War Witch

[Greycat]

6 hours ago, KingCeddd03 said:

so question, where do the ideas of powers and how they are used come from?

 

It's called "Imagination" and "Creativity."

[KingCeddd03]

1 hour ago, Shadeknight said:

That Wiki didn't exist back when Ditko, Kirby, Lee, or others started up Marvel & DC. Or Image Comics, etc so forth and on we go.

Some things appeared out of thin air and originality. Others simply used the tried and true common tropes of "What superpower would you want?" that you get asked on websites or as a kid.

That wiki isn't some End All Be All Resource, doofus.

@GM Impervium That wiki isn't some End All Be All Resource, doofus.

just thought u should know

[biostem]

On 11/7/2022 at 3:08 AM, KingCeddd03 said:

Superpowers wiki is a tool that tells what the power is correctly called and also tells what the powers in question can and should do. even though COX is a hero game I believe that that still applies to COX as well as other superpower-based things

By what authority do you claim that this "Superpowers Wiki" either applies to or dictates how powers work or where they come from, with regard to the City of Heroes setting?  AFAIK, CoH was based upon a Champions PnP game that some of the original devs played, then adapted when they decided not to license that IP, and THEY, (plus any later devs), are the ones that solely had that authority...

[KingCeddd03]

55 minutes ago, Greycat said:

 

It's called "Imagination" and "Creativity."

same as the wiki more or less. only they expand on how the power can be used just like you can make a power up here they can too and be more expansive about it than a one-note power and how it's used. I think you're trying to say that it may limit your creativity on your character yes it may, but every character has to have a limit and limitations otherwise you would have a crazy overpowered character I use the wiki to be able to know what can be done with the powers that I have taken and how far they can go 

[KingCeddd03]

9 minutes ago, biostem said:

By what authority do you claim that this "Superpowers Wiki" either applies to or dictates how powers work or where they come from, with regard to the City of Heroes setting?  AFAIK, CoH was based upon a Champions PnP game that some of the original devs played, then adapted when they decided not to license that IP, and THEY, (plus any later devs), are the ones that solely had that authority...

did u ever read the wiki it has the same powers in the game. example

gravity manipulation can also be called gravity control but in the game, it only has one use of control 

[biostem]

1 minute ago, KingCeddd03 said:

did u ever read the wiki it has the same powers in the game. example

gravity manipulation can also be called gravity control but in the game, it only has one use of control 

That wasn't what I asked.  Please address my questions to you.  I don't care if the wiki copied the in-game text verbatim - it doesn't make it authoritative...

[Rudra]

No, not the same as the wiki. And that wiki has no correlation to what can, cannot, should, or should not be done in CoX. You can use it as a reference, or handicap in my opinion, of what powers can do. That's your choice. However, it is not a valid reference for anything in CoX.

 

Not for whether or not Numina is a mage because she lacks a physical body (she is a mage despite lacking a physical body) or if she is a ghost for lacking a physical body (she isn't, she's an astral projection).

Not for whether any powers or power sets are "correctly named" or "correctly utilized" in CoX.

Not for whether or not a power set is or is not magical despite not having magic, arcane, eldritch, or anything else of that nature in its name.

Not for anything in the game. At all.

 

You can use the site as a reference all you want. Do not seek to require others to abide by it as well. Just as you using the site as a reference is your choice, not using it is everyone else's choice.

Edited November 9, 2022 by Rudra
Edited 2nd line for clarity.

[KingCeddd03]

1 hour ago, Rudra said:

It is very different from the wiki. The wiki tries to be an expansive list of all thing super, but is instead a lesson in nonsensical hilarity. It wants to be an authority on all things super, but fails at it. Not least of which is because someone somewhere has a different idea of what powers are and do.

 

The people who imagine and write up their powers? They aren't constrained by what someone else writes on a wiki. They are constrained by their ability to create, innovate, and imagine.

 

Edit:

If you want to constrain yourself to what others tell you is a super power, how it looks, what it does, how it can be applied? That's fine. Your choice. If you want to constrain yourself to using that site as your end-all-be-all reference for all things super? That's fine. That's your choice. If you want everyone else to be likewise constrained? Well, now we have a problem.

 

That site has nothing to with City of Heroes/Villains. It has nothing to do with Champions Online. It has nothing to do with DC Universe Online. It has nothing to do with anything super character related other than itself. It's that simple.

Fire manipulation =Fire Manipulation | Superpower Wiki | Fandom

Empathy = Empathy | Superpower Wiki | Fandom

Darkness manipulation, Affinity, control, Blast, melee exct = Darkness Manipulation | Superpower Wiki | Fandom

this sums up what i have been saying 

 

[KingCeddd03]

6 minutes ago, biostem said:

That wasn't what I asked.  Please address my questions to you.  I don't care if the wiki copied the in-game text verbatim - it doesn't make it authoritative...

to answer i use it there is no person that says anyone else have to use it or have the other things be used for the game

[Rudra]

Fire manipulation from that site:

Also Called

• Pyrokinesis
• Flameokinesis/Flambokinesis
• Agnikinesis/Agnimancy
• Flame Control/Manipulation/Dominion
• Ignikinesis/Ignimancy
• Fire Element Control

Capabilities

Users can generate, shape, and manipulate fire, the rapid oxidation of a material in the exothermic chemical process of combustion, releasing heat, light, and various reaction products, flame being the visible portion of the fire. Depending on the substances alight, and any impurities outside, the color of the flame and the fire's intensity will be different. The user can also completely control the temperature of the fire at will.

 

Fire Manipulation as used in comics and super hero games since the dawn of comics: Create fire, shape fire, manipulate fire (increasing/decreasing size of effect), move fire, maintain fire (without need for available fuel), absorb fire, extinguish fire, project fire (as projectiles), enflame (wrap in fire without causing harm to target), warm target (including cooking), cauterize wound, enhance melee attack (armed or unarmed, as per enflame), illumination, and propulsion. I'm sure I'm missing at least a few other uses. None of which are covered by your precious wiki as part of fire manipulation.

 

Would you like me to pick apart your precious wiki's empathy entry next? Gravity manipulation? Darkness manipulation? Or the medical entries I already pointed out in this thread? Super powers are only as limited as the individual's imagination. They are not bound by some poorly written wiki. And neither is CoX. As was previously stated up thread, CoX was based on the Hero System Champions pen and paper game. It is not the same, but it was based on it. (And given how expansive the Hero System is compared to the wiki? I'll take Hero System over that wiki any day.) However, this is a video game. Video games cannot be as open-ended as the Hero System is. (I think the devs tried to make it so, but couldn't do it.) So you wind up with thematic sets that are basically a single solitary power that the character develops into up to 9 different uses. Which is also far more comprehensive than that wiki you insist is the reference for everything, even when those things predate the wiki by decades.

Edited November 9, 2022 by Rudra
Edited to remove extra comma.

[biostem]

11 minutes ago, KingCeddd03 said:

to answer i use it there is no person that says anyone else have to use it or have the other things be used for the game

I don't think you understand - the Wiki does not dictate what powers exist in the game, how they work, or where they originate from - the game and the dev team does that.  While you, as a player, can come up with a story surrounding your particular character and how their powers work or came from, you are still constrained by the game engine and mechanics.  Your character can claim that they are Statesman's mom and that she gave him his powers through a set of magical Underoos, but that would be a baseless claim within the greater scope of the game itself... and even if you created an entire wiki about it, it still wouldn't have any veracity...

Edited November 9, 2022 by biostem

[KingCeddd03]

16 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Fire manipulation from that site:

Also Called

• Pyrokinesis
• Flameokinesis/Flambokinesis
• Agnikinesis/Agnimancy
• Flame Control/Manipulation/Dominion
• Ignikinesis/Ignimancy
• Fire Element Control

Capabilities

Users can generate, shape, and manipulate fire, the rapid oxidation of a material in the exothermic chemical process of combustion, releasing heat, light, and various reaction products, flame being the visible portion of the fire. Depending on the substances alight, and any impurities outside, the color of the flame and the fire's intensity will be different. The user can also completely control the temperature of the fire at will.

 

Fire Manipulation as used in comics and super hero games since the dawn of comics: Create fire, shape fire, manipulate fire (increasing/decreasing size of effect), move fire, maintain fire (without need for available fuel), absorb fire, extinguish fire, project fire (as projectiles), enflame (wrap in fire without causing harm to target), warm target (including cooking), cauterize wound, enhance melee attack (armed or unarmed, as per enflame), illumination, and propulsion. I'm sure I'm missing at least a few other uses. None of which are covered by your precious wiki as part of fire manipulation.

 

Would you like me to pick apart your precious wiki's empathy entry next? Gravity manipulation? Darkness manipulation? Or the medical entries I already pointed out in this thread? Super powers are only as limited as the individual's imagination. They are not bound by some poorly written wiki. And neither is CoX. As was previously stated up thread, CoX was based on the Hero System Champions pen and paper game. It is not the same, but it was based on it. (And given how expansive the Hero System is compared to the wiki? I'll take Hero System over that wiki any day.) However, this is a video game. Video games cannot be as open-ended as the Hero System is. (I think the devs tried to make it so, but couldn't do it.) So you wind up with thematic sets that are basically a single solitary power that the character develops into up to 9 different uses. Which is also, far more comprehensive than that wiki you insist is the reference for everything, even when those things predate the wiki by decades.

well that kinda sad that the devs past or present can't make the hero system happen despite how far we have come in Technolgy, having said that yes if we can do it in the game then yes there is, and will be limitations to powers, imagination is a poor excuse to say otherwise the game does what it can do with the powers, and you would have to work within that space. end of story 

[Luminara]

That wiki that didn't exist until 20 years after development of this game began.  It's no more relevant than yesterday's sports section in a newspaper.

[Rudra]

17 minutes ago, KingCeddd03 said:

well that kinda sad that the devs past or present can't make the hero system happen despite how far we have come in Technolgy, having said that yes if we can do it in the game then yes there is, and will be limitations to powers, imagination is a poor excuse to say otherwise the game does what it can do with the powers, and you would have to work within that space. end of story 

I see you shifted from saying that wiki is the proper reference for things to saying that powers need limitations or they become overpowered. Welcome to gaming, where in-game powers come with preset limitations baked right in. In CoX, it is the devs that create power sets, design/implement the associated mechanics of the set, design/implement the animations for the power sets, and determine what the limitations of those powers and power sets are. Typically by keeping the new power sets as generic as they can so they fit with the five game origins. And they do so based on what they've seen/read in comics, or seen in movies, or just came up with from their own imaginations. Without the need to reference a poorly written wiki with no quality control (anyone can edit it at any time to say what they want, it says so right on the wiki).

[KingCeddd03]

12 hours ago, Luminara said:

That wiki that didn't exist until 20 years after development of this game began.  It's no more relevant than yesterday's sports section in a newspaper.

says who? you i don't think you are in a position to say what is relevant or not. 

[KingCeddd03]

13 hours ago, Rudra said:

I see you shifted from saying that wiki is the proper reference for things to saying that powers need limitations or they become overpowered. Welcome to gaming, where in-game powers come with preset limitations baked right in. In CoX, it is the devs that create power sets, design/implement the associated mechanics of the set, design/implement the animations for the power sets, and determine what the limitations of those powers and power sets are. Typically by keeping the new power sets as generic as they can so they fit with the five game origins. And they do so based on what they've seen/read in comics, or seen in movies, or just came up with from their own imaginations. Without the need to reference a poorly written wiki with no quality control (anyone can edit it at any time to say what they want, it says so right on the wiki).

everything on the wiki is correct it all has been back up from other sources tv show's games and other media  

[Greycat]

5 minutes ago, KingCeddd03 said:

everything on the wiki is correct it all has been back up from other sources tv show's games and other media  

 

"Other sources" are not COH.

"(Other) show's" are not COH. And an apostrophe indicates a possessive, not a plural.

"(Other) games" are *quite obviously* not COH.

"Other media" is not COH.

 

All that pretty much by definition is ... not City of Heroes. And none of it makes it correct for COH.  The world of COH and the way its powers work and are defined are *internal to COH.* It doesn't care that, for instance, in the Dresden series Harry and technology don't get along - it doesn't have robots and beam rifles start malfunctioning if a magic origin character is nearby or uses their powers. Why? Because this is City of Heroes, not the Dresden Files. It doesn't force someone trying to use an ability to consume a specific metal to empower it like in the Mistborn series. Why? Because Mistborn is not City of Heroes. It doesn't care how close the Gbaba came to wiping out humanity, or the limits that were programmed into a PICA,  or how a Manticoran cruiser goes between Manticore and Greyson or how its grasers work. Why? Because City of Heroes is not Safehold or the Honorverse.  And saying that one is "wrong" or "needs to be this way" because the other is that way is ridiculous.

 

Are you getting the point yet? That silly little wiki is not the be-all, end-all source for anything. It is *utterly irrelevant* to COH. It's as irrelevant to COH as a Halo wiki is. It's as relevant to City of Heroes as "Tasting History with Max Miller" is (and Max is far more entertaining.) 

[Rudra]

1 hour ago, KingCeddd03 said:

says who? you i don't think you are in a position to say what is relevant or not. 

Let's start with the original game developers. Then go into the current devs. Tack on the current player base with some exceptions (I have to account for you after all).

 

14 minutes ago, KingCeddd03 said:

everything on the wiki is correct it all has been back up from other sources tv show's games and other media  

You just can't let it go. Use the wiki all you want. Noone cares if you do. It's your choice, feel free to do as you please. If you want to use it to define and create your characters for you? Go ahead. If you want to use it for ideas? Go ahead. If you want the devs or your fellow players to be bound by it and its limited interpretation of powers and their uses? Or to impose how powers are listed in that site as how they should work in City of Heroes? Stop. Just, stop.

 

That site has no relevance to the superhero genre beyond itself. It has no bearing on how people can imagine, create, and present their characters or the powers they want their characters to have. It is not an authoritative mandate on what players call their powers or make them work. It can make for a decent launch point to come up with concepts if you want to use it as such, but it is by no means comprehensive, authoritative, or binding in any capacity. There is no MMO, RPG, or other game that uses that wiki as a reference for how the game should or does work. There is no comic, novel, show, or movie that uses that wiki as a reference for how powers in the comic, novel, show, or movie should or do work.

 

So stop using that wiki as a mandate for CoX. It is NOT a CoX wiki. It is NOT a mandate. It is a publicly written/sourced site with no quality controls, incomplete data, and a LOT of redundancy and unnecessary limitations on concept.

[lemming]

On 10/25/2022 at 9:42 PM, KingCeddd03 said:

Now that war witch has returned to life, i was thinking she could be the one to introduce a new task force or become the 8th member of the  freedom Phalanx. plus on top of that war witch now inhabits sorceress serene's body. now her having a better body and powers at that, i feel her potential as a hero would be far greater.  The question is what the devs be doing with her moving forward? And will the powersets Autumnal Control and Assault be made to fit her come up.

 

This thread seems to have gone from almost interesting to arguing about a collection of data being authoritative.   That wiki is just a collection of data points from a bunch of different sources.   Very few game worlds, stories, authors are going to have the same take on powers.  

 

Will the devs do something with her?  Who knows, War Witch was a cool developer if I remember right was the one who took all the door missions out of perez park out of the woods.  The devs might just keep her as a legacy in Pocket D for training and getting to enjoy life again.

She's also both dead & alive depending on where you are in the game.

 

And about the last question, probably not since they don't exist here.

[Luminara]

3 hours ago, KingCeddd03 said:

i don't think you are in a position to say what is relevant or not. 

 

https://www.ign.com/articles/2003/08/21/city-of-heroes-diary-volume-2

https://www.ign.com/articles/2003/09/17/city-of-heroes-diary-volume-3

https://www.ign.com/articles/2003/10/16/city-of-heroes-diary-volume-4

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Champions_(role-playing_game)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hero_System

 

Your source is irrelevant.

[KingCeddd03]

28 minutes ago, Luminara said:

 

https://www.ign.com/articles/2003/08/21/city-of-heroes-diary-volume-2

https://www.ign.com/articles/2003/09/17/city-of-heroes-diary-volume-3

https://www.ign.com/articles/2003/10/16/city-of-heroes-diary-volume-4

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Champions_(role-playing_game)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hero_System

 

Your source is irrelevant.

dude I'm talking about the power itself, not the way your powers interact. the wiki has a name of the power in the game or something similar  in the game, it only has one use which is resisting and I'm not going to mention masteries because you can always change them, for example, fire manipulation on the wiki says it has a number of uses, but in-game you can do one thing or the other depending on the AT you pick such as tanker you will only be able to do melee fire attacks, then you have the controller fire control in which you will be only will be able to do is control in which you can use fire control that's it what AT you pick is how your powers function. but I do understand that cox tries to be its own thing, but it failed to do so cause well it's a superpower game it ties in with other info which leads to the wiki itself that further explains what else the powers you have chosen can do or should be able to do 

[KingCeddd03]

@Rudrawhats funny

[Rudra]

24 minutes ago, KingCeddd03 said:

dude I'm talking about the power itself, not the way your powers interact. the wiki has a name of the power in the game or something similar  in the game, it only has one use which is resisting and I'm not going to mention masteries because you can always change them, for example, fire manipulation on the wiki says it has a number of uses, but in-game you can do one thing or the other depending on the AT you pick such as tanker you will only be able to do melee fire attacks, then you have the controller fire control in which you will be only will be able to do is control in which you can use fire control that's it what AT you pick is how your powers function. but I do understand that cox tries to be its own thing, but it failed to do so cause well it's a superpower game it ties in with other info which leads to the wiki itself that further explains what else the powers you have chosen can do or should be able to do 

🤣🤣🤣

 

Oh, boy. You do try. You try so hard.  Just stop. Please. No more wiki nonsense. The wiki is not the basis for CoX. No matter how much you want it to be. It is not the basis for absolutely any super powers used in any context anywhere. It may take things from other sources. It may even have some overlap with existing games. You know why? Because a lot of super powers are common across mystic, super, sci-fi, and other genres.

 

"Fire manipulation =Fire Manipulation | Superpower Wiki | Fandom

Empathy = Empathy | Superpower Wiki | Fandom

Darkness manipulation, Affinity, control, Blast, melee exct = Darkness Manipulation | Superpower Wiki | Fandom

this sums up what i have been saying "

 

News Flash: Fire Control/Manipulation, Empathy Control/Manipulation, Darkness Control/Manipulation, and all the other powers you say come from the wiki? They have been in existence since the first writers of characters that used those powers wrote them up. And some names are more commonly used than others.

 

Just stop with this nonsense already. I'm trying to treat you as just another person with a difference of opinion, but the garbage you insist on spewing is leading me to think you are instead a troll.

Edited November 9, 2022 by Rudra
Edited to correct mispelled word.

[Luminara]

Just now, KingCeddd03 said:

dude I'm talking about the power itself, not the way your powers interact. the wiki has a name of the power in the game or something similar  in the game, it only has one use which is resisting and I'm not going to mention masteries because you can always change them, for example, fire manipulation on the wiki says it has a number of uses, but in-game you can do one thing or the other depending on the AT you pick such as tanker you will only be able to do melee fire attacks, then you have the controller fire control in which you will be only will be able to do is control in which you can use fire control that's it what AT you pick is how your powers function. but I do understand that cox tries to be its own thing, but it failed to do so cause well it's a superpower game it ties in with other info which leads to the wiki itself that further explains what else the powers you have chosen can do or should be able to do 

 

Is that wiki based on City of Heroes/Villains?  Did that wiki contribute to the design or implementation of systems or mechanics in City of Heroes/Villains, in any way?  Did that wiki even exist when City of Heroes entered development? 

No?

Then it's irrelevant because Co* pre-dates that wiki.  This game's use of power names, descriptions and uses, as well as limitations on what powers can do, came before that wiki.  Cryptic didn't use it.  Paragon didn't use it.  HC doesn't use it.  We, the players, don't use it.  That's what makes it irrelevant.  It would be no different than if you linked a Skyrim wiki, or a Fallout wiki, or a Star Wars wiki, or the ingredients list on a cereal box.  It's not Co*, so it's irrelevant.  What you want the game to be based on what you read on that wiki is irrelevant because the game isn't based on, developed around or utilizing anything from that wiki.  And it never will be.

 

https://hcwiki.cityofheroes.dev/wiki

 

That's the relevant wiki.

 

https://cod.uberguy.net/html/index.html

 

That's the relevant database of powers.

[KingCeddd03]

3 minutes ago, Rudra said:

🤣🤣🤣

 

Oh, boy. You do try. You try so hard.  Just stop. Please. No more wiki nonsense. The wiki is not the basis for CoX. No matter how much you want it to be. It is not the basis for absolutely any super powers used in any context anywhere. It may take things from other sources. It may even have some overlap with existing games. You know why? Because a lot of super powers are common across mystic, super, sci-fi, and other genres.

 

"Fire manipulation =Fire Manipulation | Superpower Wiki | Fandom

Empathy = Empathy | Superpower Wiki | Fandom

Darkness manipulation, Affinity, control, Blast, melee exct = Darkness Manipulation | Superpower Wiki | Fandom

this sums up what i have been saying "

 

News Flash: Fire Control/Manipulation, Empathy Control/Manipulation, Darkness Control/Manipulation, and all the other powers you say come from the wiki? They have been in existence sicne the first writers of characters that used those powers wrote them up. And some names are more commonly used than others.

 

Just stop with this nonsense already. I'm trying to treat you as just another person with a difference of opinion, but the garbage you insist on spewing is leading me to think you are instead a troll.

I'm sorry you feel it's nonsense it seems you don't have an intelligent mind. but every power that has every existed is on the wiki