Controller /Cold ( Ice Shield and Glacial Shield )

[krj12]

I'm currently playing my Ice/Cold Controller.  Decent combination, but nothing special.  Probably nothing I'd want to play solo due its extremely low dps.

I'm not asking for higher dps, but one thing about the secondary that kind of bugs me, and that's how both Ice Shield and Glacial Shield work.

They both appear to work as a PBAE defensive shield for my team mates - HOWEVER, it does nothing for myself, which begs the question - why?

 

It would be nice if it could add *self* to the list of targets, so that I can share in the defensive buffs that the rest of my group has been given.

 

[BrandX]

Because, for that, you're supposed to take Ice Mastery.

[MTeague]

Infridgidate can be a decent DPS power if you slot it heavily with Damage Procs and add lots of global recharge.

You certainly don't have to if that's not your thing.  But it can help /Cold have more of a DPS option for when you are soloing.

 

I do think it would unbalance things too much if FF or Cold or Sonic or Thermal or Empathy or the like could use their Ally-Only powers on themselves.  I feel there is already QUITE enough power-creep with IO's and incarnates and we should not be adding even more power creep into the equation.  But I have seen this requested enough (ally-only-powers-on-self), that I will not be shocked if it actually happens.

[krj12]

Shrug, I see no difference between it self affecting me, vs having another /Cold troller on the team who casts it on me.  Same end result - I wouldn't consider it power creep.

 

[Snowdaze]

For the same reason Force Field's Deflection Shield and Insulation Shield, Sonic Resonance's Sonic Barrier and Sonic Haven, and Thermal Radiation's Thermal Shield and Plasma Shield cant be applied to ones self. They are ally buffs. If you could apply any of these to yourself hitting caps becomes easy, also they all stack from different sources! It was a design choice, a good one, and a tried and true game mechanic.

 

Also these powers have basically FULL armor values, and are given to classes that by design don't have armors. Being able to apply them to yourself would make these 4 sets much more powerful on Defenders, Corruptors, Controllers, and Masterminds, and frankly there would be a lot less diversity in the game because they would be the sets to play.

 

Please don't change the status quo for these sets, they are working as intended, even though it might not be the way you wish they worked.

[Snowdaze]

3 hours ago, krj12 said:

They both appear to work as a PBAE defensive shield for my team mates - HOWEVER, it does nothing for myself, which begs the question - why?

Also originally all of these were single application not target based AoE, which meant back in the day at the beginning of every mission and half way through everything stopped so they could be reapplied one by one to each player on the team and it took a while, Please just be grateful you don't still have to do that!

[Tad Cooper]

Why is it that every time someone suggests buffing support classes there's gasping, pearl clutching, and fainting? God forbid they get to feel powerful once in a while. If you're worried about Tank Mages... well, cat's out of the bag on that one guys and it's practically everybody. Thank IOs.

 

Support archetypes can't defend the team if they can't defend themselves. Not to mention that if they want to solo they shouldn't have to feel like their powers are useless. Several of the sets can already buff themselves, notably Time and to a lesser extent any debuff set since weakening enemies effectively makes you stronger. Seems obvious to me that the Ice shields (and probably most Support buffs) should just be made PBAoE with a reduced bonus for the caster to emphasize the whole "support" aspect. For defenders, say 5% for self and the current values for teammates in this particular instance. That would mean with Arctic Fog up they could pull a whopping 10% personal defense out of two powers, which is still less than Frozen Armor alone on any of the melee sets.

 

7 hours ago, Snowdaze said:

Also originally all of these were single application not target based AoE, which meant back in the day at the beginning of every mission and half way through everything stopped so they could be reapplied one by one to each player on the team and it took a while, Please just be grateful you don't still have to do that!

"Just be grateful we let you save us both some tedium while you're making me invulnerable." <-- This is the most polite interpretation of this post I can make. It took some effort. It really rubbed me the wrong way.

Edited May 18, 2020 by Tad Cooper

[Naraka]

57 minutes ago, Tad Cooper said:

Why is it that every time someone suggests buffing support classes there's gasping, pearl clutching, and fainting? God forbid they get to feel powerful once in a while. If you're worried about Tank Mages... well, cat's out of the bag on that one guys and it's practically everybody. Thank IOs.

The pearl clutching goes both ways.  You suggest nerfing the high-end min/max portion of the game or make it somewhat tougher to reach said min/max potential so that said support feels meaningful and you get a slew of accusations of ruining the casual game or not understanding the playerbase or some such.

 

1 hour ago, Tad Cooper said:

Support archetypes can't defend the team if they can't defend themselves. Not to mention that if they want to solo they shouldn't have to feel like their powers are useless. Several of the sets can already buff themselves, notably Time and to a lesser extent any debuff set since weakening enemies effectively makes you stronger. Seems obvious to me that the Ice shields (and probably most Support buffs) should just be made PBAoE with a reduced bonus for the caster to emphasize the whole "support" aspect. For defenders, say 5% for self and the current values for teammates in this particular instance. That would mean with Arctic Fog up they could pull a whopping 10% personal defense out of two powers, which is still less than Frozen Armor alone on any of the melee sets.

I wouldn't be against adding an aspect to the AT's inherent so it's easier to balance across the support ATs.  For example, I don't think Controllers need the same self defense buffing as, say, a Corruptor or Defender and Mastermind certainly doesn't.

 

But at the same time, I'd enjoy the IO system more if, for instance, defense bonuses weren't so prevalent to soft-cap a blaster to smashing/lethal and/or bolstering their rech so they can toss out obscene AoEs and nukes but were more reliant on their ST DPS.  Having it so other bonuses like recovery, regen and damage weren't garbage in comparison.

 

Therefore we will likely never get anywhere because I don't want buffs without balance.  But balance isn't a concern to most.

 

[Doomguide2005]

15 hours ago, krj12 said:

Shrug, I see no difference between it self affecting me, vs having another /Cold troller on the team who casts it on me.  Same end result - I wouldn't consider it power creep.

 

The difference is one bolsters solo play the other encourages teaming.  And in some cases it is complicated by the power granting multiple buffs.  Cold shields for example also buff resists, Clear Mind doesn't just grant potent mez protection but also buffs perception.  Does this mean we can't or shouldn't consider it.  No but the Devs at the time obviously didn't allow them to self buff (or aoe buff or both) and probably had good reason for it which to me anyway says go slow before changing the way those powers work.

Edited May 18, 2020 by Doomguide2005