What do I need to know about Regen?

[FFTMime]

3 hours ago, Troo said:

 

pst, that's not love.

 

I do get it. Not every set or even every archetype is for everyone and that's okay.

I played regen in it's release state. Then sat through a series of nerf. Some justified. The community admitted it. Then admitted it was where it probably should be. Then it got nerfed again. In an incident where Statesman forged evidence to justify it to the community. And deleted his post and went silent after it was called out. In which everyone knew regen was now below par. I survived then by using air superiority in conjunction with MA's knockdown and knockback. Before you could spend infinite resources to prop up anything with proc based enhancements and incarnate powers and such. 

I like how the set plays. I really enjoy it. I don't know why people are averse to a set that doesn't rely on toggles. The fact it underperforms really shouldn't be controversial though. 

[Troo]

10 minutes ago, FFTMime said:

I like how the set plays. I really enjoy it. I don't know why people are averse to a set that doesn't rely on toggles. The fact it underperforms really shouldn't be controversial though. 

 

"pst, that's not love." referred to the recognition of an unhealthy relationship a person should run from.

 

All but one set under performs. Unless there is a tie for best set... that's how rankings work. (yes I am just giving you a little bit of fun)

 

[Skyhawke]

What's a decent recharge time for MoG? I don't have it in my current build, but I can see that everyone else is highly recommending it. Is it worth it to build around or just a nice "oh crap" button?

[biostem]

On 4/13/2025 at 2:43 PM, FFTMime said:

I like how the set plays. I really enjoy it. I don't know why people are averse to a set that doesn't rely on toggles. The fact it underperforms really shouldn't be controversial though. 

People are not "averse to a set that doesn't rely on toggles" - they are averse to the lack of layered protection that most other sets provide, and with proper end management, who cares about toggles?  They are just a method of having a power apply a continual effect without it being an auto power.  It's not really that complicated;  More forms of protection or more robust forms of a single method of mitigation, are superior to just healing...

[FFTMime]

2 hours ago, biostem said:

People are not "averse to a set that doesn't rely on toggles" - they are averse to the lack of layered protection that most other sets provide, and with proper end management, who cares about toggles?  They are just a method of having a power apply a continual effect without it being an auto power.  It's not really that complicated;  More forms of protection or more robust forms of a single method of mitigation, are superior to just healing...

Raw super reflexes is better than just regen. 

but this is a classic discussion with no real solution. The issue on live was known. If you give regen adequate healing for content, it's too much. If you don't give them enough, it's feeble. Healing is a pretty dangerous thing to give players a lot of. What do you do then? The sensible solutions all involve sucking regen's soul out and replacing it with a new power set under the same name. 

Edit: Which I personally would not mind. But it's understandable this hasn't been done in all this time either. 

Edited April 15 by FFTMime

[Maelwys]

11 hours ago, Skyhawke said:

What's a decent recharge time for MoG? I don't have it in my current build, but I can see that everyone else is highly recommending it. Is it worth it to build around or just a nice "oh crap" button?

 

Its base values are fine but yes it likes Recharge. So ideally you want a LotG +7.5% plus two Lv50+5 Recharge IOs in it. Realistically it'll probably end up sitting at 60-90s depending on your Global Recharge (since you'll be after Perma Dull Pain and a decent uptime on IH anyway)

 

 

9 hours ago, FFTMime said:

Raw super reflexes is better than just regen. 

 

Only in cases where incoming damage is beyond a certain threshold.

 

Admittedly that threshold is considered rather low these days (unless you have additional defense buff from your primary and/or IOs and/or Shadow Meld) but back in the day Arcanaville performed very extensive comparisons between the various Scrapper Secondary powersets and post-nerf Regen's Immortality Line was second only to Dark Armor. SR was (and still is) better at mitigating short spikes of severe damage but much worse vs "chip damage", being two-shot, and attacks that have high ToHit or are autohit.

Since then we've gotten IOs (which benefit everyone, but noteworthy Global Recharge and Defense/Resistance is far easier to gain via globals and Set bonuses than noteworthy Regeneration) and Incarnates (which benefit everyone and have made it rather hard for even a Blaster to die except versus really overwhelming odds) and pool/patron powers like Rune of Protection and Shadowmeld.

 

Honestly these days Bio Armor is the only set I'd rank head and shoulders above Regeneration in every category. Whilst SR is currently considered to be a very strong set, IMO it's the inherent Defense Debuff Resistance that really makes it shine; and unless you're pairing it with Dark Melee or Radiation Melee or popping green insps like candy it can still get tricky to balance out sustained bouts of incoming damage (as it often requires Ageless for Endurance Management, so Rebirth is out... which leaves Radial Lores, Melee Hybrid, Heal Proc IOs and Unrelenting/Unleash Potential). On Brutes their higher Resistance Cap definitely helps at very low Health (assuming the SR is leveraging their Scaling Damage Resistance) but the same is true for Regen whilst MoG is up and/or they're using pool power or Incarnate godmode buttons etc.

 

Personally my ideal buff to Regen would involve adding +Absorb to Dull Pain, Reconstruction and IH (50% of the healing rate would be about right); as it suffers from much the same problems vs severe spike damage as Empathy. Then add a bit of Recharge Rate Debuff Resistance and Regeneration Debuff Resistance to Fast Healing, Integration and Resilience. Done. And if it's still below par, tweaking Resilience to provide scaling damage resistance as its HP drops would work just fine without violating the cottage rule.

 

Edited April 16 by Maelwys

[FFTMime]

Man, now you're making me recall the age before stuff like streak breaker code and implementing similar stuff into SR to keep it from being randomly chain hit dead on that remaining % chance to still be hit. Because, yes, I always envied SR scrappers at higher levels, once my regeneration wasn't quite keeping up with things, till I saw them randomly get stomped by technically correct RNG. That's always a fun sight to remind you to stay in your lane. It's just the RNG saved up every hit at the same time. Which I notice the game STILL does in terms of missing my own attacks. What on earth is with this game's dice roller? In all honesty. 

People went to a LOT of effort to record a lot of combat just to confirm a 5% chance to miss is actually just that with how often violent streaks of it happen. Turns out it is. The game is just goofy about when it decides to present them. 

[Doc Spectre]

You can get pretty decent resist values on a Regen brute I’d you are prepared to build for it. Mine has 85% vs S/L and 40% vs other damage types.
Also Recharge time resistance is vital as others have mentioned, have 90% (possibly slightly overkill) and also 85% global recharge.

I didn’t bother chasing Defence as there is no native Defence debuff resistance in the Regen set.

Its also worth looking for active soft control powers in your primary, like stuns and knockdowns.

 

The Ring of Peebles temp power can come in useful vs an AV with a bunch of exotic damage types.

 

I like Regen very much because it’s active mitigation and because it’s an interesting project for Invention Origin users with deep pockets and time for theory crafting. 

[WuTang]

8 hours ago, Maelwys said:

SR was (and still is) better at mitigating short spikes of severe damage but much worse vs "chip damage"

Perfectly stated!

[FFTMime]

Honestly, starting to feel like Willpower is kind of the take two on Regeneration. 

[Troo]

On 4/15/2025 at 1:24 PM, Skyhawke said:

What's a decent recharge time for MoG? I don't have it in my current build, but I can see that everyone else is highly recommending it. Is it worth it to build around or just a nice "oh crap" button?

 

It's a good question.

On my stalker it recharges in ~80s. This book ends Instant Healing (90s duration) nicely when needed.

On one broot, it is ~100s.

 

It's a good power with no additional slotting. Beyond the obvious is [+100% Recovery (self only) for 15s] which can be very handy from time to time.

 

[Enamel_32]

On 4/18/2025 at 3:14 PM, FFTMime said:

Honestly, starting to feel like Willpower is kind of the take two on Regeneration. 

 

Totally. Several things that were considered shortcomings of regen were completely reversed for WP. It has layered mitigation, doesn't rely on click powers, and has a scaling regeneration effect instead of just having 2 speeds: IH on, and IH off.

 

On 4/15/2025 at 3:24 PM, Skyhawke said:

What's a decent recharge time for MoG? I don't have it in my current build, but I can see that everyone else is highly recommending it. Is it worth it to build around or just a nice "oh crap" button?

 

Like Troo, mine's somewhere around 90s. I built my regen brute for resistance bonuses so I don't always need to reach for MoG, but it's really nice for alpha strikes, especially in those level 50 TFs that have you facing off against an entire group of Heroes/Archvillains.

[Scarlet Shocker]

Well Barbizilla is now 50+ and I have to say got a lot nicer to play the closer to 50 and that's with only partially slotted SOs.

 

I've now rolled a Regen Sent (Dark/Regen for gits and shiggles) to compare and contrast.

 

I am going to try and make a build that is very affordable, so not too many expensive procs and/or AT/Purple sets.

 

 

[FFTMime]

I really want to try a regen brute but I keep failing on what to pair it with. I played MA to death on live, but I never really 'got' anything else. Then again, leveling then was much slower. So the cost of trying anything was very high. 

[lemming]

20 minutes ago, FFTMime said:

I really want to try a regen brute but I keep failing on what to pair it with. I played MA to death on live, but I never really 'got' anything else. Then again, leveling then was much slower. So the cost of trying anything was very high. 

I have a MA/Regen brute.  I believe Spaghetti has done a Super Strength that with her driving is very very capable.

[FFTMime]

I keep hearing it's bad, but nothing ventured nothing gained. Time to take Deka around as a SS/Regen brute. I seem to be a fan of horrible ideas anyway. 

[Scarlet Shocker]

2 hours ago, FFTMime said:

I keep hearing it's bad, but nothing ventured nothing gained. Time to take Deka around as a SS/Regen brute. I seem to be a fan of horrible ideas anyway. 

 

I never ever believe what somebody else tells me about a power set. Not because I automatically assume they are lying but simply because they probably don't have the same tastes as I do and our playstyles are very different.

 

One of the beauties of this game is that there are multiple ways to play it - so give it a whirl.

 

Also, there is no cost to levelling at all. If you're being entertained then you're winning. If you're not being entertained, you're learning. Both outcomes are very good!

[Spaghetti Betty]

5 hours ago, FFTMime said:

I keep hearing it's bad, but nothing ventured nothing gained. Time to take Deka around as a SS/Regen brute. I seem to be a fan of horrible ideas anyway. 

 

Here are some ideas for you!

Edited Monday at 11:49 PM by Spaghetti Betty

[Doc Spectre]

Super Strength / Regen / Earth mastery  is what I play and I really love it. 

 

I took Handclap btw and put in a couple of damage procs, a Sudden Acceleration knockback to knockdown and a Force Feedback chance for plus Recharge proc. I really helps with your crowd control and also buffs your recharge most of the time.

[Scarlet Shocker]

I ended up choosing Fire because I don't have the PPPs unlocked and frankly on Indom that'll be a challenge. I'm also a big fan of Melt Armor so it's a bit of a gimme

[Doc Spectre]

I love quicksand and stalagmites 😉

[Scarlet Shocker]

1 minute ago, Doc Spectre said:

I love quicksand and stalagmites 😉

 

can be hard to digest sometimes though

 

I love quicksand. One of my fave toons on live was my earth/thermal controller. Great buffs, some really solid controls, a great, robust pet and some good debuffs

[Jacke]

6 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

I ended up choosing Fire because I don't have the PPPs unlocked and frankly on Indom that'll be a challenge. I'm also a big fan of Melt Armor so it's a bit of a gimme

 

It is not that hard to unlock the Patron Pools, even solo.  Here's what I commonly do, choosing Black Scorpion as Patron.  There's schemes to unlock the others, but I've done this one the most.

• Make sure in the last 3 days you haven't used the option to Complete a Mission by just talking to the Contact.
  • You will want to do this below to skip a tedious mission.
• See Null the Gull and set Alignment to Villain or Rogue.
• Set Notoriety to -1x1, maybe No Bosses, definitely EBs not AVs.
  • Experience is secondary to finishing the arc with reasonable time and effort.
  • If you bring a Team, make sure you're the first one through the Door on Missions.
    • That first person through the Door sets the Mission Notoriety.
  • Careful forming too big a Team as that will cause EBs to become AVs.
• Talk to Arbiter Rein in Grandville, read the Plaques in Arachnos Tower, then select Black Scorpion as Patron.
• Do Black Scorpion's first arc, Armor Wars.
  • After the Mission where you see a reply from Black Scorpion going "Dr. Quatrexin? New power armor? NOOOOO! ...."
    • The next Mission will be "Look into Crey Activities" that shows as "Defeat all Scorpinoids and Arachnoids" in it.
    • Accept that Mission and call Black Scorpion again to Complete it.  It is rather tedious and long.
  • The last Mission will be "Defeat Dr. Quatrexin".
    • Dr. Quatrexin is the EB at the core of the map (at least two map layouts I've encountered).
    • If you have full Boss stealth (PvE 55ft or more), can stealth to the EB.
      • Use Teleport Target or Assemble the Team to bring in everyone in a safe spot near the final room.
    • Just need to defeat Dr. Quatrexin and any mobs in the final room.
• Everyone on the Team will get the PPP unlock, which allows choice of any Patron Pool.

https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/Black_Scorpion#Armor_Wars

 

 

[Scarlet Shocker]

15 minutes ago, Jacke said:

 

It is not that hard to unlock the Patron Pools, even solo.  Here's what I commonly do, choosing Black Scorpion as Patron.  There's schemes to unlock the others, but I've done this one the most.

• Make sure in the last 3 days you haven't used the option to Complete a Mission by just talking to the Contact.
  • You will want to do this below to skip a tedious mission.
• See Null the Gull and set Alignment to Villain or Rogue.
• Set Notoriety to -1x1, maybe No Bosses, definitely EBs not AVs.
  • Experience is secondary to finishing the arc with reasonable time and effort.
  • If you bring a Team, make sure you're the first one through the Door on Missions.
    • That first person through the Door sets the Mission Notoriety.
  • Careful forming too big a Team as that will cause EBs to become AVs.
• Talk to Arbiter Rein in Grandville, read the Plaques in Arachnos Tower, then select Black Scorpion as Patron.
• Do Black Scorpion's first arc, Armor Wars.
  • After the Mission where you see a reply from Black Scorpion going "Dr. Quatrexin? New power armor? NOOOOO! ...."
    • The next Mission will be "Look into Crey Activities" that shows as "Defeat all Scorpinoids and Arachnoids" in it.
    • Accept that Mission and call Black Scorpion again to Complete it.  It is rather tedious and long.
  • The last Mission will be "Defeat Dr. Quatrexin".
    • Dr. Quatrexin is the EB at the core of the map (at least two map layouts I've encountered).
    • If you have full Boss stealth (PvE 55ft or more), can stealth to the EB.
      • Use Teleport Target or Assemble the Team to bring in everyone in a safe spot near the final room.
    • Just need to defeat Dr. Quatrexin and any mobs in the final room.
• Everyone on the Team will get the PPP unlock, which allows choice of any Patron Pool.

https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/Black_Scorpion#Armor_Wars

 

 

 

GReat info thank you!