New laptop and 1 FPS

[biostem]

Maybe check if there's an option in the bios that you can toggle to force it to use the discrete GPU instead of the integrated one.

[WanderingAries]

• 7 hours ago, biostem said:

  Maybe check if there's an option in the bios that you can toggle to force it to use the discrete GPU instead of the integrated one.

  My custom PC has that, but I've never seen a laptop that does. It came to mind, but I'd dismissed it partially because navigating a UEFI can be confusing for many.

[Ground Fault]

While I'm waiting for HP to send my computer back I may pick up a monitor. I was using a cheap 30" TV and the resolution looked shitty. Do you guys have any recs that would work well with that laptop? I also work from home now so something wide screen would be good as I can put up multiple spreadsheets etc. while working from quarantine. Those curved monitors look cool but I don't know much about them.

[Ground Fault]

I went with this one, I hope that laptop can handle the resolution without melting down.

 

https://www.amazon.com/Sceptre-30-inch-Curved-Gaming-Monitor/dp/B07TXM7K4T/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=Sceptre+30-inch+Curved+Gaming+Monitor&qid=1588186756&s=electronics&sr=1-1

[WanderingAries]

On ‎4‎/‎29‎/‎2020 at 12:04 PM, Ground Fault said:

While I'm waiting for HP to send my computer back I may pick up a monitor. I was using a cheap 30" TV and the resolution looked shitty. Do you guys have any recs that would work well with that laptop? I also work from home now so something wide screen would be good as I can put up multiple spreadsheets etc. while working from quarantine. Those curved monitors look cool but I don't know much about them.

Mostly relies on your connection choice. IE: Standard HDMI (non-4k TV) is restricted to a max of 1920x1080 where as the VGA connection will go higher. I sadly found this out when I switched, but stuck with HDMI (for now) because of the Audio pass-through. Using VGA, you have to have an AUX cable as well unless you're using standalone speakers.

[WanderingAries]

On ‎4‎/‎29‎/‎2020 at 3:00 PM, Ground Fault said:

I went with this one, I hope that laptop can handle the resolution without melting down.

 

https://www.amazon.com/Sceptre-30-inch-Curved-Gaming-Monitor/dp/B07TXM7K4T/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=Sceptre+30-inch+Curved+Gaming+Monitor&qid=1588186756&s=electronics&sr=1-1

That's probably really nice to have for gaming on one display. In prep for W@H, I ended up getting a pair of these because running dual VGA wasn't going to be easy with the custom/ubber-secure environment of our company. I still wanna shoot the person who thought running a VM within another VM inside of a restricted user account was a good idea. I'm just glad I got smart and installed it on an isolated SSD for when it decides to crash/corrupt the OS.

Edited May 1, 2020 by WanderingAries

[Ground Fault]

Ah, I didn't realize HDMI was limited to 1920x1080, I hope there is a VGA output. Im not worried about audio, I usually use a headset or stand alone speakers.

[Seigmoraig]

39 minutes ago, Ground Fault said:

Ah, I didn't realize HDMI was limited to 1920x1080, I hope there is a VGA output. Im not worried about audio, I usually use a headset or stand alone speakers.

you most definitely don't want to use a VGA cable for anything above 1920x1080. Even then, at 1920x1080 resolution it will not be a clean image because VGA is an analog signal.

VGA is a legacy I/O device introduced in 1987 that is seen less and less on newer hardware. Most new GFX cards don't even have the port anymore and it is only included on laptops and motherboard for compatibility with old hardware.
HDMI and Displayport cables are what is needed for large resolutions

Edited May 1, 2020 by Seigmoraig

[GM Tock]

16 hours ago, WanderingAries said:

Mostly relies on your connection choice. IE: Standard HDMI (non-4k TV) is restricted to a max of 1920x1080 where as the VGA connection will go higher. I sadly found this out when I switched, but stuck with HDMI (for now) because of the Audio pass-through. Using VGA, you have to have an AUX cable as well unless you're using standalone speakers.

There's some detail here I can add to this.  Sorry to geek out, the important takeaway is the list at the bottom.  When I discuss Refresh Rate, it's pretty much a 1:1 relationship to Frame Rate (60 FPS = 60Hz on a screen.)  But since we're discussing monitors, I'll stick to their lingo.

 

HDMI: It's on everything!™

HDMI 1.4 supports 4K video (3820x2160), but is limited to 30Hz.  This was the first spec to support 4K released in 2010, but didn't get industry adoption until a few years later.  HDMI 2.0 (most video cards sold since 2016 have HDMI 2.0) supports 60Hz under 4K resolution.  Technically, it depends on the frame rate you're after.  30Hz is the ATSC TV Standard, and for most people is "good enough" for video.  60Hz is that "unreal motion" level of clarity that most Smart TVs try to interpolate to make cinematic movies move strangely on broadcast.  It looks weird because they're not shot at that high of a refresh rate to begin with.  (However, 60Hz does make for awesome looking video games.)

 

If your monitor has speakers, HDMI as of 1.1 does carry audio to the monitor, but didn't really work well until 1.4 when active audio return and sync was widespread.

 

DisplayPort: Made for PCs from the start.

DisplayPort adoption has moved a little faster than HDMI but not by much.  DP1.3 in 2014 offered 4K support, whereas DP2.0 goes all the way up to 15360 × 8640 (16K, if that's ever going to be a thing... most folks balk at 8K currently.)  That means 16K for a single display at 60Hz.  DisplayPort ALSO supports daisy-chaining, so that 16K from the source means you can get divisible and daisy-chain two 8K monitors if you want to split one cable between two screens, or 4K if you want to split one cable between 4 screens, etc.  (Whether your video card has the RAM to pull that off, different story.  16K is a theoretical maximum, it doesn't mean your video card will drive it well... or even at all.)

 

DP was designed to carry audio throughout it's entire existence.  2.0 offers increased bandwidth available for audio, not much else.

 

DVI-D: Still digital video, but missed the 4K boat.

DVI is not going to work with 4K for two reasons.  Dual link max resolution for one monitor is 2560 × 1600 (...don't get me wrong, that's a great resolution above 2K, but it's not 4K).  And two, the connector plug is huge, so equipment manufacturers are dropping it for the smaller HDMI, DP and MiniDP options to allow more outputs on cards.  VGA is going away, but DVI is right behind it getting kicked out of modern equipment designs. However, your DVI monitor can most DEFINITELY still connect to HDMI (still at it's native resolution) with a simple dongle to convert HDMI to DVI-D.  No active conversion or extra power requirements needed.

 

DVI has no audio capabilities.  If your monitor has speakers, a stereo patch cable is required.

 

Analog Video (DVI-I, VGA)

Straight up, VGA is off the table with a new computer/video card.  Trading out DVI-I for DVI-D in the NVidia GeForce 10 series means older DVI-to-VGA dongles will no longer fit into the card's DVI port at all.  It's missing the slots for 4 pins on the left of the plug needed for analog conversion, and trying to remove those four pins to force it to connect up anyway will not work.  Video ports no longer have digital to analog conversion needed to output to VGA any longer, so even if they interconnect at the cable level by force (or cheating), the video card can't drive an analog display anymore.

 

And analog video means that VGA can't carry audio either.  Same stereo patch needed.

 

But the Amazon! It has this box that does a thing...

Active signal conversion is now needed to connect a digital signal to an analog output. TECHNICALLY, VGA has no actual limit on resolution, only that analog bandwidth is more constrained, so higher detail requires more power and shorter cable runs to maintain the same degree of quality for output.  And analog offers zero support for features such as frame rate sync, CEC linking, High DPI settings (I've found that some High DPI displays will actually DISTORT pixels rendered under VGA), or audio channels unlike the digital standards.

 

Active conversion means buying a separate, and often powered, box to accept the DVI-D or HDMI/DP signal and convert it to VGA on the other side for output.  They do exist, and they're cheap, but the VGA side will be a single resolution dictated by the box you buy, and usually NOT 4K.  Some of the better boxes will even break out the audio to a stereo jack to patch into your speakers/headphones right beside your VGA plug-loving display method.  However, active conversion adds another point of failure to the signal chain.  (Box gets fried?  Screen goes black.  This can and does happen with the cheaper converters.)

 

To sum up, if you want to use a 4K monitor --

• BEST: If you want 4K Resolution at 60Hz, DisplayPort is going to have the most bandwidth to offer (especially if you want to use Frame Rate Sync like NVidia G-Sync or AMD Radeon Freesync, DisplayPort is mandatory.)  To be clear, at the time I wrote this no City of Heroes client out there has native support for Frame Rate Sync, so your results may vary.  (It'll still look good, but no promises.)
• GOOD: HDMI 2.0 monitor, cable and video card will handle 4K just fine at 60Hz, just that it will be minus the extra bandwidth room needed for Frame Rate Sync. 
• OK: Older HDMI connections (older video cards before HDMI 1.4) will be held to the 1080 standard like Aries mentioned.  That means a 4K monitor will be reduced to a lower resolution while operating.  Audio is a dice roll, depending on what you've got.  (I don't recommend making the effort in buying a 2K or 1080 display because they're almost gone from the marketplace, so getting a 4K monitor is more future-proof.)
• IF YOU MUST (again, older video cards only): HDMI will connect to DVI-D with a dongle, but it cannot support 4K resolution, so you'll get some fuzzyness.
• WORKS WITH PROBLEMS: DVI-I and VGA under active conversion will make a poor quality image, but you can do it if you don't have any choice.  The outcome isn't hard to guess: you'll be well under a 4K monitor's native resolution and stuck with any combo of letterbox/pillarbox, fuzzy edges and low DPI. (If you want an idea, connect any analog 1980s/1990's video game system to any modern HDTV.  It'll be visible, but it won't look good.)

 

Edited May 1, 2020 by GM Tahquitz
Oh, yeah. DisplayPort allows daisy-chaining. Good differentiator between that and HDMI.

[WanderingAries]

4 hours ago, Seigmoraig said:

you most definitely don't want to use a VGA cable for anything above 1920x1080. Even then, at 1920x1080 resolution it will not be a clean image because VGA is an analog signal.

VGA is a legacy I/O device introduced in 1987 that is seen less and less on newer hardware. Most new GFX cards don't even have the port anymore and it is only included on laptops and motherboard for compatibility with old hardware.
HDMI and Displayport cables are what is needed for large resolutions

I suppose a clarification would be that the monitor(s) I referenced in my own purchase were HDMI/VGA only and DP isn't as common on laptops quite yet. Well, not without a USB-C -> DP adaptor. You "shouldn't" find VGA on modern laptops at all actually, so HDMI or USB-C are really the only options unless it comes with DP.

Edited May 1, 2020 by WanderingAries

[WanderingAries]

3 hours ago, GM Tahquitz said:

But the Amazon! It has this box that does a thing...

Active signal conversion is now needed to connect a digital signal to an analog output...

And no matter what the vender says, You're not taking the DVI -> VGA in a happy fun way without a converter. Pretty sure you dove in my browsing history for that one. Specifically when I was deciding on which way to convert for my GTX 970, dual monitor setup (pre-purchase of said monitors). :p

 

In my reading, I found that DP will chain 3 displays for reference, but I forget the rez maxium on that. In my testing of using VGA vs HDMI (1.4) on this 40" TV, the VGA allowed more range of resolutions, but I can't remember the clarity difference. I know I got a lot more screen space though. >.<

Edited May 1, 2020 by WanderingAries

[Noyjitat]

1fps might be throttling. I had to download throttlestop and undervolt my cpu to fix a heat issue since laptops don't have adequate cooling for gaming and you might look into the samething if you still have issues with the laptop. Goto youtube and search for throttlestop to find a video tutorial with settings and the steps to make the program automatically run when windows starts. You can download it from techpowerup https://www.techpowerup.com/download/

 

Also open your gpu software and make a profile for coh to use the gaming gpu rather than the integrated pos. Do this for opengl, physxx etc. 

[GM Tock]

19 hours ago, WanderingAries said:

In my reading, I found that DP will chain 3 displays for reference, but I forget the rez maxium on that. In my testing of using VGA vs HDMI (1.4) on this 40" TV, the VGA allowed more range of resolutions, but I can't remember the clarity difference. I know I got a lot more screen space though. >.<

Generally, what your video card says it can do takes precedence.  Because the standard supports daisy-chaining doesn't mean that your equipment will permit it.

 

E.g. Surface Dock has two Mini DP outputs that won't Daisy chain from the dock to plug in more than two extra monitors on 4k.  They're already a split of a single output, and even then the refresh rates are constrained further due to bandwidth limitations from the "Surface Connector." So you get two 4K displays running at 30Hz, or one 4K at 60Hz, and another at 60Hz but at 2K resolution.  Them's the brakes.

[Ground Fault]

Thanks for all of the info guys. I'm ready to dial this in once my machine comes back from HP.

[WanderingAries]

On ‎5‎/‎1‎/‎2020 at 5:50 PM, Noyjitat said:

1fps might be throttling. I had to download throttlestop and undervolt my cpu to fix a heat issue since laptops don't have adequate cooling for gaming and you might look into the samething if you still have issues with the laptop. Goto youtube and search for throttlestop to find a video tutorial with settings and the steps to make the program automatically run when windows starts. You can download it from techpowerup https://www.techpowerup.com/download/

 

Also open your gpu software and make a profile for coh to use the gaming gpu rather than the integrated pos. Do this for opengl, physxx etc. 

If accessible, I've always set the fan profile to On/Full on laptops at this point. Not on my MBP though as I can use MacFanControl for that on all the installed OS'.

[WanderingAries]

6 hours ago, GM Tahquitz said:

Generally, what your video card says it can do takes precedence.  Because the standard supports daisy-chaining doesn't mean that your equipment will permit it.

 

E.g. Surface Dock has two Mini DP outputs that won't Daisy chain from the dock to plug in more than two extra monitors on 4k.  They're already a split of a single output, and even then the refresh rates are constrained further due to bandwidth limitations from the "Surface Connector." So you get two 4K displays running at 30Hz, or one 4K at 60Hz, and another at 60Hz but at 2K resolution.  Them's the brakes.

Correct, I think it'd be best to see it as 3 per bus max depending on the host hardware.

[Noyjitat]

On 5/2/2020 at 7:13 PM, WanderingAries said:

If accessible, I've always set the fan profile to On/Full on laptops at this point. Not on my MBP though as I can use MacFanControl for that on all the installed OS'.

Yeah its a coh only issue. it just causes the laptop to get too hot... I can play bdo and other more modern graphically intensive games at max settings and not have this issue. Having undervolted though I no longer have the problem, nor did undervolting cause a crash or loss in performance. The auto settings are always higher than they need to be.

[WanderingAries]

6 hours ago, Noyjitat said:

Yeah its a coh only issue. it just causes the laptop to get too hot... I can play bdo and other more modern graphically intensive games at max settings and not have this issue. Having undervolted though I no longer have the problem, nor did undervolting cause a crash or loss in performance. The auto settings are always higher than they need to be.

Yeah, back before double digit Issues I'd fried a laptop likely because of the game. >.<

[Ground Fault]

Update- HP called me today, stated that they can't fix my computer. offered to send me a replacement. Said exact config might not be available, if not is an upgrade ok? I said yes. They just sent specs over for a loaded out Omen, 6GB GPU, 4k screen, 32 gigs of ram, this thing is like 3x the cost of the one I sent them.

 

Crazy shit.

[GM Tock]

Win! 

 

Good job!

[WanderingAries]

It will likely do more than fine for CoX and then some, but keep that thing cool.

[Hyperstrike]

8 hours ago, Ground Fault said:

Update- HP called me today, stated that they can't fix my computer. offered to send me a replacement. Said exact config might not be available, if not is an upgrade ok? I said yes. They just sent specs over for a loaded out Omen, 6GB GPU, 4k screen, 32 gigs of ram, this thing is like 3x the cost of the one I sent them.

 

Crazy shit.

 

 

[Ground Fault]

GF just texted this pic over, looking forward to getting my paws on this machine.

[Hyperstrike]

8 hours ago, Ground Fault said:

GF just texted this pic over, looking forward to getting my paws on this machine.

OOooh!!  Bounces up and down like a puppy with two peters...