cranebump

Well, see those guys actually have talent.:-) When it comes to writing, I follow this (fictional) response (from Bob Dylan to Jimmy Thudpucker):

P.S. at some point I’m going to go back and rewrite the text for if Comrade is rescued to having him lapse into a coma as he delivers his message. So there will then be a difference if he’s saved. Now, I do think it’s better narrative to have someone put a bullet in his head, but that doesn’t have to be the end result no matter how malicious and bloodthirsty I feel about it.:-)

The criticism of the timer not having a valid narrative reason to exist is legitimate. I cannot really justify Its existence other than to end the mission in case the player is stuck wandering all over the map. And further, since the last two players that have actually run through it have not been able to find the objectives quickly, or in one case not find them at all, then obviously I need to rethink this from the ground floor. So the first thing I’m going to do is get rid of that map. I obviously knew there was an issue with it which is why I put a timer on that thing in the first place. So we are going to get rid of that. Second, because the difficulty in finding objectives will be fixed, I can reconsider use of a timer, since it was only there to keep the original mission from going on for too long. With that in mind, and in consideration of the feedback I have received, I believe I have a way to write the text in such a way that the player can “succeed“ in the mission while realizing that the end of the world is nigh. If I have this right then this should fix the issues for the players, while maintaining the idea I’m striving for. ( @Zhym: I'll let you know when I've fixed it, so you can give it another run, if you want. It should be less complicated, since a) writing a possible fail actually takes more time, and b) map should be considerably smaller). The short version of this is I picked a map that I could not make work, and was trying to make it work anyway. Once I take the map out of the equation, I’m not forced to make mechanical choices that are inconsistent, illogical, or just plain annoying. All that said, I’m not going to promise that I won’t use a timer in the future. So if the Contact says “you better hurry“ then you better actually hurry. 🙂

Darm rewards you for paying attention, and gives you all sorts of clever Easter eggs, call backs, and throughlines pushing from start to finish. Everything is slick, meticulously executed, clean, clear, yet you look back, and there’s a ton going on. Just loads. Hard to see how he does that, but he does. I guess he’s Francis Coppola. I haven’t played enough of Ankys stuff to comment on story, but I’ve run enough to say he’s the most technically proficient designer I’ve seen among us amateurs. I don’t think anyone else is even close. I guess he’s Stanley Kubrick. I’m not good with the details or the framing. It’s all tone - highs and lows, bittersweet victories, sacrifice, and shades of gray. I think we’re all defined by our failures more so than our victories. And I think superheroes, were they real, would understand that better than anybody. Because you can’t save EVERYONE. That’s the tragedy. Great power will never be great enough. But a true hero keeps trying anyway. And that’s what it’s all about. Which makes me the guy with a decent script and no budget.:-)

I laid out my reasoning in the other thread. For the record, I’m not emulating Peacock. I’m trying to do a no-win scenario. The issue is visibility. Makes it to where you can’t even reach the boss fights. I might fiddle with it some other day, but not today. Timer is there so players don’t waste a ton of time trying to win what cannot be won.

Would that be nice. (Sigh) i ran that mish, man, I dunno how many times. I knew exactly what was going to happen, and still couldn’t always find Pos quickly. That was the 5-minute timer. So, I pushed to 10, and added Zoria gloating over his victory, thinking, “okay, so if you buzz around, you’re BOUND to find Pos in 5 minutes. Then Zoria in a couple, because maybe we’ve cleared the map some. But the sons of bitches just won’t pop up in the same spot. (Anky’s the outdoor map guy. Not me, as this ably demonstrates)

It’s possible I guess to drop both Positron and Zoria. Maybe just flood it with bosses but I’m not sure that’s any better. What it needs is a 5-minute timer, with a direct line to Pos (say 15 seconds). Then maybe 30-60 to get to Zoria. Then a Boss chain of infinite minions. I could use burning forest map, but doesn’t have the impact of Atlas. Ruined city has better visibility, but no fire. I think it needs smoke and fire, atmospherically.

Note: keep an NPC dialog window open. If you see speech text, you know it’s not a body bag. FYI: it’s “winnable,” but VERY, VERY difficult to do it in 10 minutes. I managed Pos, Zoria and 2 bossss, using a decent Incarnate. There’s also an ambush after boss #1. It’s ridiculously rough. And it needs about a 7-minute timer, due to the gd smoke.

Well…I’m just gonna make my case for that mish as is,*and here’s why: It’s hard to simulate the end of the world with a successful mission (you win! By the way, the world ended, but, yeah, you won! Everyone died, but you can feel good, because you WON! [pst…you didnt]). It has the timer to give a sense of futility. And it has to be short timer to get it out of the way so the subsequent story can start. This IS the outcome you’re trying to avoid. Rather than describe it, I’m trying to make you live it. Bottom line: It’s a Kobayashi Maru. Full stop. It’s not supposed to be fair or winnable. I just wish the map was less smoky. *bearing in mind that I tested all sorts of variations concerning timer lengths, boss chains, ambushes, etc. Peacock’s use of a jillion glowies works really well for his arc. But he isn’t doing the end of the world. I need fire and death and absolute futility. If it’s unsettling, well, that’s the point.

Well,shoot. I’ll take a look at that. Thanks for the kind words. Glad it was a cool experience for you. Btw, I second @Darmian's rec of Peacock's arc. It's entirely unique.

Don't try to talk your way out of this one, Lex Luthor. You played to my vanity!:-) (I think I handled the Weavers okay, IIRC. HVAS I just ran right into it like a doob. Same with Lib.)

I feel like I should front you some $$ for the expenses of running this thing. I'll may have to cobble from some diff toons. I don't think I have you as a global friend yet, which is weird.

I didn't diversify my test toons on the new Mobius arcs. My TA/AR has stuns, blinds, and KD. Even with that, I had to go to the INSP well, and, in some cases, run back down the hall to regroup. If the bosses continue to be a bear, I'll have to check the power selections. Can't recall exactly what I went with, since Chalikar is a group from the original writeup, which @Darmian ran. And since I was trying to punish him for kicking my ass with Miss Liberty, Robots, Weavers, and other various stuff, I may have been...vindictive (kidding...I can't recall the powers, though).:-)

There's no ally in that mish either. My test runs=Insps. I was having to keep some spare larges for those guys. IIRC, you won't get overloaded with them as objectives, so you should be able to bypass them. Although, there's this one mish you ain't done yet...Yeah...sorry in advance. FYI: Plasmatic taser might help, too?

Lord. Um...sorry...He's yellow, so, um...I can't figure that out. (sorry...I laughed reading it). Are there more....um...sometimes?:-)

Janitor thing is a typo, for sure. I have to go back and fix so much stuff (to include some of the timers):-) Comrade death: the main reason he has to go is, if he lives, he gives more than a partial clue, which would negate any reason for Pep to investigate what he said, thus forcing me to redesign two missions. It’s not so much a “win, lose” thing as it is a narrative device. If you got him out of there at all, that’s an accomplishment. In testing, I was about 50-50, using strong toons. I kind of like how intense that battle gets. The way the game is now, getting mobbed is a rarity. I guess I don’t mind failing every now and then. In this case, it’s a “fail forward.” Comrade’s death moves the story forward (and makes me want to really kick my enemy’s ass).:-) Timers: it’s a choice. On the one hand, yeah, I can’t just take it at my speed. On the other hand, it makes “get out of the facility” etc. an actual thing. I didn’t think about bathroom breaks during the design process, but, being almost 60, I understand the demand.:-) Timer use gets rare as you go along in my stuff. Thanks for putting up with the early ones.

All good. Do what you gotta, Batman.:-)

On the “souvenir summation” thing: I think the character limit for those is much bigger than any of the other clue boxes. That said I’m not sure how many players bother to read the souvenir text. A lot of my arcs have them, but very few of them recap what has just happened, because of what I just wrote, above. I don’t spend a lot of time reading souvenir text from the regular in-game missions as it is. Which I guess is my second reason for not spending a lot of time on souvenirs. The best I figure I can hope for is that the player might see it under the souvenir tab, and it will function as a brief reminder of the gist or feel of the arc. The main thing’s already been mentioned though: in crafting some thing as dense as a 45 Mission arc, it’s pretty hard to summarize succinctly. Even with 3000 characters.

I meant to put a smiley face next to my comment. Just part of the running joke I have with @Darmian. I would guess that the closest definition of a pud would be a dumb ass.:-)

Did I or did I not say HVH was a pud? 🙂

Recap=easier said than done for a project that big, but I can think of two places: mish end clue as capstone or (my preference) souvenir text. I am of the same thought that a recap would be a good idea, because the story is dense, lore-wise, and I can’t remember what I did 5 minutes ago, much less 5 missions ago.:-) Which means I might take my own advice and expand upon the Souvenir clues in my own long forms.

Well, shit. I forgot to change the title cards on the actual missions in the arc. Yeah I will definitely fix that. ”Demon of straggling…” hehehehehe

Well, “awhile” could mean a week. Who knows?:-)

Finally...and I mean finally. Mish 5 took forever to get right, because yours truly didn't realize he couldn't spawn a certain kind of objective in a certain place. Reading is fundamental, y'all.:-) NOTE: Not the capstone to the OP/Leviathan saga, but connection between them all is finally made by the end of this arc. Will be working toward the finale, likely 2 more arcs, then long form is gonna be done for awhile.

Oh, yeah. Poor Acrobattle went WHA? (thunk)