New Staff weapon customisation

[biostem]

2 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Yep, counterfeits do exist in real life. And there are laws against them in real life too.

The difference in CoH is that our characters aren't trying to sell them to some unsuspecting buyer, and ours, by necessity/game mechanics wouldn't have all the properties of the signature characters.  Heck, the laws you cited may not even exist in a world where there is likely some piece of tech or simple spell one can use to tell a fake from the genuine article.  that being said, I am perfectly fine with getting a "knock-off" version of these weapon models - by restricting the color or other such options.  No reason our "Valkyrie fangirl" character couldn't craft herself a spear that looks similar to her hero's...

[Rudra]

Am I really that hard to understand? This seems to be a running trend. You are misunderstanding my comment.

 

I am not arguing against players getting access to Shadow Hunter's or Valkyrie's spear. The entire last paragraph of the post you quoted, not to mention the other posts I made on this thread, are actually supportive of players getting those weapon models.

 

It is the arguments being given for why we should get them that has me smashing my head against a wall in frustration. Valkyrie's spear may not even be unique. It is a nanite weapon from War Earth. Just like the halberd Battle Maiden uses. Nanite weapons on War Earth are difficult to find in that dimension because of the sheer destruction wrought upon that world, at least according to one of the story arcs we can play blue side. However, even in that arc, it is mentioned that there are probably more nanite spears and halberds waiting to be found, and likely even other weapon types, just that no one has currently found them other than Battle Maiden and her followers.

 

Now, setting aside the lore of nanite melee weapons, we get to the models used. Valkyrie's spear is closer to a javelin in appearance, except too big and top-heavy for throwing. Other than that, it is still a fairly basic generic spear weapon. So as I have said, multiple times now, since I think her spear's color is one we don't have access to, then we could get her spear, color it according to the colors we have access to, and it would still be visually different from hers. So her spear would still be unique if the devs decided hers was the only one anywhere in the CoX multiverse for any reason. Same thing for Shadow Hunter's spear, which is less a spear and more... I can't remember the name of that poleweapon right now. It is spear, but reminiscent of another weapon with a specific cultural name. And since unlike Valkyrie, Shadow Hunter does not derive his powers from his weapon, I believe his weapon is just a random weapon like any of his Spirit Stalkers may have but don't use. Or anyone else for that matter.

[FupDup]

8 hours ago, Rudra said:

Yep, counterfeits do exist in real life. And there are laws against them in real life too.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2320

https://www.justice.gov/archives/jm/criminal-resource-manual-1704-trademark-counterfeiting-elements-18-usc-2320

https://www.govinfo.gov/app/details/USCODE-2011-title18/USCODE-2011-title18-partI-chap113-sec2320/summary

 

And for outside the US:

https://www.unodc.org/documents/counterfeit/FocusSheet/Counterfeit_focussheet_EN_HIRES.pdf

https://www.worldtrademarkreview.com/global-guide/anti-counterfeiting-and-online-brand-enforcement/2017/article/international-anti-counterfeiting-legislation-existing-regime-and-future-developments

 

So if the argument is that we have counterfeits, so we should have counterfeits, then the argument is borked. Because our law enforcement lacks things like mind reading, time travel, and other super powers to track down counterfeiting operations. So that argument can be flushed.

Supervillains, rogues, and vigilantes probably don't care too much about those laws and are powerful enough to get away with breaking them. It's really only a limitation for pure heroes. 

 

The "counterfeit" weapons would have some kind of visual differences to make them not infringe on the genuine ones, like having less detail, different colors, etc. that indicate shoddy craftsmanship. Bootleg weapons if you will. The NPCs get to keep their cool unique variants with special particle FX. 

 

Spears in general (not just Valkyrie/Shadow Hunter) would be nice to have but honestly they might look kinda weird with our current melee sets. Spears are meant for stabbing and throwing, not slashing or slapping. Spear Assault set when?

Edited June 7, 2023 by FupDup

[Player2]

10 hours ago, Rudra said:

Yep, counterfeits do exist in real life. And there are laws against them in real life too.

 

I love how the use of real world laws about counterfeiting stuff gets turned to excuse not adding content for player use.

 

Oh noes, a unique NPC's item might have lookalikes out there.  There must be a law.  Unless you're telling me that heroes and villains are running to the patent office and/or getting their equipment's appearance trademarked, this is a laughable excuse.  And even still, half of this game is centered on people playing as CRIMINALS who regularly break and even flaunt the laws of the land because they can.  Like, "I will challenge Longbow and the Freedom Phalanx themselves, but I better not have a copy of this unique looking artifact because that would be against the law."

 

NPCs having unique items can be represented in theirs granting special abilities that copies won't have.  The Ghost Slaying Axe is a good example of this.  The original developers on Live never wanted to proliferate its model to the Battle Axe power set because they wanted the prestige power to remain special.  It always would have been special because it causes an additional damage effect against undead that copies in Battle Axe power set, and the fact that it was finally added here on HC proves it.  No one laments that their prestige power Ghost Slaying Axe isn't special anymore because people can use the model.

[Player2]

(nothing here)

Edited June 7, 2023 by Player2
Double post

[Tiger Shadow]

2 hours ago, Player2 said:

I love how the use of real world laws about counterfeiting stuff gets turned to excuse not adding content for player use.

 

This is especially hilarious when you consider that we're playing on what is effectively a counterfeit server.

[Player2]

53 minutes ago, Tiger Shadow said:

 

This is especially hilarious when you consider that we're playing on what is effectively a counterfeit server.

Right?!  🤣

[Rudra]

4 hours ago, Player2 said:

I love how the use of real world laws about counterfeiting stuff gets turned to excuse not adding content for player use.

 

Oh noes, a unique NPC's item might have lookalikes out there.  There must be a law.  Unless you're telling me that heroes and villains are running to the patent office and/or getting their equipment's appearance trademarked, this is a laughable excuse.  And even still, half of this game is centered on people playing as CRIMINALS who regularly break and even flaunt the laws of the land because they can.  Like, "I will challenge Longbow and the Freedom Phalanx themselves, but I better not have a copy of this unique looking artifact because that would be against the law."

 

NPCs having unique items can be represented in theirs granting special abilities that copies won't have.  The Ghost Slaying Axe is a good example of this.  The original developers on Live never wanted to proliferate its model to the Battle Axe power set because they wanted the prestige power to remain special.  It always would have been special because it causes an additional damage effect against undead that copies in Battle Axe power set, and the fact that it was finally added here on HC proves it.  No one laments that their prestige power Ghost Slaying Axe isn't special anymore because people can use the model.

If a person brings up real world activities as justification for something, then real world laws are going to get brought up too. CoX is a fiction, but they obviously have laws. Otherwise there wouldn't be a PPD.

[Player2]

1 minute ago, Rudra said:

If a person brings up real world activities as justification for something, then real world laws are going to get brought up too. CoX is a fiction, but they obviously have laws. Otherwise there wouldn't be a PPD.

It's an invalid comparison, though.  You're talking about trafficking of counterfeit goods... like trying to sell cans of Compbell's Soup with labels that look like Campbell's Soup in the hopes that no one will notice the difference, thus taking business away from the owner of a good while you profit from their name brand association.  Heroes and villains aren't proffitting from the unique appearance of their gear and likely aren't patenting or trademarking the physical appearance of their gear.  And heroes generally don't go around with lawyers trying to prevent other heroes from wearing or using gear that looks like their own... while both heroes and villains use tech and costumes and take over old identities all the time for different reasons.  Heroes usually in that lame excuse of passing on the mantle of whatever identity and villains looking to claim street of an established moniker.

[Rudra]

I am in favor of the OP. I am simply against the argument of real world counterfeits justifying in-game model access. Especially for something as generic as the spear Valkyrie and Shadow Hunter have.

[megaericzero]

34 minutes ago, Rudra said:

I am in favor of the OP. I am simply against the argument of real world counterfeits justifying in-game model access. Especially for something as generic as the spear Valkyrie and Shadow Hunter have.

 

It is weird that people are arguing back and forth about counterfeiting when a much cleaner justification would be paying homage. Like Kamala Khan cosplaying Carol Danvers.

[Saiyajinzoningen]

can i request a scythe skin here or am i in the wrong thread?