rant Why Do We Need Quantums?

[SwitchFade]

5 hours ago, Xiddo said:

Sorry, maybe I wasn't clear because I was typing half-awake. My bad.
 

I know this! Cheers 🙂
I meant...  When they changed Quantum's to do resistible damage (negative? I think), and not un-resistible like before, did they also change the damage that Voids do in the same way? Because I found the Voids in the tip mission to pack a real punch. I think it stuck out because you don't see Voids anywhere and I was very aware of my health bar.

I would like cysts to spawn like they used to. But I appreciate it isn't something that everyone agrees with.
I ran the Khel arc and there were a few missions where Cysts spawned. But the Cysts didn't spawn the extraction-mobs. If they aren't plans to turn cysts back on, for content where a kheldian is in the team, could the ones that appear in the kheldian arcs/tip missions (where a objective is a cyst) have the extraction-mob-spawn power back on? As they're the lore arc/ the story of the mission. Otherwise they're just exploding bombs we need to beat up.

They largely removed voids from the game by changing spawn behavior for kheldians, They don't random spawn anymore, but still do much more damage when encountered in missions they are part of.

[JJDrakken]

Yes you do, Blueside already faceroll easy for most part(Yah, still some scary stuff, like Malta, or Dark Astoria Banished Pantheon(or majoirty DA Mobs), or Praetorian stuff(Especially Squid Heads).

 

Back in day, there use to be Nictus Crystals showing up and spamming non stop crap on you. Amongst other stuff back in day. Be happy you don't have that or have a team having to deal with you on the team, thus infecting rest of team with your Kheldian Mob bullshit rest of teaming time, even after you leave.

 

 

[Orivon]

On 12/4/2020 at 11:04 AM, Ohsirus said:

Anyone else remember the "No Khelds Allowed" while teaming? The pleading of "Please kill the Voids first". I really need to resurrect my WS/PB alts, just to see how they function in a i27/Incarante world now.

YES! ALl of that and we used to have targeting macros to quickly find those in a group to make sure we addressed them first.

[Greycat]

On 6/28/2021 at 9:14 AM, GhostDawg said:

My problem isn't with the quants. My problem is with the fact that PB/WS power and utility don't warrant it. Never did. In the old days the idea of a ranged class with shields was verboten. So they threw quantum kryptonite at it. In the modern age you have a ranged class with shields, status protection, and no kryptonite. They're called Sentinels. And they're not considered game breaking.

 

 

They're also not an Epic (meaning story-driven) class with their own storyline, which those specific mobs are tied to. It has nothing to do with being "a ranged class with shields."

[UltraAlt]

On 7/15/2021 at 12:49 PM, JJDrakken said:

Back in day, there use to be Nictus Crystals showing up and spamming non stop crap on you. Amongst other stuff back in day. Be happy you don't have that or have a team having to deal with you on the team, thus infecting rest of team with your Kheldian Mob bullshit rest of teaming time, even after you leave.

 

lol. I loved that stuff!

Brings a lot of random chaos/excitement. 

I think Kheldians still do leave a stank on teams after they leave, but Q's are not that dangerous to non-Kheldians.

[UltraAlt]

Depending on your settings, the voids and quantums only show up one at a time.

 

I'm running in a WS and PB duo with sometimes another WS in the mix. When a Quantum or Void shows up ... they become the main target to go down first .... just the same as other groups ... go for the Tsoo Sorcerer first, take out the Sky Raider Engineer first, destroy all the Devouring Earth pet spawns first, Vazh Mortificator first, etc.

 

Kheldians were the EPIC archetype, so it was supposed to be more of a challenge to play them than the other archetypes. Of course, back then, you have to have a character reach level 50 before they unlocked, so you were assumed to have some skill with the game and were looking for a greater challenge.

[Greycat]

I felt the need to point something out, given the mention of the "threat" of Quantums.

 

As mentioned, the unresistable Nictus damage is gone.

 

As I type this, I'm on a level 29 triform. I have no sets boosting resistance - three pieces of each Kheld set, beginnings of Thunderstrike in some of my ST attacks (which does nothing for resists, adds a smidge of ranged defense.) I'm in humanform. I have a KB resist IO and a single lvl 30 resist in Absorption, a single -end and resist in Shining and a single resist in Quantum shield. I'm not "built" to resist much of anything.

 

Facing even con Family. Which, of course, has quantums. I faced a set of four and *let the quantum keep shooting me.* 9 hits, one miss, on top of combat with the others... and I still had a hair under 400 HP left. Max HP with Essence boost... 1189.

 

If I can just stand there and take hits like that and still have a comfortable amount of HP left... *they're not a threat.*

[Vengeful Arrow]

4 hours ago, Greycat said:

 

If I can just stand there and take hits like that and still have a comfortable amount of HP left... *they're not a threat.*

I know what you mean. I barely even notice them, aside from the giant purple gun.  I don't want the previous "full team wipe" versions, but perhaps in this version of City of Incarnate, a kick in the balls would be refreshing almost. I think 50+ team missions should have Incarnate level bosses every now and then. Like a random EB or something capable of spawning in any enemy group maybe with an unblockable, unresistable 50% attack.  Just to make teams pause for a second.  Then it would feel like incarnates had something to fear in every day missions. That's how Khelds felt. 

[GhostDawg]

On 9/2/2021 at 12:10 AM, Greycat said:

 

They're also not an Epic (meaning story-driven) class with their own storyline, which those specific mobs are tied to. It has nothing to do with being "a ranged class with shields."

From a raw playability standpoint that's beside the point. Great they have a story line, so let's f@#k them up with extra hazards. Where's the risk vs. reward calculation there? So you can follow a story line? Pft.

 

[GhostDawg]

On 12/7/2020 at 6:12 AM, Ohsirus said:

Never Understood why people would choose all-human for a AT based around the forms. JMHO.

Lack of slots for one.

[Greycat]

1 hour ago, GhostDawg said:

From a raw playability standpoint that's beside the point. Great they have a story line, so let's f@#k them up with extra hazards. Where's the risk vs. reward calculation there? So you can follow a story line? Pft.

 

 

Which are tied to the story.

 

There's actually character classes that have the world react *specifically to their existence.* Not with a generic ambush or name-replace-placeholder in dialog.

 

Also, as previously noted, given how heavily nerfed their enemies are, you're hardly "f@#kd." Maybe if you AFK for half an hour in front of one. Don't even need a "build" for that. They're pretty much nothing but extra XP at this point, threat wise.

[GhostDawg]

3 hours ago, Greycat said:

 

Which are tied to the story.

 

There's actually character classes that have the world react *specifically to their existence.* Not with a generic ambush or name-replace-placeholder in dialog.

 

Also, as previously noted, given how heavily nerfed their enemies are, you're hardly "f@#kd." Maybe if you AFK for half an hour in front of one. Don't even need a "build" for that. They're pretty much nothing but extra XP at this point, threat wise.

My comments weren't about how things ARE. They were about quantums at inception. The whole design was flawed because Kheldians weren't powerful enough to warrant Kryptonite. Having a single minion ruin your day because he could mez and flatline your ass in a couple shots wasn't worth the trouble. Maybe that's why they nerfed the damn things. And now that I think about it, the whole "story line" bit goes out the window because the little bastards would show up on team missions that weren't part of it.

 

[tidge]

5 hours ago, GhostDawg said:

My comments weren't about how things ARE. They were about quantums at inception. The whole design was flawed because Kheldians weren't powerful enough to warrant Kryptonite. Having a single minion ruin your day because he could mez and flatline your ass in a couple shots wasn't worth the trouble. Maybe that's why they nerfed the damn things. And now that I think about it, the whole "story line" bit goes out the window because the little bastards would show up on team missions that weren't part of it.

 

Originally: in order to unlock the HEAT, it was necessary to get another character to the level cap. This implies (to me anyway) that part of the calculus involved with HEATs was that players would be willing to face a specific, dedicated challenge while playing them. Over the course of LIVE, the barrier of entry to HEAT-play was significantly lowered so I think it is easy to overlook this aspect of the AT.

 

It's a different sort of discussion about whether or not it was 'fair' to non-HEAT players to add HEAT-specific enemy types to non-HEAT missions. Many players clearly didn't think so ("No Khelds, plz"). The nerfing (my words) of the Quants/Voids from was a compromise, considering that the Cosmic Balance/Dark Sustenance inherent abilities explicitly rely on having teammates.

 

[Ohsirus]

11 hours ago, GhostDawg said:

Lack of slots for one.

 

Pre-IOs ,Incarnates, Enhancement Boosters, I would agree. If you have the budget you can overcome the lack of slots easily nowadays. When they were first introduced it did feel like a sacrifice having to pick and choose.

[Greycat]

8 hours ago, GhostDawg said:

My comments weren't about how things ARE. They were about quantums at inception. The whole design was flawed because Kheldians weren't powerful enough to warrant Kryptonite.

 

 

Again. Epic = story based. Yes, I know you want to ignore this. It makes zero difference.

 

8 hours ago, GhostDawg said:

And now that I think about it, the whole "story line" bit goes out the window because the little bastards would show up on team missions that weren't part of it.

 

Wow, you really do not get it, do you. This is *the world reacting to you.* Quantum gunners appearing in other storylines was even explained IN the Kheld storylines - the Council selling guns to counter you to other groups. So, no, "the whole story line bit" does not go "out the window." Instead, it explains the very reason they show up.

[GhostDawg]

15 hours ago, Greycat said:

 

Again. Epic = story based. Yes, I know you want to ignore this. It makes zero difference.

 

 

Wow, you really do not get it, do you. This is *the world reacting to you.* Quantum gunners appearing in other storylines was even explained IN the Kheld storylines - the Council selling guns to counter you to other groups. So, no, "the whole story line bit" does not go "out the window." Instead, it explains the very reason they show up.

Just because I don't agree with you doesn't mean I don't get it. Having a moderately powered AT balanced with a LOL you lose mechanic hurt it overall.

 

[GhostDawg]

18 hours ago, tidge said:

 

Originally: in order to unlock the HEAT, it was necessary to get another character to the level cap. This implies (to me anyway) that part of the calculus involved with HEATs was that players would be willing to face a specific, dedicated challenge while playing them. Over the course of LIVE, the barrier of entry to HEAT-play was significantly lowered so I think it is easy to overlook this aspect of the AT.

 

It's a different sort of discussion about whether or not it was 'fair' to non-HEAT players to add HEAT-specific enemy types to non-HEAT missions. Many players clearly didn't think so ("No Khelds, plz"). The nerfing (my words) of the Quants/Voids from was a compromise, considering that the Cosmic Balance/Dark Sustenance inherent abilities explicitly rely on having teammates.

 

The payoff wasn't worth the challenge. 

 

[Greycat]

On 9/14/2021 at 2:19 AM, GhostDawg said:

Just because I don't agree with you doesn't mean I don't get it. Having a moderately powered AT balanced with a LOL you lose mechanic hurt it overall.

 

Every word you've written indicates you don't get it and/or don't want to get it. Has nothing to do with agreeing or disagreeing with me.

 

Frankly, it indicates the ATs don't click with you. Which is fine. There are a bunch of other ones to play. Have fun over there instead.

[GhostDawg]

12 hours ago, Greycat said:

 

Every word you've written indicates you don't get it and/or don't want to get it. Has nothing to do with agreeing or disagreeing with me.

 

Frankly, it indicates the ATs don't click with you. Which is fine. There are a bunch of other ones to play. Have fun over there instead.

LOL. As a matter of fact the AT clicks with me fine after they blunted that arbitrary limitation. Good thing someone with the ability to make changes saw how stupid it was in the first place.