How do the primaries rank in terms of survivability?

[Destlin]

Any dominator on a team with a threat anchor should only immobilize after the mobs have congregated just so you dont have runners. If you are opening up with it then you should take a step back and ask if you can be more effective.

Edited May 8, 2020 by Destlin
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[Chelsea Rorec]

🍿☕🤨

[Tater Todd]

 

So I really want to write up an entire paper on the control sets and give them different ratings according to Control, Kill Speed, Survival and etc but I don't have the time nor the energy :P.  I would be more focused on doing something like that if I was writing something to a Dev to plead a case for a review or go over.  I'm going to give my personal biased rating on the sets and I'm going to look at the in a Vacuum... a Dominator vacuum so to speak.

1.  Dark Control- This set is a force to be reckoned with and is a sleeper.  It's often overlooked in favor of sets like Plant Control or Fire Control yet with the right slotting Dark Control can rival the damage and control of sets like Illusion, Fire, Earth, Plant and Mind.  The major issue with this set is that it's TOO good so you're often forced to skip an amazing power or two which is interesting because there are other control sets that are pretty much 2 or 3 good powers max.  Another issue with this set is for it too truly shine you need to be very active which can be a problem for new players and it can be a problem for very active Dominator secondaries.  Dark Control excels at kill speed, hard & soft control and moderate tanking due to Haunt and Umbra Beast.

2.  Mind Control- I'm not a fan of this set.  It feels unfinished to me...or I should say it feels OLD but one cannot deny it is a force to be reckoned with when it comes to lock down. One of the issues with Mind control though is the lack of damage.  Even a fully proc'd out Terrify isn't enough damage wise compared to Plant, Fire and Dark control.  Also mind doesn't have any way of shutting down mobs at low level besides Total Domination, ST Mezz spam and Terrify.  Mass Hypnosis (and Mesmerize) has it's uses but overall it's not a great power to have on a fast moving team but it's worth keeping due to it's uses in various situations.  Mind control is not very new player friendly or damage focused.  There's a lot I want to talk about when it comes to this set but I'll save it for another time.  I would steer clear of this set until you have a better understanding of the game.

 

3. Earth Control- Earth Control loves high recharge builds.  This set really doesn't come together until you are able to double stack Earthquake, perma(or near perma) Volcanic Gasses and perma Stalagmites.  Earth Control can completely shutdown an entire room even more so than Plant and it can turn the tide of a battle as well as Dark and Mind.  Earth control's biggest issue is the lack of damage but that can be somewhat circumvented with the right procs.  Procs also increase the potency of Earth Control.  Power Boost works well with Earth Control too.  To give you an example of what a Power Boosted Earth control Dom can do I will list some numbers for you. 60 ft -35.5 To Hit, Constant fast ticking KD, -28.96 Defense, 60 ft Mag 3 Hold pets that keeps everything held for over 10 seconds and possibly Mag 5 on some if you slotted VG with the Lock down proc.  To top it all off you can stack your St hold on a Boss, EB or AV meaning you're potentially dishing out 11 mag holds if Lock down procs.

 

 

3.  Plant Control- SIGH, I'm not going to say much about this set due to the fear it might one day get nerfed lmao but let's say this set and I have some history.  So you might ask Tater!  Why did you rate this set so low?  Well, this set DEVOURS new players...almost as much as Fire Control which is hilarious because most new players flock two those two sets.  Plant and Fire Control require a skilled hand to make it turn into the monster it really is.  Seeds of Confusion is like Mind Control in a bottle and it's up every mob BUT it generates aggro and often gets an unskilled player killed every. time.  Carrion Creepers is like a slow moving far more damaging version of Shadow Field/Volcanic Gasses but it can generate threat which keeps you and your team alive.  Don't depend entirely on Creepers and SoC until you have a decent enough amount of Res or Def; that alone can be enough if you are an aggressive enough player.  With the right build and skill you can skip your T7 Hold and your pet even though I wouldn't recommend it since getting rid of Vines and Fly Trap is a huge DPS/Control loss.  But in an extreme case Plant Control can easily out do Earth Control when it comes to surviablity and that's due to all the damage Plant Control can dish out.  The only thing that will give you problems are hard targets like AVs.

 

 

4.  Elec Control- A busy control set much like Mind, Dark and Grav.  I would say that Elec is the busiest set even more so than Mind.  This set favors melee and you should be in melee if you want to up your survival chances which is ironic.  In the past I would rate this set lower when it comes to survival due to it's low damage (even with procs), need to be in melee and because -end, -recov, confusion and sleep just wasn't enough but recently there have been proc changes and additions.  With the right build and procs this set can get kinda tanky and it provides endurance to your team.  Since this set is so busy I would not recommend an assault set that demands a lot of attention...unless you feel comfortable with both sets.  This set loves procs and recharge and with enough recharge it can get down right devastating control wise.  Double stacked Static Field is almost as strong as a T7 Control against most mobs and at times reminds me of a mix of Earth, Mind and Dark due to it's layered mitigation.

 

 

5.  Gravity Control- It's rare to see Grav doms but the set is still a force to be reckoned with on a Dominator.  Even without the Overpower inherent Gravity Control still deals respectable ST damage which can be a godsend for some dom secondaries and Propel spam provides conal soft control which can be helpful at times.  Wormhole's mag isn't increased by domination BUT the stun duration is increased and wormhole has so many great uses and is up often.  A highly skilled Grav Dom can also use Dimension Shift well enough to keep their teammates alive by stopping overaggro, patrol teams or incoming mob groups.  Please be courteous with this power and don't overuse it.  Gravity also has one of the Tankiest pet in the game that can hold and immob baddies.  Singularity loves tanking for you and will run into a mob if you or a close friend are being overwhelmed.  The late changes to Gravity Control really shoots this set right up the list when it comes to survival.

6.  Fire Control- Like I said earlier is a set that attracts new Controllers and Doms and gobbles them up and spit them out.  Why?  One sentence.  Fire Cages Spam = Dead Fire Control toon lol.  I'm not a fan of Fire Control but control wise it is decent and can be sometimes very effective.  Ho Feet dishes out fear and deals excellent damage.  Flashfire much like Earth Control's Stalagmites can be made perma which makes the power potent.  Smoke adds a tiny bit of -To Hit and -Perception which can surprisingly help with survival esp if you are close to the defense or resist cap and you want to add a little bit to your survival.  Cinders is a pbaoe hold which is dangerous but it's the trade off you have to accept since Fire Control deals a lot of damage.  Bonfire...*weeps* The SA and Overwhelming proc alone has turned this power from one of the most easily skipped to one of the most beloved powers to Blasters, Controllers and Dominators everywhere.  Imagine if Ice Slick and Caltrops had a baby...yeah that's Bonfire and to add insult to injury it ticks faster than Ice slick which means it KDs baddies more often that Ice Slick.  You should of of seen Bonfire when the Overwhelming Force proc first dropped.  KD would tick so often that mobs would pop in the air twice or sometimes 3 times before they would even land.  That's due to the fact that Bonfire ticks SO often...in fact it probably ticks faster than Caltrops.  Then the devs on live spoke with eldritch tongues and somehow nerfed/balance the KD rate of Bonfire without changing how often it ticks without the KD procs.  I still don't know how they did that.  Fire Control is at a good place right now but it can be a touch set to master for most especially if you are fighting Arachnos but lets be honest Arachnos is a natural enemy for most ATs lol.  Fire Control can climb up the ladder too when it comes to control if a skilled player is using it but overall it's low on the list when it comes to control.

 

 

7.  Ice Control- Ice control comes in last and this is even after it received a few direct and indirect buffs.  This has more to do with the Devs in my opinion overvaluing -Recharge.  A majority of powers in the set only do one thing and it does that one thing extremely poorly except for Arctic Air ❤️.  Arctic Air is amazing and pretty much carries the entire set.  It's an expensive power but potent and it gets silly with procs...did I mention that it hates your blue bar?  The only issue with this power is that it generates threat which means your the first thing that gets dropped or mezzed when you're in groups.  Permadom helps keep you from getting mezzed but Ice control doesn't offer much when it comes to layering down mezz.  Ice Slick is nice and it needs no slotting but the KD of the power ticks far less than Earthquake and Bonfire which means mobs often have time to hit you in between falls which is fatal.  Ice slick much like Earthquake and Bonfire can be cast using the line of sight trick but since Ice slick has slow ticking KD I would steel yourself and prepare for the alpha hit.  You will still have to deal with aggro from this power regardless if your team has a capable Tanker/Brute.  Glacier is your typical pbaoe hold which can be nice for shutting down mobs or slowing Bosses and EBs... that is if your survive all the aggro going your way which is unlikely.  And that's it.  Shiver is dead weight since Arctic Air and Frostbite alone will debuff a mob near the -Recharge cap and the entirety of Ice Control alone is not enough to push AVs to the -Recharge cap.  Even after numerous buffs Ice Control still falls short but there are ways to make up for how lackluster it is.  Focus on bolstering your defense/resists.  Pair it with a high damage set or a set that adds survival or utility like Dark Assault, Earth Assault and Fiery Assault to name a few.

Sorry about the typos and the numerous errors in this post but I was writing this in a hurry lol.  Maybe one day I will go more into detail and grade each set fully.

Oh and I appreciate the kind words everyone!  Sorry for the lengthy post but I felt like it was justified since this might get viewed by new players or players who are new to Dominators.

Edited May 10, 2020 by Tater Todd

[Hjarki]

On 5/9/2020 at 11:20 PM, Tater Todd said:

4.  Elec Control- A busy control set much like Mind, Dark and Grav.  I would say that Elec is the busiest set even more so than Mind.  This set favors melee and you should be in melee if you want to up your survival chances which is ironic.  In the past I would rate this set lower when it comes to survival due to it's low damage (even with procs), need to be in melee and because -end, -recov, confusion and sleep just wasn't enough but recently there have been proc changes and additions.  With the right build and procs this set can get kinda tanky and it provides endurance to your team.  Since this set is so busy I would not recommend an assault set that demands a lot of attention...unless you feel comfortable with both sets.  This set loves procs and recharge and with enough recharge it can get down right devastating control wise.  Double stacked Static Field is almost as strong as a T7 Control against most mobs and at times reminds me of a mix of Earth, Mind and Dark due to it's layered mitigation.

This description doesn't really match the set:

• 'Busy'. Electric on a Controller might potentially be 'busy' because you'd use Jolting Chain a lot. On Dominator, you normally wouldn't take Jolting Chain because you've got actual AE in secondary. Once you eliminate Jolting Chain, all the unique parts of Electric are long duration fire-and-forget powers.
• 'Melee'. Electric only has a single melee-only power and it's only useful if you intend to use endurance sapping as a core concept. While it technically restores health/endurance, the amount is so trivial that no one uses it for this purpose. Moreover, if you're sapping on a Dominator, you're almost certainly playing Electric/Psi and you're forced into melee range not by Conductive Aura (which you may not even take since Chain Fences does a pretty good job all on its own) but by the Psi melee powers and Drain Psyche.
• 'Procs'. The set is actually far less proc-friendly than most. While it can proc out the ST Hold/ST Immobilize/AE Immobilize, it's less likely to use these powers as sources of damage on Dominator than other sets. I already mentioned not taking Jolting Chain as a Dominator. That leaves effects that you normally straight-slot like Static Field and Synaptic Overload - you're certainly not slotting them with damage procs. I suppose you could layer healing procs all over the place if you chose.
• 'Recharge'. Electric is amongst the least recharge-sensitive control sets because its two primary control measures can be used every spawn even without any global recharge. Moreover, because those powers are self-stacking, you don't need to layer them multiple times even on a Controller.
• 'Endurance to your team'. While this does appear in the description of Static Field, it's such a minor effect that you'll never notice. You also can't slot it for endmod sets (although you could place endmod IOs in it if you chose).

 

[Chirikiti]

On 5/2/2020 at 12:18 PM, The_Cheeseman said:

Mind is still the best, it’s just more subtle and strategic in its application, so it’s not as easily recognized as such by those who haven’t played it sufficiently. But that’s fine, let them play their inferior sets while we dominate the world and laugh.

o_-

[Tater Todd]

20 minutes ago, Hjarki said:

This description doesn't really match the set:

• 'Busy'. Electric on a Controller might potentially be 'busy' because you'd use Jolting Chain a lot. On Dominator, you normally wouldn't take Jolting Chain because you've got actual AE in secondary. Once you eliminate Jolting Chain, all the unique parts of Electric are long duration fire-and-forget powers.
• 'Melee'. Electric only has a single melee-only power and it's only useful if you intend to use endurance sapping as a core concept. While it technically restores health/endurance, the amount is so trivial that no one uses it for this purpose. Moreover, if you're sapping on a Dominator, you're almost certainly playing Electric/Psi and you're forced into melee range not by Conductive Aura (which you may not even take since Chain Fences does a pretty good job all on its own) but by the Psi melee powers and Drain Psyche.
• 'Procs'. The set is actually far less proc-friendly than most. While it can proc out the ST Hold/ST Immobilize/AE Immobilize, it's less likely to use these powers as sources of damage on Dominator than other sets. I already mentioned not taking Jolting Chain as a Dominator. That leaves effects that you normally straight-slot like Static Field and Synaptic Overload - you're certainly not slotting them with damage procs. I suppose you could layer healing procs all over the place if you chose.
• 'Recharge'. Electric is amongst the least recharge-sensitive control sets because its two primary control measures can be used every spawn even without any global recharge. Moreover, because those powers are self-stacking, you don't need to layer them multiple times even on a Controller.
• 'Endurance to your team'. While this does appear in the description of Static Field, it's such a minor effect that you'll never notice. You also can't slot it for endmod sets (although you could place endmod IOs in it if you chose).

 

 

I think this is one of those to each their own situations.  For example I actually take jolting chain and Conductive Aura you do not and that's fine.  I love the fact that Conductive aura often procs a make shift hold or a forced animation when a foe is drained.  It adds a small layer of safety for a few microseconds while I wade in the deep of the battlefield.  My favorite pairing with Elec Control is Earth Assault so believe it or not my reason for using Jolting chain and Conductive Aura is for added mitigation purposes.  I never mentioned focusing on draining a mob but even if you don't slot Static Field with an End Mod it still does a decent job at draining the average minion or lt. 

When I mentioned procs placement I was mostly referring to heal procs like Power Transfer which can make your elec dom or troller very hard to kill.

Electric Control does not require high recharge that's true and it can do just fine without it.  I just personally love being able to throw out my mezz powers often especially when I am up against tough and resistant foes like Arachnos, Talons of vengeance or malta to name a few.  Plus it helps out a great deal against AVs.

I also stated at the beginning of my post that I was giving my personal biased review so that that with a grain of salt.  I by no means am an expert or a Dev.  I'm just some schmuck that barely knows my head from my arse lol.

[Coyote]

2 hours ago, Tater Todd said:

I actually take jolting chain and Conductive Aura

 

So do I.

 

Jolting Chain, AFTER you get Apocalypse in there (because otherwise you only have two non-purple damage IOs) does about 180 damage to the primary target followed by about 100 damage as AoE. 100 AoE damage on an 8 second timer isn't all that bad, but it's actually pretty good considering you're getting it with 3 slots. Add in one slot for Accuracy/End/EndMod so you have some Accuracy in there, and that still leaves it as a usable power with 2 slots left over for Force Feedback and something else. Either Power Transfer, or Devastation Hold proc.

I do have two AoEs from the secondary, but they leave room to add in JC if I"m not hitting with single-target attacks. And if I am... doesn't hurt to have extra AoEs that are sitting unused because you're busy mixing in single-target attacks.

 

Conductive Aura isn't worth going into melee to use it. But Earth Assault is in melee anyhow, and it's endurance hungry, so... Static Field and Conductive Aura help it more than most other secondaries. And unlike /Psy, where you can go in, hit Drain Psyche, and back out... /Earth stays in melee. So it gets more use from the end recovery than most other sets. And as a bonus it makes it easier to drain spawns.

 

Neither is so dominant in what it does that they're clear must takes, but they are both useful on a melee-oriented Dominator. Although I agree with Hjarki, that the set is relatively resistant to low global Recharge since long-recharge powers still recharge fast enough, and Jolting Chain also recharges fast and can slot Force Feedback. So it doesn't really have nearly as much need for Recharge as some other sets that depend on 90-second-recharge Stuns like Fire and Earth.

 

[Chelsea Rorec]

My elec/elec dom is always in melee because i built it like that.

And i didn't take jolting chains but i did take Conductive Aura.

I have no problems being in melee range and my end draining is excellent even with just conductive and melee attacks.

 

[Phalanx480bc]

5 hours ago, Chelsea Rorec said:

My elec/elec dom is always in melee because i built it like that.

And i didn't take jolting chains but i did take Conductive Aura.

I have no problems being in melee range and my end draining is excellent even with just conductive and melee attacks.

 

I do the same.  My elec/elec feels like cheating, to be honest.  I wade in and have all the time in the world to kill mobs.  It would be boring if it wasn't so much fun to stand next to a boss that can't do anything to you because it has no endurance and is slept most of the time.

[Liam Neeson's Wet Socks]

As if I wasn't already feeling demotivated enough by all the hoops you have to jump through for the sake of perma-dom, along comes this thread. Oh, how joyous the thought of feeling like a leech in high level groups :(

[EnjoyTheJourney]

On 5/8/2020 at 7:14 PM, Destlin said:

Any dominator on a team with a threat anchor should only immobilize after the mobs have congregated just so you dont have runners. If you are opening up with it then you should take a step back and ask if you can be more effective.

+1

 

A lot of dominators and controllers lead with AOE immobilizes. Those casting them probably feel like they're doing something helpful. But, generally they're just slowing the team down. 

 

I've started to compliment teammates, mentioning in team chat that it's refreshing to see somebody help the tank do their job better and helping their teammates' AOEs be much more effective by being so patient about applying their AOE immobilize. It seems better than filling team chat with criticism, at the end of the day, and perhaps doing that once in a while makes a small difference in how some players play their dominators / controllers. I'll compliment other good things teammates do sometimes, as well, so it hopefully blends in a bit with other things being mentioned in chat. 

Edited May 16, 2020 by EnjoyTheJourney

[Bierfuizl]

On 5/16/2020 at 4:11 PM, Liam Neeson's Wet Socks said:

As if I wasn't already feeling demotivated enough by all the hoops you have to jump through for the sake of perma-dom, along comes this thread. Oh, how joyous the thought of feeling like a leech in high level groups 😞

My Plant/Psi/Psi certainly doesn't feel like a leech.

[kiramon]

I always love people that talk about skill when 90% of the players of this game click to activate abilities. We on a different level bro’s lol

[kiramon]

5 hours ago, Bierfuizl said:

My Plant/Psi/Psi certainly doesn't feel like a leech.

I’ll see how I feel about plant again after I IO it — I always loved the set when it was dom only but have one sitting at 50 (plant/earth) that i have to gear out— but nothing feels as fast paced to me as a grav/sAvage... so idk how I’ll feel.

 

i did make a mind/martial fully iod and its okay — it’s damage is fine to be honest the spam of damage is pretty great- and it controls just fine to the point it doesn’t need anything else really. I wouldn’t complain about it for sure. 

I did elec/thorns that I’m going to revisit shortly, but maybe I’ll move it to the back of my plant/earth. These happen every other daily for me (gearing out characters), so we’ll see...

 

right now I’m finishing my AR/EA cor so we’ll see which I end up deciding to do. I have a stone/SS tanker in line somewhere too, but that’ll probably be the back of the bus

 

[Frostweaver]

On 5/9/2020 at 9:20 PM, Tater Todd said:

2.  Mind Control- I'm not a fan of this set.  It feels unfinished to me...or I should say it feels OLD but one cannot deny it is a force to be reckoned with when it comes to lock down. One of the issues with Mind control though is the lack of damage.  Even a fully proc'd out Terrify isn't enough damage wise compared to Plant, Fire and Dark control.  Also mind doesn't have any way of shutting down mobs at low level besides Total Domination, ST Mezz spam and Terrify.  Mass Hypnosis (and Mesmerize) has it's uses but overall it's not a great power to have on a fast moving team but it's worth keeping due to it's uses in various situations.  Mind control is not very new player friendly or damage focused.  There's a lot I want to talk about when it comes to this set but I'll save it for another time.  I would steer clear of this set until you have a better understanding of the game.

I cannot disagree more with this evaluation. Mind control is THE dominator set, sort of the standard by which all other sets are measured.

WHY would you need extra damage in your control set as a dominator? you have an entire secondary devoted to nothing BUT damage. Plus you have THREE solid aoe controls that you can rotate for each spawn... yes, one of those is a sleep, but you are a dominator, not a controller... even against +4/8 content solo you can usually smash every thing in the spawn with ST attacks INCLUDING the bosses before it wears off. (We were running an all-dom 4 man team vs 4/8 ITF last night, and two-shotting +4 bosses was fun.)

If that is not damage-focussed, then you need to reconsider what definition you are using for the term... controller sets need damage, damage sets on Dominators are often UNDERPERFORMING in comparison. Pets usually just interfere with your cleansing and control and exist solely to wreck sleeps and fears and soak up aggro on a dominator.

Sure, it may not be AS useful on a steamrolling team, but steamroll teams are just a small part of the content, and they generally don't need any aggro/mob control anyway... just a couple of brutes with a couple of blasters behind them. That's not the sole focus of the game, and your secondary usually has more than enough damage to make you useful to the team even if your controls are less than stellar... I don't think there's a single dominator secondary that doesn't come with a brutal primary attack, decent aoe, and some sort of big damage snipe or debuff attack.

having basically every sort of possible firm control in one primary is very new player friendly, if you want the new player to figure out how to play the game. What isn't new-player friendly are setts that make immobilizes out to be 'real' controls, or have controls that are so soft that a ton of content can utterly ignore them.

 

Telling newbies to 'steer clear of' the most dominator-centric set in the game, and then simultaneously uptalking gravity and fire, sets which encourage stupid play just by their power order? Seriously?

Please do not take this as a personal attack, @Tater Todd, I simply consider you UTTERLY off base with this evaluation. Usually I value your input, but your post read head-scratchingly like you were REALLY enjoying your Saturday night, only with better grammar.

Edited June 6, 2020 by Frostweaver

[Tater Todd]

12 hours ago, Frostweaver said:

I cannot disagree more with this evaluation. Mind control is THE dominator set, sort of the standard by which all other sets are measured.

WHY would you need extra damage in your control set as a dominator? you have an entire secondary devoted to nothing BUT damage. Plus you have THREE solid aoe controls that you can rotate for each spawn... yes, one of those is a sleep, but you are a dominator, not a controller... even against +4/8 content solo you can usually smash every thing in the spawn with ST attacks INCLUDING the bosses before it wears off. (We were running an all-dom 4 man team vs 4/8 ITF last night, and two-shotting +4 bosses was fun.)

If that is not damage-focussed, then you need to reconsider what definition you are using for the term... controller sets need damage, damage sets on Dominators are often UNDERPERFORMING in comparison. Pets usually just interfere with your cleansing and control and exist solely to wreck sleeps and fears and soak up aggro on a dominator.

Sure, it may not be AS useful on a steamrolling team, but steamroll teams are just a small part of the content, and they generally don't need any aggro/mob control anyway... just a couple of brutes with a couple of blasters behind them. That's not the sole focus of the game, and your secondary usually has more than enough damage to make you useful to the team even if your controls are less than stellar... I don't think there's a single dominator secondary that doesn't come with a brutal primary attack, decent aoe, and some sort of big damage snipe or debuff attack.

having basically every sort of possible firm control in one primary is very new player friendly, if you want the new player to figure out how to play the game. What isn't new-player friendly are setts that make immobilizes out to be 'real' controls, or have controls that are so soft that a ton of content can utterly ignore them.

 

Telling newbies to 'steer clear of' the most dominator-centric set in the game, and then simultaneously uptalking gravity and fire, sets which encourage stupid play just by their power order? Seriously?

Please do not take this as a personal attack, @Tater Todd, I simply consider you UTTERLY off base with this evaluation. Usually I value your input, but your post read head-scratchingly like you were REALLY enjoying your Saturday night, only with better grammar.

Frostweaver, I appreciate your kindness and control of your frustration.  Mind Control is just not a set for me and It never will be.  It feels disjointed, blocky and out of place.  For some reason I. JUST. CAN'T. STAND. IT.  I've tried making Mind toons for years on end and I always end up disappointed.  I'm leveling a Fortunata to 50 to slowly force myself to like the Control and Utility Mind Control offers (I know Forts are not Doms but I'm familiar with Widows).  If you read my opinion on Fire and Gravity I go into detail of how these two sets are a problem for new players and I highlight why and how you should remedy the typical new player mistakes that we all see constantly on Fire and Grav Control toons.  I gave my opinion on Mind Control but keep in mind I'm the last person you want to go to when it comes to advice on Mind Control.  I just cannot stand the set.  I'd rather throw myself off a cliff than to use Mind Control.  Also, I deal with Chronic Rheumatoid Arthritis so at times I'm not at my best and that was definitely the case when I posted here.  It was quick, scattered and painfully informal but I decided to post anyway because I felt like the Dominator subforum needs more activity.

Again, I loathe Mind Control and I want nothing to do with the set but I have seen the set really shine in action in group play.  I'm just going to say for the record...I'm only human just like you guys and I have plenty of faults and quirks and I will continue to forcefully make myself enjoy Mind Control and even Psi Assault(even though it hurts doing so lol).  I love helping other players, especially if they have Dominator related questions but at this current time my dislike for a set is hindering my ability to fully assist fellow players who have questions about Mind Control.

[Coyote]

14 hours ago, Frostweaver said:

Mind control is THE dominator set, sort of the standard by which all other sets are measured.

 

Well, I think it's suprisingly good on Dominators. But I can't see it as better than Dark or Electric, because those also have good control.... and far better secondary effect that can actually defend you pretty well even when controlling fails. And Plant Control is more effective in most of the game, though it's risky since it depends on a single power that is occasionally resisted (and so Rularuu eyeballs will deliver fun fun beatings to you until you figure out how to handle them... and Nemesis won't be much fun, either).

[Bierfuizl]

On 6/5/2020 at 7:56 PM, kiramon said:

I’ll see how I feel about plant again after I IO it — I always loved the set when it was dom only but have one sitting at 50 (plant/earth) that i have to gear out— but nothing feels as fast paced to me as a grav/sAvage... so idk how I’ll feel.

 

i did make a mind/martial fully iod and its okay — it’s damage is fine to be honest the spam of damage is pretty great- and it controls just fine to the point it doesn’t need anything else really. I wouldn’t complain about it for sure. 

I did elec/thorns that I’m going to revisit shortly, but maybe I’ll move it to the back of my plant/earth. These happen every other daily for me (gearing out characters), so we’ll see...

 

right now I’m finishing my AR/EA cor so we’ll see which I end up deciding to do. I have a stone/SS tanker in line somewhere too, but that’ll probably be the back of the bus

 

Before the inf changes I was making 90mil/h with him in AE fire or S/L farms (two different builds, S/L is my normal day to day build). Not the 130mil/h of top brute builds back then, but not too shabby either for a Dom that wasn't even built with a farm focus.

 

[Frostweaver]

12 hours ago, Coyote said:

 

Well, I think it's suprisingly good on Dominators. But I can't see it as better than Dark or Electric, because those also have good control.... and far better secondary effect that can actually defend you pretty well even when controlling fails. And Plant Control is more effective in most of the game, though it's risky since it depends on a single power that is occasionally resisted (and so Rularuu eyeballs will deliver fun fun beatings to you until you figure out how to handle them... and Nemesis won't be much fun, either).

I said the standard by which other sets are measured, not the best 🙂 Invulnerability and super strength are standard-setters also, but they are not the best under every circumstance.
 

13 hours ago, Tater Todd said:

Frostweaver, I appreciate your kindness and control of your frustration.  Mind Control is just not a set for me and It never will be.  It feels disjointed, blocky and out of place.  For some reason I. JUST. CAN'T. STAND. IT.  I've tried making Mind toons for years on end and I always end up disappointed.  I'm leveling a Fortunata to 50 to slowly force myself to like the Control and Utility Mind Control offers (I know Forts are not Doms but I'm familiar with Widows).  If you read my opinion on Fire and Gravity I go into detail of how these two sets are a problem for new players and I highlight why and how you should remedy the typical new player mistakes that we all see constantly on Fire and Grav Control toons.  I gave my opinion on Mind Control but keep in mind I'm the last person you want to go to when it comes to advice on Mind Control.  I just cannot stand the set.  I'd rather throw myself off a cliff than to use Mind Control.  Also, I deal with Chronic Rheumatoid Arthritis so at times I'm not at my best and that was definitely the case when I posted here.  It was quick, scattered and painfully informal but I decided to post anyway because I felt like the Dominator subforum needs more activity.

Again, I loathe Mind Control and I want nothing to do with the set but I have seen the set really shine in action in group play.  I'm just going to say for the record...I'm only human just like you guys and I have plenty of faults and quirks and I will continue to forcefully make myself enjoy Mind Control and even Psi Assault(even though it hurts doing so lol).  I love helping other players, especially if they have Dominator related questions but at this current time my dislike for a set is hindering my ability to fully assist fellow players who have questions about Mind Control.

Not frustrated, just not in agreement, and wanted to put that out there. I guess in a similar example, A lot of people consider Titan weapons to be the Ultimate set, but I have tried it dozens of times and just cannot tolerate it's foibles, so I hear you.
The Saturday Night comment was simply meant to be a joke, please do not take it seriously. I too have over 30 years of constant computer wear and tear on my body so I totally hear you... CoH is not a youngster's game, most of us were fondly collecting comic books in the 80's and our Love for CoH extends from that... Which is probably why CoH was mismanaged near the end of it's life, the management teams didn't understand it's primarily Gen-X audience.

I love Mind because I have always preferred melee toons... My primary is basically just there so I can rip through stuff with my secondary, and it replaces the big defense and resist I usually use. The fact that you have 3 full-on aoe controls, folllowed up by 3 single target controls that stack exactly the same controls for hard targets, means I can exploit my secondary to it's greatest damage potential... in a very real way, I sorta ignore my primary once I get what I want out of it. Maybe that's the secret to enjoying mind... It's not a control set, it's just a toolbench to keep you alive while you enjoy your secondary. And as toolbenches go, it has some excellent vices and an anvil and a perfect place to install a table saw.

Edited June 7, 2020 by Frostweaver