Aggressively reduce price of basic enhancements

[Lockely]

13 minutes ago, Rudra said:

I just checked my beam rifle character. Not invalid.  Not as a character running around or when I visited a tailor to check that possibility. So I'm not understanding this comment.

 

It's happened to both myself and several others on the Beta and on Live. You can read the threads. I made two of them you're more than welcome to go look at where they are documented. It also is defaulting out of those rifles every time you open the costume up and trying to force you to change it for 200k Inf each time. It also refuses to load those costumes when you load them in, even if you saved them on this specific Page.

I have it happening on two different characters, one a bots MM made long ago, and the other a Beam Corrupter made this week. Edit: Three actually, because it's affecting my Arsenal Control Dom as well.

Edited March 7 by Lockely

[biostem]

2 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

It is too much to ask for garbage leveling gear. That is poor game design. You're basically saying two of the major functions of this game should be ignored during the bulk of the game. the leveling experience.

Unlike other games, your character can function perfectly well, even without enh's.  Even ignoring that, there are, in fact, many ways to fund and slot your character, even without a 50 to fund you.  You cannot on one hand say that you are ignoring major functions of the game, while simultaneously advocating against using the AH or even AE.

 

5 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

For the sake of keeping a GM out of the topic, I'm going to completely ignore and pretend i didn't see that books comment.

Yeah - we wouldn't want to actually help people, now would we?

[Crimsanotic]

Just now, biostem said:

Maybe I should have been clearer.  The phrase "blowing all your income" or something to the effect means you WASTED it, not spent out of necessity.  Let me assure you - I highly doubt anyone playing CoH has to worry about making ends meet, and if you do, I'd gladly look over your books to see where cuts can be made.  I also do not think it is too much to ask new players to either forego slotting each and every power at all times/levels and/or to read one of the many guides on how to generate wealth in-game.

 

The problem is that CoH has a plethora of systems tacked on top of systems. If you've ever actually tried to explain something to a brand new player, their response to a lot of things is typically "what?" Because different things were added over the course of years. It might not seem significant to you (or me, for that matter), but CoH is actually pretty overwhelming for newer players. Making enhancements literally unfundable and having to worry about grinding influence, and reading a guide just to literally have basic crap like SOs is just another thing new players have to keep track of and look out for.

But why should they not be able to afford basic enhancements? Playing without them feels bad, especially if you don't really know what you're doing, which a new player generally wouldn't. It just makes the game feel worse.

[biostem]

1 minute ago, Crimsanotic said:

The problem is that CoH has a plethora of systems tacked on top of systems. If you've ever actually tried to explain something to a brand new player, their response to a lot of things is typically "what?" Because different things were added over the course of years. It might not seem significant to you (or me, for that matter), but CoH is actually pretty overwhelming for newer players. Making enhancements literally unfundable and having to worry about grinding influence, and reading a guide just to literally have basic crap like SOs is just another thing new players have to keep track of and look out for.

No disagreement there.  And there's systems in place to alleviate the early game.  Don't get me wrong - I'm in no way saying CoH is perfect, but at the same time, we should be directing new players to the various guides on how to handle them.  You wanna see convoluted messes - check out some of the so-called F2P MMOs or mobile games.  Yeeesh!

 

3 minutes ago, Crimsanotic said:

But why should they not be able to afford basic enhancements? Playing without them feels bad, especially if you don't really know what you're doing, which a new player generally wouldn't. It just makes the game feel worse.

Well, it's not so much "playing without enhancements" - it's about player perception that not being fully slotted with max level enh's is somehow a punishment or renders them inadequate.

[Super Atom]

5 minutes ago, biostem said:

Unlike other games, your character can function perfectly well, even without enh's.  Even ignoring that, there are, in fact, many ways to fund and slot your character, even without a 50 to fund you.  You cannot on one hand say that you are ignoring major functions of the game, while simultaneously advocating against using the AH or even AE.

 

Yeah - we wouldn't want to actually help people, now would we?

 

Your character does infact not function perfectly well without SO's in the 30-50 area. You are considerably worse, just because you can doesn't prove it should be that way for all. This is once again a failure on your end to understand the difference of new vs veteran player.  I am not ignoring the AH or AE, i am being realistic to a new player.

 

You keep mentioning managing resources, but i have proven the math supports there is not enough resources to manage at all if you even attempt to SO a little.

 

also since you want to push it, your comments about other peoples finacial states are completely disgusting and not relevant to this at all. You are not helping, you are making baselsss assumptions and actively saying people are just "not handling money properly" . It is fucking disgusting you have no fucking right to make any kind of judgement on other people you don't know the situation of and im going to ask you just one time to stop trying to push this any further.

Edited March 7 by Super Atom

[biostem]

1 minute ago, Super Atom said:

our character does infact not function perfectly well without SO's in the 30-40 area.

It is not about functioning "perfectly well" - It is about functioning "good enough".

 

2 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

I am not ignoring the AH or AE, i am being realistic to a new player.

Then advocate for guides on how to educate new players, not steer them away from the resources already available.  Ignoring aspects of the game is not helping them.

 

3 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

also since you want to push it, your comments about other peoples finacial states are completely disgusting and not relevant to this at all. You are not helping, you are making baselsss assumptions and actively saying people are just "not handling money properly" . It is fucking disgusting you have no fucking right to make any kind of judgement on other people you don't know the situation of and im going to ask you just one time to stop trying to push this any further.

That's rich coming from someone posting on a video game forum.  Get off your high horse. 

[Neogumbercules]

Something I've considered for a while is that TOs, DOs, and SOs should have been completely removed from the game and basic IOs should be craftable without recipes, only costing the mats and the crafting cost at the table.

 

In addition to that, there should be more crafting tables in common areas, like inside Wentworth's or near the Black Markets in the Rogue Isles.

 

Keeping one foot in the past when the crafting system was first introduced maybe made sense back then, but it's long since become redundant.

 

A major reason to do this would be to simplify the process for new players, and another one would be to act as a tutorial/introduction to IO sets, which is pretty much a major aspect of the endgame, like it or not.

[Super Atom]

1 minute ago, biostem said:

It is not about functioning "perfectly well" - It is about functioning "good enough".

 

Then advocate for guides on how to educate new players, not steer them away from the resources already available.  Ignoring aspects of the game is not helping them.

 

That's rich coming from someone posting on a video game forum.  Get off your high horse. 

cool goal post moving. they don't infact function "good enough" either.

 

If someone has to read a bunch of guides to do something as simple as leveling and equipping some white quality gear, it's a bad game or eve.

 

I don't even know what the fuck that means, just stop making weird comments about peoples real lifes.

[Luminara]

33 minutes ago, Lockely said:

Really depends on how its implemented.

 

No, it doesn't.  There's already too much inf* in circulation.  That's why there are so many inf* sinks now, and why more are added with each update.  The inflationary pressure exerted by inf* is already enormous, and it took aggressive efforts to keep from spiraling out of control in the first couple of years.  Any implementation of increased inf* rewards would, regardless of where it was targeted, equate to more inf* entering the economy more rapidly, thus increasing the inflationary pressure and requiring even more aggressive control to prevent inflation.

You can't just dump inf* into the economy willy-nilly.  It doesn't work when you do that.

[biostem]

7 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

cool goal post moving. they don't infact function "good enough" either.

 

If someone has to read a bunch of guides to do something as simple as leveling and equipping some white quality gear, it's a bad game or eve.

 

I don't even know what the fuck that means, just stop making weird comments about peoples real lifes.

You got me - I did use the phrase "perfectly well".  No, no one has to read a guide on how to level or equip gear.  They have to read a guide on how to generate a lot of in-game wealth.  What you don't like is the rate or frequency at which they get that "white gear" - they're 2 different things.

 

My reference to real life was as an analogy on how wasting money on one thing IRL, which in turn means you don't have money for other things, is on that person to correct their behavior.  It was others that started blowing it out of proportion then getting indignant at my offer to help.

Edited March 7 by biostem

[Lockely]

1 minute ago, Luminara said:

 

No, it doesn't.  There's already too much inf* in circulation.  That's why there are so many inf* sinks now, and why more are added with each update.  The inflationary pressure exerted by inf* is already enormous, and it took aggressive efforts to keep from spiraling out of control in the first couple of years.  Any implementation of increased inf* rewards would, regardless of where it was targeted, equate to more inf* entering the economy more rapidly, thus increasing the inflationary pressure and requiring even more aggressive control to prevent inflation.

You can't just dump inf* into the economy willy-nilly.  It doesn't work when you do that.

 

The amount of Inf a player makes pre-50 is a pittance. You earn more Inf in a single level 50 MSR than you do leveling from 1-50. It's not going to have any noticeable impact as long as level 50 rates are unaffected, and absolutely no one is asking for level 50 rates to be touched.

[Super Atom]

Just now, biostem said:

You got me - I did use the phrase "perfectly well".  No, no one has to read a guide on how to level or equip gear.  They have to read a guide on how to generate a lot of in-game wealth.  What you don't like is the rate or frequency at which they get that "white gear" - they're 2 different things.

 

My reference to real life was as an analogy on how wasting money one one thing IRL, which in turn means you don't have money for other things, is on that person to correct their behavior.  It was others that started blowing it out of proportion then getting indignant at my offer to help.

 

You suggested it though, as a direct counter to the already overly proven and explained to you in many ways including the literal math there is not enough resources for the white gear for new players. Your suggestion was for them to learn how to use the AH to accumulate wealth to afford the gear they should be able to afford by just playing the content and when told they shouldn't have to read guides for the basic entry level part of the game YOU then double back to your already disproven claims. You keep going in circles and being proven wrong again and again and again. It's extremely tiring. You keep saying "manage resources" or "don't waste your money!" with no evidence or anything to the cost of SO's vs what you earn vs any other expenses that should be reasonable expected to occur. You just keep bullshitting endlessly with the worst takes i have ever seen.

 

You don't need to double back to your gross comments, just fucking stop dude what is your problem?

[nzer]

12 minutes ago, Luminara said:

 

No, it doesn't.  There's already too much inf* in circulation.  That's why there are so many inf* sinks now, and why more are added with each update.  The inflationary pressure exerted by inf* is already enormous, and it took aggressive efforts to keep from spiraling out of control in the first couple of years.  Any implementation of increased inf* rewards would, regardless of where it was targeted, equate to more inf* entering the economy more rapidly, thus increasing the inflationary pressure and requiring even more aggressive control to prevent inflation.

You can't just dump inf* into the economy willy-nilly.  It doesn't work when you do that.

 

I'm not in favor of increasing inf rewards as a solution to this problem, but I do very much doubt changes in low level inf rewards would move the needle at all on inflation. A single fire farmer probably makes more in ten minutes than a new player's first character would make in its entire journey to 50.

Edited March 7 by nzer
Speling

[GM Crumpet]

locking this thread as some people can't play nice