Infinitum

You in essence did the same thing though by starting this thread - with the same people you just insulted - they are still reading your thread, will comment on your thread. Why not put forth your ideas because you started the fire either way.

He already started the fire though. May as well try to gain rather than not gain.

Serious observation. Please don't take it personal, if you need to take it personal you can - but again try not to because I am not intending this to be a slap. You would rather start a thread - this one... Lamenting the situation of Brute's at the hands of tankers - knowing full well what response you would get (flame war), but you will not openly discuss creative/constructive solutions to the issue you are lamenting because you are worried about the flame war that would ensue. Do you see the issue here?

Maybe have a time based toggle like dominators have but for fury which doubles it but in turn cuts mitigation in half for it's duration - but you are literally enfuriated and have no consideration for your own survival. lol

Absolutely - Furthermore my gut tells me the Devs are trying to work away from farming being an all controlling factor in crucial decisions. This is why I am ok with the farming nerfs even though I utilize one for leveling - eventually it will lead to us having nicer updates elsewhere.

You could do all that with an ATO redesign

100% Truth They actually had their damage cap nerfed because - and I didn't run these numbers but someone demonstrated how certain Brute's riding the dmg cap were out damaging blasters with tanker like survivability. This was all during the testing for the tanker patch - I want to say November whatever year that patch was in Beta.

That is not even close to being true when Corruptors among others are doing the things we read about every single day on here.

What are you even saying here my friend? You are listing no specifics when I have asked you for them. So don't go there. If I want to have an argument based on gray areas and ignoring my requests and suggestions - I will go pick a fight with my wife about something stupid I should ultimately keep my mouth shut on. I can't help you or why your Brutes are dropping like flys when mine aren't if you can't give me specifics on builds or TFs Because it doesn't add up to me what issues you are having and why you are being so dang difficult. Honestly it reminds me of the first toy story where the kid got Buzz lightyear and woody felt underappreciated - both were still awesome but brute players likewise have their feelings hurt because they are no longer the new toy on the shelf even though they still are pretty darn awesome.

Mitigation that approaches tanker levels while outputting greater damage especially ST dmg when you need a hard target to take out a hard target - Brute is what I use.

What TF? Again all of my Brutes are capable of running any TF +4/8 no issues. I routinely take and slot tough/weave on my scrappers, stalkers, Brute's, and tankers the fact that you think it is funny tells me where your survivability issues are That is because they don't outside from one cherry picked set 9n one cherry picked mission that really does not simulate normal gameplay well enough IMO - @Galaxy Brainbuilt a brutal mission simulator that is far easier to test and more like what you would face in routine missions - and guess what Brute's survived and cleared faster than tankers. See above - before trapdoor was a thing this was tested extensively with the Brute's having a 15-20% edge over the tankers in clear times. 1. Because Brute's can still output more damage especially ST damage. Safely 2. I do think Brute's do need a minor buff but not to bring them back to the days of City of Brute's like before where they were out damaging scrappers and blasters with near tanker mitigation. Which leads me here below. Brute's fury gives a fury bonus that is no longer needed for the T6 enh in the set and unrelenting fury gives a Regen and end proc which is less than optimal IMO. The tanker ATO - Especially MotT is the clear winner here. So give the Brute one with a creative dmg proc and one with a creative res/def proc. That would go a long way IMO. I would love to see that Elec armor shines on a brute because you can build high resistances and softcap melee defense - then if needed rotate melee core and barrier or rebirth if it is really nasty. It is practically unkillable.

I think the damage is fine, but both ATOs should be updated and revised - 1 to focus on damage and 1 to focus on mitigation.

They most certainly could - for 99% of the content - I would routinely Tank the task force with my Brute's with far greater damage output prior to the Tanker update patch. For extreme situations I would simply switch my hybrid to melee core and my destiny to barrier - or rebirth radial - then rotate them - sure I gave up damage and recharge but with that any brute can do what a tanker can. But there is a tradeoff to it - you literally can't and shouldn't be able to do both. That all depends on the build - and the strategy - did you miss my line about page 4 dinging a few of my invul tankers hard - hard enough to where I had to adapt both my build and my strategy. It wasn't just Brute's that were affected. Brute's can still manage aggro just fine solo - and if paired or teamed with a tanker - will still be just fine - it doesn't have to manage aggro then. Tankers should be better at aggro management and survival. Brutes still do more dmg. Not sure - would need to see the builds - my Brutes aren't having a hard time surviving - and still out damage my tankers - but there again my tankers can do more silly survival stuff my Brutes can not - but once you hit a certain mitigation value all of that is overkill except for hard mode situations anyway - and even there with the right team the Brute's can still do what the silly tanker build can do AND output more damage.

Before the Tanker buff it was a very popular topic get to report how they had no use on a team, Brutes can do everything a Tanker can do with more damage etc - at least 2 or 3 a week. I think everyone that keeps coming back to this cremated equine is that perhaps Brutes being where they were was slightly overkill and tankers slightly below where they needed to be. Now they are both equivalent with one favoring damage more - one mitigation but both good and both useful to tools in any event. And this isn't a gut gud statement here - but maybe alter your tactics to suit your needs with a changing game - your damage mongering Brute may not be able to wade aimlessly into every situation without a strategy or a more mitigation based build now - just like with my energy Aura and invul characters I have to prioritize certain targets now - otherwise they could cause an issue to me. Things change - we have to adapt, sometimes it is irritating - but usually not the end of the world - and also usually we learn a thing or 2 that makes us better. Having said all of that - if the Brute ATO didn't suck now with fury being self maintaining - I think Redesigning the Brute ATO would go a long way here to making it feel better.

From how I understood and even tested - they did have positional tags also - and your defense response would tag against whatever was greater - ie if it tags toxic defense and ranged defense. - and you have 21 T defense and 45 ranged then ranged would be the fortress under attack in that case. If you could, would you be willing to duplicate what was nagging you and read your combat log to see what attacks and how they attacked and report back?

SR should not have been affected - unless one of the tags that changed the enemy attack type from S/L to Toxic or Psi is also under the category that does not assign a position - which means it will bypass your positionals and check off whatever typed defense you have in that category. I don't remember any of the attacks that were changed having this setup though, but it may be a question worth asking on the update thread.

Dominators - being 100% honest - I am a novice at best on. I wish I liked them, but for some reason it either has not clicked or I just flat out don't like them - which to be fair I have team mates that play dominator and it looks awesome to me, but I can't replicate it yet. I have played with a few builds but never was satisfied with the performance and overall style of them. Which is odd because the controllers I have I love. Melee, and controllers with a few ranged builds that I really liked are what I stick to - I keep revisiting the builds I haven't mastered hoping it will fall into place and click one day though. Anyone seeing this - have good dominator experience for @wnrblue?

The problem with it (even the MA gimmick) comes from - needing to land the hits to gain those benefits. Normal content it isn't an issue, but may stumble on 4 star hitting as many necessary to retain those benefits and also heal which also relies on hitting the mobs.

It is. I got to that point and was like... I didn't think it was possible to softcap typed and positional on an invul. I was afraid to finish it at that point. 😂

It isn't about worry - just stating facts about hard mode - there really isn't a build trick to make a tanker to survive the last two tiers effectively - those need a team. Invul needs and benefits more from the extra ddr from ageless more than it needs more defense for a fraction of the time it would be effective from barrier. The same for melee core vs radial. It doesn't need more defense just defense that will reliably hold - that's why I created that bullet proof invul build above because it actually could solo the ITF 4 star if it had enough dps and debuffing - but it doesn't so back to needing a team even there.

Yep. Haha

It is an abomination really. A beautiful abomination that will keep you warm at night and never leave your side.... lol

Not if it is ITF Hard Mode - key word was facing mobs designed to blow past your defenses. Even a properly built invul with maxed resists has issues with that scenario because the mode is designed to kill you. Because it isn't a matter of if - but when your defense gets floored - then say resists are maxed - 10% will always get through and 10 percent of a lot will still be a lot. That is why hard mode - especially the top tier settings are mainly team based. I came up with this build specifically for hard mode - it covers all the bases and even it can't sustain forever - because ultimately it can't kill them all fast enough. Invul that incarnate soft caps positionals and typed Ultimate 01 - Tanker - Invulnerability - Martial Arts.mxd

This one. I came up with it for the LOL of it all Ultimate 01 - Tanker - Invulnerability - Martial Arts.mxd

Anytime! Preference is subject to my mood so I will answer with Yes. Haha As far as builds check out my post on the tanker forums - they are both there and others also.