]

https://api.midsreborn.com/legacy/download?uc=1619&c=707&a=1414&f=HEX&dc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

[Story Archer]

On 9/26/2024 at 9:57 AM, WuTang said:

Do you need 75% psi resistance? Your Range and AOE defenses could be topped off, if you solo alot or the more defense you have the more debuff and +toHit they need to hurt you.

 

What are you looking to improve on, damage, survivability, endurance, debuff? All that recharge is for what? At your current point losing 10% recharge only increase power recharge by fractions of a second. So you could slot for defenses or resists instead.

 

Gaussian's build up proc only has a 12% chance to hit where you have it, you'd be better off with just about anything else.

 

But really the build looks solid. IMO

 

Thanks for responding! I don't feel as if the build lacks anywhere in particular, I just want to make sure I'm getting the most I can out of it in a general sense. I figured with my defenses already over the soft-cap I was good - do you think that's a better area to focus on? I'm not sure where the additional defensive numbers would come from. I've got Kuji-In Retsu and Rune of Protection there for me when I need it, so I haven't really felt a lack of either Def or Res up to this point.

 

I'm not sure what I'd want in that one slot more than the Build-Up proc - it seems ideally suited to a set up my follow-up attacks, especially considering the +50% Crit proc there too. Completing the AT set just gives me more recharge. I know it only really comes into play against AV's, GM's, etc., but what would be better? Is there something that you would suggest? 

Edited September 27 by Story Archer

[Story Archer]

On 9/26/2024 at 11:26 AM, Jeff Krock said:

https://api.midsreborn.com/legacy/download?uc=1619&c=707&a=1414&f=HEX&dc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

 

For some reason, this format won't open for me, it just bugs out.

[Story Archer]

On 9/26/2024 at 11:01 AM, Without_Pause said:

It does seem weird to have the more exotic damage types having for Res than S/L which is going to be more common. I feel like I could name most of the mobs who do Cold. Even if not true, my point remains in that Cold really isn't used that much across mobs as a whole. 

 

I've got Rune of Protection for when I need it, but I'm open to any suggestions if you see a way to meaningfully increase my S/L Res... the F/C Res is just a convenient by-product of minimally slotting the ranged attacks that I don't really use. It's true you don't see Cold much but you see Fire plenty and those two damage types are linked when it comes to set bonuses.

Edited September 27 by Story Archer

[Story Archer]

On 9/26/2024 at 9:57 AM, WuTang said:

Do you need 75% psi resistance? Your Range and AOE defenses could be topped off, if you solo alot or the more defense you have the more debuff and +toHit they need to hurt you.

 

What are you looking to improve on, damage, survivability, endurance, debuff? All that recharge is for what? At your current point losing 10% recharge only increase power recharge by fractions of a second. So you could slot for defenses or resists instead.

 

Gaussian's build up proc only has a 12% chance to hit where you have it, you'd be better off with just about anything else.

 

But really the build looks solid. IMO

 

So I tried moving a few things around - 5-slotted Energy Torrent with Superior Frozen Blast and replaced Laser Beam Eyes with Blinding Powder, 6-slotted with Coercive Persuasion. It basically cost me a 4% damage buff, the Build-Up proc, 7.5% recharge, and 6% Res to F/C/Tox/Psi, but I upped my defenses so that they're currently sitting at:

 

• Melee 50.2%
• Range 51.5% (up from 46.5%)
• AoE 51.5% (up from 46.5%)

 

I'm not sure if the speculative benefits to Defense outweigh the ongoing benefits to Resistance and Damage, relatively minor as they might be, considering that I've got Kuji-In Retsu to click if I'm facing a slew of Defensive DeBuffs. On the flip side, Rune of Protection still pushes those four resists right up to the hard cap, even with the changes. Blinding Powder on its own doesn't seem like it would offer enough benefit to have an effect on the discussion either way.

 

What do you think?

Edited September 27 by Story Archer

[WuTang]

Do you know how to attach a file? It's a better way of sharing MIDs builds than the data chunk, IMO. 

 

If not, see below: "Drag files here to attach, or choose files..." Click choose file and select the MIDs file of your choosing and that will import a link/download for everyone.

 

But I don't see your newest build.

 

I'm constantly tweaking mine too, even if they work. So I get it.... I tend to lean heavy on survivability, the DPS as long as you do more than their regen then that's good enough. There have been times when folks are faceplanting and I'm still up at around full HP, but also, as many will point out, high DPS is a great damage mitigator... a dead bad guy does no damage.

 

I like your new defense levels better and now you've got me interested in /Nin

Edited September 29 by WuTang

[Story Archer]

8 hours ago, WuTang said:

Do you know how to attach a file? It's a better way of sharing MIDs builds than the data chunk, IMO. 

 

If not, see below: "Drag files here to attach, or choose files..." Click choose file and select the MIDs file of your choosing and that will import a link/download for everyone.

 

 

Was this intended for me? I've never posted a data chunk in my life and my initial build file is attached in the OP. I've attached the new build below.

 

[Veil of Blades 3].mbd

 

Edited September 29 by Story Archer

[WuTang]

14 hours ago, Story Archer said:

 

Was this intended for me? I've never posted a data chunk in my life and my initial build file is attached in the OP. I've attached the new build below.

 

[Veil of Blades 3].mbd 43.87 kB · 0 downloads

 

I like it, and if it fits your playstyle then great. Gonna file your build away....got plans for it.

 

[Maelwys]

I'd be tempted to strip an Unbreakable Guard from "Bo Ryaku" plus the second slot from Mystic Flight (changing the default slot to a Winters Gift unique) - that would give you 2 spare enhancement slots to 6-slot Blinding Feint with (swap one of the existing SCS set to the ATO; then stick another another damage Proc and a Gaussians Unique in it)
Also, the Aegis in "Kuji-In Rin" could be swapped with the Gladiator's Unique, and the spare slot moved to RoP to keep all your resistances capped.

[Veil of Blades 3a].mbd
[No-Rop] vs [with Rop]
 

Other slots that aren't doing much for you are the last two Unbreakable Guards in "Tough"; but they're probably better placed there than anywhere else unless you really want more recovery or Fire/Cold Res etc.

[Maelwys]

Quick note on Blinding Feint - 
+ Optimal Slotting there is going to be 2x Acc/Dam HOs, the Superior Critical Strikes +CritChance ATO, the Gaussian Unique and two damage procs (e.g. Touch of Death and Gladiator). That would give you 23.19% recharge slotting in the power itself; meaning the Gaussian would have 18.24% chance of activating and the ATO 72.94%.
+ By using a 4-piece SCS set in it, you're increasing the recharge slotting in the power itself and drastically lowering proc activation rate. In the build v3a above there is 72.59% recharge slotting in the power itself, giving the Gaussian 13.59% chance of activating and the ATO 54.35%.


Judging by the slotting of your other attacks it looks like you're not really focussing on attaining maximum damage output here; but you could still juggle some slots around a little to bump up your red numbers a smidge. e.g. [Veil of Blades 3b].mbd

[Story Archer]

23 hours ago, Maelwys said:

Quick note on Blinding Feint - 
+ Optimal Slotting there is going to be 2x Acc/Dam HOs, the Superior Critical Strikes +CritChance ATO, the Gaussian Unique and two damage procs (e.g. Touch of Death and Gladiator). That would give you 23.19% recharge slotting in the power itself; meaning the Gaussian would have 18.24% chance of activating and the ATO 72.94%.
+ By using a 4-piece SCS set in it, you're increasing the recharge slotting in the power itself and drastically lowering proc activation rate. In the build v3a above there is 72.59% recharge slotting in the power itself, giving the Gaussian 13.59% chance of activating and the ATO 54.35%.


Judging by the slotting of your other attacks it looks like you're not really focussing on attaining maximum damage output here; but you could still juggle some slots around a little to bump up your red numbers a smidge. e.g. [Veil of Blades 3b].mbd

 

I really appreciate you taking the time to offer up these different perspectives, particularly the insight on getting the proc/recharge balance right on BF.

 

I looked at some of the things you did above and incorporated them into the build I'm working with. I'm going to have to see if the attack chains are as smooth, and if not how I want to address that, but maximizing the proc opportunities in BF is certainly paramount. Any particular reason why you favor the Gladiator proc over something that deals a more exotic damage type?

 

Here's what I'm playing with right now.

 

[Veil of Blades 4].mbd

 

 

[Maelwys]

2 hours ago, Story Archer said:

Any particular reason why you favor the Gladiator proc over something that deals a more exotic damage type?

Well the default Melee ST Set IO Damage Proc options are Mako's Bite (Lethal), Touch of Death (Negative) and Gladiator's Strike (Smashing).
You're already doing substantial Lethal damage, and the things that resist that damage type heavily (such as Robotic enemies) tend to be weaker against smashing.

However if a power allows additional damage Procs from other IO sets, slot whatever type you like. Just remember higher-PPM Purple Damage Procs will nearly always be better (unless the power has an long enough recharge time to cap activation chance on the regular 3.5PPM procs!)

 

In Lv40+ PVE content enemy resistances vary a fair bit, but in general Fire > Negative > Cold/Smashing > Energy/Lethal/ Psi > Toxic. 

[Story Archer]

16 minutes ago, Maelwys said:

In Lv40+ PVE content enemy resistances vary a fair bit, but in general Fire > Negative > Cold/Smashing > Energy/Lethal/ Psi > Toxic. 

 

I had no idea that Psi and especially Toxic were so heavily resisted. 

 

I always just assumed that S/L were the most heavily resisted by far, but what you say makes sense, regarding those who resist one tend to be more vulnerable to the other.

 

In the build that I sent you, does bumping my Global Recharge back up to 95% case timing issues with regards to any of my major procs? The recharge on BF is still 5.5s.

 

Also, do you think that Hasten has any place in this build? I could easily fit it in in place of Hover and find a second Recharge slot for it. I didn't bother with it because I liked my attack chain already, and the clickies seemed to come up often enough, but as I move into tougher content, is it something I should consider?

 

Edited October 1 by Story Archer

[Maelwys]

The other consideration (which may or may not matter to you!) is that even when attuned, the sets that procs belong to have different active level ranges for their set bonuses.
Mako stops working if you exemplar below Lv27.

Touch of Death stops working below Lv22.

Gladiator's will keep working all the way down to Lv7.
 

Will likely only become relevant if/when you run low level Task/Strike Forces; but still worth bearing in mind! 🙂

 

  

On 10/1/2024 at 8:06 PM, Story Archer said:

In the build that I sent you, does bumping my Global Recharge back up to 95% case timing issues with regards to any of my major procs? The recharge on BF is still 5.5s.

 

Also, do you think that Hasten has any place in this build? I could easily fit it in in place of Hover and find a second Recharge slot for it. I didn't bother with it because I liked my attack chain already, and the clickies seemed to come up often enough, but as I move into tougher content, is it something I should consider?

 

Global Recharge doesn't reduce Proc activation chance, only Local recharge slotting within the power itself does (so equipping an 'Agility' Alpha Slot ability which adds local recharge reduction % to all your powers would impact proc chance, but Hasten and a +7.5% Recharge LoTG would not!)

Hasten is always useful for getting powers up faster. But if your attack chain functions without it and you're not relying on Clicky Buffs/Debuffs then it's skippable. Just be careful of Recharge Rate Debuffs... 😀

[EDIT: Good grief what was I smoking when i originally wrote this? Hopefully should make some semblance of sense now...]
 

Edited December 17 by Maelwys

[Story Archer]

7 hours ago, Maelwys said:

The other consideration (which may or may not matter to you!) is that even when attuned, different damage procs have different active level ranges.

 

Holy crap - those HO's are going for 140,000,000 infl each. I was not ready for that.

 

What's the recharge rate I need to be at to make sure those procs are firing optimally on BF?

[Maelwys]

6 hours ago, Story Archer said:

 

Holy crap - those HO's are going for 140,000,000 infl each. I was not ready for that.

 

What's the recharge rate I need to be at to make sure those procs are firing optimally on BF?

 

You can use two regular Acc/Dam set IOs that are Lv50+5 and get nearly the same performance. Lv53 HOs are for those of us that want maximum performance and have lots of inf to burn (and you can often make them for far cheaper by playing the combine-lower-level-HOs-into-a-+3 lottery. Check the AH regularly and don't use the "buy it now" prices. That said 140m isn't surprising, last I checked some of the rarer type of Lv53 DSyncs were going for about ten times that figure!)

 

For PPM likelihood, use this to calculate the proc chance (make a copy so it's editable) and this to find any inputs you're not sure about (power recharge/radius/cast time etc. and PPM rate of the IO).

 

The short version is that the recharge and cast time on Blinding Feint are not long enough to cap a 3.5 PPM proc's activation rate, even at 0% local recharge% slotting, so any recharge slotting you place in the power itself will lower its proc activation rate. Whilst the +CritRate SCS ATO contains some +recharge% it is best placed in BF so that your other harder-hitting powers can take advantage of its buff window... but that should be the only source of local +recharge% you put in it unless you really don't care about procs.

[EDIT] - Just checked your original v4 build in Mids; and it looks like you've sufficient global accuracy buffs to have a >95% ToHit chance versus regular +3 enemies (typical endgame PVE baseline acc requirements) with just a single Lv50+3 Acc/Dam IO slotted in BF. Then after BF is already activated (even single-stacked) you'd be getting enough additional +ToHit buff from it to *just* put you just over the 125% mark (capping your ToHit chance versus regular +3 enemies in 4 Star Hard Mode content, with their baseline +30% Defense buff).
So rather than forking out for two Lv53 Acc/Dam HOs, I'd probably just throw a Lv50+5 Gladiator's Strike Acc/Dam plus a regular Lv50+5 Dam IO in there and call it done. If you don't care about HardMode then you could even get away with using a Lv40+5 Touch of Death Acc/Dam IO instead to boost your E/N resists a smidge. Or as a potential alternative; using Acc/Dam and Dam/End Superior Blistering Cold IOs would give you some additional Recharge Rate Reduction resistance.
 

Edited October 2 by Maelwys

[Troyusrex]

On 9/17/2024 at 2:48 PM, Story Archer said:

 

Ditto Kuji-In Retsu, it's just a mule for the LotG IO. 

 

 

You are totally missing out then. Kuji-in Retsu is an amazing power that lets you fight pretty much anything. Yes, the crash is a problem, but you have 3 minutes to defeat whatever you are up against, and that's a huge amount of time. I also one-slot it, but I think if you start using it you'll find it's a very nice power. 

[Doomguide2005]

1 hour ago, Troyusrex said:

You are totally missing out then. Kuji-in Retsu is an amazing power that lets you fight pretty much anything. Yes, the crash is a problem, but you have 3 minutes to defeat whatever you are up against, and that's a huge amount of time. I also one-slot it, but I think if you start using it you'll find it's a very nice power. 

     With defenses already well above soft caps outside of 'silly scrapper tricks' not sure how much benefit is actually gained.  Endurance recovery while up against a horde of +4 Mu perhaps?  Easy to pop small lucks if you need incarnate cap and RoP will cap most of his resists as well.  Granted the crash can be dealt with but little is gained by risking it 99.99% of the time.  Practically the only time I've used Elude on my SR is after getting dropped by an AV (Bobcat almost exclusively) and using it immediately afterwards to get my defenses up and buy time to finish the fight when I've been one of the few (if not only) melee on the team.  But it was fun back in the day to go nuts with Elude for a bit.

[Sovera]

On 10/1/2024 at 8:16 PM, Maelwys said:

The other consideration (which may or may not matter to you!) is that even when attuned, different damage procs have different active level ranges.
A Mako Proc will stop working if you exemplar below Lv27.

A Touch of Death will stop working below Lv22.

A Gladiator's Proc will keep working all the way down to Lv7.
 

Will likely only become relevant if/when you run low level Task/Strike Forces; but still worth bearing in mind! 🙂

 

 

Aren't procs immune to exemplaring? They aren't bonuses and once it can be slotted it will work at any level. Or am I labouring in error?

[Zect]

9 hours ago, Sovera said:

Aren't procs immune to exemplaring? They aren't bonuses and once it can be slotted it will work at any level. Or am I labouring in error?

 

Procs are immune to the rule that they stop working when exemplared below (IO level - 3). You can get a mako proc or tod proc to fire when exemped down to level 1, as a quick jaunt to your local AE farm will demonstrate.

 

What may have gotten mixed up here is that procs do stop working, if you exemplar low enough that the power they are slotted in is no longer available. But this is simply a consequence of the fact that procs require the power they are slotted in to activate for they themselves to fire. No power, no proc.

[Maelwys]

On 12/14/2024 at 11:22 PM, Sovera said:

 

Aren't procs immune to exemplaring?

The additional damage is, yes.
I'm guessing what I was thinking of was set bonuses, so have edited appropriately... but I'll chalk that one up to toddler-related sleep deprivation. Apologies!